05-26-09 02:19 PM
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  1. noaim's Avatar
    In reading various threads about WiFi/BB/Vzn the battery life is the only good reason to omit WiFi that comes up. You'd think they could make a little bigger battery and have the best of both worlds with the thing. It can't be that hard to make a battery that's 1-2mm thicker. I had one for my Pearl and it fit into the pouch just fine (not the standard case though), lasted forever.

    Battery's are one thing that haven't kept up with technology.. Batterys are very very hard hence why many HUGE corporations have a very very very large number of people working on developing them and creating new battery technology.
    05-22-09 04:21 PM
  2. thebignewt's Avatar
    Battery's are one thing that haven't kept up with technology.. Batterys are very very hard hence why many HUGE corporations have a very very very large number of people working on developing them and creating new battery technology.
    No, I didn't say make a different battery I said make a slightly thicker battery with say 30% more cowbell than the original. It's not like WiFi sucks the battery dry like GPS. I'm on Tmob and WiFi doesn't affect my battery life at all (on or off) so they could design the phone with a slightly bigger battery and include Wifi. That would be easy.
    05-22-09 04:48 PM
  3. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    thats fine wi-fi is easy to turn off for your "technical" user..

    but if its that bad on the battery bad to the point that it drains the battery so quick that you can use it for a hour or so or whatever rediculous thing it is then is there really a reason to have it at all.

    I mean realistically speaking theres not a reason to have it if the device is rendered useless while using it.

    I dont know the extent of how bad it is. Apparently they have made improvements so thats why we may finally see it on a RIM device.
    While I cannot say what effects WiFi might have on a CDMA Curve/Storm/Pearl, I can tell you that WiFi uses far more power than GPS and Bluetooth may or may not use as much power as GPS, depending on signals.

    On my Curve that has full GPS, when I turn on the GPS, without battery backup, we're looking at under two hours max. GPS and Bluetooth, less than an hour.

    But wait! Why do those TomTom & Garmin units last so long? Well, for one, they are only doing GPS. And two, they are most often used in the car, plugged in.

    Think of a laptop. How long does the battery last? Now turn on WiFi & see how long it lasts. Now expand the difference because the constant on nature of WiFi is much more taxing on a small mobile phone battery than it is a laptop battery.

    And we haven't even touched on different standards and how they interact (or don't interact) with each other.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-22-09 04:49 PM
  4. noaim's Avatar
    While I cannot say what effects WiFi might have on a CDMA Curve/Storm/Pearl, I can tell you that WiFi uses far more power than GPS and Bluetooth may or may not use as much power as GPS, depending on signals.

    On my Curve that has full GPS, when I turn on the GPS, without battery backup, we're looking at under two hours max. GPS and Bluetooth, less than an hour.

    But wait! Why do those TomTom & Garmin units last so long? Well, for one, they are only doing GPS. And two, they are most often used in the car, plugged in.

    Think of a laptop. How long does the battery last? Now turn on WiFi & see how long it lasts. Now expand the difference because the constant on nature of WiFi is much more taxing on a small mobile phone battery than it is a laptop battery.

    And we haven't even touched on different standards and how they interact (or don't interact) with each other.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

    I do know that wi-fi is very power consuming on a laptop - I also know that wi-fi drained my iPhone pretty good too..

    so it wasn't alarming to hear that the reason was do to battery power. I was just unaware in the difference between cdma and gsm power consumption...

    I also keep my gps off on my storm unless I need it for the same reason..

    By any means a phone that lasts 1 hour with using wi-fi would be rendered useless what would be the point..

    Now keep in mind that it must be something with the software that RIM uses on there devices as devices with similiar specs and some with even higher specs currently use and have wi-fi (win-mo)

    So my assumption would be how the software confronts the wi-fi radio plays a roll into how much battery power it actually uses
    05-22-09 07:31 PM
  5. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    Now keep in mind that it must be something with the software that RIM uses on there devices as devices with similiar specs and some with even higher specs currently use and have wi-fi (win-mo)

    So my assumption would be how the software confronts the wi-fi radio plays a roll into how much battery power it actually uses
    It could be either software or their CDMA hardware circuitry.

    I do the actual radio frequencies - I am not equipped to analyze design parameters of the devices themselves.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-22-09 10:17 PM
  6. noaim's Avatar
    It could be either software or their CDMA hardware circuitry.

    I do the actual radio frequencies - I am not equipped to analyze design parameters of the devices themselves.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

    thats why I think that there must be something holding rim back or it would have been out already..

    Everyone is so quick to either jump on Verizon or Rim for something when we may more often then not - not fully understand what the issues are or why they didn't do something.
    05-22-09 10:21 PM
  7. patches152's Avatar
    This subject has been covered ad-nauseum within these pages. Many are tired of the repetition and, as will happen on so many sites, frustration does occasionally show itself.
    Here are the facts:

    VZW doesn't block WiFi or have it removed, any more than any other CDMA carrier does. If they did, why are there WiFi devices sold by VZW & other CDMA carriers? Witness several HTC, Moto & Samsung CDMA devices currently or previously available on VZW, Sprint, etc.

    WiFi is not necessarily faster than EV-DO, but the way WiFi connects to the device may be.

    WiFi eats up battery resources at a much faster rate than either CDMA or GSM technologies. Considering that RIM takes pride in the battery life of BlackBerrys in general, the smaller BlackBerrys may not have room for the extra battery capacity, more complex CDMA circuitry & GPS to achieve what they feel is an acceptable battery life rating. Look at comparisons between current CDMA BlackBerrys & competitors like Samsung Omnia/Saga & you will find the competition generally scores better than BlackBerry except in battery life. Most tech sites that aren't based or tied to a certain platform, like this one is, pan the Samsungs only in this regard. Taking an objective view of these reviews would lead you to believe the shorter battery life may be a deal breaker for some - especially for those who have no interest in WiFi.

    If you are in an area of the country without CDMA coverage, what do you think the odds are of having a WiFi broadband connection? Sure, some will say they have minimal signal at their office, but good WiFi, but all too many of those don't have access permissions to that connection anyway.

    Take a look at the Curve (8300-8330) lineup - how many of them had both aGPS and WiFi? Even on AT&T & T-Mobile, you chose one or the other - not both. With this in mind, I could come up with a business reason for VZW to ask for GPS instead of WiFi & that is VZNav. They make money on VZNav, but not WiFi. Yet what excuse is there for other carriers to make the same choice, when not all CDMA carriers necessarily offer a subscription based navigation app?

    I have had RIM & Qualcomm engineers tell me there were technical limitations with conflicts between CDMA & WiFi - but I think this is only part of the story. I think the technical limitations are caused by having a set size for the device, coupled with battery life expectations. Based on what I mentioned a few paragraphs ago, one could then make a case for technical limitations precluding havinf WiFi, CDMA, GPS and reasonable battery life in an 8300-8330 series Curve or a Pearl.

    RIM figured out how to do WiFi & GPS in the Bold, but that is a GSM device with a much larger form factor.

    Lastly, don't bet on Niagara or Storm2 having WiFi. There were reports that the Storm & original Curve would have WiFi & GPS. We know that didn't happen and history of bad rumors may repeat. From what I've been told, Storm2 might have it, while Niagara probably will not.

    And remember, I was the first one to mention Storm2 in this forum probably 6 weeks before it popped up - I was panned for even claiming RIM was creating a Storm replacement so soon. Now we have a Storm2 discussion forum on CB. Go figure.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    and....scene
    /thread
    05-23-09 12:14 AM
  8. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    thats why I think that there must be something holding rim back or it would have been out already..

    Everyone is so quick to either jump on Verizon or Rim for something when we may more often then not - not fully understand what the issues are or why they didn't do something.

    I honestly dont know why there's no wifi. I jump on verizon first simply because of their track record of blocking or blocking and then charging for features that is free or unblocked by the competition. And anytime u read a news site, Verizon is the only company that comes up with articles and stories of controversy, usually resulting in Verizon trying to nickle and dime people.
    05-26-09 07:12 AM
  9. John Yester's Avatar
    Being the biggest carrier with a solid network you will attract all kinds of news stories. Bad or good. It's normal.

    Nobody wants to write stories about the small guys
    05-26-09 08:44 AM
  10. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    Being the biggest carrier with a solid network you will attract all kinds of news stories. Bad or good. It's normal.

    Nobody wants to write stories about the small guys
    probably ... I just don't think you will hear about lawsuits or complaints about locked features on any other carrier. Even on crackberry forums.

    I'm sure there's plenty of rants on other subjects like dropped calls, coverage, bad customer service, etc... but Verizon definitely owns the rap for the other issues mentioned...
    05-26-09 09:40 AM
  11. scurvydlicious's Avatar
    I honestly dont know why there's no wifi. I jump on verizon first simply because of their track record of blocking or blocking and then charging for features that is free or unblocked by the competition. And anytime u read a news site, Verizon is the only company that comes up with articles and stories of controversy, usually resulting in Verizon trying to nickle and dime people.
    Based on you quote, I don't know how you blame Verizon. If it were Verizon that's not allowing wi-fi in Blackberry's, then how come Sprint ( Captain Open Network and Allow Anything Anytime ) doesn't have a CDMA Blackberry with wi-fi either? What about US Cellular? They also don't have a CDMA Blackberry with wi-fi, and they seem to be trying to gain as much market share as they can, don't you think they would want to offer one to pick up more customers from Sprint and Verizon? What about Bell Canada? They're in Canada, they can walk to Waterloo and punch RIM in the face and tell them to put wi-fi in their Blackberry's, but no, even they don't have one.

    Based on logic, if _ANY_ CDMA Blackberry had wi-fi, we would all know that it's Verizon Wireless that isn't allowing it. But that's not the case, is it? When Verizon brings out the first CDMA Blackberry with wi-fi, is everyone going to cheer? Is everyone going to talk crap about Sprint blocking wi-fi on their CDMA Blackberry's? Doubt it, people only love to cry about Verizon as if they're criminals yet they stick with them.
    05-26-09 12:00 PM
  12. noaim's Avatar
    Based on you quote, I don't know how you blame Verizon. If it were Verizon that's not allowing wi-fi in Blackberry's, then how come Sprint ( Captain Open Network and Allow Anything Anytime ) doesn't have a CDMA Blackberry with wi-fi either? What about US Cellular? They also don't have a CDMA Blackberry with wi-fi, and they seem to be trying to gain as much market share as they can, don't you think they would want to offer one to pick up more customers from Sprint and Verizon? What about Bell Canada? They're in Canada, they can walk to Waterloo and punch RIM in the face and tell them to put wi-fi in their Blackberry's, but no, even they don't have one.

    Based on logic, if _ANY_ CDMA Blackberry had wi-fi, we would all know that it's Verizon Wireless that isn't allowing it. But that's not the case, is it? When Verizon brings out the first CDMA Blackberry with wi-fi, is everyone going to cheer? Is everyone going to talk crap about Sprint blocking wi-fi on their CDMA Blackberry's? Doubt it, people only love to cry about Verizon as if they're criminals yet they stick with them.

    this is kind of the reason why you know its not verizon. I think that its more then likely a technical issue with battery/software that RIM has had issues with in CDMA phones.

    I would rather have a good product then a sloppy non good working version of it...

    As much as I want it and would use it it seems more logical if I look at it that way anyway..
    05-26-09 02:19 PM
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