03-11-10 12:59 AM
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  1. gotblackberry's Avatar
    "Here, let me show you how to properly use the device." That goes over really well, trust me.
    03-03-10 01:14 AM
  2. OldChristine's Avatar
    Ya never know Weekend....

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-03-10 01:33 AM
  3. gotblackberry's Avatar
    LOL Yes I do I've done it.
    03-03-10 02:06 AM
  4. i_hiker's Avatar
    "Here, let me show you how to properly use the device." That goes over really well, trust me.
    You asked the wrong question. Maybe....

    "Do you know how to prevent your device from jamming?"

    "No."

    "No? Let me show you how."
    03-03-10 08:50 AM
  5. rayman21186's Avatar
    I don't know about you guys, but while watching the video, you can clearly see that he is texting, and for the first 30 characters or so, it works fine, then completely stops. Hitting end did no good, trying to type in more letters did no good, so what exactly was he doing wrong? I came from an EnV to my blackberry, and judging by what I saw, he was doing everything right. Why is it so hard for some of you to believe that maybe a phone DID cause the issue? I've personally never had any issues with any of my phones, but that doesn't mean someone else won't. Also, don't sit there and act like you wouldn't do what you had to do to get a working phone. I'm sure that any number of ANY carriers customers would go to their local media for help if they had exhausted all of their other options.
    03-03-10 09:58 AM
  6. markhunsaker's Avatar
    Rayman, it's SO hard to believe that it was happening on 4 identical phones. Yes, maybe it would be more believeable if it had happened on one of their phones and they get a replacement and it happens again. But both of their phones 4 times?
    03-03-10 10:12 AM
  7. bs1two's Avatar
    There could be more to this... getting ringtones from a 3rd party site (seen this cause tons of problems) as well as a wallpaper or forwarded text from the internet.

    mark I am with you... I find it extremely hard to believe that 4 phones had the same issue with the both of them. In the end the customer is happy! However, the method of obtaining that happiness could have been handled a lot better. To start with the VZW reps who dealt with it.
    03-03-10 10:20 AM
  8. rayman21186's Avatar
    I just don't think they should rule out the possibility of it being a software related issue. What if all of those phones were made around the same time, and there was some sort of issue with the software version they used on the phones built around that time? We've all seen software issues cripple multiple blackberrys at the same time, so I do think it is possible. I'm not saying that is what happened, but that it is a possibility.

    EDIT: I also agree with the fact that the issue could, and probably should, have been handled on the store level. They should have tested the phone, attempted to troubleshoot it, and found out if it was, in fact, user error. Nobody wants to be told something is their fault, but it does happen. I had a customer bring his brand new $3000 Cub Cadet riding mower back to Lowe's when I still worked there, because it "wouldn't move". When I loaded the mower on to his trailer, I had showed him this nice, brass looking pin that was sticking out of the back, near where you would attach a trailer to the mower. I told him that this pin DISENGAGED the transmission, so that you can push the mower if it ever runs out of gas, or you just need to for some reason. He said okay. He comes back griping 3 hours later (he lived over an hour away...) so I promptly go out to his trailer, reengage the transmission, and drive it off of his trailer. After driving it back on, he left without another word. He realized his own incompetence in the issue, and left with his pride slightly injured, but happy with his product.
    Last edited by rayman21186; 03-03-10 at 10:57 AM.
    03-03-10 10:49 AM
  9. bs1two's Avatar
    I am not ruling out the possibility of it being software. However, the steps I would have taken at the store level would have been to back everything up that I could and wipe the phone completely. Start with a fresh phone then start adding stuff back into the phone to see where the problem started. You can do stuff like that in the store. Over the phone you can't and it be verified the way you want it to be.

    It could have been something as small as the same contact in both phones being corrupt. Or as I stated earlier a ringtone, fwd text, or a wallpaper.

    The situation could have been handled a lot better. Crediting the customers account for stuff purchased or even providing another option (say a memory card) is a lot cheaper than putting them into brand new phone.
    03-03-10 11:11 AM
  10. jlfberry's Avatar
    For years customers continue to blame cell phone carriers for manufacturer and user abuse issues on cell phones. FIRST off, they need to understand cell phone carriers are in the business of SELLING a product you can communicate with and then providing you with the SERVICE to do so.

    Cell phone carriers are NOT the makers of the device that you buy. YES it IS their responsibility to help you make sure that the device is functioning properly, but ultimately it is the responsibility of the cell phone manufacturer to produce a product that functions correctly.

    Cell phone carriers sign contracts with the makers of the cell phones in good faith. The cell phone carriers TRUST that the manufacturer will put out a high quality product that they can market to the consumer. Just like a consumer trusts that the product they are buying is going to work. BOTH the consumer and the cell phone carrier are at the mercy of the manufacturer. If customers want to complain about the QUALITY of a product, they need to call and complain to the manufacturer and not the carrier.

    Its the same old song when customers come in and yell at service reps as if THEY are the people making the phone that they are buying. Cell phone carriers don't put a gun to your head and force you to spend YOUR hard earned money to buy a cell phone.

    It is the CONSUMER's responsibility to make informed decisions about the product they are buying. A perfect example would be when the STORM launched. Everybody bought it because it was the "latest and greatest". Few of those people actually took the time to research the phone to see if it was worth buying.

    More than half of the people I talked to said they bought the phone just because "they heard about it", Very few of them waited until after the release to come to the stores and test the phone out before they bought it. This was one reason the return rate was so high after the initial launch of the Storm.
    03-03-10 11:21 AM
  11. Polychrome's Avatar
    The current Env line appears to have a few PRL-based bugs and glitches that cause it to restart in certain cases. They've put out a few new versions, but haven't completely nailed it yet.

    That said...

    Seriously, does Dell give you an alienware system when your little cheapie notebook has some windows errors? Or even errors with the other included proprietary bloatware? No. Does Microsoft give you a 120gb hard-drive 360 if your 20-gig red rings? Or do they swap out your motherboard?

    No electronics company gives new or different devices for bugs. They try to fix the existing bugs. Any sane person would make do and wait for the fix. Seriously, it's not like you were working on a 100-page unsaved word document on your Env. Is it really that hard to retype your 160 character text message? Does it really wreck your day if the thing restarts in your pocket? I mean, seriously now.

    The way it was originally explained to me, "Multi-fru" was put in place for extreme cases of user-error. For example: if they believed that the USER was responsible for the device not working correctly because they were the reincarnation of Stimpy or something, we would give them a different device in hopes that they wouldn't make the same mistake over and over again with other warranty replacements as they had been up until then. It was NEVER intended for people begging for new devices.

    But people found out about it and begged for frus over and over again to entitle themselves to "new" devices. Because as we all know, used is evil and it means people's snot is all over it. (I worked at a gamestop once. Kinda silly how people will freak out over even the most pristine disks if they're "used", or even the new opened disks they take out of package so they have an empty box to put on the shelf.) Nevermind people who do it to try and milk us out of the latest device in the bunch.
    Last edited by Polychrome; 03-03-10 at 03:39 PM.
    03-03-10 03:34 PM
  12. gotblackberry's Avatar
    I just know that I've had executive complaints logged against me by customers on two occasions for different issues and Executive has always backed me up and not given in to the customer. People think that writing the executives automatically mean you'll get what you want and sometimes it's true but other times executive backs us up. So while in this situation the customer got what they want, who knows what the executive office does on the next go around.

    Just so you know the two complaints were multi-fru related and federal universal service charge related. The first customer has had three multi-fru's in 5 years with us and the only new phone he's purchased was the first one when he first signed up. He wanted another one and I told him no. The other the customer wanted to get out of his contract due to FUSC increase and I said no and both times executive backed me up.
    03-03-10 03:52 PM
  13. OldChristine's Avatar
    Verizon will continue to resolve these seriously escelated issues in the customers favor. Only under extremely rare circumstances would they fight it. Otherwise it could turn into a PR circus. I spoke with the manager of the verizon by my work today, since I went to give the Pre a second look (crap) and I was informed by him of the above info. I'm very suprised that getting rid of the "multi fru" hasn't cause more chaos, that being said I was also informed that it is still utilized in few and far between situations, and after exhausting other options.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-03-10 11:02 PM
  14. babyface35762's Avatar
    And they went to rogue? They will have even more problems. Bet you money they will NOT get a diff make/model.
    03-04-10 02:23 AM
  15. babyface35762's Avatar
    The current Env line appears to have a few PRL-based bugs and glitches that cause it to restart in certain cases. They've put out a few new versions, but haven't completely nailed it yet.

    That said...

    Seriously, does Dell give you an alienware system when your little cheapie notebook has some windows errors? Or even errors with the other included proprietary bloatware? No. Does Microsoft give you a 120gb hard-drive 360 if your 20-gig red rings? Or do they swap out your motherboard?

    No electronics company gives new or different devices for bugs. They try to fix the existing bugs. Any sane person would make do and wait for the fix. Seriously, it's not like you were working on a 100-page unsaved word document on your Env. Is it really that hard to retype your 160 character text message? Does it really wreck your day if the thing restarts in your pocket? I mean, seriously now.

    The way it was originally explained to me, "Multi-fru" was put in place for extreme cases of user-error. For example: if they believed that the USER was responsible for the device not working correctly because they were the reincarnation of Stimpy or something, we would give them a different device in hopes that they wouldn't make the same mistake over and over again with other warranty replacements as they had been up until then. It was NEVER intended for people begging for new devices.

    But people found out about it and begged for frus over and over again to entitle themselves to "new" devices. Because as we all know, used is evil and it means people's snot is all over it. (I worked at a gamestop once. Kinda silly how people will freak out over even the most pristine disks if they're "used", or even the new opened disks they take out of package so they have an empty box to put on the shelf.) Nevermind people who do it to try and milk us out of the latest device in the bunch.
    VZW does has spoiled their customers for years and now are tyring to combat the problem. It's hard when you have people who abuse the system and mess it up for people who have legitimate device issues that warrant moving to a diff device.
    03-04-10 02:27 AM
  16. bs1two's Avatar
    Verizon will continue to resolve these seriously escelated issues in the customers favor. Only under extremely rare circumstances would they fight it. Otherwise it could turn into a PR circus. I spoke with the manager of the verizon by my work today, since I went to give the Pre a second look (crap) and I was informed by him of the above info. I'm very suprised that getting rid of the "multi fru" hasn't cause more chaos, that being said I was also informed that it is still utilized in few and far between situations, and after exhausting other options.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Believe it or not there are people out there who don't feel ENTITLED to something brand new if they have issues with the device they purchased.
    03-04-10 11:02 AM
  17. Super_Mario's Avatar

    It could have been something as small as the same contact in both phones being corrupt. Or as I stated earlier a ringtone, fwd text, or a wallpaper. .
    Exactly, the customer I had with the exact same issue, the problem was resolved with a phone wipe and just a restore of contacts through Backup Asst. The common problem with the 3 phones in one day was the Cellbrite, so it could have been a corrupt contact transfered through that system. But the main point is it worked and the phone didn't need to be replaced. The customer didn't even want it replaced she just wanted it to work. So it was nice to have customer that wasn't out to get free stuff, she just had a problem and wanted it fixed.
    03-04-10 04:12 PM
  18. tsguy52's Avatar
    Really? 4 phones each...same problem? I call user error. I have friends with the EnV Touch, and they have hundreds of messages without a problem. My wife has the EnV3, never a problem. Maybe they just a horrible batch, but still...
    I agree... out of all the people I talk to on a regular basis who have these phones - none have ever had a problem with it freezing up. There was something else going on that was user related OR an act of God.
    03-04-10 08:02 PM
  19. i_hiker's Avatar
    I agree... out of all the people I talk to on a regular basis who have these phones - none have ever had a problem with it freezing up. There was something else going on that was user related OR an act of God.
    Not only was this probably user related, the VZW retail personnel had no clue either.
    03-04-10 10:52 PM
  20. Wireless Vet's Avatar
    A couple here in AZ
    Hmmm, it's interesting you are in AZ.................maybe what I was thinking the other day was correct.
    03-04-10 11:42 PM
  21. Wireless Vet's Avatar
    Bad attitude, dude! What the heck do you mean by "those types of people?" The couple ended up with what they pay for and deserve...phone and text service that works. Too bad they had to go through the media to get it.

    So VZW replaced the devices multiple times and the problem still persisted. Common sense says the device is at least partly to blame.
    Common sense could also easily dictate that maybe someone isn't using and caring for their phone properly. When an entire family is having trouble with the same phone? I don't think so.
    03-04-10 11:45 PM
  22. Wireless Vet's Avatar
    I spoke with the manager of the verizon by my work today, since I went to give the Pre a second look (crap) and I was informed by him of the above info. I'm very suprised that getting rid of the "multi fru" hasn't cause more chaos, that being said I was also informed that it is still utilized in few and far between situations, and after exhausting other options.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Did you happen to call customer service six times when you got home?
    03-04-10 11:46 PM
  23. OldChristine's Avatar
    Did you happen to call customer service six times when you got home?
    Why would I do that if I just came from a corp store? What about me being in AZ makes you think something?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-04-10 11:51 PM
  24. i_hiker's Avatar
    Common sense could also easily dictate that maybe someone isn't using and caring for their phone properly. When an entire family is having trouble with the same phone? I don't think so.
    Once again, if the situation had been resolved by VZW personnel in the store, it would have never escalated. Evidently, store clerks were only capable of replacing the phone...multiple times, rather than helping the customer fix the problem.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-05-10 07:06 AM
  25. i7guy's Avatar
    Once again, if the situation had been resolved by VZW personnel in the store, it would have never escalated. Evidently, store clerks were only capable of replacing the phone...multiple times, rather than helping the customer fix the problem.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Or the customers are to stupid (or were lieing) to use phones. Just sayin...

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-05-10 07:32 AM
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