10-11-10 01:45 AM
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  1. i7guy's Avatar
    Verizon to give refunds to some 15 million customers - CNN.com

    It's about time, this was about the most egregious, flagrant abuse.
    10-04-10 08:38 AM
  2. Wireless Vet's Avatar
    To bad Verizon has to come to a settlement to pay millions of people millions of dollars because they "accidentally" went on the internet. You don't accidentally do that.
    10-04-10 09:51 AM
  3. i7guy's Avatar
    "Egregious?" "Abuse?" I don't quite think so. They did come to terms with the issue. How is that wrong? They made a mistake and are making it right.

    Maybe checking your charges before you pay would be prudent. I do it every month. Takes all of five minutes.
    Yes, egregious. You are not a VZW customer so you never had to deal with hitting a button on your phone and getting charged $1.99, even if you didn't mean to hit the button.
    10-04-10 10:29 AM
  4. Super_Mario's Avatar
    Yes I do deal with it. Keyboard lock. Every phone, including dumb phones, have them. I don't "accidentally" use my phone. I think Verizon is being extremely gracious.

    Give me a freaking break.
    I agree. How does one accidently use their phone?

    But I think it's good that they are doing this, even though some may find it not enough (people are never happy) it at least shows that VZW is willing to own up to their mistakes and are trying to make it right.
    Last edited by supermario28; 10-04-10 at 11:43 AM.
    10-04-10 11:32 AM
  5. Jude526's Avatar
    Exactly, we need to take responsibility for what we do and not put blame. You should know what your contract covers and if you aren't sure, it only takes a moment to dial *611 from your handset and talk to a customer care rep.

    I still get a paper statement because mistakes can happen. I like being able to check my bill. I also have My Verizon. I have only had one issue and Verizon made it right by me.

    Large companies can make mistakes. I think the issues with Toyota are a lot more serious than this. Also there was an issue with a few cosmetic companies regarding sampling and a group of women decided to take action. It was a tough week for us managers who had to oversee all the free samples and making sure the paperwork was signed properly. Some people really enjoy taking advantage.

    I didn't know about the issue with Verizon till I saw it on the news.

    Too bad and they are doing their best to correct it. So, instead of bashing them, why not accept the refund and be gracious about it. But there are those who love to complain and just be whining.
    10-04-10 11:38 AM
  6. valorian's Avatar
    This is another example of the sue happy society we live in. People would rather sue a company that admit THEY are the idiots. Just like the woman a few years back that won millions from McDonalds because she was stupid enough to drive with coffee in her lap.
    10-04-10 12:01 PM
  7. anon(3047348)'s Avatar
    FWIW it helps to realize this doesn't really apply to BB owners/users at all.

    Let me explain how this works.

    You have a non-smart phone (like in my case an LG env3). You have no data plan, you don't want a data plan, and you never use data.

    You first get the phone and look at all the icons to see what they do. There is no way to tell if an icon is going to incur data usage either at startup or during use. You click "My Verizon" or some other built-in feature, and lo and behold, a browser app comes up saying it's accessing a mobile site. You instantly click back/undo/whatever to try and back out, since you don't want to be charged for data use, but it's already too late, the initial request has resulted in a few bytes being sent over the data network. Too bad, that click just cost you $2 to $6. No service was actually even used, yet you just got charged the price of a lunch.

    After this point, of course you try and lock down data services on your non-smart phone but guess what, a lot of non-smart phones don't even have an option for that. If you ever accidentally hit that icon again for whatever reason, even if you cancel out of it a split-second later, it's still too late to avoid getting charged.

    Another thing, as far as I can see there was no lawsuit involved. Kudos to Verizon for making good on this without waiting for one. But make no mistake, it was a real problem with Verizon's billing practices, not with their users. Their own built-in software on non-smart phones was initiating data transfers without asking and users who didn't use data for anything were being charged for it.
    10-04-10 02:56 PM
  8. Super_Mario's Avatar
    FWIW it helps to realize this doesn't really apply to BB owners/users at all.

    Let me explain how this works.

    You have a non-smart phone (like in my case an LG env3). You have no data plan, you don't want a data plan, and you never use data.

    You first get the phone and look at all the icons to see what they do. There is no way to tell if an icon is going to incur data usage either at startup or during use. You click "My Verizon" or some other built-in feature, and lo and behold, a browser app comes up saying it's accessing a mobile site. You instantly click back/undo/whatever to try and back out, since you don't want to be charged for data use, but it's already too late, the initial request has resulted in a few bytes being sent over the data network. Too bad, that click just cost you $2 to $6. No service was actually even used, yet you just got charged the price of a lunch.

    After this point, of course you try and lock down data services on your non-smart phone but guess what, a lot of non-smart phones don't even have an option for that. If you ever accidentally hit that icon again for whatever reason, even if you cancel out of it a split-second later, it's still too late to avoid getting charged.

    Another thing, as far as I can see there was no lawsuit involved. Kudos to Verizon for making good on this without waiting for one. But make no mistake, it was a real problem with Verizon's billing practices, not with their users. Their own built-in software on non-smart phones was initiating data transfers without asking and users who didn't use data for anything were being charged for it.
    VZW remedied this a while back, My Verizon does not charge MB's and the first splash page of Mobile Web, even if accessed by accident, does not charge data.
    10-04-10 03:02 PM
  9. titans30dude's Avatar
    @supermario
    if you read the article phones were charged for data fee's for weird reasons so My Verizon is one on those reasons dumb @$$
    10-04-10 04:33 PM
  10. Super_Mario's Avatar
    @supermario
    if you read the article phones were charged for data fee's for weird reasons so My Verizon is one on those reasons dumb @$$
    Excuse you c*nt? I was making a general statement about My Verizon, not even remotly directed to you or anybody.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-04-10 05:54 PM
  11. 7scarabs's Avatar
    I'm trying to figure out what the time frame was for these glitches. I've been a Verizon customer since Day 1 (when Ameritech became Verizon) and had LOTS of "non-smartphones" for both personal and business use until we switched over to BBs about a year ago.

    Velcrovan... I understand what you're saying about how non-intentional data use *could* have happened. But on ALL of the phones I've had since VZW came out with their internet apps, I have ALWAYS gotten the message, when selecting an icon for Mobile Web, Mobile e-mail, V-cast, or whatever, that said something like "downloading and using this program will result in a monthly service charge of $X," "a per-usage charge of $X," or whatever. Same as for downloading ringtones, music, games, or whatever from the VZW online "stores" ... the charge was ALWAYS shown BEFORE anything was downloaded, and you could select the "agree/disagree" or "yes/no" option. So, I NEVER saw one of these "accidental" charges... on my personal phone, any other phone on my family plan, or any of our business plan phones. You'd figure that one of us would have messed up SOMETIME over the past few years if this had been a real problem.

    If people have indeed been unfairly charged, it's good that Verizon is making it right. I just can't figure out how so many people were affected, since I've always seen the upfront message about the charges for the apps before anything ever actually got downloaded.
    10-05-10 12:21 AM
  12. Gitpicker51's Avatar
    Verizon to give refunds to some 15 million customers - CNN.com

    It's about time, this was about the most egregious, flagrant abuse.
    Did you know it before they announced it? What makes you entitled? VZW came forth willingly. Get over it.
    10-05-10 06:28 AM
  13. i7guy's Avatar
    From what I have seen in the news today, VZW made no mistake what-so-ever. It's the clients who have disregarded the protection afforded them on their own phones. I use keyboard lock constantly even though I am a preferred customer and have unlimited everything and never carry my phone in a way that it can dial unexpectedly. Prudence is the better part of protection.

    One thing to address, as I use my phone, occasionally I used to hit my Web2Go icon and didn't need it (Web2Go) being it is a wap access app, so I hide it. How hard is that to figure out. I don't need it so I don't use it so I hide it.
    It happened multiple times, verizon should have had a safeguard in place to begin with. Yes, they took it off my bill when I called to discuss it, but at the time the policy was put into place, they should have had a way to block it.
    10-05-10 03:19 PM
  14. i7guy's Avatar
    Did you know it before they announced it? What makes you entitled? VZW came forth willingly. Get over it.
    I don't actually have to get over anything. I'll be waiting for my check in the mail.
    10-05-10 03:20 PM
  15. i7guy's Avatar
    FWIW it helps to realize this doesn't really apply to BB owners/users at all.

    Let me explain how this works.

    You have a non-smart phone (like in my case an LG env3). You have no data plan, you don't want a data plan, and you never use data.

    You first get the phone and look at all the icons to see what they do. There is no way to tell if an icon is going to incur data usage either at startup or during use. You click "My Verizon" or some other built-in feature, and lo and behold, a browser app comes up saying it's accessing a mobile site. You instantly click back/undo/whatever to try and back out, since you don't want to be charged for data use, but it's already too late, the initial request has resulted in a few bytes being sent over the data network. Too bad, that click just cost you $2 to $6. No service was actually even used, yet you just got charged the price of a lunch.

    After this point, of course you try and lock down data services on your non-smart phone but guess what, a lot of non-smart phones don't even have an option for that. If you ever accidentally hit that icon again for whatever reason, even if you cancel out of it a split-second later, it's still too late to avoid getting charged.

    Another thing, as far as I can see there was no lawsuit involved. Kudos to Verizon for making good on this without waiting for one. But make no mistake, it was a real problem with Verizon's billing practices, not with their users. Their own built-in software on non-smart phones was initiating data transfers without asking and users who didn't use data for anything were being charged for it.
    Thanks for taking the time to explain, what I had no motivation to explain. It appears most of the respondents to the original post didn't really understand the issue.
    10-05-10 03:22 PM
  16. i7guy's Avatar
    They do. It's the "A*" key on your keyboard.
    Sorry tired tonight....I don't get the reference.
    10-05-10 07:36 PM
  17. jetman1287's Avatar
    This isn't too much money for Verizon. They're doing this to look good and avoid a larger (forced) payout from a lawsuit. I doubt they did it "just to be nice."
    10-05-10 09:43 PM
  18. Feeeeg's Avatar

    Hide the icon or lock your keyboard.

    I have had a cell phone in one form or another, smart/dumb for at least twelve years and have accidentally used my phone to call someone ONE time (it was my brother and he was just blocks away, [I remember it well, I was a noob] at which time he drove to my place of business and told me to hang up), right then I decided to never put my phone in my pocket unlocked. Upon arriving home from work that day, I retrieved my manual from the bedroom table and read MORE of the manual. Now, do you think I am depriving T-Mobile of extra cash by being prudent? I think not. I am denying them of the money they are rightfully entitled to if I were to not lock my phone with the facility provided by the phone manufacturer in the first place. it's not an accidental feature. It is purposefully programed into the phone.

    I have no use for Web2Go or wap so I hide that icon, along with those cheesy trial period games that come pushed to my phone, in a folder, then hide that folder.
    First,, again this does not relate to bb's so you cant just hide the icon.

    Second, they have already stated there was an error in programming that allowed the charges to go through. As you stated, you yourself called someone unintentionally once,,,, If I remember the article correctly it stated that most refunds would be for $2, to me that seems like most people made the mistake once like you, only the programming allowed the charge to go through without asking for confirmation.

    Third, you relate this to a call, which in my estimation is covered by your minutes plan, we are talking about a 1.99 charge in error after hitting a button by accident, a charge of 1.99 for literally a seconds worth of data. A charge for 1.99 when most likely the phone did not ask for confirmation, which would have avoided the charge, and is henceforth a PROGRAMMING ERROR. JUST LIKE STATED IN THE ARTICLE.

    While I do not believe that verizon Did something so bad to have gotten the ire of the OP, I think that they are responsible for a programming error and should repay the moneys that were charged..
    10-06-10 08:09 AM
  19. i7guy's Avatar
    I have remote engine start on my Camry.

    It's a small green button on the remote locking module you carry with you.

    Conceivably I could accidentally start my car if I were within 30 feet of unobstructed view of the car. If I were to accidentally start my car, it will run for 10 minutes and shut down, still locked. If it were to not have the built in shut down feature and started by accident because the green button got pushed twice while in my pocket and burned up a tank of gas or a significant portion of a tank, I doubt that I could sue the last gas station I had bought the fuel from for the gas cost which allowed my car to run.

    I don't see that Verizon is guilty of any untoward practice at all. They are being very gracious in my opinion. I stated this earlier. If you do not want to be charged for something you do not want to use or be charged for, don't initiate the activity. Hide the icon or lock your keyboard.

    I have had a cell phone in one form or another, smart/dumb for at least twelve years and have accidentally used my phone to call someone ONE time (it was my brother and he was just blocks away, [I remember it well, I was a noob] at which time he drove to my place of business and told me to hang up), right then I decided to never put my phone in my pocket unlocked. Upon arriving home from work that day, I retrieved my manual from the bedroom table and read MORE of the manual. Now, do you think I am depriving T-Mobile of extra cash by being prudent? I think not. I am denying them of the money they are rightfully entitled to if I were to not lock my phone with the facility provided by the phone manufacturer in the first place. it's not an accidental feature. It is purposefully programed into the phone.

    I have no use for Web2Go or wap so I hide that icon, along with those cheesy trial period games that come pushed to my phone, in a folder, then hide that folder.

    This does not require a genius to understand. A bit of prudence, as stated, is all you need. Verizon could easily refuse to refund everyone and have no worries with the matter. Someone earlier stated that when you dial into a fee assessed facility with your phone you are advised immediately on the phone screen that the activity you are entering into is going to assess a fee to your phone bill if you choose to continue.
    First,, again this does not relate to bb's so you cant just hide the icon.

    Second, they have already stated there was an error in programming that allowed the charges to go through. As you stated, you yourself called someone unintentionally once,,,, If I remember the article correctly it stated that most refunds would be for $2, to me that seems like most people made the mistake once like you, only the programming allowed the charge to go through without asking for confirmation.

    Third, you relate this to a call, which in my estimation is covered by your minutes plan, we are talking about a 1.99 charge in error after hitting a button by accident, a charge of 1.99 for literally a seconds worth of data. A charge for 1.99 when most likely the phone did not ask for confirmation, which would have avoided the charge, and is henceforth a PROGRAMMING ERROR. JUST LIKE STATED IN THE ARTICLE.

    While I do not believe that verizon Did something so bad to have gotten the ire of the OP, I think that they are responsible for a programming error and should repay the moneys that were charged..
    kellyj do you understand the premise of the issue? It seems you do not. Please reread thread carefully. This is not a smartphone issue, it is a "dumb" phone issue.

    feeeeg...I had to deal with this on multiple occassions. Hitting a key to get charged $1.99 when:

    1. there is no warning/you don't know about it
    2. it can't be shut off
    3. it can't be cancelled

    was an oversight on verizons part, and they knew. Before a class lawsuit hit, they were proactive and settled the issue.
    10-06-10 08:47 AM
  20. Feeeeg's Avatar
    @i7guy

    I agree with you, I however would like to know what you mean by multiple times.... If by that you are stating that you did it after seeing a bill for the first time and seeing this charge, then I have to agree with Drummer. If however all of your multiple times were in the same month and unbeknownst to you were charging you, then verizon is at fault.

    @drummer,,, what do you play, I am a Tama, Zildjian, Remo, Vater kind of guy, with Evans for my kick.
    10-06-10 08:57 AM
  21. kbz1960's Avatar
    To bad Verizon has to come to a settlement to pay millions of people millions of dollars because they "accidentally" went on the internet. You don't accidentally do that.
    You shouldn't be able to "accidentally" go on the internet. If you're not paying for it, it simply shouldn't work. So yeah I'd say it's the carriers fault no matter who the carrier is. If the carrier is pushing stuff to your phone and charging you for that, that is also wrong.
    10-06-10 09:11 AM
  22. jetman1287's Avatar
    You shouldn't be able to "accidentally" go on the internet. If you're not paying for it, it simply shouldn't work. So yeah I'd say it's the carriers fault no matter who the carrier is. If the carrier is pushing stuff to your phone and charging you for that, that is also wrong.
    But what about all that exciting vcast content you may want to download at the per-mb rate?

    Lol! Sometimes this forum feels more like verizon pr than their own forums.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-06-10 09:18 AM
  23. kbz1960's Avatar
    Well I don't know about vcast as I don't have vzw but it should warn you if you're going to be charged and not just do it.
    10-06-10 09:31 AM
  24. jetman1287's Avatar
    Well I don't know about vcast as I don't have vzw but it should warn you if you're going to be charged and not just do it.
    I was being sarcastic about the vcast bloatware

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-06-10 10:55 AM
  25. Feeeeg's Avatar
    apparently so.
    ? Confused....


    kellyj you have pm
    Last edited by Feeeeg; 10-06-10 at 11:44 AM. Reason: add a comment
    10-06-10 11:27 AM
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