10-09-09 01:41 PM
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  1. sorlipm's Avatar
    Civic, just an FYI, if we send a phone back to the warehouse and a wipe fixes it, you will be charged FULL retail on your next bill.....Happy NOW
    10-07-09 07:13 AM
  2. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    I think your TV analogy is a little flawed, Twins.
    I know it wasn't a precise analogy, but it was the closest there was.

    As for paying extra for service & comparing other carriers - the rest of your post - do you pay more for VZW? Not if AT&T is your comparison. So how do we justify not getting the "rigamarole" of other carriers, at least if the other carrier is AT&T?

    Now, let's look at the subsidy part. I could see your thoughts about expecting more if you're paying more, but we aren't. Whether you pay full price for a phone (any carrier) or bring your own (AT&T/T-Mobile), or buy a used phone off eBay/Craigslist/swapmeet, do you see a reduction in your service costs? Not a thin dime. I don't get a penny's worth of subsidy from any carrier on any phone I have, yet if I call for tech support on a current device, they will try to help me.

    Yes, Civic has "banged into" an issue - but that issue is not one of the reps. It is of customer expectations & misperceptions. We see it here all the time. Someone wants the latest & greatest smartphone. That phone is defective. Why is it the carrier's fault? You demand the device, they sell you the device, there is something wrong with it - and it isn't just yours. Thousands have the same problem. The solution isn't to scream, yell & whine at the carrier. The solution is to realize the manufacturer isn't the wonderful producer people have fabricated them to be & look elsewhere. You don't expect VZW to be any different than other carriers.

    Why do you think VZW & Nokia have not been partnered in recent years? Because VZW didn't want to play Nokia's game. Same goes for iPhone. VZW didn't want to get into bed with Apple on Apple's terms. Same with Sony - some of these were service related issues.

    So now, we have a carrier wanting to offer smartphones that people demand. RIM & VZW have agreements that cover the entire lineup. If VZW plays hardball, RIM could just take their toys elsewhere, or at least their latest & greatest ones.

    According to the contract you sign for service, VZW under Disclaimer of Warranties, you will see the following:

    ? WE ARE NOT THE MANUFACTURER OF YOUR WIRELESS DEVICE. WE MAKE NO REPRESENTATIONS OR WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, TO THE EXTENT PERMITTED BY APPLICABLE LAW, ANY IMPLIED WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE CONCERNING YOUR SERVICE OR YOUR WIRELESS DEVICE, OR ANY APPLICATIONS YOU ACCESS THROUGH YOUR DEVICE. WE CAN'T PROMISE UNINTERRUPTED OR ERRORFREE SERVICE AND DON'T AUTHORIZE ANYONE TO MAKE ANY WARRANTIES ON OUR BEHALF. THIS DOESN'T DEPRIVE YOU OF ANY WARRANTY RIGHTS YOU MAY HAVE AGAINST ANYONE ELSE.

    IF YOU ACTIVATED YOUR WIRELESS DEVICE ON ONE OF OUR PLANS THROUGH OUR OPEN DEVELOPMENT PROGRAM, VERIZON WIRELESS HAS NOT MADE ANY DETERMINATION AS TO THE CALL QUALITY OR OTHER FUNCTIONALITY PROVIDED BY YOUR DEVICE. VERIZON WIRELESS DOES NOT IN ANY WAY WARRANT THAT YOUR DEVICE (A) WILL OPERATE WITHOUT ERROR ON OUR NETWORK (INCLUDING THE NETWORK OF ANY OTHER CARRIER ACCESSED WHILE ROAMING OR OTHERWISE); (B) WILL OPERATE WITHOUT THE NEED FOR PERIODIC UPGRADES OR MODIFICATIONS; (C) WILL OPERATE INDEFINITELY ON OUR NETWORK; OR (D) WILL NOT BE ADVERSELY AFFECTED BY NETWORKRELATED MODIFICATIONS, UPGRADES OR SIMILAR ACTIVITY

    It does not promise VZW can, or will even attempt to, offer service on the phone after the sale. So why broil the reps for something they don't even have to offer?

    That is the problem I have with Civic & many others here. They agree to terms, then later want to get around those terms. If you don't like the terms, look elsewhere.

    Everyone here knows I am highly critical of all carriers, including VZW. But you agreed to terms. If you weren't aware of what you agreed to, it is your fault.

    I guarantee you this - if people stopped buying a product and started laying proper blame for the product itself, the product will change or go away. There is no incentive for RIM to change these things, because too many want them no matter what - then blame the carrier & its reps for things they never agreed to accept responsibility for.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-07-09 09:06 AM
  3. JSClark's Avatar
    Here's a simple resolution to the problem - if you don't like speaking to "moron robotic reps with blinders on", then don't call them, hop on google, and find the answer your self.

    And this is one of the many reasons why I want to get out of the phone support / call center environment. Its because some people need to take the blinders off themselves and realize that part of this job is to follow procedure. On the other side of the coin, I have spoken up about specific procedures, and was heard (at a former job). Why am I not there anymore? Because my metrics weren't good enough, but my 100% customer satisfaction rating wasn't good enough.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-07-09 09:21 AM
  4. blue_and_bold's Avatar
    So don't call in the future?
    Thats the point of this?
    10-07-09 09:23 AM
  5. tsguy52's Avatar
    Civic, just an FYI, if we send a phone back to the warehouse and a wipe fixes it, you will be charged FULL retail on your next bill.....Happy NOW
    That's not true.. Just something you're told so you will exhaust all troubleshooting measures lol..

    Now if the phone was actually damaged physically or by liquid, then yes full retail.

    Fun Fact: Only around 30% of returns are due to a manufacturers defect.
    10-07-09 11:42 AM
  6. AaronWasHere's Avatar
    But it is kind of fun to throw into the conversation, TS.
    10-07-09 12:08 PM
  7. tsguy52's Avatar
    But it is kind of fun to throw into the conversation, TS.
    Yeah especially for those who want to act like ******** and not let you troubleshoot the phone. They just want a warranty replacement NOW. haha.. kinda reminds me of the OP.
    10-07-09 12:12 PM
  8. bminnis's Avatar
    Man, who really has the time of the day to even waste time complaining on here about this? lol. go complain to VZW, they are the ones who need to hear this so t hey can improve it. I work for VZW and we are constantly passing feedback along to the higher ups!
    10-07-09 12:32 PM
  9. gettinthere's Avatar
    To the people who think they can "fake" their way through a wipe and just say they did one......it's 100% clear in the system if you did a wipe or not. The rep just has to look at 1 thing and can tell you're lying.
    10-07-09 12:46 PM
  10. dwood721's Avatar
    From the point of cost I don't blame VZW for making you do a wipe, and I wouldn't blame them for making you do a wipe on the phone even after you told them you had done it. It is much cheaper for VZW to troubleshoot your phone and possibly fix the issue before going through all of the steps to return and replace it.

    I am sure the amount of people that call in and just claim they already did a wipe just so they can quicken the replacement process is a pretty high number too.

    Also, how happy would you be as a customer if they fixed the issue while you were on the phone, and you didn't have to worry about waiting a few days to get a new working model?
    10-07-09 12:48 PM
  11. tsguy52's Avatar
    To the people who think they can "fake" their way through a wipe and just say they did one......it's 100% clear in the system if you did a wipe or not. The rep just has to look at 1 thing and can tell you're lying.
    What's that 1 thing?
    10-07-09 12:48 PM
  12. dwood721's Avatar
    What's that 1 thing?
    They check it for dingleberries, they know if they see them you didn't take the time to wipe
    10-07-09 12:52 PM
  13. tsguy52's Avatar
    They check it for dingleberries, they know if they see them you didn't take the time to wipe
    haha oh wow.. guess you fakers better start using 2 ply!
    10-07-09 12:54 PM
  14. gettinthere's Avatar
    What's that 1 thing?
    Last time the PRL was updated. If you wipe the phone, it goes back to "out of the box" meaning it needs to be reprogrammed. When you reprogram a phone (*228 option 1 or *22899) it updates in the system as a PRL update.
    10-07-09 12:57 PM
  15. dwood721's Avatar
    Last time the PRL was updated. If you wipe the phone, it goes back to "out of the box" meaning it needs to be reprogrammed. When you reprogram a phone (*228 option 1 or *22899) it updates in the system as a PRL update.
    So if I wanted to fake a wipe I could still just *228 the phone. A good number of times I have called tech for myself or customers that is one of the first things the rep would have me do anyway.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-07-09 01:01 PM
  16. tsguy52's Avatar
    Last time the PRL was updated. If you wipe the phone, it goes back to "out of the box" meaning it needs to be reprogrammed. When you reprogram a phone (*228 option 1 or *22899) it updates in the system as a PRL update.
    huh? Not a Blackberry.. The programming information still stays intact..
    10-07-09 01:01 PM
  17. gettinthere's Avatar
    huh? Not a Blackberry.. The programming information still stays intact..
    Not from what I've seen. I've actually done this and it updates. Not sure why it'd show different on your end.
    10-07-09 01:45 PM
  18. pkcable's Avatar
    You could just pretend to wipe.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-07-09 02:32 PM
  19. dwood721's Avatar
    When you upgrade to a new OS doesn't your DM back and then wipe your berry? If it does I can tell you for a fact that I didn't have to *228 when I did that, I only had to turn the radio back on.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-07-09 02:39 PM
  20. itsthemusic's Avatar
    Did you explain how high your CB post count was?
    It gets that way when he cries 40 times per thread he posts in.
    10-07-09 02:49 PM
  21. tcbj#AC's Avatar
    Do you follow the rules at your job? I'll bet you do. Otherwise you would not have a job. Right? No doubt if you chose to cook your fries for 2 minutes instead of three, the manager would not be happy. Of course I don't come to Burger King to tell you how to do your job.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-07-09 02:49 PM
  22. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    You could just pretend to wipe.
    If you just pretend to wipe, you & your diaper rash need to stay away from me!
    10-07-09 03:46 PM
  23. Branta's Avatar
    That's just it, I wasn't passed off. As a matter of fact I called in calm to get the phone replaced and informed the CSR I had already taken the time to do their troubleshooting steps prior to calling because this was like the 8th replacement I've had to do for this same reason, so I know what's up. The rep was just not listening.... Kind of like you aren't.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    They have orders not to listen. When you consider the number of openly dishonest users here on CB who have admitted lying to get a replacement phone, the CSRs are absolutely correct to follow a procedure laid down to detect the cheats.

    If the script says no exceptions that's what they are required to follow. In the current employment market they would be dumb to risk job security and surrender to a whining bully on the other end of a phone line. They probably get it ten times per day, and at least one of the users is trying to scam the system. One liar getting a worn but working phone past the procedure and the lucky CSR is flipping burgers.
    10-07-09 04:17 PM
  24. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    Oh my goodness - you're alive!

    Was thinking about sending you one of those dreaded PMs to see what happened to you.

    They have orders not to listen. When you consider the number of openly dishonest users here on CB who have admitted lying to get a replacement phone, the CSRs are absolutely correct to follow a procedure laid down to detect the cheats.
    Agreed - people these days always seem to want to connive their way into something - not saying that was Civic's intent, but I can see where that thought could come from.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-07-09 04:25 PM
  25. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    Here's a simple resolution to the problem - if you don't like speaking to "moron robotic reps with blinders on", then don't call them, hop on google, and find the answer your self.

    And this is one of the many reasons why I want to get out of the phone support / call center environment. Its because some people need to take the blinders off themselves and realize that part of this job is to follow procedure. On the other side of the coin, I have spoken up about specific procedures, and was heard (at a former job). Why am I not there anymore? Because my metrics weren't good enough, but my 100% customer satisfaction rating wasn't good enough.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Good example of what I'm talking about.

    I'm not calling support for their help, I'm calling them for handset replacement. How is Google going to do that?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

    Not from what I've seen. I've actually done this and it updates. Not sure why it'd show different on your end.
    You're wrong. CDMA programming does not get wiped with a security wipe. It remains enact on Blackberries.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

    So basically all you guy's consensus is that there is no "known hardware issue" with the Tour's trackball that makes it stop working horizontally? OK, sure.

    BTW, the phone was wiped before it went back... Guess what? Didn't fix the problem.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-07-09 07:11 PM
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