12-15-09 08:42 PM
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  1. gotblackberry's Avatar
    edit: states confidential info, can not comment until 11/15/2009. Sorry :P
    11-03-09 12:52 PM
  2. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    One would still be able to just remove the BOGO device and replace it with a cheap cell phone purchased off of eBay. While that wouldnt really be most profitable method, it would still work.
    I don't know how true it is, but what I was told this morning is that if you get a subsidized smartphone under the new policy, the data plan will be part of the contract. If this comes to fruition, remove the data plan & you'll be assessed an ETF as well.

    I like this as it should reduce costs for all of us.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 01:19 PM
  3. gotblackberry's Avatar
    I haven't seen anything regarding putting the data plan as part of the contract. Regarding the fee change 11/15 that is proprietary and I can't comment.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 01:50 PM
  4. Darthkuriboh's Avatar
    Yep I saw it. No, I can't comment either.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 02:26 PM
  5. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    Don't want you guys to comment - just speculating here as to how many people are going to be whining here in the coming months about how hard it is to screw VZW.
    11-03-09 02:29 PM
  6. Darthkuriboh's Avatar
    Just the dishonest ones CB needs to permaban anyway.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 02:31 PM
  7. gotblackberry's Avatar
    "Omg. I can't scam anymore! Screw Verizon, damn corporations!"

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 02:31 PM
  8. Darthkuriboh's Avatar
    Lol... Sucks to be them huh

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 02:32 PM
  9. sjsjr's Avatar
    I don't know how true it is, but what I was told this morning is that if you get a subsidized smartphone under the new policy, the data plan will be part of the contract. If this comes to fruition, remove the data plan & you'll be assessed an ETF as well.

    I like this as it should reduce costs for all of us.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Are you saying that if you break your smartphone, cant afford or don't have a different one, you can't activate and switch to an old flip phone and cancel the data portion without an ETF? Obviously you wouldn't be canceling the line in this case just the data. How is that right or fair? I could see if you cancel the data in less then a year while the phone is still under warranty but past that a lot of people could be in trouble. I don't think it is fair to charge someone an ETF because they can't afford $600 for a new phone or $30 a month for a service you cant use on the device you have already.

    Obviously what I consider fair is irrelevant and I am glad they are attempting to stop all these scams. Just because people can get away with stuff does not make it right. And even if this is going to be the new policy I keep all my old phones anyway. At least I can switch back to my Curve if my new phone breaks.
    11-03-09 02:33 PM
  10. JaunDawg's Avatar
    Doesn't make sense... You buy the phone, they do a credit check. You drop the service and pay an ETF, fine, but you're not home free, doesn't VZ still bill you for the cost of the device?
    Last edited by JaunDawg; 11-03-09 at 02:43 PM.
    11-03-09 02:40 PM
  11. leskchan's Avatar
    Data plan for smartphone and ETF are different issues.

    Yes, if you "operate" a smartphone you must have a data plan or the carrier will add it for you. You can downgrade your phone to a non-smart phone and drop the data plan.

    The ETF contract is for the based voice plan only. Add-ons, like data, text, insurance, roadside assistance, etc, are month to month only.

    This applies to all US carriers.
    11-03-09 02:42 PM
  12. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    1. They don't want your phone.
    2. What if it was lost/stolen/damaged?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    customer must pay the cost of equipment that was not yet purchased fully (meaning still in contract)
    11-03-09 02:52 PM
  13. sjsjr's Avatar
    Data plan for smartphone and ETF are different issues.

    Yes, if you "operate" a smartphone you must have a data plan or the carrier will add it for you. You can downgrade your phone to a non-smart phone and drop the data plan.

    The ETF contract is for the based voice plan only. Add-ons, like data, text, insurance, roadside assistance, etc, are month to month only.

    This applies to all US carriers.
    If I understood what he was saying, and if what Twins was told turns out to be true, these will no longer separate issues as the DATA portion would become part of the contract. To drop the DATA plan would go against the contract. Re-Read his post that I quoted. Obviously it is not this way right now. According to what his source speculated it will be in the future.
    11-03-09 02:54 PM
  14. leskchan's Avatar
    I think OP is saying the ETF fee will be higher if you start with smartphone. That's fare as you are getting a more expensive phone.

    If you downgrade your phone, you ETF fee doesn't change.
    11-03-09 03:00 PM
  15. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    I know your data plan is "considered" manditory as long as you possess a blackberry or data phone. However, if you switch to a non smart phone device, you can drop your data plan. On the other hand, if you do a bogo deal where you get free blackberries, I think you have to honor 2 years with blackberry service as well.

    Correct me if I'm wrong folks...
    11-03-09 03:02 PM
  16. diggy15's Avatar
    "Omg. I can't scam anymore! Screw Verizon, damn corporations!"

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Just go to ATT or Sprint it will take them months to catch on.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 03:03 PM
  17. leskchan's Avatar
    This is the problem with ETF amount. That's the lawsuit against the US carriers about the actual ETF has no relationship to the cost of phone and service. It's random $200 all around.

    What I think is fair to set an ETF as the difference between retail price of the phone less your out-of-pocket, which is the subsidy, and decrease proportionally over the contract period.
    Last edited by leskchan; 11-03-09 at 03:13 PM.
    11-03-09 03:08 PM
  18. Darthkuriboh's Avatar
    I think people need to stop suing over ETF's. Your getting an expensive device at a portion of the price. Be happy with that. No ETF's no subsidies.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 03:14 PM
  19. gotblackberry's Avatar
    This is the problem with ETF amount. That's the lawsuit against the US carriers about the actual ETF has no relationship to the cost of phone and service. It's random $200 all around.

    What I think is fair to set an ETF as the difference between retail price of the phone less your out-of-pocket, which is the subsidy, and decrease proportionally over the contract period.
    Is there anything in the us constitution that business have to be "fair" to you? Define fair? You choose to enter the contract. If you don't want an ETF you 1) not cancel or 2) pay full retail.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 03:43 PM
  20. leskchan's Avatar
    Is there anything in the us constitution that business have to be "fair" to you? Define fair? You choose to enter the contract. If you don't want an ETF you 1) not cancel or 2) pay full retail.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    No, it doesn't, but I personally like to be fair. In the context of ETF, fair means each party is responsible for the cost of the contract.

    Verizon is actually more than fair in charging only $350 for ETF, that's less than the actual subsidy of an expensive smartphone. No wonder people are stealing them blind with only $200 ETF.
    Last edited by leskchan; 11-03-09 at 03:51 PM.
    11-03-09 03:47 PM
  21. gotblackberry's Avatar
    No, it doesn't, but I personally like to be fair.

    Verizon is actually more than fair in charging only $350 for ETF, that's less than the actual subsidy of an expensive smartphone. No wonder people are stealing them blind with only $200 ETF.
    I personally like to be fair too and I think businesses should as a good business decision. Should consumers be able to sue because they feel the etf is "unfair?" No. Verizon had the lowest etf of any carrier ($175). People were scamming the company. Shouldn't consumers be fair too? It only makes sense Verizon would do this.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-03-09 03:52 PM
  22. leskchan's Avatar
    I personally like to be fair too and I think businesses should as a good business decision. Should consumers be able to sue because they feel the etf is "unfair?" No. Verizon had the lowest etf of any carrier ($175). People were scamming the company. Shouldn't consumers be fair too? It only makes sense Verizon would do this.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    I agree with your completely. I don't mind having an ETF of $375 for a smartphone. That's a bargain.

    That lawsuit was about a different situation with very cheap cell phones and ETF that didn't decrease over the length of the contract. ETF was intended for carrier to recoup the subsidy paid to customers, which was fair. Instead ETF was used to lock a customer.
    Last edited by leskchan; 11-03-09 at 04:26 PM.
    11-03-09 03:57 PM
  23. cmblazek's Avatar
    Had a guy call in who has had 5 different phones this year BRAND NEW PHONES!!! So fru fru fru NEW fru fru fru NEW...and so on he wanted a droid and he had a storm 1. First of all the droid is not even out yet Second of all my sup and I offered him a a replacement not a multi fru. Then the guy was so pissed he wanted to cancel..so we sent him to cancel and he did then he had the nerve to tell customer service ok well get me back to tech support so i can get that device so i can atleast sell it on ebay!!!! Are you serious?!?!
    11-03-09 04:24 PM
  24. cenloe's Avatar
    I don't know how true it is, but what I was told this morning is that if you get a subsidized smartphone under the new policy, the data plan will be part of the contract. If this comes to fruition, remove the data plan & you'll be assessed an ETF as well.

    I like this as it should reduce costs for all of us.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Now that would be interesting. To be honest, I'm surprised that more carriers haven't already made this policy.
    11-03-09 04:27 PM
  25. cenloe's Avatar
    I know your data plan is "considered" manditory as long as you possess a blackberry or data phone. However, if you switch to a non smart phone device, you can drop your data plan. On the other hand, if you do a bogo deal where you get free blackberries, I think you have to honor 2 years with blackberry service as well.

    Correct me if I'm wrong folks...
    No, thats currently not the policy. I just upgraded and used the BOGO back in August. I added a line to get another Tour for my wife. We had just upgraded her line in July, she chose the Ozone and she didnt like it. So when I upgraded to the Tour she decided that she also wanted one. I added another line and then sold the Ozone for $200 when I only paid $50. The extra line now has an old Samsung on it and no data plan.
    11-03-09 04:34 PM
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