05-24-09 06:42 PM
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  1. ls1norcal's Avatar
    Unconscious Carroll man found after 11-hour search - New Philadelphia, OH - The Times-Reporter

    Thats just the latest news story. I remember a story a few months ago where someone was missing, and it took Verizon DAYS to send a technician to a tower to help find a missing person. Luckily (for Verizon) the person missing was dead before the authorities requested Verizon's help. That combined with them being the only powerhouse carrier to completely lock down GPS unless you pay for their VZNav, I can see the news story now...."Family of 4 dies, but would have been okay if they could have been found with the GPS receiver in their phones..."
    05-23-09 11:23 PM
  2. fsafranek's Avatar
    Rather than wasting time talking to the Verizon operator the police should have elevated it to that
    person's supervisor. Don't waste time when you encounter an obstacle, go around it.

    It's my understanding that GPS is not locked down on the Storm with or without vzNavigator.
    Last edited by fsafranek; 05-23-09 at 11:29 PM.
    05-23-09 11:27 PM
  3. amosrock's Avatar
    Its ridiculous that people are complaining about this...how the **** is verizon supposed to know that someone is in trouble? I could call up right now and say that its an emergency and they have to turn my phone on right now...and you know what they'd say...ok pay your bill. (Well...i pay my bills on time so they wouldn't say that but you get my point)

    The fact is e911 is available regardless of whether or not you're behind on your bill and they just went through the wrong procedure. There are certain things the police should've done in order to locate the man using e911 and instead they spent god knows how long screwing around with customer service. Verizon is not at fault here...a man who didn't pay his bill and crappy police work are.
    05-23-09 11:35 PM
  4. scurvydlicious's Avatar
    Rather than wasting time talking to the Verizon operator the police should have elevated it to that
    person's supervisor. Don't waste time when you encounter an obstacle, go around it.

    It's my understanding that GPS is not locked down on the Storm with or without vzNavigator.
    Nah, the police called the wrong people. From the story, sounds like the police officer contacted financial services. He should have contacted Verizon's law enforcement resource team... The officer went through the wrong channel, but the financial services rep should have transfered him to the law enforcement resource team. So mistakes were made on both sides.

    Besides, who's to say he even had his cell phone on him if it was already disconnected due to non-pay?
    05-23-09 11:36 PM
  5. trimdawg's Avatar
    this has already been discussed,
    05-23-09 11:37 PM
  6. trimdawg's Avatar
    05-23-09 11:37 PM
  7. lastraid's Avatar
    While 911 will work wether service is acitve is not really the problem. If anyone should be sued it is the police for not knowing this. Now with said, if this guys phone was turned off, 911 cannot be traced and VZW cannot remotely turn on a phone.
    05-24-09 12:04 AM
  8. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    I foresee the OP getting beat to death by ******** monkeys wearing plaid overalls and carrying billy clubs.
    LOL!!!

    The sad thing is, I can too.

    PT Barnum supposedly had a word to describe people who believe such tripe. Podunk town LEO expects to call a company & have said company believe he is an LEO by his word only - when there are established channels for LE to get the info easily. And the dope journalist isn't even smart enough to realize the phone doesn't need to have service for E911 to function.

    The word attributed to PT Barnum which would fit anyone who would belive such tripe, then claim a lawsuit was imminent? SUCKER.

    Oh, learn to spell, too - it is foresee - 3 E's in that.

    Posted from my SnifferBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-24-09 12:05 AM
  9. gvillager's Avatar
    Did anyone read the comments section in the news article link? HILARIOUS!

    I don't care what the circumstances are. Law enforcement should only be able to track someone if a 911 call is initiated or if it's ordered by a judge.

    Both the CSR & Sheriff are idiots. The Sheriff should know what the proper procedures are to get this information from VZW. And the rep should have directed the Sheriff to the law enforcement team.

    The rep probably didn't believe that they were talking to the Sheriff and just thought it was the customer trying to pull a fast one to get their phone turned on.
    05-24-09 12:32 AM
  10. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    I don't care what the circumstances are. Law enforcement should only be able to track someone if a 911 call is initiated or if it's ordered by a judge.
    Exactly - anything else & we're all screwed.

    Actually, I need to figure out a way to disable E911 on my devices, then sell it as a fix - I'd probably make a fortune.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-24-09 12:43 AM
  11. scurvydlicious's Avatar
    Exactly - anything else & we're all screwed.

    Actually, I need to figure out a way to disable E911 on my devices, then sell it as a fix - I'd probably make a fortune.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    I'd buy your mod.
    05-24-09 12:50 AM
  12. noaim's Avatar
    I would like them to be able to find me if I was not ok
    05-24-09 01:38 AM
  13. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    I would like them to be able to find me if I was not ok
    This would be fine - problem is, they can track you anytime they want & you'd never know.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-24-09 01:47 AM
  14. noaim's Avatar
    This would be fine - problem is, they can track you anytime they want & you'd never know.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

    and yes I agree this is a issue...

    definitely but I definitely do see the need for law enforcement to be able to access that data based on certain situations
    05-24-09 01:54 AM
  15. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    But who determines those situations?

    Every year, more & more people are gaining a shortsightedness that makes them blindly happy to give up liberty, freedom & privacy for safety & convenience.

    Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety - Benjamin Franklin

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-24-09 03:53 AM
  16. noaim's Avatar
    But who determines those situations?

    Every year, more & more people are gaining a shortsightedness that makes them blindly happy to give up liberty, freedom & privacy for safety & convenience.

    Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety - Benjamin Franklin

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com


    its not just a little safety though.. its the safety of millions of people..

    there has been multiple bad criminals along with people who were stuck in ditches in there car and many other situations that it helped...

    now for them to simply be able to track me whenever they want is a problem..

    but tracking some guy who just robbed a bank I have no problem with lol
    05-24-09 03:56 AM
  17. sojmama's Avatar
    But who determines those situations?

    Every year, more & more people are gaining a shortsightedness that makes them blindly happy to give up liberty, freedom & privacy for safety & convenience.

    Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety - Benjamin Franklin

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    I'm with you!

    And an app to disable E911? Fantastic idea

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-24-09 04:11 AM
  18. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    its not just a little safety though.. its the safety of millions of people..

    there has been multiple bad criminals along with people who were stuck in ditches in there car and many other situations that it helped...

    now for them to simply be able to track me whenever they want is a problem..

    but tracking some guy who just robbed a bank I have no problem with lol
    It's the liberty of those millions.

    We want safety? Take away my cars, my knives & don't let me go camping in the wilderness. Lock away the alcohol & cigars. Don't let me light a fire. Put walls between the humans & the animals.

    It'd be just like prison.

    Two out of he four major wireless carriers are already purported to track & record the movements of their customers. It would only take an executive order to make it four of four & all of us would be watched all the time.

    The people who keep crying for GPS on their phones only want to amplify that.

    I wonder how we ever got along without these stupid devices & the shortsighted sheep want even more two-way interactive tracking available.

    Just food for thought - I am not picking on you, Noaim.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-24-09 05:05 AM
  19. sreneel77's Avatar
    I had two cops come into my store recently and wanted me to pull up a customers account and give them information on a customer. I informed them they'd have to go through our legal department and yea, I was pretty sure something like that would require a court order too.
    When people sign a contract with a company, they do so with the understanding that we won't give out their information to just anyone because they ask for it.
    I understand emergency situations, but this isn't CSI or Law & Order, there is still a process for everything.
    All phones manufactured now are required by law to have the E911, which mean if the phone is turned on, emergency services and the phone company once they legally communicate properly can find where a phone is at whether or not the phone has service. There is also a little thing on Verizon phones that customers can switch themselves that turns the location on, which means you can one use VZ Nav on the phone of course but also, ooh this is exciting folks, you can do parent/child chaperone on the phones. What does that mean to you? It means you can track from your account on line where that phone is at so long as it is turned on and that has been downloaded to the phone.
    So yes there are laws that for everyone's rights must be followed but you as consumers have options as well. Whether or not you choose to use these options is completely up to you though.
    05-24-09 05:34 AM
  20. Branta's Avatar
    Actually, I need to figure out a way to disable E911 on my devices, then sell it as a fix - I'd probably make a fortune.
    As you know all too well, the basic location service is derived by triangulation from the tower side. The only way to prevent it is to shut down the phone - and that is cheaper than a third party application.
    05-24-09 06:57 AM
  21. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    As you know all too well, the basic location service is derived by triangulation from the tower side. The only way to prevent it is to shut down the phone - and that is cheaper than a third party application.
    Very true - but with aGPS, this makes it all the more accurate. I do know that the only way to have your movement return to complete anonymity is to ditch the phone altogether. I'd like to be able to disable aGPS, so at best, tracking isn't that accurate.

    This is about 5 years old, but it is short & indicates some devices allow you to shut off the aGPS - unfortunately, it is RIM's policy to not allow it to be disabled in BlackBerrys.

    SpywareInfo : Cell Phone Spying.

    Bear in mind - I am law-abiding. I possess a CCW/CCP with the full blessing of law-enforcement.

    Posted from my StealthBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-24-09 01:42 PM
  22. amosrock's Avatar
    I frickin love how all of you are like "I don't want the government being able to track me...blah blah blah"

    People...unless you happen to be robbing banks, dealing drugs in record numbers, or murdering people I really don't think the police give a flying crap about you. Who cares if the police can track you...are you that paranoid that the little nugget of weed in your car is going to get you tracked down by the cops? Sheesh.

    And yes...I love e911...If i'm in trouble and don't know where I am or can't speak well enough to tell 911 where I am...I want them to be able to find me. And I find it hard to believe that you'd rather be left for dead with no one able to find you than have e911 on your phone.
    05-24-09 02:37 PM
  23. ok4a56's Avatar
    And yes...I love e911...If i'm in trouble and don't know where I am or can't speak well enough to tell 911 where I am...I want them to be able to find me. And I find it hard to believe that you'd rather be left for dead with no one able to find you than have e911 on your phone.

    Not every 911 center can track cell phones, and even if they can, not 100% are phase II (able to get gps location). We can track about 80% of the cell phone callers that call into our center. Heck we still have places in Ohio that does not have land-line 911, let alone cell phone tracking.

    And with NG911 coming down the tubes, here soon everyone will expect us to track your cell phone, get your text messages and video/pictures.

    Fun times ahead.
    05-24-09 02:42 PM
  24. lastraid's Avatar
    I also belive with cell phones that if you maintain a number say in california and move to another state, if you call 911 you get a 911 center in the area the number comes from.
    05-24-09 02:47 PM
  25. mab4285's Avatar
    I want to see the government agents that have nothing better to do with their time than track people via their cell phones....

    Believe me, I know plenty of law enforcement officers...that's the last thing they want to do with their time, let alone risk their shield for it.
    05-24-09 02:49 PM
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