12-20-09 10:38 PM
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  1. tony bag o donuts's Avatar
    When Verizon raised fees not in the plan I received a letter from them stating I had until xx date to cancel my contract with them. If I didn't call cs or send the paperwork, I waived my right with the additional fee.
    I forgot what it was in regards to. This was about 3 yrs ago when PA was raising taxes on cell phone carriers and their consumers....
    10-12-09 02:30 PM
  2. leskchan's Avatar
    When Verizon raised fees not in the plan I received a letter from them stating I had until xx date to cancel my contract with them. If I didn't call cs or send the paperwork, I waived my right with the additional fee..
    Then you should exercise your right to either opt-in to remain on Verizon and opt-out to another carrier.
    10-12-09 02:36 PM
  3. tony bag o donuts's Avatar
    Then you should exercise your right to either opt-in to remain on Verizon and opt-out to another carrier.
    Yep I did...it was a 4 cent surcharge or something....

    Do you know how I get things from verizon? I just ask.
    Why did your phone stop working? My 4 yr old said it was thirsty.
    Why do you want to upgrade your phone? because my wife has been through 9 voyagers (true). Okay no problem.

    Sometimes they say can't help. Other times they can. I'm tired of people thinking they pull a fast one. In the end, the house always wins.
    10-12-09 02:41 PM
  4. DMR6186's Avatar
    Well, somehow that person qualified for it. Either way, it's not comparable to getting out of a VZW contract without an ETF using a reason that is clearly stated in the contract as being valid. Wow.......
    No he did not qualify but he was able to find a loophole to figure out how to get these free benefits. That means your tax dollars were going to some lazy scumbag, which means taxes have to be raised in order to compensate for the growing usage of these free services.

    Same with VZW. If too many people abuse something that was meant to HELP people, then they will have to make changes to their services, be it raising prices or changing some policy that was once a benefit to the customers.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-12-09 03:13 PM
  5. Alenee83xx's Avatar
    Look, this isn't disability or welfare or whatnot. If the OP finds a legitimate way to get out of contract, that does not break a law, then there is no reason for any debate! Get it through your thick skulls people.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-12-09 03:55 PM
  6. fecurtis's Avatar
    lol @ this thread.

    I love the people who are complaining of people "gaming" the system.

    Oh boo hoo! People are picking on a MASSIVE CORPORATION.

    If it effected the bottom line enough and hurt their business, Verizon wouldn't allow it, period.
    10-12-09 04:02 PM
  7. leskchan's Avatar
    If it effected the bottom line enough and hurt their business, Verizon wouldn't allow it, period.
    Not true, there is no real bottomline for Verizon, credit card companies, or businesses. They just make up the difference due to fraud and abuse by price increase or fee hike or reduced services.

    Again, wouldn't you like Verizon to lower your monthly fee for a change. Not likely when you have to subsidize frauds and abuses.
    Last edited by leskchan; 10-12-09 at 04:15 PM.
    10-12-09 04:06 PM
  8. AG212's Avatar
    I find it funny the lengths people would go through to get themselves a new phone.

    One should really just accept the purchase they made in the past until its actually time for an upgrade, or pay full price, or buy it through other means.

    If a person really hated the phone they got so much that it warranted them to scan the contract for any loopholes, I would have highly recommended taking some use of the 30 day return policy to them.
    10-12-09 04:10 PM
  9. DMR6186's Avatar
    Look, this isn't disability or welfare or whatnot. If the OP finds a legitimate way to get out of contract, that does not break a law, then there is no reason for any debate! Get it through your thick skulls people.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    It's called a comparison.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-12-09 04:14 PM
  10. tony bag o donuts's Avatar
    Not true, there is no real bottomline for Verizon, credit card companies, or businesses. They just make up the difference due to fraud and abuse by price increase or fee hike or reduced services.

    Again, wouldn't you like Verizon to lower your monthly fee for a change. Not likely when you have to subsidize frauds and abuses.
    Same when I get a rebate from insurance company for my cars. Less claims in a given year, the lower the rate and the higher rebate I get back.

    I find it funny the lengths people would go through to get themselves a new phone.

    One should really just accept the purchase they made in the past until its actually time for an upgrade, or pay full price, or buy it through other means.

    If a person really hated the phone they got so much that it warranted them to scan the contract for any loopholes, I would have highly recommended taking some use of the 30 day return policy to them.
    Agreed.
    10-12-09 04:19 PM
  11. fecurtis's Avatar
    Not true, there is no real bottomline for Verizon, credit card companies, or businesses. They just make up the difference due to fraud and abuse by price increase or fee hike or reduced services.
    Congratulations you've described every industry and company on the planet.

    By your proxy, no company has a bottomline, which makes 0 sense.

    It isn't that hard for Verizon to realize how much money it loses by giving 2 year contracts out early and clever customers who read between the lines. If they were concerned about it...reword the contracts and dump the policy allowing users to get the 2 year price after 1 year...it's not hard.
    10-12-09 04:25 PM
  12. leskchan's Avatar
    Congratulations you've described every industry and company on the planet.

    By your proxy, no company has a bottomline, which makes 0 sense.
    You are taking the word "bottomline" out of context and yet made no argument to present your point. All you were able to do was attack the wordings of the post. Present your point.

    Yes, all businesses on the planet are for profit. Do you think Sprint or Apple or Cheveron operate differently. They will have to pass along cost of frauds/abuses back to the customers to maintain the "bottomline profit margin".
    Last edited by leskchan; 10-12-09 at 04:42 PM.
    10-12-09 04:32 PM
  13. leskchan's Avatar
    It isn't that hard for Verizon to realize how much money it loses by giving 2 year contracts out early and clever customers who read between the lines. If they were concerned about it...reword the contracts and dump the policy allowing users to get the 2 year price after 1 year...it's not hard.
    And yet the pricing or the incentive given a new is based on the length of the contract. What is the bottomline for Verizon? They can implement your easy idea without incurring additional cost.
    10-12-09 04:40 PM
  14. fecurtis's Avatar
    You are taking the word "bottomline" out of context and yet didn't make any argument to present your point. All you were able to do was attack the wordings of the post. Present your point.

    Yes, all businesses on the planet are for profit. Do you think Sprint or Apple or Cheveron operate differently. They will have to pass along cost of frauds/abuses back to the customers to maintain the "bottomline profit margin".
    First of all, no all businesses on the planet are not for profit.

    However, all businesses have a bottomline and yes I understand they have to pass the costs of frauds and abuses onto customers.

    However, in many cases, fraud and abuses are preventable (in the specific case of Verizon), by simply saying no to many people wanting upgrades when they're only 4-5 months into their contract or eating the cost upfront since in the long run VZW will more than likely be making a lot of money off these folks who are in contracts.

    Sure VZW can pass off the costs they'd otherwise eat to the consumers...but how often do you see Verizon increasing rates? They also have to stay competitive with the competition. And if you think these phones are expensive for Verizon, you're fooling yourself (I can only imagine the profit margin if you were to buy one of those phones at full retail). How do you think Verizon can easily afford to throw these Buy One Get One free promos? Look at RIM's and Verizon's earnings...these "frauds" aren't hurting their bottom line and their passing of costs don't seem to be effecting us too much as their prices are still reasonable when compared to the competition.
    10-12-09 04:42 PM
  15. busterw's Avatar
    I asked my store saturday about getting the storm2 prior to my new every two being up. They said I could just agree to extending my contract for 2 years.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    10-12-09 04:47 PM
  16. leskchan's Avatar
    Fraud and abuses are preventable. Same with return, theft, or inventory shrinkage. Theses events are already accounted in the original pricing scheme as a percentage to the cost of sales.

    How often does Verizon increases rates? Very rare. Why? Because their pricing is right on, accouting for cost of sales (fraud etc).

    How often does Verison decrease rates? Never, as far as can remember? Why? Because their pricing is right on, accouting for cost of sales (fraud etc).

    By reducting abusing/fraud (or other cost of sales), then they can be even more competitive with their pricing. Whatever the cost of cell phone, or kickbacks from manufacturers, is part of the pricing scheme already.
    Last edited by leskchan; 10-12-09 at 04:56 PM.
    10-12-09 04:52 PM
  17. jhagan09's Avatar
    this may only apply to some people but vzw just told me since i lost service in my are i can drop my contract with no ETF. for those of u who want to leave VZW
    10-12-09 05:27 PM
  18. Alenee83xx's Avatar
    Scanning the contract for loopholes is not morally wrong OR fraud. Nor is it "going to alot of trouble" if you know what to look for and are smart enough to stand up for your rights in regards to the contract.

    I for one have no problem with VZW I love them! Have 5 lines, 4 with data service! My bill is what it is and I would never leave them for another carrier. Over the years I have had a few of my upgrades moved up from their orignial dates, (some times as much as 6mos sooner then it was supposed to be) Many replacements and multi-fru's, credits, ect... they have wonderful CS and all the reps Ive delt with are awesome.

    However, I still agree that if the OP has figured out a way to legally excersize his rights of the contract he signed, then more power to him!
    10-12-09 08:29 PM
  19. 1812dave's Avatar
    Scanning the contract for loopholes is not morally wrong OR fraud. Nor is it "going to alot of trouble" if you know what to look for and are smart enough to stand up for your rights in regards to the contract.

    I for one have no problem with VZW I love them! Have 5 lines, 4 with data service! My bill is what it is and I would never leave them for another carrier. Over the years I have had a few of my upgrades moved up from their orignial dates, (some times as much as 6mos sooner then it was supposed to be) Many replacements and multi-fru's, credits, ect... they have wonderful CS and all the reps Ive delt with are awesome.

    However, I still agree that if the OP has figured out a way to legally excersize his rights of the contract he signed, then more power to him!
    I agree with you. Furthermore, the constant reference to "loophole" by those who feel it's morally reprehensible (hogwash!!) to avail oneself of the PROVISIONS of a contract irritates me because the term "loophole" carries with it a negative connotation. How about if we use the less inflammatory term, "provision" for "loophole" and all the moralists can perhaps get a grip on their take-no-prisoners approach to this subject. There is simply NOTHING wrong with following the provisions of the contract's "small print", which contains various and sundry PROVISIONS.
    10-12-09 08:38 PM
  20. CJBullitt's Avatar
    Is it really worth all that? I mean for real if you HAVE to have a S2 just pay for it or wait for your NE2 like everyone else.
    10-12-09 08:41 PM
  21. Alenee83xx's Avatar
    Is it really worth all that? I mean for real if you HAVE to have a S2 just pay for it or wait for your NE2 like everyone else.
    Its not really all that much work.... not if you are smart
    10-12-09 09:07 PM
  22. Alenee83xx's Avatar
    Hmmmmm....

    How many people hire a tax attorney or go to a major tax firm and PAY them to find every little "loophole" to get you out of paying more taxes or to get a bigger refund? Why dont those of you on your moral high-horses just pay what the government says you owe, no questions asked. H3ll send them some extra just for good measure!
    10-12-09 09:10 PM
  23. AG212's Avatar
    I would like someone to point out where in the quoted part of the contract in the OP it states directly that one may enact this section if one wishes to rid themselves of a contract for the purpose of purchasing a new phone at two year contract price upon reinstating the contract which you just opted out of under the exact same terms.

    If you cant, Im afraid thats using contract wording to your advantage out of the context of which it was intended.

    i.e, loophole.
    10-12-09 09:39 PM
  24. fecurtis's Avatar
    I would like someone to point out where in the quoted part of the contract in the OP it states directly that one may enact this section if one wishes to rid themselves of a contract for the purpose of purchasing a new phone at two year contract price upon reinstating the contract which you just opted out of under the exact same terms.

    If you cant, Im afraid thats using contract wording to your advantage out of the context of which it was intended.

    i.e, loophole.
    It's clearly a loophole and he's clearly exploiting it to his advantage.

    People do it with taxes all the time, who cares. Verizon won't go belly up over it. The ETA is meant to be an incentive to not jump ship...the OP isn't jumping ship so who cares? It won't hurt Verizon that much.
    10-12-09 10:07 PM
  25. CJBullitt's Avatar
    Its not really all that much work.... not if you are smart
    Oh well more power to ya then

    Oh and kudos on your avatar
    Last edited by GT_Bullitt; 10-12-09 at 10:24 PM.
    10-12-09 10:19 PM
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