05-27-09 07:12 PM
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  1. Hurricane2k9's Avatar
    I'm not trying to start a flame war. I love Verizon's network, don't get me wrong. But there are three things I can think of where wi-fi would be nice.

    1) You're in a place where you get a bad cellular signal but you can get a great wi-fi signal. With UMA, you'll have five-bar quality if I'm not mistaken.

    2) You're in another country and want to make a phone call. If you've got just CDMA, you're out of luck. If you've got a world phone, Verizon will rob you blind with intl roaming charges. So you use UMA to make free calls from a wifi hotspot.

    3) Even without UMA, you could still use Skype to make cheap phone calls over wifi (you COULD use the data connection, except the aforementioned robbery would be even worse)

    Yes, one could use a laptop or netbook with skype and be fine, but sometimes you don't want to lug around your computer. Or you might not even have it on you (whereas people almost always have their phones on them). So while it's not essential that Verizon get wi-fi, it would be appreciated (especially if they offered UMA).
    05-17-09 09:17 AM
  2. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    UMA is not available with verizon but I agree. U cant call CDMA "world" technology and then cut out the single best feature for getting data globally!

    GSM BBs don't omitt wifi, AND THEY ARE GLOBAL! CDMA is NOT and its omitted! Doesn't make sense to me!

    But I'm sure someones going to flame and call us beggers and bottom feeders pretty soon so watch out, lol
    05-17-09 09:32 AM
  3. spasmonaut's Avatar
    None of the CDMA BlackBerrys have WiFi? Wow, I never really even noticed. Man that does suck. I finally got my first BlackBerry just this past Christmas with T-Mobile after I switched back from ATT. It had been a long time coming as I was going to get myself a 7100t back in the day when I still worked at T-Mobile, or a 7290, but those days came and went. I love my Pearl Flip and using UMA is sweet. Sorry to rub it in, but I feel for you guys.
    05-17-09 10:33 AM
  4. Hurricane2k9's Avatar
    UMA is not available with verizon but I agree. U cant call CDMA "world" technology and then cut out the single best feature for getting data globally!

    GSM BBs don't omitt wifi, AND THEY ARE GLOBAL! CDMA is NOT and its omitted! Doesn't make sense to me!

    But I'm sure someones going to flame and call us beggers and bottom feeders pretty soon so watch out, lol
    The V doesn't have UMA because I don't think any of their phones have wifi. It's a chicken or the egg type of problem. Would VZW have to make it available to bring wifi, or would wifi make them bring UMA? ****, I wouldn't mind paying an extra 5 or 10 a month for UMA.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-17-09 10:44 AM
  5. scurvydlicious's Avatar
    The V doesn't have UMA because I don't think any of their phones have wifi. It's a chicken or the egg type of problem. Would VZW have to make it available to bring wifi, or would wifi make them bring UMA? ****, I wouldn't mind paying an extra 5 or 10 a month for UMA.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Wow. I guess their website that says the Touch Pro and Touch Diamond and the Samsung Omnia and Saga have wi-fi is false advertising, since, according to you, they have no wi-fi phones? Maybe we should sue.
    05-17-09 11:10 AM
  6. Hurricane2k9's Avatar
    Wow. I guess their website that says the Touch Pro and Touch Diamond and the Samsung Omnia and Saga have wi-fi is false advertising, since, according to you, they have no wi-fi phones? Maybe we should sue.
    Read more closely. I said that "I don't think" they have wifi phones. Meaning that "I am not certain, but I believe" that they don't have wifi phones. No need to act so hostile, you're behaving as if I insulted your girlfriend or something.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-17-09 11:17 AM
  7. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    The V doesn't have UMA because I don't think any of their phones have wifi. It's a chicken or the egg type of problem. Would VZW have to make it available to bring wifi, or would wifi make them bring UMA? ****, I wouldn't mind paying an extra 5 or 10 a month for UMA.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    i doubt it... AT&T is GSM and their berries have wifi yet they still dont support UMA. It would be sweet if vzw did get wifi and then also support it tho. THats a bit too much to ask for right now...
    05-17-09 11:57 AM
  8. blopez24's Avatar
    I think we should be happy that Verizon will begin to support Wi-fi. Baby steps please. Lets get wi-fi then people can complain about not having uma.
    05-17-09 12:07 PM
  9. tehBrad's Avatar
    Also another defense is that more and more airlines are putting wifi on planes for a cheap one time per flight charge

    I dont really care about wifi though i would barely use.
    05-17-09 12:10 PM
  10. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    Read more closely. I said that "I don't think" they have wifi phones. Meaning that "I am not certain, but I believe" that they don't have wifi phones. No need to act so hostile, you're behaving as if I insulted your girlfriend or something.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    u have only 38 post so u still dont know. The vzw loyalist here take their carrier very VERY serious! They'll call you a bottom feeder fairly quickly if you insult their carrier! Trust me, I'm already on their hitlist

    I think its quite funny actually... So don't worry, u have us normal people here to balance it out a bit
    05-17-09 12:11 PM
  11. Hurricane2k9's Avatar
    u have only 38 post so u still dont know. The vzw loyalist here take their carrier very VERY serious! They'll call you a bottom feeder fairly quickly if you insult their carrier! Trust me, I'm already on their hitlist

    I think its quite funny actually... So don't worry, u have us normal people here to balance it out a bit
    Heh, yeah I've noticed (I do a fair bit of lurking). Again, Verizon's a great network. If they had UMA and didn't lock down GPS, then I would probably never use another carrier.
    05-17-09 12:39 PM
  12. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    I think we should be happy that Verizon will begin to support Wi-fi. Baby steps please. Lets get wi-fi then people can complain about not having uma.
    haha, I was thinking the same thing! Rome wasn't built in a day!

    is that how the saying goes

    Heh, yeah I've noticed (I do a fair bit of lurking). Again, Verizon's a great network. If they had UMA and didn't lock down GPS, then I would probably never use another carrier.
    shoot, if verizon did data/voice together along with what u said, I'd never switch! Its annoying to be on a call for an hour, hang up, and then have every message in the world hit your phone at the same time to the point of jamming it and requiring a battery pull! Out of all my beefs, this is the biggest! I dont complain about it however because this is a proven CDMA issue, not a verizon issue. The GPS and wifi still on the other hand....... is not!
    Last edited by RicanMedic78; 05-17-09 at 12:51 PM.
    05-17-09 12:46 PM
  13. gotblackberry's Avatar
    This wifi discussion is really getting old.
    05-17-09 12:57 PM
  14. scurvydlicious's Avatar
    Read more closely. I said that "I don't think" they have wifi phones. Meaning that "I am not certain, but I believe" that they don't have wifi phones. No need to act so hostile, you're behaving as if I insulted your girlfriend or something.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    I'm not hostile at all. Just posting the facts. If you are not certain, or you don't think, or you're not sure, maybe you should find out before posting.

    u have only 38 post so u still dont know. The vzw loyalist here take their carrier very VERY serious! They'll call you a bottom feeder fairly quickly if you insult their carrier! Trust me, I'm already on their hitlist

    I think its quite funny actually... So don't worry, u have us normal people here to balance it out a bit
    I'm not a fanboy nor a loyalist. I could care less about Verizon Wireless. I just think it's silly that people come on here and cry and complain about Verizon locking gps down, or stealing their money, or being crooks, or ripping people off... If it's that big of a deal, leave. How hard is that? Verizon is not the only wireless company in the US. Then there are people that act like Verizon is the only company that doesn't have a CDMA wi-fi enabled Blackberry, like it's Verizon's fault. Yet Sprint doesn't have CDMA wi-fi enabled Blackberry, nor does Bell, nor does US Cellular, nor did Alltel... There isn't a CDMA wi-fi enabled Blackberry offered ( yet ) by an CDMA carrier, not just Verizon Wireless. If I wanted UMA support so badly, I'd go with TMO. Or if I only wanted wi-fi, I'd go with AT&T. But since I'd rather have good coverage, a great network, 3G, no dropped calls ( from my expierence, I'm sure others do have dropped calls ) and great customer service, I choose to be with Verizon, and I don't cry about not having stuff that other carriers do, because if I wanted it bad enough, I would be with the other carriers.
    05-17-09 01:55 PM
  15. SilverLight98's Avatar
    For the most part you do make a valid point here. As it happens, Verizon has a device that is absolutely outstanding for Wi-Fi. It is called the Saga and it is made by Samsung.

    I have carried the device and you do give up a little as far as the seamless integration that a BlackBerry has but it does have a solid Wi-Fi experience. You will not, to my knowledge have UMA, but the Wi-Fi access is included in your data plan.

    I will be posting more information about the Wi-Fi Devices in a later thread today.
    But there aren't any BlackBerry devices with Wi-Fi..... that's the problem

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-17-09 03:08 PM
  16. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    I'm not a fanboy nor a loyalist. I could care less about Verizon Wireless.
    then it doesnt apply to you

    I just think it's silly that people come on here and cry and complain about Verizon locking gps down, or stealing their money, or being crooks, or ripping people off... If it's that big of a deal, leave. How hard is that?
    if that was the solution to everything, then we shouldn't complain about ANYTHING and live in a passive society where corporate america can shove anything down our throats and we have to accept it or move on

    Verizon is not the only wireless company in the US.
    for some its the best option, sometimes the only option! Not my case but definitely the best option.

    Then there are people that act like Verizon is the only company that doesn't have a CDMA wi-fi enabled Blackberry, like it's Verizon's fault.
    just their confirmation of a CDMA wifi berry in the pipeline shows that it was always possobile! The radios havent changed, just the pactice! What does that tell you?

    Yet Sprint doesn't have CDMA wi-fi enabled Blackberry, nor does Bell, nor does US Cellular, nor did Alltel... There isn't a CDMA wi-fi enabled Blackberry offered ( yet ) by an CDMA carrier, not just Verizon Wireless.
    That may just be a RIM cost saving issue

    If I wanted UMA support so badly, I'd go with TMO.
    UMA is a very nice option, but not good enough to lose a good 3g signal for.

    Or if I only wanted wi-fi, I'd go with AT&T. But since I'd rather have good coverage, a great network, 3G, no dropped calls ( from my expierence, I'm sure others do have dropped calls ) and great customer service, I choose to be with Verizon, and I don't cry about not having stuff that other carriers do, because if I wanted it bad enough, I would be with the other carriers.
    I agree... and when the first berry comes with wifi this september, you'll be wreeping the benefits of the complaints of others that made it happen. Its not crying, its complaining! And as a customer, its our right and out duty to complain when we see something wrong with services rendered. It doesnt mean we hate the company, it doesnt mean we want to switch immediately! It just means that we are telling the company that we as paying customers feel we are entitled to have based on the competition. If they choose not to do it, then thats fine, we move on. They will adjust based on #s. But we have to voice our concerns. If we didn't, there would be no movement or initiate for change.

    As far as GPS goes however, that falls into more of a legal issue as opposed to just a desire from customers like wifi is.
    05-17-09 04:36 PM
  17. blopez24's Avatar
    Whats UMA?
    05-17-09 04:50 PM
  18. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    Here is what phone scoop has on UMA:

    Unlicensed Mobile Access (UMA) provides access to cellular mobile voice and data services over unlicensed spectrum technologies, such Bluetooth or Wi-Fi (802.11).

    A UMA phone will use a cellular networks (GSM, CDMA, etc.) when out and about, and automatically switch to a UMA-enabled Bluetooth or Wi-Fi local network when in range, such as at home or in the office.

    In local mode, a complete, virtual GSM or CDMA connection is "tunneled" to the carrier via the Bluetooth or Wi-Fi connection and the Internet. This allows seamless, transparent use of all services at all times, including voice, messaging, and data services.

    This hybrid approach allows fulls mobility, while offering consumers better coverage, faster data rates, and lower service costs when using the local network.

    The technology can also lower infrastructure costs for carriers, by reducing load on networks in densely populated areas, and reducing the need for towers in sparsely-populated residential areas.
    now... because this is a cease fire

    do u know if 802.11n is something UMA technology can take advantage of? I know it will work regardless since N freq is backward compatible with ab/g, but I wonder if mobile phones can benefit from N router technology and in what way other than obvious faster web speed...
    05-17-09 05:09 PM
  19. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    Again - people seem to miss a fundamental issue here. Things like WiFi as extra features that have nothing to do with what anyone originally signed up for and has nothing in the way pf profit for any company.

    You might as well be ticked off at Ford for not offering personal computer functionality in their cars. After all, the average Ford has more computing power than any home computer. Then again, there could be a profit motive with a PC in a car - $2000 option anyone?

    As far as GPS goes however, that falls into more of a legal issue as opposed to just a desire from customers like wifi is.
    To continually state it is a legal issue, when all two cases were tossed out of court before being heard, is extremely foolish.

    To have WiFi on a phone requires that the phone manufacturer build it into their phones. Some dummies continue to claim VZW blocks the manufacturers from adding WiFi - and a more ludicrous claim is that WiFi exists but is turned off. These same people then fail to acknowledge that VZW has offered WiFi capable devices for years, but like other CDMA carriers, cannot offer a WiFi BlackBerry none are made.

    You can say you don't want WinMo - fine - but then again, there are many things WinMo has that BlackBerry may never have. The only thing BlackBerry has that WinMo doesn't have is push email - and that deficiency has been tossed with data packages and email apps that check the server for you.

    BlackBerry devices have slower data connections because all data traffic must be routed through RIM servers. There have been many instances where RIM servers or connectivity went down & BlackBerry users were minus email, data, messenger, everything. During these failures, WinMo/Palm/Symbian phones were still humming, delivering email and data to millions. The BlackBerry users got to twist & spin in the wind.

    Go look at the things WinMo or iPhone or Palm offers. If you want those things, you need to get a WinMo or iPhone or Palm. WiFi is similar - if you want it badly enough, you make the change. If I wanted iPhone, I know the tradeoffs and would make my decision based on that. I'd not sit around crying that Storm needs a touchscreen as good as iPhone.

    Unlike the tripe that RM has been claiming the past few days, I know for a fact that there are serious doubts within RIM of ever being able to offer WiFi on a CDMA device. That may change with some technical breakthrough or if they decide to lower performance standards. But for today, there are no CDMA BlackBerrys coming with WiFi.

    Here's another tidbit folks - one you may not want to hear - the long-term analysts are saying that RIM is on its way down; that in five years, RIM will be where Palm is today - on the ropes. Between Microsoft & Google, both of whom could buy RIM lock, stock & barrel, shut it down & never blink, RIM has a long row to hoe - and from the technical aspects, it doesn't look good. Toss in Apple and the coolness factor of that - and the establishment feel of RIM looks even more bleak.

    While I currently carry two BlackBerrys, I have several working devices on all four major carriers - representing WinMo, Palm and more. Some have WiFi while some do not. There are many reasons to go with WinMo or Palm - and that might be coming soon for me personally - work may be a bit longer, as BlackBerry still holds the edge for business, but is in last place for personal smartphone functionality. I get what works and don't hold to a brand. I prefer devices whose operating systems are not locked down to anything in particular, which favors WinMo, Palm & Android. I refuse to do anything with Google, so Android is out.

    So, as I've said before - if you want WiFi, you have to get another device. If you want more apps, you have to go with another device. If you want seamless integration with your home computer, again, another device. You aren't getting it all on the same phone, so quit crying about it.

    List what is important to you and then decide which device best suits your needs.
    05-17-09 05:22 PM
  20. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    To continually state it is a legal issue, when all two cases were tossed out of court before being heard, is extremely foolish.
    show me proof of this! Because its a pretty big coincidence that right after a few lawsuits in 05/06, we have a BB storm with dual mode functional GPS and more on the way with the same concept in design
    05-17-09 05:30 PM
  21. Gkins3's Avatar
    show me proof of this!
    Now you did it! Now we're going to get another novel of nonsense!
    05-17-09 05:37 PM
  22. TwinsX2Dad's Avatar
    show me proof of this! Because its a pretty big coincidence that right after a few lawsuits in 05/06, we have a BB storm with dual mode functional GPS and more on the way with the same concept in design
    Why don't you show proof of the legal cases? You could start with the ones that are on process & then go to the ones that have been won.

    The court records are public and can be accessed online.

    Proof of legal battles are easy to show. But all you can do is point to a few reports that there might have been some activity - then you refuse to note the technical & economics aspects of why there was none until recently.

    By the way - the 11/08 release of the Storm is not "right after" 05/06. If any legal issues had caused it to have a dual-mode GPS processor, why not the 8830 or 8330? Why wasn't it miraculously activated on all phones?

    I know why you answer none of these points - it is because you don't care about the truth.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-17-09 05:42 PM
  23. BerryMedic20's Avatar
    I think the point is, why NOT have wifi as an option. There ARE uses for it. In my house for example, I have a garbage data connection, but a pervasive wifi signal. Its really frustrating trying to get a simple page to load on my Curve and having to watch those damn arrows and pray they'll flash enough to load a couple KB of data!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-17-09 05:47 PM
  24. Gkins3's Avatar
    Go back to the T-mobile forum if you have nothing of value to add to the discussion.
    I have Verizon as well, but thank you for caring.
    05-17-09 05:50 PM
  25. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    Why don't you show proof of the legal cases? You could start with the ones that are on process & then go to the ones that have been won.

    The court records are public and can be accessed online.

    Proof of legal battles are easy to show. But all you can do is point to a few reports that there might have been some activity - then you refuse to note the technical & economics aspects of why there was none until recently.

    By the way - the 11/08 release of the Storm is not "right after" 05/06. If any legal issues had caused it to have a dual-mode GPS processor, why not the 8830 or 8330? Why wasn't it miraculously activated on all phones?

    I know why you answer none of these points - it is because you don't care about the truth.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    DOW JONES NEWSWIRES



    ITT Corp. (ITT) filed a lawsuit against Verizon Wireless and several handset players, alleging the companies illegally used its global positioning system technology in their phones.

    The company said Verizon Wireless, a joint venture between Verizon Communications Inc. (VZ) and Vodafone Group PLC (VOD), continues to infringe on the patent by selling cellphones adapted to operate with assisted GPS technology and by providing services including support for GPS. ITT said it has notified Verizon Wireless of the patent.

    A Verizon Wireless spokeswoman declined to comment on the litigation.

    ITT, White Plains, N.Y., also said Verizon Wireless has induced other companies to violate the patent by encouraging them to sell GPS phones and provide a cellular network that supports GPS operations.

    Other defendants in the patent-infringement case include handset makers LG Electronics Inc. (066570.SE); Motorola Inc. (MOT); Kyocera Corp. (KYO); and Nokia Corp. (NOK). Qualcomm Inc. (QCOM), which makes chips for cellphones, was also named as a defendant.

    ITT settled patent-infringement claims several years ago against other wireless companies in disputes concerning assisted GPS technology.

    Assisted GPS was initially developed partly because the government wanted a way for emergency responders to locate people in trouble. But more recently, the wireless industry has used location technology as a tentpole for an array of services, including recommendations for nearby ATM machines or restaurants, or advertisements based on nearby stores.

    The company is demanding a permanent injunction against the defendants to prevent them from infringing on the patent further, except where needed to support 911 calls.

    A Motorola spokesman said, "We do not think we're in the wrong and we'll defend ourselves vigorously." Qualcomm, LG, Kyocera all declined to comment. Nokia couldn't be reached for comment.

    ITT's shares were recently down 63 cents at $38.53, while Verizon lost 95 cents to $29.56.



    -By Kerry E. Grace, Dow Jones Newswires; 201-938-5089; kerry.grace@dowjones.com

    (END) Dow Jones Newswires" http://www.smartmoney.com/news/on/?s...25-000745-1549
    05-17-09 05:53 PM
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