[EFats]

While I don’t understand the “potential” since the company that owns the OS isn’t and won’t support future OS development. I believe the current BBW is pretty good but I agree it’s up on a wing and prayer....

The basic OS is pretty well built, in my opinion. Aside from missing future security fixes, it's an OS that still works. As far as we know it doesn't depend on BlackBerry to keep running (except maybe for initial login during an OS reload).

An example is Windows 7. Released over 10 years ago, older than BB10. You can argue about the quality of design, but aside from security patches it is still a viable OS for applications.

I think the current BB10 is complete enough for this purpose. There are still tons of things in Android and the latest iOS that I wish for that BB10 already had. And from an OS point of view, not a lot missing from BB10 on the OS level.

[EFats]

I saw someone on the blackberry basement discord was working with Broadway to bring gtk apps to blackberry. This would open up a lot of possibility bring some the mobile optimized gnome apps over to BB10. We could even create out own gtk3 theme to make it feel at home on the OS.

Maybe it's just me but I found the GTK tools for creating GUI was a horrible experience compared to Qt.
I did it once just to learn and didn't do it again as it was not enjoyable at all

[EFats]

Hi all, I'm looking for any devs out there who have docs or content they could share on how to best develop apps for BB10 in 2020, currently using Momentics and the old simulator but I'd rather have docs and tutorials available with more modern tooling such as Visual Studio or QT Creator rather than the rather painful eclipse based environment that BB offered. Specifically i'm pooling information to g...

Maybe I haven't kept up, I just noticed they have a Visual Studio Plugin for BB10 development. Works for Visual Studio 2013 but it seems the Plugin itself is open sourced so there is hope it can be updated if necessary.
But step 1, I gotta go download everything, just in case

[Ecm]

*** Please stay on topic! Let’s keep this to the discussion that the OP intended and leave any old baggage out of it.

And, for those who have not gotten the hint, when a Moderator deletes a post, it’s unwise to post the same comment again.

[Chuck Finley69]

The basic OS is pretty well built, in my opinion. Aside from missing future security fixes, it's an OS that still works. As far as we know it doesn't depend on BlackBerry to keep running (except maybe for initial login during an OS reload).

An example is Windows 7. Released over 10 years ago, older than BB10. You can argue about the quality of design, but aside from security patches it is still a viable OS for applications.

I think the current BB10 is complete enough for this purpose. There are still tons of things in Android and the latest iOS that I wish for that BB10 already had. And from an OS point of view, not a lot missing from BB10 on the OS level.

"Potential" is what I was referring to as it suggests more of a starting point and for the OS, this is all that we have and the most we'll ever have. For BB10 apps, totally different story as development can still happen from third parties, if they so wish, for now.

Posted via CB10

[Aleix Armenteros]

Muchas gracias desde Barcelona

[app_Developer]

I think there is value in a marketplace over the doc that we have now. Developers would like to have a place to showcase their work and track analytics from looks and downloads. Plus it’s a cleaner user experience and a good way to help build community.

[patrickjmquinn]

Yep this makes sense, ima focus on building native apps and enabling others to do the same and once that starts happening a marketplace will be a required. The spreadsheet will become unwieldy if the number of new apps balloons.

Posted via CB10

[Exentio]

I sincerely hope the best for this project, I just love my Q10. If someone could make Syncthing work on BBOS 10, it'd make me really happy

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

Too need a community to help developers see where the needs are.... what is most wanted.

There will be limits on what can be done, but there is still room for improvement... as the Twitter and YouTube apps have shown.

[Gordo inc]

Too need a community to help developers see where the needs are.... what is most wanted.

There will be limits on what can be done, but there is still room for improvement... as the Twitter and YouTube apps have shown.

What do you mean by Twitter and YouTube app shown?

Posted via CB10

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

What do you mean by Twitter and YouTube app shown?

Posted via CB10

Those are two services that have seen some developers offer some new love to BB10.

[BronzeBeard]

Imo, Browser upgrade should be your top concern. As goes the browser, goes the usability of the OS for most people. You can build all the infrastructure and twitter apps you want, it won't move the needle in terms of user loss.

Upgrade the browser, and the need for twitter and youtube apps are gone anyway.


As for upgrading android run times, don't listen to people begging for it. It's a waste of time and practically impossible.

Fix the Qt5 port and backport QtWebkit, OR port Chromium and embed it into Qt4. Do that, and the OS becomes as practical as any other feature phone OS.

Posted via CB10

[Chuck Finley69]

It won't move the needle in terms of user loss.

Posted via CB10

What do you mean regarding user loss?

[brookie229]

Browser upgrade should be your top concern

^^^^^THIS ....... if even possible.

[joeldf]

Imo, Browser upgrade should be your top concern. As goes the browser, goes the usability of the OS for most people. You can build all the infrastructure and twitter apps you want, it won't move the needle in terms of user loss.

Upgrade the browser, and the need for twitter and youtube apps are gone anyway.


As for upgrading android run times, don't listen to people begging for it. It's a waste of time and practically impossible.

Fix the Qt5 port and backport QtWebkit, OR port Chromium and embed it into Qt4. Do that, and the OS becomes as practical as any other feature phone OS.

Posted via CB10

Problem with the browser is that its main function in the OS. Can't change the OS, can't change the browser. That's why all the alternative browsers that are made to be more current are all android browsers. All the native third-party browsers have to work with the one built into the OS and all have the same issues.

The stock native browser that has its own bar install file is just the UI.

[Gordo inc]

Imo, Browser upgrade should be your top concern. As goes the browser, goes the usability of the OS for most people. You can build all the infrastructure and twitter apps you want, it won't move the needle in terms of user loss.

Upgrade the browser, and the need for twitter and youtube apps are gone anyway.


As for upgrading android run times, don't listen to people begging for it. It's a waste of time and practically impossible.

Fix the Qt5 port and backport QtWebkit, OR port Chromium and embed it into Qt4. Do that, and the OS becomes as practical as any other feature phone OS.

Posted via CB10

I totally agree. The android runtime is of no use even if upgrade. Why have we all not bought android devices, had we wanted android apps?

I want BlackBerry native feel and developing apps could be a better option.

And the need is utmost for the browser thing. Browser needs to be upgraded firstly.
So it would be very much helpful to have enhance browser and develop apps alongside as well.

Posted via CB10

[Gordo inc]

Those are two services that have seen some developers offer some new love to BB10.

I am known to that BB10 OS native YouTube client "bbtube" but what's about the twitter love? Has anyone developed any new twitter client?

Posted via CB10

[Chuck Finley69]

I totally agree. The android runtime is of no use even if upgrade. Why have we all not bought android devices, had we wanted android apps?

I want BlackBerry native feel and developing apps could be a better option.

And the need is utmost for the browser thing. Browser needs to be upgraded firstly.
So it would be very much helpful to have enhance browser and develop apps alongside as well.

Posted via CB10

As others are pointing out, can the browser really be upgraded or is that impossible given BB10 limitations internally?

[Gordo inc]

As others are pointing out, can the browser really be upgraded or is that impossible given BB10 limitations internally?

Don't know as well. I am not technical guy....i just support ideas...

Posted via CB10

[brookie229]

I am known to that BB10 OS native YouTube client "bbtube" but what's about the twitter love? Has anyone developed any new twitter client?

Posted via CB10

Yep, Bird 10 see here: https://forums.crackberry.com/blackb...itter-1178312/

[BronzeBeard]

What do you mean regarding user loss?

Just what I wrote, loss of users.

Problem with the browser is that its main function in the OS. Can't change the OS, can't change the browser. That's why all the alternative browsers that are made to be more current are all android browsers.

This is incorrect. If by your assumption a browser being a requirement of an OS means that another browser can not run, then Internet Explorer would be the only browser on (older) Windows. Because it is used in most of the UI elements from Windows 95 to 7.


The core BB10 Browser remains on the system. That does not prohibit you from writing your own browser. Qt is open source. All work RIM did to port Qt to the platform is opensource. You only have to fix the issue with BB10's Qt5 Webkit. Then merge later versions of Qt5 Webkit. Build your program and ship it. It has nothing to do with the OS. It's a stand alone program.

Ditto with porting Chromium.

All of that being said. This is a lot of work. Hundreds of thousands of lines. So it's probably out of the realm of most developers. Especially if they’re not familiar with the code bases.

All the native third-party browsers have to work with the one built into the OS and all have the same issues.

Mobile developers not able to write a full stack webbrowser? Wow I am amazed.

The reason no one else has naively ported Chromium or backported Qt5 Webkit is because it's a lot of work and a moving target. I work with both Qt and CEF for a living, I would estimate around 3 years for a Chromium port, and without looking at the Qt, probably 2 years there. All of which is C++, which is outside the realm of most mobile devs. Roughly $350,000 for the Chromium port, $250,000 for the Qt port. Neither of which would be guaranteed.

The stock native browser that has its own bar install file is just the UI.

You mean browsers which use the bb10 backend are just UI. We're talking about porting a separate backend.

As others are pointing out, can the browser really be upgraded or is that impossible given BB10 limitations internally?

I am not talking about upgrading bb10's browser specifically, but back port Qt5 Webkit to BB10 Qt5, fixing the issue with BB10 Qt5, then statically building or rpathing the upgraded library for the new browser. It would be a separate program, using separate library systems from the native browser.

None of that requires OS replacement.


FYI, I have 15 years experience in C/C++, several years experience in MIPS OS development (mostly revolving around NetBSD), and been working with Qt4, Qt5, Chromium 12, and CEF for about 3 years now. Most you guys have no idea what you're talking about.

EDIT: Sorry for spelling and grammar, watching a toddler.

Posted via CB10

[joeldf]

@BronzeBeard, okay, guess I misunderstood what's been reported on these forums for the past 7 years.

Wouldn't be the first time.

[BronzeBeard]

And for reference if anyone where to take this on, here is directions for building your own Qt5.2 for bb10 : https://wiki.qt.io/Building_Qt_5_for_BlackBerry

And here is what is working: https://wiki.qt.io/Qt5_Status_on_BlackBerry10

So it would be a bit of work as you have 6 years of updates to port and fix whatever is broke in qtwebkit. I also believe BB10 specific code was removed at some point.

Either way, just fixing 5.2's webkit port, then back porting the community webkit plugin would be the best way to go with limited resources.

Posted via CB10

[conite]

@BronzeBeard, okay, guess I misunderstood what's been reported on these forums for the past 7 years.

Wouldn't be the first time.

All of the existing native browsers use the WebKit engine embedded in the OS.

That was of course due to expediency. One could, as described, start from scratch and bring a new native browsing experience.

But, also as indicated, the time and money to do such a thing is really beyond the realm of feasibility.