08-22-15 04:33 PM
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  1. Robin Borodin's Avatar
    Of course they could, but normal consumers wouldn't even bother with sideloading google play services. How is that consumer friendly?
    But no one could use the excuse of no apps, it could be made as easy as installing a package from the Internet via an app on the BB10 side, effectively flashing the AOSP side with GPS as is usually done with custom roms

    Posted via CB10
    08-15-15 01:51 PM
  2. Soulstream's Avatar
    But no one could use the excuse of no apps, it could be made as easy as installing a package from the Internet via an app on the BB10 side, effectively flashing the AOSP side with GPS as is usually done with custom roms

    Posted via CB10
    True, but that is not consumer friendly at all. It's similar to the workarounds we use to patch google play services and use snap. Anything that cna be considered sideloading or workaround isn't going to bring in consumers (as shown with BB10).
    ayngling and Bbnivende like this.
    08-15-15 01:56 PM
  3. Smokeaire's Avatar
    True, but that is not consumer friendly at all. It's similar to the workarounds we use to patch google play services and use snap. Anything that cna be considered sideloading or workaround isn't going to bring in consumers (as shown with BB10).
    You hit the nail on the head. The average consumer, who are the majority of users, basically want a turn on and it works phone. The minority of users are those who are on these forums, be it CB, AC, or other forums. They don't root their phones, sideload, or patch. Most will have the phone stores employees do the initial setups. The phones have to be as brainless as possible to use. Most average users do not care about specs unless they are told to care and and upgrading will make their lives full of Unicorns and Rainbows.

    Sent from my BlackBerry Passport.
    08-15-15 04:16 PM
  4. extisis's Avatar
    Apparently the hypervisor performs about 90%+ as well as real hardware so it's not that much of a penalty if the hardware is good enough

    Posted via CB10
    Apparently nothing. You've never seen it in action. Don't see how people can hype something up that they've never even seen.

    Posted via CB10
    08-15-15 08:20 PM
  5. Robin Borodin's Avatar
    You hit the nail on the head. The average consumer, who are the majority of users, basically want a turn on and it works phone. The minority of users are those who are on these forums, be it CB, AC, or other forums. They don't root their phones, sideload, or patch. Most will have the phone stores employees do the initial setups. The phones have to be as brainless as possible to use. Most average users do not care about specs unless they are told to care and and upgrading will make their lives full of Unicorns and Rainbows.

    Sent from my BlackBerry Passport.
    If the average consumer is made aware of what they can do and/or how easy it is to do so then and the benefits then they're much more likely to do it. And if it's phone stores who do the initial setup then they can click a link to install the play store too. It wouldn't need a computer to side load or anything, just the actual phone itself

    Posted via CB10
    08-16-15 07:12 AM
  6. lnichols's Avatar
    If the average consumer is made aware of what they can do and/or how easy it is to do so then and the benefits then they're much more likely to do it. And if it's phone stores who do the initial setup then they can click a link to install the play store too. It wouldn't need a computer to side load or anything, just the actual phone itself

    Posted via CB10
    So phone stores are going to side loading an app that violates Google's terms of service and Google wouldn't block this from happening if it were to be done and actually work? Seriously until BlackBerry either has a full app store, or has access to Google Play and Google Play Services, the platform has no chance. If they go Android they can't compete with other Android OEM's on price and will fail too.

    Posted via Z30
    08-16-15 10:05 AM
  7. MasturB's Avatar
    I honestly don't see why Blackberry can't produce both.

    A slider with Android/BB hybrid OS, or just a flat BB10 OS.

    I left BB for a few reasons. I had the Torch 2 and loved it until the hardware finally became old and the phone started cosmetically breaking down. I bought the classic because I missed a PK, but then it ran rather slow when I would type up my messages, and after using a Note 2 for so long I liked the bigger screen for watching videos, etc. If the slider happens to run Android, I'll be ecstatic because it means I can use my Moto360 watch with it as well, something I couldn't do with the Classic.

    I will gladly sell my Note 4 for a Blackberry Slider (if it has a PK and a large beautiful screen like the Note 4, and can run Android apps like Android Wear for my Moto360).

    Also professionally, I teach tennis. Having a huge phone with a nice camera like the Note 4, I can record my students and show them in real time on a nice big screen what they're doing wrong and what to fix. A little bit more challenging on a smaller screen like the Classic. And I wasn't a fan of an all touchscreen BB. Venice would suffice all my needs. I actually would buy it if it didn't run the Android Apps I'd prefer, just because of the PK and rumored specs on the screen.
    KingOfQwerty and ayngling like this.
    08-16-15 10:15 AM
  8. Smokeaire's Avatar
    Most phone store employees who I have met don't know anything about rooting or side loading.
    There are very few average users who even care about such things. They want to turn on the phone and have it just work without going through the technical gymnastics we find intriguing and (mostly) fun.


    Sent from my BlackBerry Passport.
    lnichols, 007Storm and ayngling like this.
    08-16-15 10:17 AM
  9. deadcowboy's Avatar
    I agree with you about being satisfied with limited capabilities of legacy devices. I am not sure that many Professionals are on BBOS devices any more though.

    The Q10 with a trackpad would make a great 9900 replacenent.
    Could even be pure BB10 if and when there is no run time.

    Posted via CB10
    I saw two BBOS users on a flight this past week. One next to me, one in line for the flight. One had an iPhone as well. Small flight, too. But it was connecting through DC...so I guess that's what you're likely to see. I consistently see businessmen with BBOS devices, pretty much one on every weekday-flight.

    I also saw a girl with both an HTC One-something. But she also had an iPod touch. People like having multiple devices I guess.



    Posted via CB10
    08-16-15 04:30 PM
  10. Robin Borodin's Avatar
    So phone stores are going to side loading an app that violates Google's terms of service and Google wouldn't block this from happening if it were to be done and actually work? Seriously until BlackBerry either has a full app store, or has access to Google Play and Google Play Services, the platform has no chance. If they go Android they can't compete with other Android OEM's on price and will fail too.

    Posted via Z30
    Loading GPS on non-OHA devices doesn't violate the terms of service for Google Play, and there would be no contracts being broken if BlackBerry doesn't sign up to the OHA to begin with. Side loading it can literally mean pressing install on a zip file like the way AMI DuOS does it on Windows

    Posted via CB10
    08-21-15 09:15 AM
  11. cgk's Avatar
    Loading GPS on non-OHA devices doesn't violate the terms of service for Google Play, and there would be no contracts being broken if BlackBerry doesn't sign up to the OHA to begin with. Side loading it can literally mean pressing install on a zip file like the way AMI DuOS does it on Windows

    Posted via CB10
    This is laughable stuff and wouldn't fly in court - yes if you are the end consumer, nobody can stop you and indeed, google isn't interested in stopping you but if you think that google would let BBRY put a device in stores where it has a app on it to install GAPPS, you are dreaming - this would be seen as the same thing as bundling them in anyway.

    No carrier would touch such a device in case they were caught in the cross-fire.

    All these complex get-outs aren't needed, it's pretty clear from the renders what is actually happening - BBRY has capitulated and is bending its knee to its new King. It is releasing a stock android phone with some of its own apps and when google says jump, it will say "how high boss?"
    08-21-15 09:19 AM
  12. Bbnivende's Avatar
    This is laughable stuff and wouldn't fly in court - yes if you are the end consumer, nobody can stop you and indeed, google isn't interested in stopping you but if you think that google would let BBRY put a device in stores where it has a app on it to install GAPPS, you are dreaming - this would be seen as the same thing as bundling them in anyway.

    No carrier would touch such a device in case they were caught in the cross-fire.

    All these complex get-outs aren't needed, it's pretty clear from the renders what is actually happening - BBRY has capitulated and is bending its knee to its new King. It is releasing a stock android phone with some of its own apps and when google says jump, it will say "how high boss?"
    The Android Slider, if there is one, is to expand sales past their Crackberry fan base. It would be crazy not to add a BB10 model but if it would have no runtime or if BlackBerry is forced to have no runtime then BB10 sales would take a hit.

    My total off the wall guess would be only 1.5 mill BB10 (no runtime ) sales per year but perhaps 6 million devices ( and growing) sold per year as a combo of BB10 (no runtime) and Android.

    Even with the Slider , I do not see BlackBerry 10 device sales increasing past the initial bump if they do not add a line of Android phones. The Amazon solution has not helped BlackBerry that much.
    08-21-15 10:47 AM
  13. cgk's Avatar
    There might well continue to be bb10 handsets for a while - I was more commenting on some of the increasingly bizarre theories we are see.

    Sent from my LG-D802 using Tapatalk
    08-21-15 10:51 AM
  14. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    The Android Slider, if there is one, is to expand sales past their Crackberry fan base. It would be crazy not to add a BB10 model but if it would have no runtime or if BlackBerry is forced to have no runtime then BB10 sales would take a hit.

    My total off the wall guess would be only 1.5 mill BB10 (no runtime ) sales per year but perhaps 6 million devices ( and growing) sold per year as a combo of BB10 (no runtime) and Android.

    Even with the Slider , I do not see BlackBerry 10 device sales increasing past the initial bump if they do not add a line of Android phones. The Amazon solution has not helped BlackBerry that much.

    My just as off the wall guess it that IF BB10 is still a product... sales would only be a few 100K. Think BB10 is only going to be a fit for high security installations, and it I doubt there are enough of those to justify 1.5 million each year... especially when there are several other products targeting this market. I'm just look at the last ER and the continued decline in sales... just don't see that big of a market for BB10.

    As for BlackBerry/Android sales.... I don't really have a clue where those will go. It really depends on if BlackBerry is capable of being a competitive player - hardware/pricing, custom software/performance, carrier support and MARKETING. And get away from ENTERPRISE focus - you can't repeat that message and expect carriers to treat you product like a regular consumer product... and you can't expect consumers to pay attention to your products.

    They might sell 500K of these SLIDERS.... or if everything works out just right, they might sell 10 Million of them... Who knows, some times a hail marry pass connects.
    08-21-15 11:08 AM
  15. Robin Borodin's Avatar
    There might well continue to be bb10 handsets for a while - I was more commenting on some of the increasingly bizarre theories we are see.

    Sent from my LG-D802 using Tapatalk
    I wasn't stating theories, I was only stating possibilities. A user installable runtime with user installable GPS is very possible

    Posted via CB10
    08-21-15 09:40 PM
  16. cgk's Avatar
    I wasn't stating theories, I was only stating possibilities. A user installable runtime with user installable GPS is very possible

    Posted via CB10
    Of course a *user installable* runtime is possible, a user installable runtime *on the device when it ships* is highly unlikely.

    We are seeing feather and can hear quacking coming from the lake but a lot of you seem to think it is a bear with a snorkel.
    08-22-15 07:16 AM
  17. sayf777's Avatar
    If I remember correctly from an old thread BlackBerry purposely made it impossible to use gps since there is a stub /placeholder where gps is in the system files in the android runtime. And also it's unrootable

    Posted via CB10
    08-22-15 04:33 PM
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