02-14-11 05:24 PM
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  1. espenfjogstad's Avatar
    The Bold 9000.

    When the 9000 was launched Blackberry was way ahead of all the other smartphonemakers.
    - It had the by far best screen, the envy of all competition
    - It was lightning fast
    - Had an amazing keyboard
    - Had a distinct and "exclusive" design
    - Had great build quality (maybe except for battery door not being "tight" enough)

    In 2008, even the iPhone in spite of a cool look was just a joke compared to what the Bold had to offer.

    Instead of building on this leadership position and improving it, Blackberry has "lost their way" and focused on launching :
    - Poor copycats iphone/android. The whole BB OS is optimized around a qwerty keyboard.
    - A "downgraded" Bold "look and feel" so that the current Bold look like an evolution of the Curve instead of a modern Bold.

    It has made me - at least temporarily - desert to iphone 4.

    But I miss my BB and would be back in a second if they launched a true upgrade to the original Bold 9000, which to me is :
    - Same physical design/look just a tiny bit smaller (somewhere between 9000 and 9700 in size). Smaller menu/phone buttons should enable keeping screen at 9000 size still.
    - Improved overall build quality, ideally with option for real leather on back.
    - A really improved camera.
    - State of the art screen resolution (Amoled, iPhone4 quality)
    - Touchscreen for easier OS6 top-level navigation between applications
    - Trackpad for improved navigation within applications
    - Audiojack, mute and lock button on top

    How many of you agree ?
    Sweet_n_Fierce and jaymojones like this.
    11-24-10 04:02 PM
  2. Sweet_n_Fierce's Avatar
    I agree with you on the new bolds looking like "evolved curves"; the whole point of the blackberry BOLD 9000 was...well...BOLD....from the size, to the screen, to the over all feel!
    Blackberry 9000 > other blackberry phones
    11-24-10 08:01 PM
  3. elgolfman's Avatar
    Sign me up... I have been whining about this for a long time now. I have heard no rumors of such a device though.
    11-24-10 08:48 PM
  4. Skeevecr's Avatar
    But I miss my BB and would be back in a second if they launched a true upgrade to the original Bold 9000, which to me is :
    - Same physical design/look just a tiny bit smaller (somewhere between 9000 and 9700 in size). Smaller menu/phone buttons should enable keeping screen at 9000 size still.
    - Improved overall build quality, ideally with option for real leather on back.
    - A really improved camera.
    - State of the art screen resolution (Amoled, iPhone4 quality)
    - Touchscreen for easier OS6 top-level navigation between applications
    - Trackpad for improved navigation within applications
    - Audiojack, mute and lock button on top

    How many of you agree ?
    Assuming they do include a touchscreen then a new device being the size of a 9000 would make more sense than trying to make something between 9000 and 9700. One thing to bear in mind is that since this would be a smaller screen then even moving up to vga would result in a fairly high pixel density, albeit not up there with some of the snazziest screens, but clearly competitive which they aren't currently.

    Hopefully they will have seen with the torch that the combination of trackpad and touchscreen does actually work really well.

    I expect we won't see much if any change in the camera from the 5mp of current models, unless you are making a phone where the camera is the main focus then it isn't a big enough selling point to overspend.

    One thing I very much doubt is that we will see Rim banking on any single model to bring them back to the lead, I expect we will see new models in all the main families bold, curve, storm and torch along with them trying other things since it has been a long time since they took the one size fit all approach.
    Last edited by Skeevecr; 11-24-10 at 11:24 PM.
    11-24-10 11:21 PM
  5. espenfjogstad's Avatar
    There is a wise old saying that goes : "If you try to be something for everybody, you end up not being anything for anybody".

    I am not advocating a "one size fits all" approach. I am advocating that RIM should focus on building phones that build on the strengths of their platform. RIMs strength is in messaging. It is by far the best technology platform/OS for people who do a lot of messaging and calling. It is also obvious - despite Steve Jobs' claims to the contrary - that a physical QWERTY keyboard is the best/fastest/most convenient HW platform to do such messaging. The STORM is in my opinion a "panicked response" product that RIM should never have made, and which should be discontinued. Why build a Blackberry specifically designed for people for whom messaging is NOT the key buying criteria of a phone - these people will not like the BB OS compared to Apple IOS anyway.

    In my opinion RIM would be better off constantly improving 3QWERTY models :
    One Low cost option - Targeted toward youth and very cost aware consumers - build qualitylevel, tech specificaitons and formfactor like current Curve
    One Medium cost option - Targeted toward business segment - quality level and form factor and tech specifications as current Bold
    One High cost options - Targeted toward upper business segment and affluent designaware consumers - quality level, form factor and tech specs state of the art at any time (real leather back, max resolution screen, supersnappy processor, ample RAM, ample built in storage etc, high quality camera).

    Price range without subsidy in the 2-300, 4-500 and 8-900 USD range for the three devices, and my guess is that sales would be split roughly 25, 50 and 25 % respectively

    That way RIM could get a huge marketshare in the large segment of the total market that prefers QWERTY, as opposed to a small market share in the overall market.
    Last edited by espenfjogstad; 11-25-10 at 07:59 AM.
    11-25-10 07:56 AM
  6. corymcnutt's Avatar
    There is a wise old saying that goes : "If you try to be something for everybody, you end up not being anything for anybody".

    I am not advocating a "one size fits all" approach. I am advocating that RIM should focus on building phones that build on the strengths of their platform. RIMs strength is in messaging. It is by far the best technology platform/OS for people who do a lot of messaging and calling. It is also obvious - despite Steve Jobs' claims to the contrary - that a physical QWERTY keyboard is the best/fastest/most convenient HW platform to do such messaging. The STORM is in my opinion a "panicked response" product that RIM should never have made, and which should be discontinued. Why build a Blackberry specifically designed for people for whom messaging is NOT the key buying criteria of a phone - these people will not like the BB OS compared to Apple IOS anyway...
    Hence the problem...this is YOUR opinion, and not everybody, certainly myself, do not agree with you. It is not "obvious" to me that a physical keyboard is the best way to text. I can type faster on my Storm2 than I ever could on my physical kb BB...again, saying the Storm "should be discontinued" is, as you admit, YOUR opinion. Again, I certainly disagree, as I LOVE my S2...I want BOTH, great messaging AND a large screen for reading those messages. Hence RIM's dilemma - how do they satisfy the most people and increase sales? I agree they need to have a GREAT Bold; but what about a Flip Phone, and Touchscreen...three designs that fit most needs. I guess we have to have a Slider in there too??? Where does it all end? You can't be a one-trick pony these days and survive very long, so I think RIM will have to try and satisfy the most people they can.
    11-25-10 11:06 AM
  7. Skeevecr's Avatar
    I don't think that a flip phone is going to be integral to their line-up, it is a form factor that is ignored outside north america and is a lot less important than it used to be in north america judging by the fact that only Sprint got the last one.

    At the mid to high end a bold is obviously essential and to go with it you would also expect to see a new storm and torch with all 3 having a touchscreen since it would increase development time to not support one on a new bold.

    At the mid to low end, a new curve is a no-brainer as those are a model that sells very well and also helps to draw people away from dumbphones too.

    Beyond this essential four we might see another new form factor introduced (maybe a landscape slider or a storm hd with a bigger screen for example) or updates to existing lesser form factors like the pearl or style, but if carriers are already taking 3 or 4 of the main models they may not have any room for anything else.
    11-25-10 05:05 PM
  8. 67Tucker's Avatar
    The bulky @ssed 9000 is gone. Just let it go!
    11-25-10 05:51 PM
  9. TheEdge's Avatar
    There is a wise old saying that goes : "If you try to be something for everybody, you end up not being anything for anybody".

    I am not advocating a "one size fits all" approach. I am advocating that RIM should focus on building phones that build on the strengths of their platform. RIMs strength is in messaging. It is by far the best technology platform/OS for people who do a lot of messaging and calling. It is also obvious - despite Steve Jobs' claims to the contrary - that a physical QWERTY keyboard is the best/fastest/most convenient HW platform to do such messaging. The STORM is in my opinion a "panicked response" product that RIM should never have made, and which should be discontinued. Why build a Blackberry specifically designed for people for whom messaging is NOT the key buying criteria of a phone - these people will not like the BB OS compared to Apple IOS anyway.

    In my opinion RIM would be better off constantly improving 3QWERTY models :
    One Low cost option - Targeted toward youth and very cost aware consumers - build qualitylevel, tech specificaitons and formfactor like current Curve
    One Medium cost option - Targeted toward business segment - quality level and form factor and tech specifications as current Bold
    One High cost options - Targeted toward upper business segment and affluent designaware consumers - quality level, form factor and tech specs state of the art at any time (real leather back, max resolution screen, supersnappy processor, ample RAM, ample built in storage etc, high quality camera).

    Price range without subsidy in the 2-300, 4-500 and 8-900 USD range for the three devices, and my guess is that sales would be split roughly 25, 50 and 25 % respectively

    That way RIM could get a huge marketshare in the large segment of the total market that prefers QWERTY, as opposed to a small market share in the overall market.
    Spot on!! And may i add, RIM.. it's better to get 10% of market share that is worth billions than 90% of the market which is worth much less.. positioning... hello... focus... hello? Whatever happened to being a leader rather than a follower?

    At least Nokia kicks some serious buttx when it comes to hardware specs.. but you RIM, your 600+Mhz processor (really????) coupled with a weak marketplace and a mediocre OS... penetrate well for crying out loud.

    And finally, LISTEN TO THE COMMUNITY FOR ONCE RIM! We bash because we care and want you to improve, don't EVER forget that.
    11-26-10 03:44 PM
  10. mountainman's Avatar
    The bulky @ssed 9000 is gone. Just let it go!
    Go smoke some more crack... yeah, that's it.

    The Bold 9000 form factor is the Holy Grail of Crack-heads. We need it, we want it, we must have it. C'mon RIM, build this phone please!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-26-10 11:28 PM
  11. Skeevecr's Avatar
    The Bold 9000 form factor is the Holy Grail of Crack-heads. We need it, we want it, we must have it. C'mon RIM, build this phone please!
    I don't think a return to the size of the 9000 will have anything to do with it being the 'holy grail' so much as it simply being due to the fact that it would allow them to include as big a touchscreen as possible while the device still clearly remains a bold and on a similar note I wouldn't expect any of those mockups with a tall screen to be real either as anyone wanting that combination of screen size and physical keyboard are better off with a torch since you can still type one-handed with one of those.
    11-27-10 12:50 PM
  12. jaymojones's Avatar
    I am waiting for this phone as well. This was definitely RIM's best phone ever. I still to this day can't figure out what has taken so long for an up to date device.
    11-29-10 05:00 PM
  13. axe50's Avatar
    Even with the 9000 there was a lot of watsed space that could have been better used for a larger screen or a smaller casing (without changing the keyboard). Either would have satisfied most. Have to say that I honesly prefer the 9700 from a size and keyboard styling, but what I long for is the same size, same keyboard, but larger screen that is also touchscreen. Look at any 9700 and you can see there's almost an inch of available space by moving the keyboard down and above the current screen.

    Its not so much RIM copying android and itoy, but more droid copying berry...ala "droid pro"

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-29-10 05:15 PM
  14. lssanjose's Avatar
    Then why make the storm to begin with?
    11-29-10 07:36 PM
  15. Skeevecr's Avatar
    Then why make the storm to begin with?
    Rim aren't so arrogant as to try to impose a one size fits all idea on potential customers so they offer a range of form factors and that's why you'll see new bolds, storms, torches, curves etc. in the future.
    11-29-10 10:22 PM
  16. nikosg21's Avatar
    This device is coming...
    11-30-10 01:07 PM
  17. corymcnutt's Avatar
    This device is coming...
    So is Spring... How long do they expect people to wait? And, will any come back to BB?
    11-30-10 01:29 PM
  18. syb0rg's Avatar
    The Bold 9000 is a sumo wrestler in a room full of super models.

    it's okay you can admit it as well.
    11-30-10 01:31 PM
  19. syb0rg's Avatar
    So is Spring... How long do they expect people to wait? And, will any come back to BB?
    For that beast of a phone? no


    and since when does RIM need to "regain leadership". They are still the most popular phone in the White Collar world?

    and if they want to gain ground in the Mr. and Ms. Knucklehead world, they need to have a Kernel based OS that is easy and accessible to build applications for. I'm not stating they need Open Source, but they need an easier OS to build Apps for. Then they need to focus on beefing the hardware end of things.
    Last edited by syb0rg; 11-30-10 at 01:37 PM.
    11-30-10 01:31 PM
  20. lssanjose's Avatar
    If the device is compelling, I might. But with the pace of Android updates in functionality, it'll be tough. I'm awaiting Gingerbread, and see how that'll go.
    11-30-10 01:32 PM
  21. Slapnpop826's Avatar
    The day I bought my 9000, I had actually gone to the store to buy an iphone. the sales person began running down the specs and features of the iphone as compared to the 9000. After about 10 minutes, I was convinced that the Bold was the greatest smartphone ever! I purchased the 9000 that day and absolutely loved the phone. The only drawback of the phone, which I know now was a foretelling of the short sightedness of RIM, was it needed more memory.
    11-30-10 02:01 PM
  22. Mamaluka's Avatar
    The Bold 9000 is a sumo wrestler in a room full of super models.

    it's okay you can admit it as well.
    Someone's been copying amazinglygraceless's posts from a year ago!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-30-10 06:36 PM
  23. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    There is a wise old saying that goes : "If you try to be something for everybody, you end up not being anything for anybody".

    I am not advocating a "one size fits all" approach. I am advocating that RIM should focus on building phones that build on the strengths of their platform. RIMs strength is in messaging. It is by far the best technology platform/OS for people who do a lot of messaging and calling. It is also obvious - despite Steve Jobs' claims to the contrary - that a physical QWERTY keyboard is the best/fastest/most convenient HW platform to do such messaging. The STORM is in my opinion a "panicked response" product that RIM should never have made, and which should be discontinued. Why build a Blackberry specifically designed for people for whom messaging is NOT the key buying criteria of a phone - these people will not like the BB OS compared to Apple IOS anyway.

    In my opinion RIM would be better off constantly improving 3QWERTY models :
    One Low cost option - Targeted toward youth and very cost aware consumers - build qualitylevel, tech specificaitons and formfactor like current Curve
    One Medium cost option - Targeted toward business segment - quality level and form factor and tech specifications as current Bold
    One High cost options - Targeted toward upper business segment and affluent designaware consumers - quality level, form factor and tech specs state of the art at any time (real leather back, max resolution screen, supersnappy processor, ample RAM, ample built in storage etc, high quality camera).

    Price range without subsidy in the 2-300, 4-500 and 8-900 USD range for the three devices, and my guess is that sales would be split roughly 25, 50 and 25 % respectively

    That way RIM could get a huge marketshare in the large segment of the total market that prefers QWERTY, as opposed to a small market share in the overall market.

    I KIND of agree with you, BUT to a much more detailed level.


    IF I was RIM I would be looking to make a Family of phones to meet the needs of my Business Customers, and their Families.


    I would develop multiple lines with different upgrade cycles

    Bold9000 Form Factor
    Bold9700 Form Factor
    Curve9300 Form Factorr-
    Curve8300 Form Factor
    Torch9800 Form Factor
    Storm(NEW) Form Factor
    Pearl 9100 Form Factor
    Style 9670 Form Factor


    For the Bold9000 I would have a 24 Month upgrade Cycle,
    The device would essentially stay the same size as the 9000 possibly slightly thinner, but upgrade the internal hardware with what the phones of the day have,

    For the Bold9700 I would also have a 24 Month upgrade cycle, off set from the 9000 cycle by 12 months, so every year in February a New Bold would launch. but 2 different sizes, to fit with Contract times. This is a Business centric device,

    For the 9300/8300 devices, the 9300 is the Consumer Media Qwerty with the media buttons on the top, the 8300 is the Business Low cost qwerty or Fleet phone with out the Media buttons on the top these would each upgrade about 18 months from each other, they don't need to be top of the line, so a 36 month upgrade cycle would be fine for the people who hold their phones longer, or for companies that don't upgrade the entire fleet at one time, they have a longer life expectancy out of the phones.

    The Torch and Storm Form Factors would Both be 12-18 month upgrade cycles EACH, possibly being off set from eachother by about 4-6 months, These are very consumer phone driven devices, they need to be more cutting edge and need to remain in the face of the Consumer via promotions and new releases,


    The Pearl and the Style are both Niche products, they should have 24 Month upgrade cycles, 12 months apart, they should be cutting edge at launch, those that WANT this form factor will be early adopters, those that are unsure will wait and buy them as they get discounted 12 months into the life span,

    What we then have is approximately 5 Device launches a year, if positioned properly that is a new device every quarter, to help keep sales boosted, or slightly more often, Major advertising would be left to the Storm/Torch/Bold products, while print ads, and in store ads would market the Niche products and the low cost curves. RIM would be like apple in terms of Consistent buzz, yet it would not be dedicated to a single product.

    RIM also would have devices like the Playbook, of various sizes and potentially some key accessories to put into the advertising mix.
    11-30-10 06:41 PM
  24. RicanMedic78's Avatar
    I agree that the Bold 9000 was the best BB of its time. But I also agree that a lot of space was waisted as usually is with BBs. If we get an evolutionary update to the Bold 9000 with a touch screen, qnx, lots of app memory, 1ghz, I would be very happy with that! Maybe a 9780 with a close to 9000 size with a screen that maximizes the space, and maybe "touch" style lower keys imbeded into the screen like Storm 2 but WITHOUT such thick black borders. But I've said this on many occasions and in other threads.
    11-30-10 09:04 PM
  25. Slapnpop826's Avatar
    @deRusett What your saying makes so much sense. I don't understand why RIM can't see that also.
    12-01-10 12:50 AM
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