09-14-15 05:00 PM
285 1234 ...
tools
  1. crackberry_geek's Avatar
    In a way, if kind of defies the 10.3.3 announcement, let's say it's a small update which it seems it will be, could be early build released on a new device, like, oh, the Slider.
    I hope no one is really counting on BlackBerry doing what they say they're going to do.

    They've been doing a pretty good job of not following through over past few years.

    Posted via CB10
    06-30-15 11:36 AM
  2. Witmen's Avatar
    They need to try something if they plan on staying in the hardware business. BB10 has had years to catch on and become successful. It hasn't yet and I don't see any reason why it would any time soon. Turning to Android might be just what BlackBerry needs to turn things around.
    06-30-15 11:46 AM
  3. crackberry_geek's Avatar
    It would catch on pretty freaking soon if people just knew about it.

    The Hub is awesome... file management is awesome... getting real work done with it is AWESOME... but nobody knows about it.

    But Chen doesn't really care. All he knows is software... and that's the only world he cares to explore.
    bigjman and gugomat like this.
    06-30-15 11:52 AM
  4. FCSC's Avatar
    Any information when is it coming out?
    from the OP that you quoted, and presumably read:

    The first slider phone will be released before US Thanksgiving, with a Classic type model to follow by the end of the year.
    bp2k7 likes this.
    06-30-15 12:05 PM
  5. eddy_berry's Avatar
    My adoption of an Android/BB device relies solely on its implementation. If it is just stock Google cert. Android with a BB10 UI I'm not really interested.

    Posted via CB10
    Superfly_FR and gugomat like this.
    06-30-15 12:26 PM
  6. tickerguy's Avatar
    There is nothing preventing running Android on top of QNX. Linux and QNX are both POSIX OSs when you get down to it.

    The problem with securing Android is not just the OS, it's the philosophy and backward compatibility requirements with older versions (E.g. older apps that have to still run) and the internal code being something north of SpaghettiMonsterAwful. Having ported it a couple of times to various phones because I wanted a newer version than the manufacturer would ship I've been in the software on a fairly deep level......
    halfnibble likes this.
    06-30-15 12:56 PM
  7. stardomains's Avatar
    I'll give it a spin but it definitely will be a sad day.
    06-30-15 12:59 PM
  8. Pcmx's Avatar
    I could see it happen and could imagine there are members right here on these forums testing this out already.

    The Passport was made for the fans, the Classic to try for the older bbos crowd and QNX was used to stabilize the business. The other devices, tho we love them, didn't really work out as intended.

    QNX is definitely a big cornerstone of the company and doesn't get thrown out; it can do the heavy lifting where it does best; in automotive, health care, blah blah.

    Our resistance to running say an Android device may be not much different from the resistance QNX faced with BB10 in the beginning. Let's all hope that they can take the years of refinement in UI and features and apply that to Android, if they are going this way, and I believe what we see and use now won't be lost..

    There isn't enough room where there are two big oses duking it out. That's the way I see it - they need to grow, and to do it now, they'll will have to be working toward something different, like the "New App Strategy"
    06-30-15 01:11 PM
  9. ljfong's Avatar
    There is nothing preventing running Android on top of QNX. Linux and QNX are both POSIX OSs when you get down to it.

    The problem with securing Android is not just the OS, it's the philosophy and backward compatibility requirements with older versions (E.g. older apps that have to still run) and the internal code being something north of SpaghettiMonsterAwful. Having ported it a couple of times to various phones because I wanted a newer version than the manufacturer would ship I've been in the software on a fairly deep level......
    Android is already running on top of QNX today in the form of Android Player service thanks to microkernel architecture of QNX. However, the performance is far from stellar, again, thanks to limitations of microkernel architecture.

    Code entropy is unavoidable. Internal code being spaghetti monster awful is to be expected, after all, it is internal code for a reason. Internal code typically performs all kinds of complicated logic gymnastics to make things work so that the public API works as expected and has the semantics expected by the consumers of the public API. Then you have to uphold the design contracts you have published in the past using whatever incomplete information you had in the past. If you ask any software API designer, how would you have done any differently if you had the hindsight of what the software would look like today? The answer, it would have been done differently with much better architecture, always. So yeah, securing Android would be hard, just like securing Windows. Not to mention all those low level C API full of mallocs, strlens, getline, scanf, etc that were never properly designed when viewed from today's software engineering state of the art.

    BlackBerry 10 had the nice clean break from the past, but failed to thrive on the market unfortunately.
    06-30-15 01:13 PM
  10. undone's Avatar
    And the prototype could have been used for real world testing of a BB UI for Android. Chen did say he'd sell anything he had to anyone that wants to buy it.

    I am beating on some new hardware form factor they had, test bedded BB skin with other various sellable apps on a vanilla android. Even maybe a Google hardware device itself.
    06-30-15 01:26 PM
  11. Bbnivende's Avatar
    The thought that a skin could operate just like BlackBerry 10 as if the OS was invisible seems to good to be true.. That is why it isn't.

    Posted via CB10
    Dunt Dunt Dunt likes this.
    06-30-15 01:46 PM
  12. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    The thought that a skin could operate just like BlackBerry 10 as if the OS was invisible seems to good to be true.. That is why it isn't.

    Posted via CB10
    How many times have we heard of people getting rid of the custom UI of some manufacture because of the hit that performance is taking. On reason the NEXUS line is so popular with hardcore users is it isn't cluttered with a UI that requires too much of the devices resources.

    Then there is BlackBerry history with software and most recently with BBMx on Android... can you imagine both BBM along with a HUB App and some custom UI features... what kind of hardware will be required for this not to be noticeable to the end user?
    06-30-15 02:12 PM
  13. dejanh's Avatar
    How many times have we heard of people getting rid of the custom UI of some manufacture because of the hit that performance is taking. On reason the NEXUS line is so popular with hardcore users is it isn't cluttered with a UI that requires too much of the devices resources.

    Then there is BlackBerry history with software and most recently with BBMx on Android... can you imagine both BBM along with a HUB App and some custom UI features... what kind of hardware will be required for this not to be noticeable to the end user?
    Optimized? O_o
    06-30-15 02:36 PM
  14. Allanon89's Avatar
    There can be no such thing as optimized hardware differentiating an Android BB from any other Android flagship phone.
    There can be optimized software, but it looks like all OEMs struggle to optimize their Android skins. So, unless BB developers create something extraordinary that nobody ever did before (they did with BB10, but alas it seems it has gone out of fashion now) on top of the laggy mess that Android UI is, I fear it will be yet another phone whose UI smoothness will degrade over time.
    Dunt Dunt Dunt likes this.
    06-30-15 03:56 PM
  15. Phone Guy 4567's Avatar
    Sony tried to heavily and deeply customize the Android UI and I believe they abandoned it. I had an Xperia x10 and for it's time the UI was nice, but the heavy UI customization meant a lag in receiving updates compared to other phones from Samsung etc. For example the x10 came with Dounut when it was released when other phones already came with Eclair. Blackberry would suffer the same problem with a heavily customized version of Android.
    early2bed and gugomat like this.
    06-30-15 04:34 PM
  16. anon(9353145)'s Avatar
    There can be no such thing as optimized hardware differentiating an Android BB from any other Android flagship phone.
    There can be optimized software, but it looks like all OEMs struggle to optimize their Android skins. So, unless BB developers create something extraordinary that nobody ever did before (they did with BB10, but alas it seems it has gone out of fashion now) on top of the laggy mess that Android UI is, I fear it will be yet another phone whose UI smoothness will degrade over time.
    So a slider with a touch capacitive pkb coupled with actions and shortcuts isn't a differentiator? It would still have the same 16x9 candybar resolution, but instead of 3 buttons (Menu, home, back), you get 38 buttons. And you can program each one for quick launches and shortcuts "in app". And use the entire pkb as a trackpad for things like document editing, browsing web pages, etc.

    Sounds pretty different from everything else currently being offered hardware wise by other Android manufacturers, lol. Of course to have the full Android experience it would need to be manufactured by an OHA provider (like Samsung) with the BlackBerry IP being licensed, not made by BlackBerry itself. And by not being BB branded, any lag / security failings are on Android, not BlackBerry.
    06-30-15 04:35 PM
  17. lnichols's Avatar
    So a slider with a touch capacitive pkb coupled with actions and shortcuts isn't a differentiator? It would still have the same 16x9 candybar resolution, but instead of 3 buttons (Menu, home, back), you get 38 buttons. And you can program each one for quick launches and shortcuts "in app". And use the entire pkb as a trackpad for things like document editing, browsing web pages, etc.

    Sounds pretty different from everything else currently being offered hardware wise by other Android manufacturers, lol. Of course to have the full Android experience it would need to be manufactured by an OHA provider (like Samsung) with the BlackBerry IP being licensed, not made by BlackBerry itself. And by not being BB branded, any lag / security failings are on Android, not BlackBerry.
    If BlackBerry says they are securing Android, then it is on them. Whether via the experience suite, or the containerized work space, any failings of those offerings is on them. Also look how long it took BlackBerry to integrate in a capacitive PKB and keyboard shortcuts into an OS that they own. Now imagine having to integrate it into an OS they don't. And if they develop a skin for Android, and it is leggy and slow, then that too is 100% on them. But don't worry, their past software offerings have been superb, so what could go wrong.

    Posted via Z30
    DrBoomBotz and Allanon89 like this.
    06-30-15 05:15 PM
  18. Smitty13's Avatar
    If the rumours are to be believed that this slider will be debuting BlackBerry's first of the Android lineup, I really think BlackBerry needs to be proactive and confirm this (or deny it). While I understand there would be a whole host of logistical issues and the like, I for one would really like to know if this would be spelling the end of the BB10 platform as we currently know it.

    There are some consumers out there looking to purchase BB10 devices still and I am quite sure they too would appreciate full disclosure that BlackBerry will be phasing out the OS starting (?) the 26th of November. That is less than 5 months away at this point.

    While this is all of course a rumour at this point I think we all would appreciate an official statement from BlackBerry on this very soon.
    Allanon89 and Josh Garrow like this.
    06-30-15 06:27 PM
  19. lnichols's Avatar
    If the rumours are to be believed that this slider will be debuting BlackBerry's first of the Android lineup, I really think BlackBerry needs to be proactive and confirm this (or deny it). While I understand there would be a whole host of logistical issues and the like, I for one would really like to know if this would be spelling the end of the BB10 platform as we currently know it.

    There are some consumers out there looking to purchase BB10 devices still and I am quite sure they too would appreciate full disclosure that BlackBerry will be phasing out the OS starting (?) the 26th of November. That is less than 5 months away at this point.

    While this is all of course a rumour at this point I think we all would appreciate an official statement from BlackBerry on this very soon.
    If they say it is coming, then they risk killing off any sales of BB10 devices as the press will be all over it saying BB10 is dead. If BlackBerry let's rumors be rumors, then if true, they can announce right before it happens while trying to reduce BB10 inventory before then and then telling all the BB10 owners they have been PlayBook'd!

    Posted via Z30
    06-30-15 07:04 PM
  20. anon(9353145)'s Avatar
    If they say it is coming, then they risk killing off any sales of BB10 devices as the press will be all over it saying BB10 is dead. If BlackBerry let's rumors be rumors, then if true, they can announce right before it happens while trying to reduce BB10 inventory before then and then telling all the BB10 owners they have been PlayBook'd!

    Posted via Z30
    Gotta ask... You and several others have been selling the Kool Aid that BlackBerry is abandoning their OS for quite some time now.

    Given handset sales it's obviously a possibility. BUT, do you have anything more than conjecture to back up your claims? No offense, but you're a broken record that harps on and on about the PAST when it comes to BlackBerry without giving any consideration to the PRESENT, lol. You're great at pointing out their mistakes, any thoughts on how they can grow as a company? BEYOND making a high end all touch device... Which won't be enough to turn things around obviously.
    higherdestiny likes this.
    06-30-15 07:24 PM
  21. jmr1015's Avatar
    If they say it is coming, then they risk killing off any sales of BB10 devices as the press will be all over it saying BB10 is dead. If BlackBerry let's rumors be rumors, then if true, they can announce right before it happens while trying to reduce BB10 inventory before then and then telling all the BB10 owners they have been PlayBook'd!

    Posted via Z30
    This. Officially confirming Android rumors too far ahead of launch would be irresponsible, when considering the impact such an announcement would have on sales of current models.
    06-30-15 07:33 PM
  22. anon(9353145)'s Avatar
    This. Officially confirming Android rumors too far ahead of launch would be irresponsible, when considering the impact such an announcement would have on sales of current models.
    SO will the Slider be an Android device then? You seem to know better than the rest of us, why not call it. Don't beat around the bush, lol.
    06-30-15 07:40 PM
  23. vladi's Avatar
    I do believe that there is a BB slider running Android, they are testing much like Nokia tested Android on their Lumias/N9. What will happen out of it no one knows except few decision makers and decisions can change.
    06-30-15 07:51 PM
  24. lnichols's Avatar
    Gotta ask... You and several others have been selling the Kool Aid that BlackBerry is abandoning their OS for quite some time now.

    Given handset sales it's obviously a possibility. BUT, do you have anything more than conjecture to back up your claims? No offense, but you're a broken record that harps on and on about the PAST when it comes to BlackBerry without giving any consideration to the PRESENT, lol. You're great at pointing out their mistakes, any thoughts on how they can grow as a company? BEYOND making a high end all touch device... Which won't be enough to turn things around obviously.
    Do I have proof? No. But it is clear that Chen has put zero effort into BB10 and/or handset sales since taking the helm. He wants BlackBerry to be predominantly a software company, he has stated this numerous times. Rumors of the Android phone are rampant, even with the people in the know like the people on the Upstream podcasts. And as for the past/present, if they would change the way they operate, and stop being intentionally misleading in conference calls and evading questions, then they might earn some trust of users. Anyone who looks at all of the information being out by BlackBerry and not thinking that some major change is coming that likely won't include BB10 is simply blind.

    As for how to grow the company now, I think handsets isn't it. They have built up too much ill will there and Chen has provided zero confidence that they will put an honest effort in. When Chen came in, BB10 could have still had a chance, but just like milking BBOS as long as they can through the transition, they will milk BB10 out until they either have the Android phone ready, or until the BlackBerry Experience suite is ready. They will keep the games running until the software portion is ready. I still think the end goal is to make the company attractive to be bought from a player with the resources and talent to make the pieces BlackBerry has assembled successful.

    I don't see much growth in BlackBerry customer base in software as the people who value what they will be offering in software already have the hardware. The only thing there is higher revenue as software has higher revenue than software tied to failing hardware. IoT, I don't see how BlackBerry has the resources to compete there as they haven't had the resource to compete in anything else they have been working on. So my outlook for BlackBerry is very bleak and I actually hope that someone buys them and would take the BB10 OS, make it their own rebranded, and put the effort behind it that it deserved and deserves. BlackBerry simply isn't the company that can make this happen.

    So I want BB10 to live, and IMHO the only chance for that is for someone other than BlackBerry to take ownership of the OS.

    Posted via Z30
    crackberry_geek and Allanon89 like this.
    06-30-15 08:01 PM
  25. TheScionicMan's Avatar
    Given BBRY's track record with officially announced dates, I'm not going to hold my breath that this "rumored" date will be met. The claim of "enhanced security" seems dubious at best, especially considering the time line.
    They'd be the last ones to market and have dozens of OEMs with years of Android experience ahead of them. It wouldn't change the bad reputation, it will only add to the ridicule and talk of demise, which it probably would bring about.

    After it was called a failure by the media for not being an instant hit, Tizen has slowly started to grow. I think BB10 has the same possibility. I hope they don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.
    Allanon89 and Cynycl like this.
    06-30-15 08:28 PM
285 1234 ...

Similar Threads

  1. The touchscreen start acting strange
    By Janeta Walashewska in forum Ask a Question
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 09-03-15, 05:29 PM
  2. Proud the Classic continues BlackBerry improvement
    By JAS0NB0URNE in forum BlackBerry Classic
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 09-03-15, 05:07 PM
  3. found out where the BlackBerry users in Africa and Asia are moving to
    By LostOnThePianoRoll in forum General BlackBerry Discussion
    Replies: 34
    Last Post: 07-04-15, 09:00 AM
  4. I cant get past the user agreement during setup. Please help :(
    By n3xtgen in forum BlackBerry PlayBook
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 07-02-15, 06:18 AM
  5. Replies: 19
    Last Post: 06-30-15, 10:32 AM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD