[xxxxpradaxxxx]

Now you have me laughing . . . Even after editing your post (I am assuming so you could look up the spelling of swastika), you still are a slow learner it appears. As referencing my earlier post . . . It is not "your", it is you're.

Let me help you further. The word "Your" is a possessive form of you, referring to something that a person has. "You're" is a combination of the words You and Are.

Now you can go back to being angry at 75% of your neighbors.

Oh no, I'm not angry-

I don't get angry at people who don't know any better, and besides-

I take it from where it comes.

And again, all you do is correct my grammar.

Your so skilled. Props to you.

Practice what you preach, and turn the other cheek.

WWJD?

[jimmiejohnson]

again..this post not aimed at anyone....but something to think about. I read this in a book.

"Never argue with a fool, he will drag you down to his level and beat you to a pulp!"

[prometheus]

Another proverb comes to mind. I don't know if this is from the bible or not. I'll probably butcher it if I try to quote verbatim, so.. My translation:

"If you slap a fool a thousand times - they're still a fool".

Prada - you're (haha) hand must be stinging by now.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[jimmiejohnson]

also...if anyone is still reading this. Before anyone opens their mouth and takes a side. The history of the USA is exciting. Like the founding fathers and the US Constitution. It might surprise you. I am assuming most of us are from America and enjoy living in this great country, we might want to find out where we came from and the history behind what we are founded on.

[xxxxpradaxxxx]

also...if anyone is still reading this. Before anyone opens their mouth and takes a side. The history of the USA is exciting. Like the founding fathers and the US Constitution. It might surprise you. I am assuming most of us are from America and enjoy living in this great country, we might want to find out where we came from and the history behind what we are founded on.

Can you be less vague?

Are you referring to America's Puritanical Roots?

[prometheus]

also...if anyone is still reading this. Before anyone opens their mouth and takes a side. The history of the USA is exciting. Like the founding fathers and the US Constitution. It might surprise you. I am assuming most of us are from America and enjoy living in this great country, we might want to find out where we came from and the history behind what we are founded on.

Of course people are still reading this, hardly a day goes by without a fresh post.

What sides are you talking about taking?

The history of America is certainly exciting, it's also exciting to watch a ping-pong match - if ping-pong matches are exciting to you.

What is "like the founding fathers and constitution"? Was that valley girl talk, "like you know, whatever..." or was some sort of comparison being made? I don't follow you.

What might surprise me? I have a 2-year old and a 5-year old, few things "surprise" me. It's amazing where one can find ****.

Why might I ant to find out where we came from? My family is from Italy and Germany and I was born in Philly. So???

RE: "find out... the history behind what we are founded on.": Disregarding the poor sentence structure, I'm really scratching the noodle trying to grasp your point... I still have no frickin' clue what your point is.

We're pretty slow around here and don't catch on to innuendos and hints very well. I think you're trying to make some profound point here. But, ya' lost me.

I WANT to understand this. So, please -- repost with longer sentences and complete thoughts. I'm not trying to be rude. I'm trying to help you get your point accross and it just came out rude. I lack the ability to censor sarcasm lately.

[xxxxpradaxxxx]

I think it's a lost cause with Jimmie-

I Don't think he means any harm or ill will, but I asked him to explain his previously vague posts, and he has yet to do so.

I Doubt he'll start now

But I do think or better yet, I assume that he is referring to America's puritanical roots.

That America was created out of a need for freedom of religious expression.

Just in a very very vague way-

But Maybe I'm Just Assuming the wrong thing.

And We All Know What they Say About Making Assumptions!

[xxxxpradaxxxx]

RE: "find out... the history behind what we are founded on.": Disregarding the poor sentence structure, I'm really scratching the noodle trying to grasp your point... I still have no frickin' clue what your point is.

Hahaha

On a Side Note-

I'm Surprised You Haven't Mauled ME over Poor Sentence Structure Yet!

[jimmiejohnson]

sorry for my poor sentence structure...I'm not an english major. I don't type like a pro either. it's just not something i worry about on forums. I'm also not trying to argue, and I am not saying I am a history genius about anything. But these guys in my opinion have great facts.

since i can't post urls yet..search wallbuilders on google or type wallbuilders dot com

[jimmiejohnson]

and prada...it's not that i ignored you out of spite, I just didn't feel the need to respond. The quote was not directed at to who was stupid, I'm not calling anyone stupid. I just think arguing online is pointless.

[prometheus]

I hate reading an argument when I didn't even know it was an argument, or worse yet - can't pick side 'cause I don't even know what the argument is about.

Moving on (please)

For discussion: someone please make a bold statement that we can all either attack or defend. I'm sitting in the Las Vegas airport waiting for a flight. It's almost 4 in the afternoon on Wed and I've slept about 13 hours since Saturday morning (business meeting). With the flight and the driveI won't be in bed "til at least 2AM.

So.... I lack the ability to be witty, but in this state I may come off as profound.

[xxxxpradaxxxx]

I hate reading an argument when I didn't even know it was an argument, or worse yet - can't pick side 'cause I don't even know what the argument is about.

Moving on (please)

For discussion: someone please make a bold statement that we can all either attack or defend. I'm sitting in the Las Vegas airport waiting for a flight. It's almost 4 in the afternoon on Wed and I've slept about 13 hours since Saturday morning (business meeting). With the flight and the driveI won't be in bed "til at least 2AM.

So.... I lack the ability to be witty, but in this state I may come off as profound.

Hahaha

The Topic itself Isn't Specifically About Christianity, So I'll move the topic away from christianity, just a little though.

I'm sure this can lead back to christianity though-

The Question is, Can Animals Be Spiritual?

Or is Spirituality Reserved for the Homo Sapien Elite?

Or do our ego's refuse to think an animal can reach the divine as we do?

All sorts of animals have been deified, and revered throughout History-

Why has that changed so?

Science?

If your wondering what sparked this whole thing, See the link below.

(I truly Wish I knew how to post pictures.)

Buddhist dog prays for worldly desires

[Ndahlseid]

This thread was spawned from a current thread dealing with Prop 8. As expected, which is ALWAYS the case,the Bible thumpers had to jump in about how gay marriage is wrong and homosexuality is a choice.

My post isn't directly about that. This post is about my dislike and intolerance of the religious right in this country. The Bible thumpers. You know the type. They believe in some magical place called heaven and the fiery pits of helll. They beleive that all non-beleivers will be banished to helll unless you accept Jesus Christ as your savior. They judge, they condemn, they divide, they quote a sacred book they believe is Gods word and anyone who does not share their beliefs must be saved. They may not do it to your face but when you turn around be sure they are praying for your little lost soul.

I am not an Atheist so before some go there lets get that out of the way. The religious right act so damn self righteous yet live their lives as hypocrits and pass their limited view of reality onto others as truths.

They are brainwwashed and live in fear of pisssing of some judgemental God who will condemn them to the burning fires in helll. They believe that snakes talk, they condemn incest as a sin YET in their little story of Adam and Eve it reeks of it. They turn their backs on child molestation yet condemn thoughts or acts of homosexuality. They beleive that some woman was impregnated by some magical event called the immaculate conception oooooh how interesting. They took something called pergatory (which by the way is the word of God *sarcasm*) and said there is now no such thing.

They teach their kids to pray for others who are different from them, who don't share their same beliefs because "those people are lost" Yes all the Muslims, baptist, Presbyterians, Buddhist, Hindus etc etc are all going to helll. What a bummer for them.

There are some people in this country who practice religion and can function in society normally. I do not have a problem with people practicing religion. My problem lies with the Bible thumpers who spew their intolerance and judgements on others because the Bible says "its not right." Their ridiiculous religious beliefs pop up in politics and peoples personal lives all the time where it doesn't belong.

In closing, I'm tired of these people and I truly dislike what they preach and what they stand for. Their beliefs are solidly anchored in lies, deceit and fear. The perfect brew for the ultimate agenda of religion...CONTROL THE MASSES.

Yes your being brainwashed.

I have always liked how we talk about how tolerant of other people we need to be, and then when it comes to those "bible thumpers" we act so intolerant! As to Prop 8, I truly believe that this would have passed had a couple of judges not forced their opinions on the people of the state. Get the people behind something and the rules will change

[jimmiejohnson]

I'll give you all something controversial to discuss. Why do you get heavily fined and possible jail time for shooting a bird, but if you take an child's life it's legal?

[xxxxpradaxxxx]

I'll give you all something controversial to discuss. Why do you get heavily fined and possible jail time for shooting a bird, but if you take an child's life it's legal?

Legal?

Where is it legal?

Do you mean fetus? If so, are you referring to an abortion?

How is that related to Religion or Spirituality?

[jimmiejohnson]

I hate reading an argument when I didn't even know it was an argument, or worse yet - can't pick side 'cause I don't even know what the argument is about.

Moving on (please)

For discussion: someone please make a bold statement that we can all either attack or defend. I'm sitting in the Las Vegas airport waiting for a flight. It's almost 4 in the afternoon on Wed and I've slept about 13 hours since Saturday morning (business meeting). With the flight and the driveI won't be in bed "til at least 2AM.

So.... I lack the ability to be witty, but in this state I may come off as profound.

just making a bold statement. and yes i am referring to abortion.

[xxxxpradaxxxx]

Yes a Bold Statement in a Religious Thread lol

Meaning it should be something along a religious context lol

[golfnut]

Abortion is a touchy subject. Most Christians are pro-life so is it that far off base here in the religious thread?
On second thought, maybe it should be left alone. Nevermind.

[gregerator]

I posted it *way* back but I'll mention it again as the topic has arrived. As a follower of Jesus I am Pro-choice. Reason being, God is in the choice business. Anyone who has read my posts on the Garden of Eden back oh 15 pages or so knows that i believe choice has to exist for love to exist. My hope is that no one would choose abortion. I personally find it morally wrong. But what right have I to take people's choices away. If I did, they'll take mine away, and I don't want that.

[prometheus]

The idea I was presenting when saying: "make a bold statement" was.... This thread seems to have died down a bit lately and got a little stale. I was hoping to jump start some more philosophical debate regarding the role of faith in life. I wanted to discuss the role a Christian has in America today with divided loyalties between faith and citizenship. This ties in with the OP's post. He opined that religious folks irritated him by using Christian faith as a weapon to legitimize their political views. We then strayed into some wonderful discussions.

In response to this�.

I'll give you all something controversial to discuss. Why do you get heavily fined and possible jail time for shooting a bird, but if you take an child's life it's legal?

No one ever asked for anything �controversial�. What I mean by �attack / defend �is in the light of a debate. This is the process I was proposing: someone states, �resolved: blah, blah, blah.� Then gives reasons why his view is correct. Someone else tries to disprove that resolution by either destroying the support statements or finding flaws with the reasoning or offering stronger, more persuasive arguments to refute. Just making a �controversial statement� is a nice start but�

Legal? Where is it legal? Do you mean fetus? If so, are you referring to an abortion? How is that related to Religion or Spirituality?

Sounds like some of the veterans of the thread feel the subject isn�t mixing well with the vibe of this thread. Read on�

Abortion is a touchy subject. Most Christians are pro-life so is it that far off base here in the religious thread?
On second thought, maybe it should be left alone. Nevermind.

Golfnut really is a nut (just joking, love ya man) but he�s right. That is a touchy subject. There may be other subjects that would be more fun.

On a side note golfnut: You made a general statement, �most Christians are pro-life.� I don�t care for generalizations, they serve little purpose. Regardless of whether the generalization is positive or negative of that group and regardless of whether you are a member of that group. My reasoning: �Pro-life� connotes a certain political leaning. True, the ideals and principles of the pro-life mindset may be founded in moral or religious basis. However, the designation �pro-life� is more often associated with political affiliation rather than religious beliefs. It is my opinion that true Christians (in following Jesus example) do not affiliate themselves with ANY political party or political group � no matter how much the principles of that group align with their religious ideals. It is not a Christian�s responsibility to get embroiled in political debate.

Now we come full circle to the OP�s idea � religious zealots using religion to advance their politics. You have just become a prime example of that. If you are pro-life, fine. If you are Christian, fine. The two are not synonymous. By making a statement �most Christians are pro-life�, you make the implication that if one is in the camp of pro-choice they are either non-Christian or immoral. That may not have been your message, but believe me � your critics are hearing that message and they are evaluating your argument as attempting to give a veneer of �right� �proper� �moral� and �Christian� to a political ideal. As has been established and is incontrovertible � Jesus did NOT involve himself in politics. He taught his disciples that they should be �no part of the world�. If you have religiously inspired political views � more power to you. However, to have your political views shaped by your Christian views is to miss one of the basic tenets of Christianity and teaching of Jesus - namely, to be no part of the world.

Please refrain from generalizations. Because I am a Christian and would NEVER describe myself as �pro-life� because that is a POLITICAL designation primarily and I feel that a true Christian should not be part of any political party. My beliefs on abortion notwithstanding � I take umbrage with political affiliation being implied. A fine point to be sure, but a point nonetheless.

To continue on this side note, Greg said�

�. As a follower of Jesus I am Pro-choice. �.. My hope is that no one would choose abortion. I personally find it morally wrong.

Wait a minute, I thought as a follower of Jesus you�d be Pro-life. I�m confused??? I thought Golfnut just stated �Most Christians are pro-life?

You see � you end up looking dumb when you make generalizations. Anyone atempting to dress up their politics by saying it is in obedience to God, Jesus, or the bible is missing one of the main points of Jesus� teaching � His kingdom is NO PART OF THIS WORLD. The religious right attempts to use a message they say is loving and inclusive and welcoming to beat someone over the head and judge. Don�t try to justify it and say that abortion is not a political issue and say it�s a moral issue. That�s not what�s being discussed. Golfnut and Greg both chose to use the political designations of �pro-life� and �pro-choice�. I think in most people�s minds those lables are reserved for politics. So, don�t deceive yourselves � you are using your brand of Christianity to justify your politics and using religion to elevate your politics.
Back to our discussion�

I appreciate Prada�s efforts to introduce an extremely interesting subject: animal spirituality.

In response to Prada: No. I do not believe animals have the ability to fathom God and they do not have the ability to appreciate spirituality. My opinion stems from the biblical account of creation. God (the creator of animals and humans) said he made man "in our image" (speaking with his son Jesus). So, humans possess an inborn spirituality as was intentioned by their creator. God did not endow animals with this gift. The designation of being created "in God's image" is reserved for humans alone.

[xxxxpradaxxxx]

Wait Wait Wait, Hold Up!

What about Praying Chihuahuas!!!???

LOL

[golfnut]

Most Christians ARE pro-life. I don't think I came off sounding or looking dumb. If you happen to be someone other than "most", more power to you. I'm trying to mind my tongue so forgive me if I slip a little. General statements aren't the anti-Christ or anything. They're made all the time. I like to use them because it saves me from posting a book. Know what I mean, Alex? Anyways, I was happy to contribute to breathing life back into this thread.( If that's what I did.)

[hootdocta5]

nobody likes a hippy

[prometheus]

nobody likes a hippy

I actually laughed at that, but I don't know why.

[golfnut]

I actually laughed at that, but I don't know why.

I did, too. lol. Maybe they can explain the meaning. God Bless.