04-21-09 12:39 PM
129 ... 23456
tools
  1. ScandaLeX's Avatar
    Lex, he's talking about my post.
    Got'cha.... sometimes it hard to know what Wolf is talking about.
    04-19-09 07:27 PM
  2. MissJennell#IM's Avatar
    Exactly what I was thinking. Probably thinks Bush did a good job as President too.
    I think it is hilarious how people automatically think that if you dislike Obama then you automatically like Bush and everything he did in his eight years. I am here to say that is SO not ture! I no not like Obama by any stretch of the imagination but I also do not like a lot of what Bush did.

    I also think its hilarious (just a side note, lol) that in one breath people can say that they hate that Bush put us almost a trillion dollars in debt in 8 years but then in the next breath say that its completely okay that Obama wants to put us ten trillion in debt in half that amount of time. Side splitting hilarious!
    04-19-09 07:27 PM
  3. eyetek's Avatar
    Well lets clear some things up in this thread, first in response to my assertion that you can always find 10% of Americans who believe in outlandish untruths...I gave a few examples and one of them was the Earth being flat....that one is the absolute extreme and although it may not equate to 10% I believe you get my point.

    Interesting enough I did find fair sized open an ongoing Forum dedicated to believers of the earth being Flat!

    theflatearthsociety.org/forum/

    Sorry I am not able to post links due to my post count.

    Now to the topic of this thread, and the assertion that Obama was going to shut down the internet. The original post was I am sure posted out of FEAR, this fear is often used by parties on the Right and Left in an attempt to gain control over a persons beliefs through their personal fears.

    The fact is there are people in America that are fearful of Obama...I have been witness to Surgeons, Anesthesiologist and OR nurses that believe that Obama is the Anti-Christ and that the wold is coming to an end...so for me to see that someone is fearful that Obama would shut off the internet is not surprising to me at all.

    In an attempt to research the topic of the original post and in looking at the article posted entitled SEC. 18. CYBERSECURITY RESPONSIBILITIES AND AUTHORITY it is clear that the fear stems from the sentence within the act that states (2) may declare a cybersecurity emergency and order the limitation or shutdown of Internet traffic to and from any compromised Federal Government or United States critical infrastructure information system or network;

    But one needs to look further into this and find out the intent of the bill and not just take a few words out of context to fan the flames of FEAR!

    Below is a link to the actual bill as it was presented to Congress, its sponsors and the intent of the bill.

    opencongress.org/bill/111-s773/text

    Just put in the www stuff in the browser followed by the info above and you will find what you are looking for.

    Without getting into to much depth to explain this bill it is an attempt to focus attention of the Homeland Security on the threat of a Cyber attack on America and it's economic system.

    In the bill it states....Americaís failure to protect cyberspace is one of the most urgent national security problems facing the country.

    The intent of the Bill is this...To ensure the continued free flow of commerce within the United States and with its global trading partners through secure cyber communications, to provide for the continued development and exploitation of the Internet and intranet communications for such purposes, to provide for the development of a cadre of information technology specialists to improve and maintain effective cybersecurity defenses against disruption, and for other purposes.

    If you want more information on this Bill and its intent and purpose you may direct your attention to Sec. 2 of the actual bill found by following the link I provided above.

    Bottom line is that it is my opinion that a person has a responsibility to research topics that they may want to understand. Fear is a difficult thing to overcome and there are those that will pray on that fear in an attempt to gain your support for their cause...good or bad, but do yourself a favor and use that internet for knowledge, often times after doing some research you may find that there is not as much to be afraid of after all
    04-19-09 07:31 PM
  4. eyetek's Avatar
    I also think its hilarious (just a side note, lol) that in one breath people can say that they hate that Bush put us almost a trillion dollars in debt in 8 years but then in the next breath say that its completely okay that Obama wants to put us ten trillion in debt in half that amount of time. Side splitting hilarious!
    This statement caught my eye as I was glancing through it, am I to understand that you believe President Bush was only responsible for 1 Trillion dollars of National debt during his eight years in office?

    I think this is another example of someone who needs to do some research on their assertion before posting it as fact in open forum.

    In fact it is a widely held opinion that during the last eight years our national debt has doubled and actually increased by 5 Trillion dollars under President Bush.

    During fiscal 2008, which ended Sept. 30, the national debt increased by more than $1 trillion, breaking the previous fiscal year record of more than $600 billion. The national debt includes obligations held by the public as well as the intragovernmental debt in trust funds such as those operated by Medicare and Social Security.

    The government's debt situation is about to get worse.

    "Federal debt should increase by $2 trillion in fiscal year 2009," said Stan Collender, a longtime budget analyst who is the managing director at Qorvis Communications.
    washingtontimes.com/news/2008/dec/15/big-spender-debt-heads-home-to-texas/

    I believe that the Iraq war cost us over 3 Trillion dollars...but President Bush refused to include those figures in his budget figures during his terms in office.

    The fact is President Bush's 2009 budget figure was around 3.2 Trillion dollars, so your assurtion is just not based on fact at all!

    washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/04/AR2008020400493.html
    Last edited by eyetek; 04-19-09 at 08:01 PM.
    04-19-09 07:50 PM
  5. Tlynnsmith's Avatar

    Bottom line is that it is my opinion that a person has a responsibility to research topics that they may want to understand. Fear is a difficult thing to overcome and there are those that will pray on that fear in an attempt to gain your support for their cause...good or bad, but do yourself a favor and use that internet for knowledge, often times after doing some research you may find that there is not as much to be afraid of after all
    Well said.
    04-19-09 09:11 PM
  6. MissJennell#IM's Avatar
    This statement caught my eye as I was glancing through it, am I to understand that you believe President Bush was only responsible for 1 Trillion dollars of National debt during his eight years in office?

    I think this is another example of someone who needs to do some research on their assertion before posting it as fact in open forum.

    In fact it is a widely held opinion that during the last eight years our national debt has doubled and actually increased by 5 Trillion dollars under President Bush.



    washingtontimes.com/news/2008/dec/15/big-spender-debt-heads-home-to-texas/



    I believe that the Iraq war cost us over 3 Trillion dollars...but President Bush refused to include those figures in his budget figures during his terms in office.

    The fact is President Bush's 2009 budget figure was around 3.2 Trillion dollars, so your assurtion is just not based on fact at all!

    washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/04/AR2008020400493.html
    Okay for one I did not say it was a fact. I was merely stating that it was funny that some people can use one breath and say something and in the next contradict what they just said. I think that its hilarious. Some people need to listen to what they say. Just hilarious. And it was just an example of what I have heard someone say. And for two, you say, it OPINION (see red above). Who is to say if its one or five. Either way ten trillion more still makes my point because its still at least 2x's more than what Bush put us into. So my point still stands.

    Edit: And I also didn't say that I believed that Bush put us one trillion in debt.
    Last edited by MissJennell; 04-19-09 at 09:55 PM.
    04-19-09 09:51 PM
  7. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    Got'cha.... sometimes it hard to know what Wolf is talking about.
    Hooka Chuka, Hooka Chuka, Hooka Chuka. Hommina Hommina Hommina. hubba hubba hubba. You know what I mean SL?
    04-19-09 11:24 PM
  8. izzyncade's Avatar
    I think it is hilarious how people automatically think that if you dislike Obama then you automatically like Bush and everything he did in his eight years. I am here to say that is SO not ture! I no not like Obama by any stretch of the imagination but I also do not like a lot of what Bush did.

    I also think its hilarious (just a side note, lol) that in one breath people can say that they hate that Bush put us almost a trillion dollars in debt in 8 years but then in the next breath say that its completely okay that Obama wants to put us ten trillion in debt in half that amount of time. Side splitting hilarious!
    Oh and Shaking hands with Hugo Chavez and talking to the non violent Taliban is OK with them as well.... now.... liberals and leftist are so hypocritical... I still want to kick Jeanie Garafalo (spelling? yeah don't care) in the **** hole for calling me a redneck racists.
    04-20-09 12:35 AM
  9. izzyncade's Avatar
    Well said.
    well said? bow to Obama, he is the anti christ.... thats well said!
    04-20-09 12:37 AM
  10. shchasm's Avatar
    I'm not sure, but I believe people are getting a little confused with the "deficit" and the "budget". Of course their two different things, you know that.

    In simple terms, say your family's in debt by 1000 dollars. (that's your deficit) You've squandered and spent beyond what your bringing in (your budget).

    Now you want to set things straight but your family needs to eat, have electricity and warmth, basically not die. So you have to spend more money to keep these necessities and survive. This increases your deficit to say 1500 dollars--YOU HAVE NO CHIOCE, YOUR DEFICIT MUST INCREASE because the last guy in charge almost single handedly buried your family.

    Sure you've made cuts and start to spend within your means, but you won't see the benefits for awhile. Things might have to get a little worse before they get better.
    Last edited by shchasm; 04-20-09 at 12:42 AM. Reason: spelling
    04-20-09 12:39 AM
  11. shchasm's Avatar
    well said? bow to Obama, he is the anti christ.... thats well said!
    Did you just invoke the antichrist?
    04-20-09 12:50 AM
  12. aadiawan's Avatar
    wouldn't surprise me....
    04-20-09 05:33 AM
  13. Tlynnsmith's Avatar
    well said? bow to Obama, he is the anti christ.... thats well said!
    Obama's politics aren't the point of contention here, for me. The issue is posting information, without doing research first. Read, and then answer. It's really better that way.

    As far as Obama being the "Anti-Christ", and assuming you actually know what that means (and you're not just ranting): If he is, then there's nothing you or I can do about it. So, it's best to make sure you're in good with The Christ. Huffing and puffing won't work.
    Last edited by Tlynnsmith; 04-20-09 at 09:16 AM.
    04-20-09 09:13 AM
  14. MissJennell#IM's Avatar
    I'm not sure, but I believe people are getting a little confused with the "deficit" and the "budget". Of course their two different things, you know that.

    In simple terms, say your family's in debt by 1000 dollars. (that's your deficit) You've squandered and spent beyond what your bringing in (your budget).

    Now you want to set things straight but your family needs to eat, have electricity and warmth, basically not die. So you have to spend more money to keep these necessities and survive. This increases your deficit to say 1500 dollars--YOU HAVE NO CHIOCE, YOUR DEFICIT MUST INCREASE because the last guy in charge almost single handedly buried your family.

    Sure you've made cuts and start to spend within your means, but you won't see the benefits for awhile. Things might have to get a little worse before they get better.
    I also think people are confusing the deficit with the budget. I also do not think that you should add that much more to your deficit to make it better. Its not going to help in the long run. But thats just common sense. Yeah a little bit more in debt is one thing but that much more is just scary. If American families can (and most have to) live on a budget then why shouldn't the government. Because when they spend they take money out of our budget. Taxes for all people will eventually have to go up (dramatically) to pay off this increased spending spree.
    04-20-09 10:27 AM
  15. JRussett's Avatar
    the worst part is that CHINA is buying up our debt...that's the sole reason we have no leverage against them in world politics. taxes may have to go up, but the gov't will also have to spend MUCH less...both of those options are inevitable.
    04-20-09 10:32 AM
  16. MissJennell#IM's Avatar
    the worst part is that CHINA is buying up our debt...that's the sole reason we have no leverage against them in world politics. taxes may have to go up, but the gov't will also have to spend MUCH less...both of those options are inevitable.
    Exactly my point. If I was in debt and had no money. Yeah I would pay the bills I have to (rent, electric, and such) but I would be getting rid of the internet, tv, phone, and so on. I wouldn't be able to go on a spending spree like I was Oprah. I would have to cut back where it is needed. And all the earmarks in all the bills and packages is just crazy. Cut them out. They are not necessities. Thats for danged sure.
    04-20-09 11:08 AM
  17. sodakitty's Avatar
    Just remember:
    Obama's the antichrist because 2012 is the end of the world and that's the end of his first term and the antichrist is "charismatic with Christ-like appeal".

    The internet is
    A) for porn
    B) a series of tubes
    C) gonna be pwn3d by the antichrist
    D) all of the above

    Really, just live your life. That's all you're guaranteed. You have no control over things like this. Believe what you want when it comes to conspiracies (until MythBusters busts them ), believe the world is flat, believe in God or Zeus or the Goddess or nothing......just take care of yourself, your family, your loved ones...do unto others as you'd have done to you...and just BREATHE. Exist. Live. Enjoy the time you have. Stop worrying about the things over which you have no control.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    04-20-09 12:13 PM
  18. shchasm's Avatar
    I also think people are confusing the deficit with the budget. I also do not think that you should add that much more to your deficit to make it better. Its not going to help in the long run. But thats just common sense. Yeah a little bit more in debt is one thing but that much more is just scary. If American families can (and most have to) live on a budget then why shouldn't the government. Because when they spend they take money out of our budget. Taxes for all people will eventually have to go up (dramatically) to pay off this increased spending spree.
    Thier not trying to make it "better" just yet, Their trying to save our nation from a complete econmic collapse. Maybe I was a little simplistic in my analogy, it's been four months since we got rid of the disease in the white house. Things Happen a little slower when dealing with one of the largest nations in the world. We need stability first. What cuts do you propose? Get rid of social security?

    It's a scary time right now. taxes will go up...but for who?

    This disaster began with Reagan slowly pulling away the regulations that kept these scumbag corperate buisnesses men from raping the american public.
    It culminated with a completly inept addministration squandering has much of your hard earned money as posibble (many examples available).
    04-20-09 01:18 PM
  19. MissJennell#IM's Avatar
    Thier not trying to make it "better" just yet, Their trying to save our nation from a complete econmic collapse. Maybe I was a little simplistic in my analogy, it's been four months since we got rid of the disease in the white house. Things Happen a little slower when dealing with one of the largest nations in the world. We need stability first. What cuts do you propose? Get rid of social security?

    It's a scary time right now. taxes will go up...but for who?

    This disaster began with Reagan slowly pulling away the regulations that kept these scumbag corperate buisnesses men from raping the american public.
    It culminated with a completly inept addministration squandering has much of your hard earned money as posibble (many examples available).
    You can't spend that much money and expect that you are saving us from a complete economic collapse. If you think that then you are crazy! Thats like me saying I am in debt 1,000 and then spending 10,000 more so that I can be financially sound. That is just crazy. I would be worse off then I was to begin with. I understand some has to be spent but that much is out of hand. And I don't think that they should cut social security. I do however think that they should rework social security so that what I (and a whole lot of other people) am paying into will actually receive one day. I also think that quite a few other things need to be reworked so that they are more effectively run financially. I also think that they could cut out all the earmarks and overspending. There is a start. Why spend money on things that don't really matter at the moment? That is like me being in debt and then going shopping for shoes when I already have 100 pairs. That is just nuts. There is no common sense with that. You need to start somewhere to get out of debt and to become financially stable. And yeah the governments budget and deficit are on a bigger scale but same concept.
    04-20-09 02:15 PM
  20. Slingbox's Avatar
    Its very sad that some believe bigger government ,higher tax will be the fix.History has proven it never works and takes away freedom from those it represents.
    Those that think bigger government is their savior are out of touch with reality.
    04-20-09 02:35 PM
  21. MissJennell#IM's Avatar
    Its very sad that some believe bigger government ,higher tax will be the fix.History has proven it never works and takes away freedom from those it represents.
    Those that think government is their savior are out of touch with reality.
    +1 on that!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    04-20-09 02:36 PM
  22. Swoopster's Avatar
    MissJennell...your opinions; as I do respect them (however not necessarily agree with them)...are too simple to be able to correlate how government works with how a common family works.

    Even though you added in a disclaimer stating that you know the government operates on a much larger scale...that doesn't take away from the fact that you can't even compare a family with the government in an economical breath that has relavence.
    04-20-09 02:57 PM
  23. JRussett's Avatar
    lets also take a minute to remember that the Republicans (who constantly campaign that THEY are the party for smaller govt) are the ones who, over the past 8 years, INCREASED the size of the govt substantially. decreasing the size and expenditures of the national govt will not happen overnight. it will take time, and it will at times seem like it's not happening, but much of what will be cut we will not see or hear about in our day to day activities.

    while it would be nice to see congress just go ahead and pass a balanced budget, it just wouldn't work that way. that would truly put this country into an econmic crisis that we would have a hard time recovering from. changing the rest of the world's impression of us over the next year or two will be a huge step because we have lost billions upon billions of tax revenue in exports. as out of control as our budget is, the ratio of our imports vs exports is even more lopsided.

    lastly we have to remember also that this has been a problem since well before bush (the sequel) took office. although clinton created a budget surplus, we were still trillions in debt. it's the CULTURE in washington that needs to change before we'll see any kind of real change amongst republicans and democrats.

    and just to think...100 years ago we had no income tax!!
    04-20-09 03:58 PM
  24. MissJennell#IM's Avatar
    I don't even see it as republican dem any more. Its more liberal and conservative and in between.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    04-20-09 04:16 PM
  25. area52's Avatar
    [QUOTE=MissJennell;2333505]You can't spend that much money and expect that you are saving us from a complete economic collapse. If you think that then you are crazy! Thats like me saying I am in debt 1,000 and then spending 10,000 more so that I can be financially sound. That is just crazy.


    That's a poor analogy. They (the FED)are not spending money on tangible "things" they are spending money on debt instruments that eventually will provide a greater return than they are currently yielding (will be worth more later than they are now), and they are lending money to institutions with the promise of being repaid at a very good rate of return. Obviously there is a lot more to that but considering the OP I wanted to keep my post simplistic.
    I understand that the popular opinion given to us through the media thinks this is a bad thing. But I ask you: where would we be right now if the FED did not take these steps?
    04-20-09 05:04 PM
129 ... 23456
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD