1. moviemogul's Avatar
    I am in the process of purchasing my first pistol, but I can't decide what to get.

    I have 3 options.

    Ruger P95: $320 + taxes/gun tax/etc Involves registering, typical dealer stuff

    Taurus 24/7 Pro: $369 plus all taxes/fees/etc

    Glock 19: Private seller: $500 (worn in weapon with reliability)

    The first 2 are brand new, in the economy range. The Glock is a standard though around the world.

    I am heading out to the range today to shoot all three, but I just wanted to get some opinions of any who have handled these weapons.
    08-09-09 09:38 AM
  2. stormcenter's Avatar
    I am in the process of purchasing my first pistol, but I can't decide what to get.

    I have 3 options.

    Ruger P95: $320 + taxes/gun tax/etc Involves registering, typical dealer stuff

    Taurus 24/7 Pro: $369 plus all taxes/fees/etc

    Glock 19: Private seller: $500 (worn in weapon with reliability)

    The first 2 are brand new, in the economy range. The Glock is a standard though around the world.

    I am heading out to the range today to shoot all three, but I just wanted to get some opinions of any who have handled these weapons.
    Not sure why this post is here but I would go for the Ruger. It's a lot of gun for the money and it is built like a tank. Don't shoot me, i'm just the messenger.
    Last edited by stormcenter; 08-09-09 at 10:25 AM.
    08-09-09 09:43 AM
  3. anon(1754793)'s Avatar
    Personally Id go with the Glock, not the 19 though if you can get Glock 21 .45 ACP I'd test that out and see how if feels on you, Its beautiful and comfortable. Then again it really doesnt matter which Glock you go with because their all beautifly crafted guns and their quality is immaculate.

    GLOCK 21 Specifications:

    Caliber .45 ACP

    Action Safe Action (constant double action mode)

    Overall length (slide) 7.59 in. (193 mm)

    Height, including magazine 5.47 in. (139 mm)

    Width 1.27 in. (32.5 mm)

    Barrel length 4.60 in. (117 mm)

    Sight radius 6.77 in. (172 mm)

    Rifling Octagonal profile with right-hand
    twist of one turn in 15.75 in. (400 mm)

    Weight, without magazine 26.28 oz. (745 g)

    Weight, empty magazine 3.1 oz. (88 g)

    Weight, full magazine ~12 oz. (~340 g)

    Magazine capacity 15 rounds

    Standard trigger pull ~5.5 lbs. (~2.5 kg)

    Trigger pull length 0.5 in. (12.5 mm)

    Number of safeties 3



    Edit: They are all great guns though thats for sure.
    Last edited by CB.Mike-D; 08-09-09 at 09:51 AM.
    08-09-09 09:46 AM
  4. the_sandman_454's Avatar
    Don't forget the Springfield XD or XDm depending on the size of gun you want. They seem to be good quality, at least my BIL's XD.40 compact and my XDm 9mm.

    I used to not like the grip angle on Glocks, but have recently gotten more comfortable with it. I still prefer the grip angle on the 1911s and the Springfield XD series though.

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    08-09-09 11:02 AM
  5. h20work's Avatar
    Don't forget the Springfield XD or XDm depending on the size of gun you want. They seem to be good quality, at least my BIL's XD.40 compact and my XDm 9mm.

    I used to not like the grip angle on Glocks, but have recently gotten more comfortable with it. I still prefer the grip angle on the 1911s and the Springfield XD series though.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Get the XD .45. Mine has choked down thoudnads of rounds without any problems. Well built and reliable. The thing is crazy accurate for an out the box 45 as well.

    If you don't want a Springfield, try a Sig. They are a bit pricey, but worth it.

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    08-09-09 12:20 PM
  6. corpnetsolutions's Avatar
    I have an s&w model 60 357 which is a nice concealed weapon. I also have the Glock model 17 which is awesome 9mm for target. They are both priced good.

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    08-10-09 12:33 AM
  7. SlydWyz's Avatar
    OP,

    If you're here in Florida, you may want to look at other options besides a USED glock for $500 (based on your "worn in" description). During the past few months, larger vendors at gunshows here in this area (S.FL), have been more than willing to part with inventory for well below their MSRP stickers, especially for cash buyers. Just this weekend there was a gunshow in the Palm Beach County area. While I had my money set on picking up another Glock (21SF), my eyes fell upon a Ruger P345 and I had to have it. The dealers were very willing to barter and wanted to let the 21SF go out the door for $525. Tempting as it was, I bought the P345 anyway. My brother bought the Glock at that price however, and since they made a 2 gun purchase out of it, they had no problem installing his night sights for no cost.

    That being said, there are some things to consider. How big/small are your hands? If grip size is important to you, and you like the G19, then also consider the G17. Most shooters that want a larger caliber like the G21 often get turned off because the frame is too large for them, so also consider the G21SF if you want to look at the .45Auto.

    Rugers are tanks, no question. The P95 will serve you fine as a pistol, and will pistol whip an aggressor much more effectively (in a pinch) than a Glock would. If you want something lighter weight and a bit more "modern" looking, then the P345 would be a wise choice.

    Also consider your budget. How much are you willing to spend? Any used gun comes with some baggage, even the highly praised Glock. Sometimes for a few dollars more, a new gun can make its way home with you instead. Then whatever issues DO arise can be easier to troubleshoot be it that there has only been one owner.

    Another budget issue is Steel/Aluminum/Plastic. Which one would you prefer to use? Be it that this is your first pistol, you may find that some Polymer pistols in larger calibers (or hotter calibers, think .357Sig) have sharper recoil than you can handle. Steel or aluminum framed pistols may help to alleviate that, along with more range time. If you're looking at pistols in general, then in this category consider the Sig P220, P226, and just about anything in the S&W line-up.

    Since you live in Florida also, the debate of what to carry for weight during what season is not needed. Whatever frame you choose, if you do decide to carry concealed, you'll have to deal with the heat we have here, so get used to it.

    As for Taurus, well, they make some very nice revolvers.

    I hope this may have helped you out, keep us posted on your purchase.
    Last edited by SlydWyz; 08-10-09 at 02:15 AM.
    08-10-09 02:10 AM
  8. syb0rg's Avatar
    OP,


    Since you live in Florida also, the debate of what to carry for weight during what season is not needed. Whatever frame you choose, if you do decide to carry concealed, you'll have to deal with the heat we have here, so get used to it.

    As for Taurus, well, they make some very nice revolvers.

    .
    Since you are getting this for the intent of CCW. i would suggest getting a subcompact weapon, for carrying. I personally carry a Taurus PT111 PRO. 9mm 10rd clip SA/DA with a just over 3" barrel. I know alot of people bash on Taurus AutoLoaders but i've put 1000+ rds through mine and it looks just as good as the day i bought it and it goes "bang" every time i pull the trigger. i've shot glock, i've shot ruger, i've show S&W, heck i have a old H&R from the 50's that i still play with every now and then. the most important thing i can tell you is get a BRAND name fire arm, Taurus, Glock, Springfield, Ruger, something like that. and stay away from the mom and pop brands. make sure you are comfortable holding the weapon and you can hide it easily. if you take care of a weapon and use good ammo it will last you a long time and preform like it should.
    08-10-09 07:27 AM
  9. moviemogul's Avatar
    I am leaning toward the G19.

    It only has had ~200 rounds through it. It comes with FMJ's and some other ammo. Also it has 2 holsters.

    For $550 it isn't a bad deal, IMO
    08-10-09 11:46 AM
  10. syb0rg's Avatar
    I am leaning toward the G19.

    It only has had ~200 rounds through it. It comes with FMJ's and some other ammo. Also it has 2 holsters.

    For $550 it isn't a bad deal, IMO
    for $550.00 ?!?! WOW ! ! !

    does that come with a kiss ?


    you can buy the BRAND new for $509.. Glock 19 9mm Hand Gun for Sale

    and that is a pretty big gun to try and hide, my old manager has one. and never carries it due to the size...
    Last edited by mjneid; 08-10-09 at 01:44 PM.
    08-10-09 01:25 PM
  11. moviemogul's Avatar
    for $550.00 ?!?! WOW ! ! !

    does that come with a kiss ?


    you can buy the BRAND new for $509.. Glock 19 9mm Hand Gun for Sale

    and that is a pretty big gun to try and hide, my old manager has one. and never carries it due to the size...
    Thanks for the link, will forward it to the seller, try and talk him down abit
    08-10-09 01:48 PM
  12. syb0rg's Avatar
    Thanks for the link, will forward it to the seller, try and talk him down abit
    I'm a fellow CCW carrier my self and i'd hate to see you get ripped off, plus i love the idea of the BackGround Check.... and buying it from a vendor v. buying from a private seller if that fire arm was used in a crime you will be charge with the crime, regardless if you did it or not. No granted you have a higher chance of riding in a stolen car, but it still can and will happen - to someone.
    08-10-09 02:06 PM
  13. SevereDeceit's Avatar
    I carry a Glock 27 sub-compact .40 caliber, love that gun, easy to conceal, reliable, 10 rounds of potent .40 caliber...

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    08-10-09 02:11 PM
  14. moviemogul's Avatar
    FWIW, It's $544.99 shipped to me. Adding in cost of ammo, holster/s, etc, it'll be closer to $600
    08-10-09 02:14 PM
  15. Witmen's Avatar
    *DO NOT READ IF YOUR REALLY INTO ANIMALS*


    If your going to spend $500 for a Glock it had better be brand new. But besides that what are you wanting the gun for? Target practice, self defense or what?

    I hate to say it but a 9mm is pathetic for stopping anything except maybe paper targets. A town in my county issues 9mm Glocks to their officers. One was called to scene of a car accident involving a deer. The animal was still alive when he arrived and in quite a bit of pain I would imagine and the decision was made by the officer to end the animals suffering. Four point blank 9mm +P rounds to the head later and it was dead.

    It's not a joke it really happened I was on duty in my small town the night it took place. If you want this gun for anything more then target practice please consider a G23 or if you really want a handful get yourself a G30.

    Either way like I said for $500 you can pretty much name whatever glock you want. Please consider that before you give him that much for a $350-$375 used G19.

    But just my opinion.
    08-10-09 02:15 PM
  16. moviemogul's Avatar
    I'm a fellow CCW carrier my self and i'd hate to see you get ripped off, plus i love the idea of the BackGround Check.... and buying it from a vendor v. buying from a private seller if that fire arm was used in a crime you will be charge with the crime, regardless if you did it or not. No granted you have a higher chance of riding in a stolen car, but it still can and will happen - to someone.
    I know the original owner of the gun (personal friend), he has never used it in a crime, just on the range
    08-10-09 02:15 PM
  17. syb0rg's Avatar
    *DO NOT READ IF YOUR REALLY INTO ANIMALS*


    If your going to spend $500 for a Glock it had better be brand new. But besides that what are you wanting the gun for? Target practice, self defense or what?

    I hate to say it but a 9mm is pathetic for stopping anything except maybe paper targets.
    IF that is how you really feel you need to buy different ammo, i'm shoot 147Gr. +P wad-cutters for my PP rounds and it'll rip most anything to shreds.... and to be honest about how many times to plan on pulling the trigger on someone?
    08-10-09 02:58 PM
  18. syb0rg's Avatar
    *DO NOT READ IF YOUR REALLY INTO ANIMALS*


    If your going to spend $500 for a Glock it had better be brand new. But besides that what are you wanting the gun for? Target practice, self defense or what?

    I hate to say it but a 9mm is pathetic for stopping anything except maybe paper targets.
    IF that is how you really feel you need to buy different ammo, i'm shoot 147Gr. +P wad-cutters for my PP rounds and it'll rip most anything to shreds.... and to be honest about how many times to plan on pulling the trigger on someone?

    People like .38 Spc and .357 mags... .did you know a 9mm would be a .356???? .001 difference..... in hole size.....


    im not saying i'm just saying...
    08-10-09 03:00 PM
  19. h20work's Avatar
    That's like saying 44mag and 45 acp are the same...

    Since it is for carry duty, I would strongly suggest going with at least 40 s&w. 40 packs a good punch and is still very accurate.

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    08-10-09 03:05 PM
  20. SevereDeceit's Avatar
    Agreed on the .40 cal. comment. The PD here is issued Sig-Sauer P-229 .40 cal. service weapons. My best friend is a cop so I got to put a couple hundred rounds throught it, I liked it so much I bought one. I'm extremely accurate with it, it's perfectly weighted and a great size, beautiful weapon...
    08-10-09 03:10 PM
  21. SlydWyz's Avatar
    Since you are getting this for the intent of CCW. i would suggest getting a subcompact weapon, for carrying.
    Sorry, OP never mentioned if it was for CCW or not, I assumed that. My apologies.

    However, if you are going to CC a pistol, there is nothing wrong with a full sized frame at all. Depending on your body type, it can be just as easy as carrying a smaller framed weapon. A typical average built male about 5'10" can just as easily conceal a Govt size 1911 as he can a G27. It's all based on how you carry and your gear (holster,belt, mag pouches, light, etc). Some of us do it all the time, and it does take a bit of getting used to, but it is do-able. Until just recently, I have always carried a Govt sized Para-Ord P14-45, a steel frame/steel slide/ double stacked 1911 and a spare mag.

    I still agree that $500 is high for a used Glock. If the owner is a friend, then ask him for a better frined price
    08-10-09 03:20 PM
  22. h20work's Avatar
    The 229 is a wonderful gun. You can also get it in 357 sig which matches a 357 mag pretty closely. That's what the secret service is using now. 9mm is fun (I have 2), but if I'm going to carry 1 gun and task it with self preservation it will be something with more punch.

    Trust me, go to the range and try a few different calibers. You will definitely feel the difference. FWIW, Sig has a nice CPO program for refurbs.

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    08-10-09 03:23 PM
  23. Witmen's Avatar
    IF that is how you really feel you need to buy different ammo, i'm shoot 147Gr. +P wad-cutters for my PP rounds and it'll rip most anything to shreds.... and to be honest about how many times to plan on pulling the trigger on someone?

    People like .38 Spc and .357 mags... .did you know a 9mm would be a .356???? .001 difference..... in hole size.....


    im not saying i'm just saying...

    I've been a Police officer for 3 years. I plan on pulling the trigger on someone everynight. The nights that I don't are good nights. So far they have all been good nights and I hope to god they will always remain that way.

    The deer was shot with +P rounds. The problem with the 9mm is it is small and such a fast round that when it hits you it is so hot it burns the surrounding flesh instantly, Resulting in no where near the blood loss you will have with a .40 or .45

    Some "experts" claim that statistically speaking a .22 LR is far more dangerous then a 9mm. A forensic pathologist, who has worked on several autopsies released papers on his experience. Which follow the same idea. When your shot with a 9mm it's almost like your getting the hole stitched up as soon as impact happens.

    Now maybe you think your experience with the 9mm can compare to the real life experiences that came from this guy. But I doubt it. I Know mine sure don't, So when this ballistic expert tells me that the 9mm isn't effective as a self defense round I listen.The vast majority of law Enforcement has long long ago dropped the 9mm.

    I mean after all have you ever heard of 50 cent? Claims to have been shot 9 times by a 9mm. Once in the face and you can see he was shot in the face. I highly doubt he would be around to make sucky *** music if someone had bought a .40
    08-10-09 03:29 PM
  24. h20work's Avatar
    A typical average built male about 5'10" can just as easily conceal a Govt size 1911 as he can a G27. It's all based on how you carry and your gear (holster,belt, mag pouches, light, etc). Some of us do it all the time, and it does take a bit of getting used to, but it is do-able. Until just recently, I have always carried a Govt sized Para-Ord P14-45, a steel frame/steel slide/ double stacked 1911 and a spare mag.
    1911's are obviously great guns. The only real drawback would be the single action only. SA/DA or DA only would (to me) make a better choice for ccw duty. I rarely carry anymore and as much as I love my xd45, when I do carry I prefer my sig.

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    08-10-09 03:32 PM
  25. the_sandman_454's Avatar
    Holy misinformation about 9mm. Being so fast it cauterizes the wound to prevent bleeding? .40sw isn't *that* much slower than 9mm, and what about .357SIG? It is a 9mm bullet in a .40sw case. It travels faster than 9mm yet the USSS and various other agencies seem to carry that without concern for too high of velocity. Interesting.
    .308 rifle rounds or even .22-250 @ 4000fps don't seem to be able to cauterize a wound, so how is it the 9 travelling around 1250fps is going to make that happen?

    9mm is what I normally carry with 147 grain +p ammo, and do not feel undergunned. The average person can get more rounds on target more quickly than bigger calibers. My other carry guns are an air weight scandium SW .357mag and a 1911 in .45acp. I like the XDm 9 I carry also due to higher magazine capacity.

    9mm is used at police depts and militaries throughout the world and has killed millions of people since its' inception. Surely they all can't be wrong.

    Was the cop who tried to put down the deer a hunter or have good knowledge of the anatomy of a deer's head such as knowing what part to hit for instant kill? If not then hits in the head could have been in the wrong part. There are reports of people being hit in the head with various rounds and not going down. This could happen with any round, which is why you don't stop firing after the first shot, you stop firing when the individual no longer presents you the threat which caused you to fear for your life in the first place. Its not like the movies or tv where a magic bullet stops the fight every time. Guns aren't death rays.

    With regard to how many times to pull the trigger, you do that until the threat is eliminated. This means either until the aggressor drops his/her weapon and surrenders or is incapacitated to an extent that they can no longer harm you. You don't stop firing until you're safe. Otherwise what's the point?

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    08-10-09 05:00 PM
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