Can't find a job

So I've got a wonderful bachelor's degree in Computer Science, sold by the school I studied at as an entry ticket to employment, and well, that just isn't the case (I don't live in the US and didn't know until recently that the situation here is almost as bad as it's there). I've applied twenty times until now (I only apply for jobs I *really* want since I'm currently busy until March doing obligatory civilian service) and I just can't get anything, except for an excellent web agency who might have an internship for me at the end of March. I don't think I have a particularly bad profile, I own a pretty successful website and use advanced Linux tools my classmates have never heard of. Yet some of them knew the right person and are now employed, despite having lower averages than I did. One of them knew the school director and thanks to him landed a remote and full-paid job. He has no experience whatsoever, he's actually a part-time student in his first semester. It's pretty disgusting, honestly. Is this how society is welcoming a motivated, clean and healthy young man? By forcing me to rely on my parents forever, making me go crazy in the meantime?

Welcome to the new world order of globalization, off continent outsourcing and domestic downsizing. Our motto is we can do more......with less staff. Clients and customers don't mind if we transfer them to some customer service rep (cough cough) in some third world country with nary a grasp of the language or product. Just as long as we can shave .00001 cents of the bottom line and keep Goldman Sachs happy.

Just take solace that in your field the rate of burnout and turnover is tremendous so positions are always opening up. That and the fact that as soon as some large conglomerate gets a new manager, they start by getting rid of anyone in the department who knew what they were doing, and hiring your former classmates for the position because why?????.........................ITS CHEAPER.

Want a job and job security. Get a trade and work with your hands. Never seen a starving tradesman.

Hang in there, one day the current business management paradigm will collapse in on itself.

Networking. Like you said, your buddies knew someone and now they have jobs. You gotta get out there and work it. Good luck

Anything worth having is worth working for (excuse the pun)

Z10STL100-2/10.2.2.1531

Keep up the spirit OP don't give up by the situation! :)

PassportSQW100-1/10.3.1.2072

Originally Posted by initialsBB

So I've got a wonderful bachelor's degree in Computer Science, sold by the school I studied at as an entry ticket to employment, and well, that just isn't the case (I don't live in the US and didn't know until recently that the situation here is almost as bad as it's there). I've applied twenty times until now (I only apply for jobs I *really* want since I'm currently busy until March doing obligatory civilian service) and I just can't get anything, except for an excellent web agency who might have an internship for me at the end of March. I don't think I have a particularly bad profile, I own a pretty successful website and use advanced Linux tools my classmates have never heard of. Yet some of them knew the right person and are now employed, despite having lower averages than I did. One of them knew the school director and thanks to him landed a remote and full-paid job. He has no experience whatsoever, he's actually a part-time student in his first semester. It's pretty disgusting, honestly. Is this how society is welcoming a motivated, clean and healthy young man? By forcing me to rely on my parents forever, making me go crazy in the meantime?

Where are you from?

Posted via Q10Bold

Nowadays it's not about what you can do anymore. A website and advanced Linux tools don't say jack. You really gotta put yourself out there. I have a MSc degree in Information Science and I had a rough time finding a job as a graduate with so many people looking for a job who do have experience. I eventually found a job at a contractor who's hiring me to an airline. I'm not in a bad position at all the pay is above average and I have some pretty neat advatages, but I know I can do better than this, but it's hard to find a IT job directly here in The Netherlands.

However, there is a IT Management traineeship at the airline where I work where I'm gonna try to get in. I talked with this guy who did the same traineeship and he gave me some tips that might be helpful to you as well.

Sell yourself! Make a timeline of everything that you've done. However don't focus too much of the content. It's good to have done this and that with whatever tool, but in the end it's about your challenges during the whole process, who you were before your experience and who you were afterwards. Don't just focus on the good things, also on the bad things. You learn to walk by falling, so describe the fall and how it changed you in order not to fall again. Give a good twist to all your experience and show them why YOU'RE the guy to hire. Get a coffee with people you haven't talked to in a whille, even if you think there's no opportunity there. Everyone knows someone who knows someone. Like someone else already said, NETWORK!

Think about why you want certain things, make them clear. Make them favorable for both parties. This means you also have to do research about the people you're going to talk to. Find out what they do, what drives them, see how you can build a bridge to them with your own set of skills, competences and personality. And be honest, always be, and do it in a skillful way.

Having a degree and working experience is nice, but the IT field changes so fast, skills that you have now are already part of yesterday. You gotta be able to manage and adapt with the changes, that's what people are looking for. You gotta have fresh ideas, which are pretty easy to come up with if you know what direction someone is willing to go to.

Make a profile page about yourself, write about the things that you've done but focus on your experiences rather than technical knowledge. Give the website a nice twist that identifies you. Make a business card that you give to the people you've talked to. You never know when you pop up in their conversations with others. It's easier to 'sell' you that way.

Keep your head up, you sound like someone who's willing to do stuff but doesn't exactly know how. The timeline is important, make a presentation about yourself, tell stuff that will impress and motivate others. You're unique, show your uniqueness!

Just my 2 cents, hope it helps!

Posted from the 'Classy' Classic!

Originally Posted by initialsBB

So I've got a wonderful bachelor's degree in Computer Science, sold by the school I studied at as an entry ticket to employment, and well, that just isn't the case (I don't live in the US and didn't know until recently that the situation here is almost as bad as it's there). I've applied twenty times until now (I only apply for jobs I *really* want since I'm currently busy until March doing obligatory civilian service) and I just can't get anything, except for an excellent web agency who might have an internship for me at the end of March. I don't think I have a particularly bad profile, I own a pretty successful website and use advanced Linux tools my classmates have never heard of. Yet some of them knew the right person and are now employed, despite having lower averages than I did. One of them knew the school director and thanks to him landed a remote and full-paid job. He has no experience whatsoever, he's actually a part-time student in his first semester. It's pretty disgusting, honestly. Is this how society is welcoming a motivated, clean and healthy young man? By forcing me to rely on my parents forever, making me go crazy in the meantime?

I've been in your shoes and can only say two things:

1. It's not fun when those "incompetent bozos" get jobs while you're not even receiving acknowledgements for your application / emails.

2. That's how things have been for a long time, way before internet and emails.

Apprentice / internships were how most folks got jobs. Now it's called networking (LinkedIn et al).

Unfortunately this is both the good and the bad news. Haul the Best! ;-)

CB10 @ Q5

Thanks for the support guys :heart: I'm from Switzerland.

I think I should definitely stop responding to job ads. Even when I carefully pick the ones where I could see myself being able to offer real value to the company, I don't get any answer. And yet unemployment agencies worldwide ask you to make twenty-something or those every month - some people actually make a living out of this. (This bs is really starting to get on my nerves.) No, what I've had the most success with, and some replies reminded me of this, is when I find companies I like by myself and show a genuine interest. I still get the infamous "but you've got no job experience!" (I was studying full-time until now and I showed you multiple successful side-projects I did in my freetime, what more do you want me to do?) but at least that's how I got the relationship with the web agency, and another phone interview.

Originally Posted by H4zN

A website and advanced Linux tools don't say jack.

You must be right as they don't seem to make a difference. Yet I can't help but think that if I were an employer I would rather pick a guy who's refined his toolset with free and timeless Linux tools - and used them to create stuff that helps real people out there - rather than pick guys who'll forever use whatever Windows version is available at the time without giving it a thought, and who were playing video games in class. The perfectionism you show with your own setup is the best example of the perfectionism you'll show when given work.

Originally Posted by initialsBB

You must be right as they don't seem to make a difference. Yet I can't help but think that if I were an employer I would rather pick a guy who's refined his toolset with free and timeless Linux tools - and used them to create stuff that helps real people out there - rather than pick guys who'll forever use whatever Windows version is available at the time without giving it a thought, and who were playing video games in class. The perfectionism you show with your own setup is the best example of the perfectionism you'll show when given work.

You need to stop focusing on what others gained despite their supposed lack of skills, they networked and that's what got them through. It is the hard reality and not going to phase out anytime soon.

Moreover, at the time of appraisals, employees with 8 achievements compared to your 12 receive the promotion because the supervisor knows them better. The pieces of advice on the past few posts is gold, I just wanted to add to that, otherwise you will end up very grumpy and it will be downhill from there.

All the best for your endeavours.

I do network, I could have landed a golden gig through an ex-colleague of mine but the timing didn't work in my favor, I arrived one or two years too late. Also, this thread reminded me of another start-up CEO with whom I ate pizza two years ago. I didn't like him much and he never replied to the email he asked me to send him that day, but I will try pinging him again on Monday.

PS: I'm not saying I'm an exceptional developer, I actually think I'm pretty bad compared to some devs I follow online. I simply find what I know morally disgusting.

Originally Posted by initialsBB

Thanks for the support guys :heart: I'm from Switzerland.

I think I should definitely stop responding to job ads. Even when I carefully pick the ones where I could see myself being able to offer real value to the company, I don't get any answer. And yet unemployment agencies worldwide ask you to make twenty-something or those every month - some people actually make a living out of this. (This bs is really starting to get on my nerves.) No, what I've had the most success with, and some replies reminded me of this, is when I find companies I like by myself and show a genuine interest. I still get the infamous "but you've got no job experience!" (I was studying full-time until now and I showed you multiple successful side-projects I did in my freetime, what more do you want me to do?) but at least that's how I got the relationship with the web agency, and another phone interview.


You must be right as they don't seem to make a difference. Yet I can't help but think that if I were an employer I would rather pick a guy who's refined his toolset with free and timeless Linux tools - and used them to create stuff that helps real people out there - rather than pick guys who'll forever use whatever Windows version is available at the time without giving it a thought, and who were playing video games in class. The perfectionism you show with your own setup is the best example of the perfectionism you'll show when given work.

Nope. All that stuff will do is scare the interviewer, because they don't understand what you've done. What they really want is tech sheep who will tow the line and not rock the boat.

You need to give the impression you're a good fit for what they do and how they do it. Even if it's rubbish.

Posted via CB10 from BlackBerry Passport

Originally Posted by initialsBB

I simply find what I know morally disgusting.

Agreed. A 1001%

Originally Posted by initialsBB

I think I should definitely stop responding to job ads. Even when I carefully pick the ones where I could see myself being able to offer real value to the company, I don't get any answer.

Don't stop, rather learn and practice so that you are thorough with all the types of questions HR can come up with. Always take their business cards and thank them through email.

If a company does not respond to you even if it is a rejection email, then the HR folks are incompetent and give a bad name to the company.

Oh, and while you are looking for jobs, start with projects, internships and most-demanded (you can find this out through job placement ads) professional certifications - the latter is always an investment!

Originally Posted by initialsBB

...
I simply find what I know morally disgusting.

I agree with you, but for any given number of such people I also know an equal number of people who appreciate genuine competence and act with utmost integrity. You'll have to find them.

CB10 @ Q5

Originally Posted by pyBerry

Nope. All that stuff will do is scare the interviewer, because they don't understand what you've done. What they really want is tech sheep who will tow the line and not rock the boat.

You need to give the impression you're a good fit for what they do and how they do it. Even if it's rubbish.

That only works with tech companies doing mass recruitment. Unfortunately, those that look for sheep just train them further to become still better sheep.

I'd suggest OP should avoid such organisations, at least don't stay with them very long.

Instead start with a small sized organisation. Due to the inherent constraints you'll learn (and need) to become competent in many things (anything and everything from different software platforms, writing/ debugging/ scaling/ support, communication/ client handling etc).

With that experience under your belt then you can choose which particular field/ subset you like best and would want to specialise in.

And never be afraid to rock the boat. If you can truly add value you will always be acknowledged and rewarded.

But right now focus on getting in front of as many interviewers as you can :-)

CB10 @ Q5

Originally Posted by umaima.b.zia

don't stop, rather learn and practice so that you are thorough with all the types of questions hr can come up with. Always take their business cards and thank them through email.

If a company does not respond to you even if it is a rejection email, then the hr folks are incompetent and give a bad name to the company.

Oh, and while you are looking for jobs, start with projects, internships and most-demanded (you can find this out through job placement ads) professional certifications - the latter is always an investment!

+1

cb10 @ q5