11-06-08 03:29 PM
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  1. jmoney1026's Avatar
    I am so over this ...I just got a Pin message from someone....It reads....

    You're White! You have NO idea what this means for people across the world. Sorry you can't see past color or Dems vs Reps. Sorry you cant embrace this time and open up!
    Makes no sence to me...I am not going to vote for some just because there race. I voted on the Issues i believe are best for this country and the platform to take it forward (in my opinion)

    If your a Woman, should you vote for a woman just because she is a woman. Not on issues. The reason Mccain didn't get a ton of Hillary voters by picking palin is because Palin is Pro LIFE and Clinton is pro Choice.
    11-05-08 12:32 PM
  2. exelant's Avatar
    They did?!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-05-08 12:34 PM
  3. JRussett's Avatar
    and the first 4 years of bush's presidency there wasnt a republican president and republican controlled congress?
    republicans tend forget this...
    11-05-08 12:35 PM
  4. LuckyStar's Avatar
    Some one in another thread wrote these words........Hope We Can instead of Yes we Can....Priceless!
    Hope We Can?

    AMERICA already DID!
    11-05-08 12:36 PM
  5. jmoney1026's Avatar
    With you I agree.

    I am nowhere near depressed about the outcome but for those that are, Europe is still an option. MY president is now YOUR president as well. AMERICA voted for Barack Obama! Not just minorities, AMERICA. Get that through your heads. The sweep that took place just goes to show that AMERICA wanted a change. AMERICA finally got it and showed up and showed out! If you are ashamed to be an American, then MOVE. Plain and simple. Don't b*tch and complain about it. Be about it. What's the point in trying to predict Obama's so-called impending failure as president? CLEARLY, AMERICA believed in him enough to vote him into office. So are you saying that AMERICANS have been misguided? Are you saying that AMERICANS have made a huge mistake? Are you saying that AMERICANS didn't read and re-read and review these policies before casting the RIGHT vote? PLEASE! You depressed souls are in the mix of us AMERICANS so just do us a favor and leave! Renounce your citizenship as an AMERICAN and leave us to focus on the change we believed in! Please believe you won't be missed!

    Not interested in going to Europe sorry they already have plenty of Socialist leaning Governments there so i will take my chances here and hope it Doesn't happen here!

    This is why Political threads Blow!!!!! I say right and you say left, I say Blue you say Black, We can go back and forth on this all day.

    BUT ME J$ aka Jeremy totally disagree with the ideas as to who and what will turn this country around..I dont beleive in giving hand outs and leg ups. Sorry if you feel different, we will agree to disagree.

    OK question time....What do you feel the Role of the Government is?
    11-05-08 12:38 PM
  6. JRussett's Avatar
    J$.....i have a better question...as an employee of a car dealership how do you feel about the automakers lobbying to get their piece of the $750 billion bailout? interested to know how you feel because you dont believe in handouts...(i'll preface this by saying i dont agree with handouts either)
    11-05-08 12:41 PM
  7. jmoney1026's Avatar
    I run a Finance Department at Buick Pontiac GMC dealership. We are getting hammered. No sales and cant get anyone approved so i am just as stressed as eveyone else about the Economy trust me.

    As for GM they need to be held accountable for the Business Practices, Rick Wagoner needs to be Fired and maybe filing BK is the only way to disolve the Unions and start over. On a serious note GM has about 15 months of Operating Cash Available, once that runs out is over!

    GM Closing would kill this Economy!

    Also the money they want is to merge with Chrysler and sell off Chryslers Assets. It is gonna Cost around $10bil to do this.

    As for my opinion i think GM needs to seek help from the private markets and not the Government and bring people on board that can actually read a balance Sheet. If they get the bail out i think we will be talking about GM's troubles again in 2 years. Its a patch not a FIX!
    11-05-08 01:00 PM
  8. vinnie_dugan's Avatar
    I just want to debate fdr right now

    "The most important source of New Deal revenue were excise taxes levied on alcoholic beverages, cigarettes, matches, candy, chewing gum, margarine, fruit juice, soft drinks, cars, tires (including tires on wheelchairs), telephone calls, movie tickets, playing cards, electricity, radios -- these and many other everyday things were subject to New Deal excise taxes, which meant that the New Deal was substantially financed by the middle class and poor people. Yes, to hear FDR's "Fireside Chats," one had to pay FDR excise taxes for a radio and electricity! A Treasury Department report acknowledged that excise taxes "often fell disproportionately on the less affluent.""

    "New Deal taxes were major job destroyers during the 1930s, prolonging unemployment that averaged 17%. Higher business taxes meant that employers had less money for growth and jobs. Social Security excise taxes on payrolls made it more expensive for employers to hire people, which discouraged hiring."

    "Other New Deal programs destroyed jobs, too. For example, the National Industrial Recovery Act (1933) cut back production and forced wages above market levels, making it more expensive for employers to hire people - blacks alone were estimated to have lost some 500,000 jobs because of the National Industrial Recovery Act. The Agricultural Adjustment Act (1933) cut back farm production and devastated black tenant farmers who needed work. The National Labor Relations Act (1935) gave unions monopoly bargaining power in workplaces and led to violent strikes and compulsory unionization of mass production industries. Unions secured above-market wages, triggering big layoffs and helping to usher in the depression of 1938."

    "What about the good supposedly done by New Deal spending programs? These didn't increase the number of jobs in the economy, because the money spent on New Deal projects came from taxpayers who consequently had less money to spend on food, coats, cars, books and other things that would have stimulated the economy. This is a classic case of the seen versus the unseen -- we can see the jobs created by New Deal spending, but we cannot see jobs destroyed by New Deal taxing."

    "FDR might not have intended to harm millions of poor people, but that's what happened. We should evaluate government policies according to their actual consequences, not their good intentions."

    hope this helps
    11-05-08 01:03 PM
  9. JRussett's Avatar
    yeah i hear most of that...not a good scenario for most people...i read once that GM could stay in the red each quarter for something like 80years before it had to declare bankruptcy because of it's capital. not sure how accurate that was but i was curious how you felt about that. it might not be a horrible thing for any company to start over...look at the airlines (ive been in the aviation industry since i was 16) - united, usair, american etc all the big time airlines that have been around for decades had to totally reorganize because the systems they were operating under were so bogged down with costs that they couldnt keep themselves afloat. now they've all adapted to the more streamlined and cost effective methods that southwest and jetblue use...now they're not exactly alike but the premise is similar...and the govt tried to bail out the airlines too after 9/11 - it didnt work, they went under anyway and declared bankruptcy...now most have them have climbed back and are doing reasonable well (as volitile as the industry is)
    11-05-08 01:10 PM
  10. jmoney1026's Avatar
    to put it out there as far as stocks go Netflix has a Larger Market Cap than GM!

    I agree start over and bring in good people that can actually run a business. GM cant compete with Toyota, Honda, Kia, ect when they pay a Employee at a plant $50 a hour including Benefits, while the non unioned lines pay $10- 12 a hour. The only way that GM can break there agreement with unions is to do Buy Outs which they cant afford or File BK and they judge can break there contract with the unions. Plus there are also to many dealerships and brands in the GM family. At my dealership let me tell you who our number one competitor we get shopped against most is....Chevy, No lie we get more people shopping our sierras trucks with Silverado's. Its crazy, we are not getting people looking at Dodges or Fords!

    I agree with you...Start over and clean house!
    11-05-08 01:25 PM
  11. exelant's Avatar
    You are correct Vinnie that many of the short term job programs were ineffective, as was an experiment in letting the private sector provide relief. Roosevelt was trying anything and everything. There was 25% unemployment and no jobs were being created -- not under the low taxes of Hoover or the slightly higher taxes under Roosevelt -- none, nada, zip. Maybe you don't like the legitimizing of labor unions, but I think it was a wonderful thing that actually changed us from dieposable parts of industry to partners able to share in the rewards. I guess you hate health benefits or an 8 hour day or any of the other benefits we take for granted today won by the labor unions of the early part of the 20th century. Americans were starving and massive numbers were homeless. It is fact that we were on the verge of a revolution in the US and Roosevelt brought us back from the brink.

    The long term aspects of Roosevelts New Deal were much more successful. Many New Deal programs were established to reform the economic system to ensure that an economic depression to the extent of the 1930s would never be seen again. The Securities and Exchange Commission was established to regulate the stock market and enforce federal security laws. Another New Deal program that reformed in the economic system was the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC). During the Great Depression, many people lost all their life savings because the bank they invested in had no money. FDIC was established to provide depositors governmental insurance to all money deposited in commercial banks up to $100,000 dollars. Another New Deal program established to reform economic policies was the Social Security Act which guaranteed all retired peoples over 65 a monthly pension. All things I'm sure you hate.
    11-05-08 03:28 PM
  12. the_sandman_454's Avatar
    I'm depressed that so many people are making a fuss about Obama's race rather than his politics. I'm depressed that some people have implied it was racist to have voted against Obama even if done due to his politics rather than ethnicity.

    I'm worried about the Second Amendment rights of Americans and the extreme liberal congress with an antigun president who'll likely rubber stamp any anti gun bill that crosses his desk. You should all know there will be plenty of such bills spewed by this group.

    I'm worried we'll get another liberal Supreme Court Justice, and that is absolutely what we do not need at this point. Finally got a decent ruling on individual's right to own of firearms versus the misguided notion that it was a collective right. There's still a lot of cases that need to be heard to cease certain violations of Constitutional rights for which we can't afford another liberal justice.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-05-08 03:49 PM
  13. khelena13's Avatar
    Not at all depressed!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-05-08 03:52 PM
  14. metalwraith's Avatar
    Nope not depressed at all... besides I'm finally glad to see someone younger in office than some fossil ready for the nursing home. I don't even care what race they are. Obama could of been a green martian for all I cared.... long as it's someone younger than the fossils that have served prior.
    11-05-08 04:11 PM
  15. weiber teufel's Avatar
    I'm depressed that so many people are making a fuss about Obama's race rather than his politics. I'm depressed that some people have implied it was racist to have voted against Obama even if done due to his politics rather than ethnicity.

    I'm worried about the Second Amendment rights of Americans and the extreme liberal congress with an antigun president who'll likely rubber stamp any anti gun bill that crosses his desk. You should all know there will be plenty of such bills spewed by this group.

    I'm worried we'll get another liberal Supreme Court Justice, and that is absolutely what we do not need at this point. Finally got a decent ruling on individual's right to own of firearms versus the misguided notion that it was a collective right. There's still a lot of cases that need to be heard to cease certain violations of Constitutional rights for which we can't afford another liberal justice.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

    i agree with you 100%!!!!
    11-05-08 04:15 PM
  16. FletchsGirl's Avatar
    I didn't vote for anybody determined by their race or their party. I voted because of their values and beliefs... And as for that Sarah Chick...Quite frankly, I would have voted for her in a HEARTBEAT!!! I will post more when I get back tonight.
    11-05-08 05:19 PM
  17. jmoney1026's Avatar
    I didn't vote for anybody determined by their race or their party. I voted because of their values and beliefs... And as for that Sarah Chick...Quite frankly, I would have voted for her in a HEARTBEAT!!! I will post more when I get back tonight.
    Very True....Vote on issues is my belief. I am Glad we have our first African American President. I just wish it was a Republican! I loved Palin..A friend of a friend lives in Alaska, She just came down to Visit and she was telling everyone about Sarah. She has done alot for the People of Alaska. She has the Highest Approval Rating of any Gov in the US FyI!
    11-05-08 05:28 PM
  18. naturalbeauty334's Avatar
    I am beyond happy for Obama!
    11-05-08 05:40 PM
  19. Crucial_Xtreme's Avatar
    1459 days 1hr 37 mins 10 seconds until next election
    11-05-08 08:28 PM
  20. exelant's Avatar
    It couldn't have turned out any better. I am a gun owner and have no worries at all about Obama. This same warning has been brought up every time a Democrat has been elected since LBJ that this is going to happen and it never does. Guys, the sky is not falling and no one is going to take your weapons. Hasn't happened and isn't going to happen.

    As far as the Supreme Court goes, we need to keep a balance between the left, the right and the middle. Right now the court leans right, and the justices most likely to retire (or die in office) are the liberal justices. Over 8 years the best Obama can do is maintain the current makeup. People on the right are never happy unless it is all their way . No compromise and no middle ground.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-05-08 08:32 PM
  21. exelant's Avatar
    I said the same thing about Bush, CX, and he ended up winning a second term to do even more damage.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-05-08 08:41 PM
  22. the_sandman_454's Avatar
    The court is pretty moderate right now. It needs to swing a hard right for a few decades to further secure Second Amendment rights in every state.

    Obama may be somewhat moderate but there's no way you can tell me the Congressional leaders are moderate. New AWB will probably come up and guess what, probably pass. And once again all it will accomplish is penalizing law abiding citizens for being law abiding citizens.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-05-08 09:41 PM
  23. jmoney1026's Avatar
    Omg,,,The liberal media is so scared of Sarah Palin its funny.
    I am so sick of Keith Oberman i wish he would go back to sports....
    tonight on his tv show he said " Sarah Palin was in her room at the hoted and a Mccain aid came in to bring her down for a statment only to find Palin in a bath Towel standing there" WTF then Oberman said "Isnt that what she was brougjt into do! for the party...Sexism,,,,!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    So annoying all the dumb progressives are chearing and waiting for there free day in the sun,,,

    Take his punk azz of the air, NBC is losing viewers at a record pace....MAybe because they are ti left
    Last edited by jmoney1026; 11-05-08 at 10:45 PM.
    11-05-08 10:42 PM
  24. ninja please's Avatar
    well, after today I honestly can't see how anyone could be smug and "pleased" with it... there were several colleges/high schools around here that had to have cops come because of some violent black/white racial rioting and fighting. I'm sure this isn't the only place where those things went on and I'm also sure that it's far from over, it's just getting started... it's really sad. I knew it would happen, but I do certainly hope something positive comes out of this election and not such hatred and general smartassedness from any race. I don't care what color you are, be mature about it and let it be.


    anyway, completely off topic, Sarah Palin is a cougar.
    11-06-08 02:02 AM
  25. JRussett's Avatar
    a cougar she is, and she should be left at the zoo not brought into national politics lol....i live in ny and there have been no reports of unruly activity here in the 'burbs or in the city. again oberman should def have stayed at espn, but....msnbc is actually gained alot of viewship the last 6 months...earlier in the year they were tagged as a dead network, but have leaped back towards the top of the ratings again...
    11-06-08 08:11 AM
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