01-04-12 02:54 PM
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  1. alnamvet68's Avatar
    I don't get it, people spend $500, $600, $700 and up on a tablet and they're complaining about an app that cost less then a cup of Starbuck's coffee?
    01-04-12 10:09 AM
  2. ADozenEggs@aol.com's Avatar
    I don't get it, people spend $500, $600, $700 and up on a tablet and they're complaining about an app that cost less then a cup of Starbuck's coffee?
    Coffee is less than $3 at Starbucks. Unless you're talking about a Latte.
    01-04-12 10:19 AM
  3. apg300's Avatar
    People are entitled to their own opinion, because people have different sets of experiences, expectations, values, upbringing, educational attainment, etc.

    After all, this would be a boring, stagnant world if everyone agreed on everything. Conflict is part of human existence and evolution. Having said that, it is how we manage conflict that will spell the difference. Learn to disagree agreeably. Learn to respect other people's opinion as you throw out your own.

    As for my thoughts on this thread...

    One of the main issues that people raise with BlackBerry phones and the Playbook is the lack of available apps. If we want more apps to be available, we should be willing to pay a reasonable amount for quality apps. This way, more developers will be encouraged to develop apps for the Playbook and for BB Smartphones. If we would always demand that apps be free, then we should not be surprised to find less and less apps on Appworld.

    I personally don't mind paying for an app, so long as it's reasonably priced, of high quality, and has good support from developer/s. Yes, 3-day trial versions with full functionality are sufficient for evaluating whether to purchase or not.

    Truthfully, I actually think twice even before downloading a totally free app. Chances are there are tons of ads, limitations, and nagging "buy me" scripts that I am not really fond of. But that's alright, the developers are entitled to that. After all, they spent time working on these apps. Remember, time spent working on something means time away from other things like family, vacations, sports, etc. I think that should be rewarded.

    Just my two cents worth.

    Best regards to everyone! Cheers!!!
    01-04-12 11:31 AM
  4. jivegirl14's Avatar
    I don't get it, people spend $500, $600, $700 and up on a tablet and they're complaining about an app that cost less then a cup of Starbuck's coffee?
    Even $200. And some even have 2 or 3 other devices. SMH. But just watch them justify that overpriced Starbucks that they buy more than once a week and probably several times a month. Or that McD's or whatever other here today gone in 3 minutes purchase they make. It's OK for Starbucks et al, developers on the other hand should give away their hard work for free..

    Seriously, if one can't afford the app just don't buy it, why complain? If people find anything else too expensive for their tastes don't they just not buy it and go somewhere else/get something cheaper?

    Dear Rovio - Thanks for bringing Angry Birds HD to the Playbook just in time for Christmas. It's worth every bit of the $4.99 I paid for it (and the other two). Please (and this applies to other app developers too) ignore those who think you should work for free ...just bring more great quality games and apps to Playbook. Much appreciated
    alnamvet68 likes this.
    01-04-12 12:14 PM
  5. nubTard's Avatar
    I take it that you would be happy if the company you work for stopped paying you then?

    I left the second part in as I wanted to add that you do almost have a point. However, apps aren't art, they're a product. Angry Birds is not art. I'm not sure that I'd pay for it if it was!
    software is not a product, software is a pile of characters. companies both claim copyright and patents over these piles of characters, meaning that you can't copy it and you can't make your own. if they are going to assert that i can't do what comes naturally (copying) then no, they do not deserve a cent for anything they do as they are trying to profit from human knowledge, something that belongs to everyone (check our history, all the greatest things come from sharing not exploiting... most specifically check the history of agriculture. only the free flow of knowledge leads to progress).

    i don't work. i'll do stuff that most people consider work for free, but i refuse to create a profit for someone. that's not what we're here for. in order to create a profit, someone has to get screwed: either the clients, the suppliers, or the employees. it is impossible to create a profit otherwise. we do happen to live in a society that glorifies theft, but that does not mean we should say it's a good thing. from that, you can find the answer to your question; i will work harder than anyone else so long as it's for a good cause, if it's solely for profit then the only thing i can do as someone who values good is try to limit the profits created (meaning pushing for the most money while accepting the least amount of work and responsibility). so.. if the 'company' is doing something for a non-profit motive, than i will as well, but if they are doing it for a profit motive it would be wrong to do anything without being overpaid for your input... and that is not to be selfish, it is to penalize the company for engaging in unethical behaviour.

    the argument for the profit economy is based on people who say that without a profit motive no one would push anything forward but that totally ignores the people who refuse to participate due to the profit motives. once this society implodes on itself (inevitably as it is more and more based around counterproductive economic actions such as financial services, general consumer services, tourism, and hoarding) i'll be more than happy to participate in building an ethical society. i'm guessing some uber-capitalist will jump on me for this, so let me just say, im anti-communist as much as im anti-capitalist (both have been proven to not work).

    the games are art argument is something i'd rather skip.. i'm not a fan of art, nor games, i can appreciate both, but neither is of any actual value. in fact they have negative value as they take resources away from things that would be more deserving.
    Last edited by BigBadWulf; 01-04-12 at 01:15 PM. Reason: language
    01-04-12 12:24 PM
  6. darkmanx2g's Avatar
    LOL rovio actually developed for the unfinished unproven platform and you guys think it should be free considering there are so little users compared to the other platforms.
    01-04-12 12:29 PM
  7. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    software is not a product, software is a pile of characters. companies both claim copyright and patents over these piles of characters, meaning that you can't copy it and you can't make your own. if they are going to assert that i can't do what comes naturally (copying) then no, they do not deserve a cent for anything they do as they are trying to profit from human knowledge, something that belongs to everyone (check our history, all the greatest things come from sharing not exploiting... most specifically check the history of agriculture. only the free flow of knowledge leads to progress).

    i don't work. i'll do stuff that most people consider work for free, but i refuse to create a profit for someone. that's not what we're here for. in order to create a profit, someone has to get screwed: either the clients, the suppliers, or the employees. it is impossible to create a profit otherwise. we do happen to live in a society that glorifies theft, but that does not mean we should say it's a good thing. from that, you can find the answer to your question; i will work harder than anyone else so long as it's for a good cause, if it's solely for profit then the only thing i can do as someone who values good is try to limit the profits created (meaning pushing for the most money while accepting the least amount of work and responsibility). so.. if the 'company' is doing something for a non-profit motive, than i will as well, but if they are doing it for a profit motive it would be wrong to do anything without being overpaid for your input... and that is not to be selfish, it is to penalize the company for engaging in unethical behaviour.

    the argument for the profit economy is based on people who say that without a profit motive no one would push anything forward but that totally ignores the people who refuse to participate due to the profit motives. once this society implodes on itself (inevitably as it is more and more based around counterproductive economic actions such as financial services, general consumer services, tourism, and hoarding) i'll be more than happy to participate in building an ethical society. i'm guessing some uber-capitalist will jump on me for this, so let me just say, im anti-communist as much as im anti-capitalist (both have been proven to not work).

    the games are art argument is something i'd rather skip.. i'm not a fan of art, nor games, i can appreciate both, but neither is of any actual value. in fact they have negative value as they take resources away from things that would be more deserving.
    Writing software is just as legitimate a job as any other. If you can't respect the effort involved, I'm sorry.

    The rest of your anarchist rant needs to stop. This is a forum about BlackBerries, not a place for political/societal debate.
    Chaddface, jivegirl14 and Pdinos3 like this.
    01-04-12 01:18 PM
  8. nubTard's Avatar
    Writing software is just as legitimate a job as any other. If you can't respect the effort involved, I'm sorry.

    The rest of your anarchist rant needs to stop. This is a forum about BlackBerries, not a place for political/societal debate.
    writing software is legitimate, selling software is not. the rest of the rant is required in this particular thread as it is about the price of apps. no one should be complaining about app prices, nor should they be wanting apps, as the playbook has no need for apps. it has a browser that supports flash, meaning that anything you may want to do is available for free on the internet already, and if there is something you need which isn't... then you can code it easily yourself in html without having to apply for a dev key or whatever the pb uses to sign it's apps.

    this is a forum for blackberries, but half the posts are people complaining about the lack of something they don't need and people saying that if the complainers were willing to pay people they could have access to higher quality versions of things that they don't need. you didn't bother to come out against those people who want to improve the playbook for a fee, nor those suggesting that the playbook is a failure, or even those who brought up the societal debate by claiming that nothing is free or those who are unwilling to pay for apps would be better off selling their playbook (for what? a tablet that does require apps in order to function??).

    the app love comes directly from the ipad, it had no native capability to do anything which is why they created the app store. the pb, having a flash-capable browser has absolutely no need for any apps. supporting apps is counter-intuitive: by playing to the pay-for-features crowd, resources will doubtlessly be shifted from useful (supporting more websites such as googlemaps) to useless (angrybirds) to the detriment of the entire platform. the argument is that simple, you have to choose to support apps or support the playbook itself (my rant should make the reasoning for that clear) as the two cannot coexist (unless the pb were opensourced which is not going to happen). since i want my playbook to continue functioning, i have no choice but to argue against apps at every opportunity, sony's removal of the 'other os' option on their gaming console is proof that you cannot trust a company not to retroactively nerf a product if it will create a profit for them (such as forcing the purchase of apps that mimicwhat is available through the web because of limitations on functionality).

    at present, the pb is a free system: it requires no additional purchases in order to work. supporting devs changes that, and as RIM profits from app sales, they have a monetary motive to choose apps over development of the platform. that same monetary motive is why the pb will never have bbm available to it without a bb and the bridge app.

    do you still believe my political rant is not entirely about the playbook?
    01-04-12 01:59 PM
  9. olblueyez's Avatar
    This is just my take on things. Most of the "Paid Apps" I have are of the more expensive variety because they work and they get regular updates. And continue to work.

    However, the software distributors are basically absent when it comes time to set any standards for who is able to sell and who is not. I believe if they were more proactive than the overall quality of "The Store" would be much better and instill more confidence with the customers. Greater confidence equals many good things along with more sales.

    Just think, if all the crud apps, that everyone knows will never be updated and or finished were removed until they met some kind of standard, buying apps would be easier and much more likely.

    Anyone ever try the Netflix app for adding movies to your que? Should have been flushed along time ago.

    Does having a store full of neglected apps that someone neglected to ditch really help the bottom line that much? Only if you are depending on people not reclaiming their stolen money because it was a few bucks.

    Ever eat at some hole in the wall that claimed to have the best "whatever" and the food was terrible? You don't go there anymore right?

    The BlackBerry Platform is diverse and complicated enough, why leave all the dead merchandise in the front window when you have product that "Is Good"? So the good stuff is harder to find in hopes of unloading a few one timers???

    Its just like the threads about RIM advertising, when you have a store merchandising is everything.

    Hey Kevin, I'd buy a lot more cases if the pictures were clear enough to see if the cases interfered with the keypad on my 9900. You know, the famous RIM keypad. How do I know the pictures the vendor gave you are telling me everything or not?
    01-04-12 02:22 PM
  10. blackjack93117's Avatar
    software is not a product, software is a pile of characters. companies both claim copyright and patents over these piles of characters, meaning that you can't copy it and you can't make your own. if they are going to assert that i can't do what comes naturally (copying) then no, they do not deserve a cent for anything they do as they are trying to profit from human knowledge, something that belongs to everyone (check our history, all the greatest things come from sharing not exploiting... most specifically check the history of agriculture. only the free flow of knowledge leads to progress).

    i don't work. i'll do stuff that most people consider work for free, but i refuse to create a profit for someone. that's not what we're here for. in order to create a profit, someone has to get screwed: either the clients, the suppliers, or the employees. it is impossible to create a profit otherwise. we do happen to live in a society that glorifies theft, but that does not mean we should say it's a good thing. from that, you can find the answer to your question; i will work harder than anyone else so long as it's for a good cause, if it's solely for profit then the only thing i can do as someone who values good is try to limit the profits created (meaning pushing for the most money while accepting the least amount of work and responsibility). so.. if the 'company' is doing something for a non-profit motive, than i will as well, but if they are doing it for a profit motive it would be wrong to do anything without being overpaid for your input... and that is not to be selfish, it is to penalize the company for engaging in unethical behaviour.

    the argument for the profit economy is based on people who say that without a profit motive no one would push anything forward but that totally ignores the people who refuse to participate due to the profit motives. once this society implodes on itself (inevitably as it is more and more based around counterproductive economic actions such as financial services, general consumer services, tourism, and hoarding) i'll be more than happy to participate in building an ethical society. i'm guessing some uber-capitalist will jump on me for this, so let me just say, im anti-communist as much as im anti-capitalist (both have been proven to not work).

    the games are art argument is something i'd rather skip.. i'm not a fan of art, nor games, i can appreciate both, but neither is of any actual value. in fact they have negative value as they take resources away from things that would be more deserving.
    Soo basically everyone is supposed to work for free so you can have everything you want for free?
    I tell ya - if I wasn't making a profit I would just go bang on the drum all day...are you typing this from Wall Street?

    I profit from people who profit. I don't begrudge them for making a profit with my labor, because I profit from it also. If that did not happen the world would stop turning. Or there would be slavery and rampant poverty

    Not working while others pay taxes to support artists is theft IMO, so the artists must be paid by the value of their work. If their work has no value they should find another product to sell. Software is hard work, not "art" - people value it and it sells. You're not going to find too many willing to do it for the sake of humanity.

    Stop working because you don't want to contribute to someone's profit? Cut off your nose to spite your face while you're at it, or maybe you just don't want to work? Because all jobs are provided by those who make a profit. Unless you mean the government who takes money from those who make a profit.

    Oops hope I didn't cross another line Wulf.
    Last edited by blackjack93117; 01-04-12 at 02:41 PM.
    Barljo likes this.
    01-04-12 02:23 PM
  11. olblueyez's Avatar
    Soo basically everyone is supposed to work for free so you can have everything you want for free?
    Apologies in advance, to the Mods if its a little too far out.

    [YT]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKqCq_Knnbo[/YT]

    Last edited by olblueyez; 01-04-12 at 02:46 PM.
    01-04-12 02:30 PM
  12. kill_9's Avatar
    The pricing of applications in BlackBerry App World is reasonable in my opinion and in some cases the application is worth many times more than the asking price. I am very selective though in choosing which applications to download and install which leads me to be more satisfied than those whom download 100 applications (paid or free) in a weekend.
    01-04-12 02:31 PM
  13. nubTard's Avatar
    Soo basically everyone is supposed to work for free so you can have everything you want for free?

    I tell ya - if I wasn't making a profit I would just go bang on the drum all day...are you typing this from Wall Street?

    Not working while others pay taxes to support artists is theft IMO
    im apolitical, so no (i consider the 99% to be part of the 1% as for the most part they want a 'fair' deal that ignores that the wealth is being siphoned from the true poor of the world). well, the thing is.. everything is theft. the only things that are actually produced come from the ground (natural resources, agriculture, water) meaning that some unfairly profit from everyone's mutual wealth. that profit is then used to fund less meaningful activities in exchange for subservience. essentially, any work anyone does is simply to get access to what is already free. it does not seem unreasonable to ask that everything be free since everything we want was free in the first place.

    and i believe i said before, artists do not deserve money for their contribution to humanity. the fact that taxes go towards artists has nothing to do with this, that problem is a creation of government and our history of feudalism (an elite group chose to maintain dominance over resources through the use of force and chose to 'share' the wealth with artists through way of patronage).
    01-04-12 02:43 PM
  14. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    writing software is legitimate, selling software is not. the rest of the rant is required in this particular thread as it is about the price of apps. no one should be complaining about app prices, nor should they be wanting apps, as the playbook has no need for apps. it has a browser that supports flash, meaning that anything you may want to do is available for free on the internet already, and if there is something you need which isn't... then you can code it easily yourself in html without having to apply for a dev key or whatever the pb uses to sign it's apps.

    this is a forum for blackberries, but half the posts are people complaining about the lack of something they don't need and people saying that if the complainers were willing to pay people they could have access to higher quality versions of things that they don't need. you didn't bother to come out against those people who want to improve the playbook for a fee, nor those suggesting that the playbook is a failure, or even those who brought up the societal debate by claiming that nothing is free or those who are unwilling to pay for apps would be better off selling their playbook (for what? a tablet that does require apps in order to function??).

    the app love comes directly from the ipad, it had no native capability to do anything which is why they created the app store. the pb, having a flash-capable browser has absolutely no need for any apps. supporting apps is counter-intuitive: by playing to the pay-for-features crowd, resources will doubtlessly be shifted from useful (supporting more websites such as googlemaps) to useless (angrybirds) to the detriment of the entire platform. the argument is that simple, you have to choose to support apps or support the playbook itself (my rant should make the reasoning for that clear) as the two cannot coexist (unless the pb were opensourced which is not going to happen). since i want my playbook to continue functioning, i have no choice but to argue against apps at every opportunity, sony's removal of the 'other os' option on their gaming console is proof that you cannot trust a company not to retroactively nerf a product if it will create a profit for them (such as forcing the purchase of apps that mimicwhat is available through the web because of limitations on functionality).

    at present, the pb is a free system: it requires no additional purchases in order to work. supporting devs changes that, and as RIM profits from app sales, they have a monetary motive to choose apps over development of the platform. that same monetary motive is why the pb will never have bbm available to it without a bb and the bridge app.

    do you still believe my political rant is not entirely about the playbook?
    It's a thread about an app, not the native system. You can't play Angry Birds online. The expansion of apps leads to further consumption of the device, which leads to further development of said device. What a company decides to do with it's product is their choice.

    I'm not getting hooked into a theological discussion about how the world should/shouldn't work, and peoples values within it. Nice try though
    spike12 and jivegirl14 like this.
    01-04-12 02:53 PM
  15. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    The topic has now run it's course. Directly into the ground.
    Barljo and apg300 like this.
    01-04-12 02:54 PM
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