06-09-11 04:03 PM
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  1. esqlaw's Avatar
    no--it IS useless, because you cried wolf. There's nothing to see here.
    I disagree. I still do not trust app world. Someone has confirmed that the developers themselves can deny a review and its score... so how can app world's reviews ever be a true representation of user's experience when a dev can just erase all the bad opinion's. Also, I paid for this product based on user reviews on app world to my own dismay. In the future you can bet that I will look for a better and more independent source when evaluating a transaction over bb app world. In business thats a failure in a sense because you want to reduce impediments to a purchase not add to them. Unless you're selling a bad product where obscurity works towards your advantage.

    So I didn't cry wolf. If you have sufficient knowledge of what that phrase connotes then you'd know by now, if you read the discussion, that this thread was not useless or someone "crying wolf".
    05-05-11 05:37 PM
  2. esqlaw's Avatar
    Gotta agree with Dave here.
    There are too many threads with sensational titles that end up giving a totally different impression than what is actually in the thread.

    At least change the title to something more relevant like. "Can't find my review in AppWorld".

    For some reason, people seem to feel they need to have a dramatic title to draw readers into the thread. If you really want answers or help to a problem, make the title clear and to the point.

    I still don't trust app world. Plus I do understand what you mean by a "sensational title", but I think if you think my title fits this category, you ought to lighten up... its a forum post not a product review. Furthermore, the title actually reflects the content of the discussion I aimed at. I, after purchasing my first app and reviewing had lost trust in the system. And based on further discussion, I haven't changed my mind. Despite the fact that my post shows up for some people, I am concerned.

    Do you trust app world assuming devs can censor their product reviews they charge money for? I know its a microtransaction involving so little cash, but its not about the amount... is it? Its about being tricked... essentially. Perhaps you think differently?

    Reviews also serve a secondary purpose. By identifying the app's faults the devs are motivated to improve or fix their product.
    05-05-11 05:48 PM
  3. louzer's Avatar
    Perhaps the problem with the app is the same as the problem with App World. Maybe you did not save your work correctly as opposed to the app being buggy.

    (jk...I could not resist - no harm meant)

    I find that App World caches in my browser and sometimes I have to do a <ctrl>-f5 to refresh to see new reviews.

    I think that it's naive to make any purchase soley on customer reviews. Amazon is filled with product pages with a single 5-star review which is obviously written by the person selling the product. Also, some people post reviews immediately after downloading without really giving the app a workout. And others don't use all of the same functionality that you might.

    I'm not sure, but I think you can apply for a refund on an app that doesn't work.

    App developers are allowed to deny reviews. This removes both the reviews as well as the star points from the rating average. A better system would be to allow reviewers to reply. But in lieu of this, it's not bad. If you have 100 reviews, and one is bad, denying will leave your average score probably where it should be. If you deny all bad reviews, then your app will be sitting there with only a couple of reviews.

    If you're going to purchase based on reviews, then you should consider the number of reviews along with the rating.
    05-05-11 06:12 PM
  4. HaTaX's Avatar
    I bought cogimap as well and actually really like it! I think the developer posted that in the new version that has been submitted there are numerous fixes and additions that allow saving it yourself.

    For the meantime, I've just been taking a screenshot of the map when I want to "save" it. It's a really cool program and will come in VERY handy during meetings I need to keep track of things in.
    05-05-11 06:19 PM
  5. esqlaw's Avatar
    I bought cogimap as well and actually really like it! I think the developer posted that in the new version that has been submitted there are numerous fixes and additions that allow saving it yourself.

    For the meantime, I've just been taking a screenshot of the map when I want to "save" it. It's a really cool program and will come in VERY handy during meetings I need to keep track of things in.
    Could you tell me what version you're using because I don't see any update or save function. I do like the app and its prob worth $2 in the end if it functions well enough.

    Its preety good at organizing your thoughts for a letter or paper you need to draft.

    edit. Oh I misread your post. the update is pending. So I guess I understand why replying to reviews should be permitted. Either way I stick to my concerns I have raised previously.
    Last edited by esqlaw; 05-05-11 at 06:39 PM.
    05-05-11 06:33 PM
  6. HaTaX's Avatar
    There's no update yet, I saw him mention somewhere that the new version is SUBMITTED but not yet approved by App World. And the saving that I'm doing is just taking a screenshot of the map and it gets placed in your pictures. Screenshots are done with Vol + and - keys at the same time.

    EDIT:
    Here's what he posted on the app world page for it:

    To come as soon as the device is available:
    * Multitouch gesture (Zoom, Pan ...)
    * Export to various mindmap formats
    * Email integration
    * Copy / Paste
    * Many more...
    05-05-11 06:40 PM
  7. anon(1035135)'s Avatar
    i think this is a legitimate post. I purchased the "Go Studio" app, saw my review actually posted, and today it is gone. The developer has no rating once again. It was a negative post as the app simply was a gui interface that had absolutely no functionality. I gave it 1/2 a star. Now you'd never know.

    Shady? Absolutely.
    belsunce likes this.
    05-05-11 07:01 PM
  8. Jake Storm's Avatar
    How's that for a post title?

    I still don't trust app world. Plus I do understand what you mean by a "sensational title", but I think if you think my title fits this category, you ought to lighten up... its a forum post not a product review.
    So that means it's o.k. to sensationalize and exaggerate?

    I haven't changed my mind. Despite the fact that my post shows up for some people, I am concerned.
    Why? Don't you believe the posters that are saying they can see it? You have major trust issues!

    Do you trust app world assuming devs can censor their product reviews they charge money for? I know its a microtransaction involving so little cash, but its not about the amount... is it? Its about being tricked... essentially. Perhaps you think differently?
    I do think differently. Devs should be able to delete falsely negative reviews from people that like to sensationalize, aren't using the app right, or competitors simply posting lies. Why not let the devs edit reviews of their own product rather than pay someone from RIM to do the same?
    05-05-11 07:19 PM
  9. esqlaw's Avatar
    Jake:
    I think I have been sufficiently clear and candid in all my conduct. What is the point of an app that doesn't save reliably? The app is ok... not extraordinary. With full functionality I'd still only rate it a 3/5. My opinion is well grounded. It didn't deserve to be deleted. It was spot on review of the product. Not exaggerated. How could that be "sensational"?

    How is my "forum post" sensational? Like I said, it is not sensational. It doesn't fit that category.

    next, I outlined my concerns. In short, you generally don't give control of what reviews are posted for a reason.

    And as for your third remark, do you really think my post was false? You suggested that I don't trust others..... The guy was protecting his product from a true but harmful review. I say that rather than censoring bad reviews, we let every voice be heard so that others make a more informed decision. This includes developer's ability to respond.

    But on other grounds, perhaps devs should put out more complete products? How do you explain away no save function? Either way, I as a consumer should be permitted to voice my concerns about a product or service...
    05-05-11 08:35 PM
  10. 1812dave's Avatar
    Let me put you on "ignore" before I say something that might make me get a "time out". Now you go right ahead and whine all you want about how you don't trust App World. Any chance you write for Seinfeld? oops, don't answer--I wont see it.
    05-05-11 08:54 PM
  11. esqlaw's Avatar
    i didnt think i was whining. people like you, dave, tend to drive others nuts with your egocentric and condescending attitude.
    05-05-11 09:26 PM
  12. Motorcycle Mama's Avatar
    Your title should have said "I don't trust the reviews on App World".

    Your title and your OP were definitely "sensational" and absolutely over dramatic.

    As noted RIM doesn't censor reviews. The developer may or may not, however.
    05-05-11 09:46 PM
  13. belsunce's Avatar
    wow, some of you guys are f-u-n-n-y.

    regardless of the fact that the review may or may not be on App World, I think this thread DOES raise an interesting point: what is the value of a review system if unfavourable reviews can simply be erased?

    what would be the value of grades in school if students could remove Ds and Cs from their report cards and only keep the good marks?

    I mean, THINK ABOUT IT! it's absurd!
    05-05-11 10:27 PM
  14. Jake Storm's Avatar
    Nobody likes a drama queen

    Jake:
    I think I have been sufficiently clear and candid in all my conduct. What is the point of an app that doesn't save reliably? The app is ok... not extraordinary. With full functionality I'd still only rate it a 3/5. My opinion is well grounded. It didn't deserve to be deleted. It was spot on review of the product. Not exaggerated. How could that be "sensational"?

    How is my "forum post" sensational? Like I said, it is not sensational. It doesn't fit that category.

    next, I outlined my concerns. In short, you generally don't give control of what reviews are posted for a reason.

    And as for your third remark, do you really think my post was false? You suggested that I don't trust others..... The guy was protecting his product from a true but harmful review. I say that rather than censoring bad reviews, we let every voice be heard so that others make a more informed decision. This includes developer's ability to respond.

    But on other grounds, perhaps devs should put out more complete products? How do you explain away no save function? Either way, I as a consumer should be permitted to voice my concerns about a product or service...
    05-05-11 10:44 PM
  15. stubbornswiss's Avatar
    Reviews being edited / removed by the developers is a known issue.

    http://forums.crackberry.com/f35/app...-point-608380/

    I have also had reason to post about this.
    05-05-11 11:47 PM
  16. Motorcycle Mama's Avatar
    Nobody likes a drama queen
    Totally.
    05-06-11 10:24 AM
  17. BBThemes's Avatar
    wow, some of you guys are f-u-n-n-y.

    regardless of the fact that the review may or may not be on App World, I think this thread DOES raise an interesting point: what is the value of a review system if unfavourable reviews can simply be erased?

    what would be the value of grades in school if students could remove Ds and Cs from their report cards and only keep the good marks?

    I mean, THINK ABOUT IT! it's absurd!
    ok, so you make a fair point, but you forget, the review does NOT show which version of the app your reviewing, so lets say v1 is buggy, and v2 fixes it, how is a customer to know? if that review is rendered irrelevant then why should it remain? or in your analogy, if you retake an exam, should the original grade stand?

    yes developers can REQUEST to have a comment removed, that doesnt mean it will be though, it means appworld admin can then check it. that is not absurd.
    05-06-11 06:58 PM
  18. jstarett's Avatar
    If developers could remove all the negative comments I would think there would be 0 negatives, right?

    I usually check for a beta version before I actually try a full version but thats me

    On a side note I don't see his comment listed when I browsed to the below appworld link
    05-06-11 10:43 PM
  19. sportline's Avatar
    its ok if people complains. as long as it's fair.
    in some way the appworld is quick to load, download and install. haven't try purchasing any though.
    people do whine and complains, it's normal. people becomes fanatics, it's normal. my pb drains a lot and get warm, it's also normal. can't complain.
    05-06-11 10:58 PM
  20. killerham's Avatar
    This is in response to emailthisaddress.
    I am one of the developers for Go Studio, and can tell you why the review was removed. The review you left was not very helpful to other users, or even to us so we can improve the product.
    Looked like a lot of fun and it is a great concept, but i couldn't get anything to work.
    That is the review you left.

    We kept the review up until we were certain that the application was working. We sent it off to a few other developers and made sure everything was working fine for EVERYONE.
    What we heard back was the program was functional, there were some bugs that we missed but everything worked.

    After we verified the review was misinterpreting, we decided to submit for denial.

    If you look now, we have a 2 star rating. This time the review actually states a problem (or a missing feature, which we are in the process of implementing).
    Our intention is not to make our program look perfect, but to gain usable information and feedback (for both other users and us so we can improve the program).


    As for the topic on hand, the denial system set in place for developers is not there to reject any negative review. It is set in place to lower the amount of misleading and random (troll) reviews which make no sense and misrepresent the application.
    If you look at the iOS appstore, you will see what I mean. There are reviews that just say things like "Theres a turtle on my head!", or "this app is great, etc etc." then go and give it a 1 star rating.
    There is also a process so developers don't abuse this feature. When you click "deny" it takes time for RIM to approve it. I don't think all reviews will be rejected and they will obviously use their discretion so the system is not abused or gamed.
    05-06-11 11:11 PM
  21. gbsn's Avatar

    As for the topic on hand, the denial system set in place for developers is not there to reject any negative review. It is set in place to lower the amount of misleading and random (troll) reviews which make no sense and misrepresent the application.
    If you look at the iOS appstore, you will see what I mean. There are reviews that just say things like "Theres a turtle on my head!", or "this app is great, etc etc." then go and give it a 1 star rating.
    There is also a process so developers don't abuse this feature. When you click "deny" it takes time for RIM to approve it. I don't think all reviews will be rejected and they will obviously use their discretion so the system is not abused or gamed.
    Oh so RIM fixed the issue? A few months ago that "review denial" system was not being moderated correctly or at all and a few developers were abusing the system by basically deleting every negative review they had.
    Not to mention that its a usual regular trend to just give away free apps in exchange of a 5 star review.
    Last edited by gbsn; 05-06-11 at 11:55 PM.
    05-06-11 11:53 PM
  22. killerham's Avatar
    Honestly I don't know, I just assumed that was the case because it didn't get denied right away.
    05-07-11 12:22 AM
  23. IndubitablyMe's Avatar
    Immediately after you post a review, you will be able to read it on the App Page. When you return to the page after leaving, it will be gone. What's happening is that you're basically seeing a preview. Your final review will actually post sometime in the next few days. Check back the day after tomorrow and see if it's there yet. This always happens to me - I'm pretty sure it's just how their system is set up.
    Last edited by IndubitablyMe; 06-09-11 at 02:54 PM. Reason: turned "teh" into "the" :D
    06-09-11 02:52 PM
  24. PDADoctor's Avatar
    If true, that is troublesome, as even the notoriously over-the-top control freak, Jobs allows zillions of negative feedback comments to remain in the App Store. And even the Apple forums contains a lot of complaints.
    That's a very good point. The only forums I've run across that will actually censor you (and even discontinue your service for negative comments) are AT&T and Verizon, and they even say they will in their terms and conditions when you sign up for their forums.
    06-09-11 03:27 PM
  25. ifarlow's Avatar
    Apple will most definitely clean up their discussion forums. Happens all the time.
    06-09-11 03:38 PM
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