1. whackamac's Avatar
    Ok you all aren't gonna like this, but I fixed the problem with my App World hanging at the background after updating.

    Ready?

    Don't worry about backing up because you will not be restoring after you do a Security Erase and reload everything from scratch. Yeah, it sucks, but it worked. I am in it now.

    Worked for me. And others. And we are all getting pissed at this unfinished device. And after reading the CNN post, RIM needs to get this device finished. Like now.
    06-09-11 05:09 PM
  2. mandony's Avatar
    1) If you don't like the PB sell it or return it. Many trolls are have likely done that.
    2) The CNN post had nothing to do with the PB, rather they wanted to return it without trying the product.
    3) Program upgrade hangups are common for most all OS including Apple & MS.
    4) The fix for the App World 'problem' is to reload the OS which takes only a few minutes.
    06-09-11 05:30 PM
  3. whackamac's Avatar
    1) If you don't like the PB sell it or return it. Many trolls are have likely done that.
    2) The CNN post had nothing to do with the PB, rather they wanted to return it without trying the product.
    3) Program upgrade hangups are common for most all OS including Apple & MS.
    4) The fix for the App World 'problem' is to reload the OS which takes only a few minutes.
    Geeesh all I was doing is letting the people know this info formally that may still have the problem so they can get back up and running too.

    And yeah, I can make numbered lists of pointless fanboy information too. Are you a RIM employee? And yes I understand tech. Enough to where I got to talk to a RIM engineer yesterday about the problems we (and CB users) are having seeing we bought over 30 of them for my staff and our not-so-happy clients. They asked what we felt we needed to make this device better for business use. We gave our recommendations and several from these forums. Personally we can see the potential of this device and love it. Others do not share that optimism and shouldn't have to at a price of $499 and up. Hopefully the next update will open up this device like a beautiful flower and amaze us like RIM has been noted as saying.

    And if sharing my feelings while offering a fix makes me a troll... then your little list makes you a d***.

    And reloading some of ours from scratch takes far more than a few minutes. Did you think of all the time it takes to reinstall all the apps, personalize and set up sharing/networking? How about the time to transfer docs, movies, and pics? Oh and 10gb of music too? A few minutes my ...

    Now do it to 20 of them. You're not going to like it.
    06-09-11 06:11 PM
  4. drethos's Avatar
    uhhhh no nothing on app world is important anoff for me to security wipe.....ever id rather deal with it by waiting for rim to fix.
    06-09-11 07:10 PM
  5. rlarsen462's Avatar
    But he used italics.
    06-09-11 07:25 PM
  6. trsbbs's Avatar
    Ok you all aren't gonna like this, but I fixed the problem with my App World hanging at the background after updating.

    Ready?

    Don't worry about backing up because you will not be restoring after you do a Security Erase and reload everything from scratch. Yeah, it sucks, but it worked. I am in it now.

    Worked for me. And others. And we are all getting pissed at this unfinished device. And after reading the CNN post, RIM needs to get this device finished. Like now.
    Did it without restore. All fresh install..App World worked fine until tonight. Its doing the same thing it did before. RIM has messed something up and are covering it up until they can find it and fix it.

    Tim
    06-09-11 10:25 PM
  7. trsbbs's Avatar
    1) If you don't like the PB sell it or return it. Many trolls are have likely done that.
    2) The CNN post had nothing to do with the PB, rather they wanted to return it without trying the product.
    3) Program upgrade hangups are common for most all OS including Apple & MS.
    4) The fix for the App World 'problem' is to reload the OS which takes only a few minutes.
    Didn't fix it with a full fresh install. It worked half a day then the same issue came back tonight. Pull your head out of the sand and see the truth.

    Tim
    Maestrodog likes this.
    06-09-11 10:28 PM
  8. Maestrodog's Avatar
    Good to see hardnosed and sensible people on here handling the pollyanna fanboi set. This device and the people behind it need to get the heck going.

    This has been a major frig. I've put over ten hours into it and had contradictory and bewildered handling from RIM on multiple occasions and multiple channels.

    I'm rather sure I've narrowed it down to certain applications are preventing App World from populating. You can resuscitate it for a small window of time by wiping with two ply and starting all over but it will #FAIL again.

    I strongly suggest people not waste their time and stress levels. RIM doesn't even know what they screwed up yet and will humor you through various levels of support, reboots, reinstalls, wipes and other proctology to try to get you going again, but there's a bug in the house.

    I'm fixing to go on hiatus with the slab until after the NHL and NBA years.

    I. Thou Shalt Not Early Adopt
    06-09-11 10:48 PM
  9. zzgguuyy's Avatar
    got my app world working again. and didn't have to do a security wipe. i deleted the hello note app which i noticed had a problem starting up after the os upgrade. then i also deleted the icons for hotmail, aol, and yahoo. bingo. app world started up ok again. of course, i got the 4mb os upgrade again which brought back the icons i deleted. but i have not downloaded hello note again and all is well so far. praying it doesn't crap out again!
    06-10-11 12:03 AM
  10. shootsscores's Avatar
    Good to see hardnosed and sensible people on here handling the pollyanna fanboi set. This device and the people behind it need to get the heck going.

    This has been a major frig. I've put over ten hours into it and had contradictory and bewildered handling from RIM on multiple occasions and multiple channels.

    I'm rather sure I've narrowed it down to certain applications are preventing App World from populating. You can resuscitate it for a small window of time by wiping with two ply and starting all over but it will #FAIL again.

    I strongly suggest people not waste their time and stress levels. RIM doesn't even know what they screwed up yet and will humor you through various levels of support, reboots, reinstalls, wipes and other proctology to try to get you going again, but there's a bug in the house.

    I'm fixing to go on hiatus with the slab until after the NHL and NBA years.

    I. Thou Shalt Not Early Adopt
    App world on my PB was out of commission for about 8 hours and then started working again. Maybe I have horse shoes up my keester but I don't suffer from 90% of the complaints that get posted to this site and I've had two different PBs. Then again, I made an effort to understand the QNX OS which is a system entirely new in the mobile computing world. I get the feeling that many are trying to jam a round peg into a square hole when trying to deal with their perceived problems.

    If one understands how a true microkernel works, the feeling that a hard reboot is always necessary goes away. I have never done a hard restart. The QNX OS is adaptive which is to say that it will partition according to use patterns. A simple soft restart will fix baulky processes most times. The QNX system is famous for its robustness. All **** can break loose and the microkernel will continue nominal function. However, a touch based UI for a mobile computer is a new application for QNX that will have teething problems but the guts of the OS remain the same. It is the processes that get buggy not the OS itself.

    I can only imagine tech support dealing with folks who have tried all manner of bizarre things to their PB's like 10 hard reboots and 5 security wipes and who then complain that their PB is acting weird. As I wrote once before, the QNX OS may perform mission critical functions on the space station but it's never had 100s of 1000s of monkeys monkeying around with 100s of 1000s of individual units.

    It's all good though and I am enjoying the evolution of this OS.

    Go Bruins!
    06-10-11 01:09 AM
  11. Maestrodog's Avatar
    App world on my PB was out of commission for about 8 hours and then started working again. Maybe I have horse shoes up my keester but I don't suffer from 90% of the complaints that get posted to this site and I've had two different PBs. Then again, I made an effort to understand the QNX OS which is a system entirely new in the mobile computing world. I get the feeling that many are trying to jam a round peg into a square hole when trying to deal with their perceived problems.

    If one understands how a true microkernel works, the feeling that a hard reboot is always necessary goes away. I have never done a hard restart. The QNX OS is adaptive which is to say that it will partition according to use patterns. A simple soft restart will fix baulky processes most times. The QNX system is famous for its robustness. All **** can break loose and the microkernel will continue nominal function. However, a touch based UI for a mobile computer is a new application for QNX that will have teething problems but the guts of the OS remain the same. It is the processes that get buggy not the OS itself.

    I can only imagine tech support dealing with folks who have tried all manner of bizarre things to their PB's like 10 hard reboots and 5 security wipes and who then complain that their PB is acting weird. As I wrote once before, the QNX OS may perform mission critical functions on the space station but it's never had 100s of 1000s of monkeys monkeying around with 100s of 1000s of individual units.

    It's all good though and I am enjoying the evolution of this OS.

    Go Bruins!

    Perhaps RIM should not have added the hard reset and security wipe to affect the mighty and promethean QNX.

    As for me, not a monkey at all sir, I never used hard reset until RIM support had me do it to solve their App World screw up. That failed every time. They then had me try another procedure that rendered everything unusable. They were then unable to restore anything and wanted me to send it in for repair.

    I then spent a few hours getting the machine back up and running, with App World making a brief reappearance before FAILING again.

    I have yet to do a security wipe though RIM keeps advising I do. Until others stop reporting the problem returns after they wipe, I will hold off.

    Nice pollyanna try to bail RIM support out on this, but they have been uninformed, unhelpful and even hard to understand on the first tier. Had to ask one person to repeat themself over and over and over.

    At any rate, nice try on the resets and wipes, but that has NOTHING to do my my App World being down all week since the minor update.
    06-10-11 01:18 PM
  12. shootsscores's Avatar
    Sorry to hear of your travails but my app world functions just fine. As I wrote previously, my app world was down for some hours and then resumed nominal function. We all have the same OS yet I rarely have any of the problems that get mentioned on this site and have never performed a hard restart or security wipe when I've encountered them.

    It is hard to break people out of old habits. Those with long histories with BB devices are conditioned to doing hard restarts (i.e. battery pulls) in order to regain function but as QNX is nothing like the BB OS, what makes one believe that a completely different OS would function the same way? IMHO, multiple hart restarts don't do the QNX OS any good at all. Remember, with the QNX OS processes run independently of the microkernel which is a very simple piece of code and therein lies its beauty and robustness.

    Since we all share exactly the same OS and hardware, why are some encountering problems while I am not? Perhaps it could be because I came to the BB only some moths ago and don't have ingrained habits such as the battery pull hard restart but instead run the QNX OS more like it was designed. Simple ending of baulky processes or simple restarts have handled any bug that I have encountered.

    Now, I don't fault any particular user for trying to remedy problems as their experience dictates. Rather, RIM has to understand that people are going to try all kinds of old habits to solve perceived problems and those old solutions may damage the new OS. QNX is adaptive in a way. It will repartition according to useage patterns. This is a new OS and new techniques in problem solving are required.

    Again, sorry to hear of your problems but you are having them and I am not so it could be that I've got a better feel for the OS than you or it could be that I am just lucky.
    06-10-11 01:54 PM
  13. Maestrodog's Avatar
    Seems pretty clear that some application or applications are causing it. Not everyone has the same of those.

    How interesting that you don't even put that possibility on the table!

    A better feel for the OS is a real stretch. I have hardly used this thing and done very little to it other than browse and try a few applications that didn't impress me.

    Luck is a bit out there too. This is a widespread issue that many people are having, on other boards and off the boards too.

    I don't care about QNX, old habits or the lot. I'm only following RIM direction on solving this malfunction and getting nowhere. They themselves admit to not knowing the core issue, but none of them has so much as implied that old user habits are in any way to blame.

    Appreciate your sympathy, but to even to hint this is user error versus RIM foul up is a huge stretch, quite wishful thinking even.
    Last edited by Maestrodog; 06-10-11 at 02:53 PM.
    06-10-11 02:43 PM
  14. shootsscores's Avatar
    It's not user error. It's user ignorance but the user cannot be held responsible for that. RIM has to come up with an ***** proof system and that is not an easy undertaking to say the least.

    I added an app at one point before the latest update that immediately had my OS acting oddly so I uninstalled it and did a normal restart with the system resuming nominal function. So, yes indeed faulty apps can screw things up. However, what PB owners should know is that processes do not run on the microkernel. They are self contained and run on their own. The microkernel and boot loader determine resource allocation and priority. If a particular process is buggy, it is the process that is buggy not the OS. It seems to me that your problems lie in app world itself not the OS which is functioning normally as your UI would attest (the UI is probably the most complicated process running on the PB and it has a lot of resources directed to it). I wonder if it is possible to uninstall your AW and then install a new copy as your AW could very well be damaged.
    06-10-11 03:11 PM
  15. shootsscores's Avatar
    It's not user error. It's user ignorance but the user cannot be held responsible for that. RIM has to come up with an ***** proof system and that is not an easy undertaking to say the least.

    I added an app at one point before the latest update that immediately had my OS acting oddly so I uninstalled it and did a normal restart with the system resuming nominal function. So, yes indeed faulty apps can screw things up. However, what PB owners should know is that processes do not run on the microkernel. They are self contained and run on their own. The microkernel and boot loader determine resource allocation and priority. If a particular process is buggy, it is the process that is buggy not the OS. It seems to me that your problems lie in app world itself not the OS which is functioning normally as your UI would attest (the UI is probably the most complicated process running on the PB and it has a lot of resources directed to it). I wonder if it is possible to uninstall your AW and then install a new copy as your AW could very well be damaged.
    06-10-11 03:12 PM
  16. Maestrodog's Avatar
    Does that explain why the only fix is a wipe WITHOUT doing restore, as the user above noted?

    Assuming this stays a fix?

    Now that I can't use any of my data and have spent another several hours getting things to a new ground zero, I won't be using Playpen for anything important nor creating files that I want to keep.

    Who's to say the next OS update won't conflict with whatever and this will happen all over?

    I'd made some nice sketches, taken some nice pictures, videos, bookmarked dozens of important sites, all gone because the backup is now toxic.

    Anyway, time to go set up Blaq and Tweedle-dee again, and whatever other applications need to be given the jaws of life.
    06-10-11 03:39 PM
  17. shootsscores's Avatar
    Who's to say that your app world wouldn't have sorted itself out as mine did and that you needlessly wiped your data? It would no doubt have been prudent to back up your files before you undertook all the wiping and hard restarts.
    06-10-11 04:08 PM
  18. gman77's Avatar
    Try resetting the cache in App World. Mine was hanging on the blank purple splash screen. i pulled up the keyboard and typed "rst", closed App World then restarted it and it now seems to work fine.
    06-10-11 07:22 PM
  19. whackamac's Avatar
    I am still working fine. I just downloaded all the apps again and copied my stuff back. Took a bit, but it is fine now.

    I did try the RST fix several times before I did this and no dice.

    I'm just glad I have chosen not to create anything on this yet. I have a 3D lappy and a desktop i7 w/16gb ram each to do all that for now. For what this thing can do, it does it pretty well. I am in love with the cameras, especially the 1080p feature.
    06-10-11 07:43 PM
  20. Maestrodog's Avatar
    Who's to say that your app world wouldn't have sorted itself out as mine did and that you needlessly wiped your data? It would no doubt have been prudent to back up your files before you undertook all the wiping and hard restarts.
    Prudent indeed, which is why I did that. I'm a whole lot more sophisticated about technology and other matters than you seem to want to recognize at all. Did you read what I wrote? If I wipe, App World works. When I restore to that wipe, it does not. Others have reported the same. Hence my theory about one or more applications--or data related to those applications--befouling Crapp World.

    Maybe I'm wrong, but I think it is a far superior theory to "ignorant" users performing a couple three hard resets or wipes per RIM or anyone else.

    So currently my choice is to have my old data and no App World, or start from scratch.

    As the subsequent gent posted, no point in putting anything you want to keep on this thing yet.
    06-10-11 07:52 PM
  21. trsbbs's Avatar
    Try resetting the cache in App World. Mine was hanging on the blank purple splash screen. i pulled up the keyboard and typed "rst", closed App World then restarted it and it now seems to work fine.
    RST does not work on the new App World.

    Tim
    06-10-11 08:10 PM
  22. shootsscores's Avatar
    Prudent indeed, which is why I did that. I'm a whole lot more sophisticated about technology and other matters than you seem to want to recognize at all. Did you read what I wrote? If I wipe, App World works. When I restore to that wipe, it does not. Others have reported the same. Hence my theory about one or more applications--or data related to those applications--befouling Crapp World.

    Maybe I'm wrong, but I think it is a far superior theory to "ignorant" users performing a couple three hard resets or wipes per RIM or anyone else.

    So currently my choice is to have my old data and no App World, or start from scratch.

    As the subsequent gent posted, no point in putting anything you want to keep on this thing yet.
    Works fine for me. I've never lost any data. Then again, I've never resorted to hard resets or wipes when I've encountered anomalies. This is a brand new OS. You're learning it your way and I'm learning it my way. I've never lost data. You, OTOH, have. Same OS and same hardware.
    06-11-11 02:21 AM
  23. Maestrodog's Avatar
    and RIM is learning it their way, which is to say not well.

    They have no idea why this is happening.

    Neither do you.

    If you were paying attention instead of selfishly insinuating I did something wrong, you'd perhaps be able to deduce that some of the applications are conflicting.

    We have the same device and OS, not the same applications.

    I don't like your style, or your refusal to back off your silly, almost RIM-payroll type pollyanna repetitions on this topic.

    I'll not be responding further to your subtle taunts and ignorance of this very significant mess up by RIM that RIM has been instructing us to do resets, wipes and the like.

    If the OS were as sensitive as you say, then RIM should be managing the situation far, far, far differently. Much likelier is the OS is fine, the coding of App World and the race to allow developers into App World has created a SNAFU. They have mismanaged the communications and support on the issue, so likely there are other human errors occurring within the testing and developer relations chains.

    I've been operating information systems since 1976, can code and program, build machines from scratch, whatever. In fact, I got my Playpen to work again after a very intelligent RIM top tier tech threw up his hands and wanted me to send it in for repairs.

    You are the classic board bore: mine works, the problem must be with you.

    Meantime, RIM is clueless for day five of this frig.

    So, in summary, I haven't lost data, I just can't RESTORE my data without losing App World. Something in the app data conflicts. So, as I said--this by the way being the second time I've had to correct your misrepresenting me--I can have the data and not App World or App World and not the data.

    The very fact you tried to limit the discussion to OS and hardware without accounting for the software added on to that OS and hardware as a possible source of conflict only PROVES your inability to troubleshoot logically and holistically.

    Talk about kidstuff, the software is a terribly obvious place to consider! The very first place to look.

    Your statements, misstatements and omissions make clear that your agenda is more focused on supporting RIM regardless than debugging this issue that has plagued a variety of boards and forums since the meager OS update on Tuesday--you know, the one that invalidated dozens of applications that now crash or go blank when you attempt to open them.

    I'm very sorry you missed this obvious evidence.


    Adios.
    Last edited by Maestrodog; 06-11-11 at 02:34 PM.
    06-11-11 02:14 PM
  24. shootsscores's Avatar
    Sorry you're so delicate but you really do not seem to have a feel for the QNX OS. It's different than your Atari. Keep your hard reboots and I'll take advantage of the microkernel. Let's see who sruggles the most. Any apps you want me to check out for you?
    06-11-11 06:44 PM
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