[Chuck Finley69]

Yep, and it's an arrangement that has worked very well for both carriers and certain oems with deep pockets. Restricting competition, "locking" phones, and limiting features for non-carrier devices or even excluding them from service completely. It is these tactics, for the vast majority, that have limited our options when it comes to mobile devices - not oem, OS, update support, or superior hardware, all of which carry little significance if the device is replaced on a two year term for free anyway, regardless of its actual value. With price eliminated from the equation and carriers limiting our choices, the greatest motivator is advertising and marketing and once again, it's no accident the two companies that spend the most sell the most phones in a market that is already largely hemmed in and theirs for the taking.

What options are limited when you can buy any device you want factory unlocked and drop a TMO SIM into device ?

[idssteve]

Well, as you know, you are a special use case to the power of 4.

Actually consider myself an advocate to the percentage of 5. Lol. The 5% of humanity who might consider themselves kinesthetic learning style... If they only knew...

Wouldn't be too shocked if you might even find yourself among that group, to some degree? Lol

[eshropshire]

The PKB will most likely remain niche until the day a major manufacturer decides to implement one as a slider or add-on accessory for their popular slab models.

Samsung made a PKB attachment for the S8 family of phones. From whatnI heard the sales were very low. Samsung has not tried again. Years ago I had a Windows OS Samsung slider PKB phone. I had a co-worker with a Samsung nonsliding PKB phone.

You posted about the new Titan on Android Central. The comments about a PKB were not positive.

[the_boon]

Samsung made a PKB attachment for the S8 family of phones. From whatnI heard the sales were very low. Samsung has not tried again.

I'd bet that they didn't lose any money on those cases, but just chose to focus efforts elsewhere for other reasons.

You posted about the new Titan on Android Central. The comments about a PKB were not positive.

Not sure what that proves. Most people won't like a phone with that form factor. Reactions would be quite different with a 6" OLED slider.

[pdr733]

Yep, and it's an arrangement that has worked very well for both carriers and certain oems with deep pockets. Restricting competition, "locking" phones, and limiting features for non-carrier devices or even excluding them from service completely. It is these tactics, for the vast majority, that have limited our options when it comes to mobile devices - not oem, OS, update support, or superior hardware, all of which carry little significance if the device is replaced on a two year term for free anyway, regardless of its actual value. With price eliminated from the equation and carriers limiting our choices, the greatest motivator is advertising and marketing and once again, it's no accident the two companies that spend the most sell the most phones in a market that is already largely hemmed in and theirs for the taking.

How you explain the fact that in some markets like Europe many things you mention (restricting device choice, limiting features / unlocked device access) did/do not exist and BB/PKB still didn't sell?

[app_Developer]

I'd bet that they didn't lose any money on those cases, but just chose to focus efforts elsewhere for other reasons.

??

Why are you sure of that, exactly?

[Emaderton3]

Similar to the vast majority of others and not unlike the trend of automatic vs manual transmissions adoption/preference in cars. Most of us in say our 40's to 50's learned and were taught how to drive a car with a manual transmission. For those that remember there is nothing like rowing the gears of a nice sports car and the physical process of slowing without always having to use one's brakes. That form of driving and transmission option is being relegated to Classics and or some smaller produced sports cars. Most of us in the same demographic also utilized a BlackBerry at some point in our business ventures.

What's interesting in some ways to me is why and how PKB's are still so necessary and coveted in our laptop and desktop devices. In many ways I suspected we would have moved solely to voice dictation by now. Interestingly the press and feel of a pkb on a laptop is still very important in and for any review.

I remember the process of moving from the pencil to pen, to typewriter to then computer and of course my first BlackBerry 9000 that felt like a natural extension. For me and a minority there is something more pleasing about the thought and accurate physical press process of a PKB smartphone. My hope is that some company (all niche at this time in UniHertz or OM if it ever gets of the ground) continues to produce a good PKB for those of us that prefer that PKB mechanism as a means to use our phones to communicate.

Some of us need a keyboard on a laptop or computer to do our jobs. I would never (and can't) do what I do on a phone PKB.

[bh7171]

Some of us need a keyboard on a laptop or computer to do our jobs. I would never (and can't) do what I do on a phone PKB.

That's great- we all have different ways of using our devices to communicate and get done what we need too. I use my lap and desktop for the majority of my work as well. I think that's the case for most people.

[Trouveur]

I'd bet that they didn't lose any money on those cases, but just chose to focus efforts elsewhere for other reasons.

Not sure what that proves. Most people won't like a phone with that form factor. Reactions would be quite different with a 6" OLED slider.

But you said earlier :
"The PKB will most likely remain niche until the day a major manufacturer decides to implement one as a slider or add-on accessory for their popular slab models."

Fact is, the world leader smartphones OEM Samsung, did a PKB add-on accessory for its flagship Galaxy S8, and nevertheless PKB still are niche.

Minus the last die hard fans here, truth is no one wants a PKB device anymore.

[spARTacus]

...Fact is, the world leader smartphones OEM Samsung, did a PKB add-on accessory for its flagship Galaxy S8, and nevertheless PKB still are niche....

Yeah one has to wonder about it when that thing didn't stick/take-off. I guess maybe it didn't have the soft button features and that was less than ideal (however, neither did the early BlackBerry PKBs)? Or maybe PKB lovers were still using actual BlackBerry PKB phones back then? Just what was wrong with that S8 snap on concept, from the perspective of for those that love PKBs?

[the_boon]

??

Why are you sure of that, exactly?

Because the cases were relatively cheap looking (and all plastic) and basic in function. Probably didn't cost Samsung nearly anything to make.

[the_boon]

Yeah one has to wonder about it when that thing didn't stick/take-off. I guess maybe it didn't have the soft button features and that was less than ideal (however, neither did the early BlackBerry PKBs)? Or maybe PKB lovers were still using actual BlackBerry PKB phones back then? Just what was wrong with that S8 snap on concept, from the perspective of for those that love PKBs?

I've used both the S8 and S8+ cases.

They're not the worst things ever functionally, but cosmetically they really look off.

The keyboard itself has flat keys with zero sculpting, but the rubber material of them helps make up for that with grip, and therefore the accuracy is still better than typing on glass for the most part.

Back in 2017 though, the keyboard market was a bit better as the Priv and BB10 phones were more viable options, and the KEYone was right around the corner.

Had that case come out today for the S21 phones, might have been a different story.

[hoytbowhunter]

Just happy you have this friend to keep us posted.

Lol, me too.

[spARTacus]

...Had that case come out today for the S21 phones, might have been a different story.

So there could be more of a market now for something like those snap on keyboards? Do the @SES Mobile Accessories folks know that?

[joshualebowitz]

https://twitter.com/casey/status/140...658666498?s=10

[the_boon]

https://twitter.com/casey/status/140...658666498?s=10

Well someone finally admits that typing on real keys is superior to typing on glass.

What do the comments say? I don't have Twitter

[howarmat]

Well someone finally admits that typing on real keys is superior to typing on glass.

What do the comments say? I don't have Twitter

This stood out to me and sums it all up

Everyone wishes the physical keyboards were still a thing on phones, but when they make one, nobody buys them. BB could come back with the best BB ever and they’d still barely sell any.

Most all the comments are nostalgia, everyone has moved on. Sure the memories of the first keyboard device give you the fuzzies inside but then you realize how you have moved on from it and are perfectly happy and productive you are in your current phone of choice.

[joshualebowitz]

This stood out to me and sums it all up



Most all the comments are nostalgia, everyone has moved on. Sure the memories of the first keyboard device give you the fuzzies inside but then you realize how you have moved on from it and are perfectly happy and productive you are in your current phone of choice.

I disagree. If you get some of the new BlackBerry devices to the right people, like Casey Neistat, an entire generation of young people will want to purchase them.

[howarmat]

I disagree. If you get some of the new BlackBerry devices to the right people, like Casey Neistat, an entire generation of young people will want to purchase them.

It really wont as BB has demonstrated with celebrities in the past lol

[joshualebowitz]

It really wont as BB has demonstrated with celebrities in the past lol

Again, BlackBerry did a poor job in the past via weak, inauthentic, partnerships like the one with Alicia Keys. Head over to Universal Music Group, today, on 56th and Broadway in Manhattan, sit in the lobby by the security desk, and note how many hip-hop artists and music executives are using BlackBerry devices. Then talk to an iPhone user sitting beside a BlackBerry user and ask them how hard they've tried, over the last year and a half, to get a KEY2.

[howarmat]

Again, BlackBerry did a poor job in the past via weak, inauthentic, partnerships like the one with Alicia Keys. Head over to Universal Music Group, today, on 56th and Broadway in Manhattan, sit in the lobby by the security desk, and note how many hip-hop artists and music executives are using BlackBerry devices. Then talk to an iPhone user sitting beside a BlackBerry user and ask them how hard they've tried, over the last year and a half, to get a KEY2.

you prove my point! Apparently loads of hip hop artists already own BB devices. Therefore the phones “are in the hands of the right people” as you said and Key sales should have been in the millions then right? And we all know how pitiful the Key2 sold and even the much cheaper key2 LE

[joshualebowitz]

you prove my point! Apparently loads of hip hop artists already own BB devices. Therefore the phones “are in the hands of the right people” as you said and Key sales should have been in the millions then right? And we all know how pitiful the Key2 sold and even the much cheaper key2 LE

No. The hip-hop scene was just getting into the KEY2 as availability disappeared and no one else was able to get them.

[conite]

I disagree. If you get some of the new BlackBerry devices to the right people, like Casey Neistat, an entire generation of young people will want to purchase them.

I can only assume this is a joke.

[idssteve]

No. The hip-hop scene was just getting into the KEY2 as availability disappeared and no one else was able to get them.

It does take time for "acceptance" of "strange" products to popularly mature. Apple type "overnight" enthusiasm proves an unrealistic expectation for many products.


Sometimes takes time for enthusiasts to perfect skill sets and then communicate the potential of a product.

Problem with K2, imo, was that it intro'd too near K1 and wasn't sufficiently upgraded to entice K1 migration. Imo. Sticking it out another year might've seen gradual acceptance and then maybe even enthusiasm for K2?

Time after time, BB et al has impatiently folded their cards just when "acceptance" might've gained some ground. Imo. Few users will prove enthusiastic about products who's manufacturer telegraphs "three years and done" with each attempt. Imo. Fwiw.

[the_boon]

This stood out to me and sums it all up



Most all the comments are nostalgia, everyone has moved on. Sure the memories of the first keyboard device give you the fuzzies inside but then you realize how you have moved on from it and are perfectly happy and productive you are in your current phone of choice.

Yes but if they miss it, that says something about glass typing never matching up to the experience that those keys provide