04-20-14 04:21 AM
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  1. Stephen Cooper's Avatar
    What if BlackBerry made their own Android device....

    Posted via CB10
    04-13-14 10:37 PM
  2. anon1727506's Avatar
    What if BlackBerry made their own Android device....

    Posted via CB10
    Why?

    There can't afford to build premium devices like Samsung and HTC and compete in "their" class of devices.

    And I don't see security being a huge concern among consumers.

    And it would still have the BlackBerry name and the YEARS of being known as being outdated to overcome.

    So.....WHY?


    BB10 is going to live and die with BlackBerry... It?s a very good OS on its own, but people don't care as much about the OS as they do the overall ecosystems. At this point BlackBerry has run out of money... sure they have enough to stay on life support for maybe another year. But they can't afford to really get behind the platform and market it the way any product would need.

    Posted via CB10
    04-14-14 06:42 AM
  3. spikesolie's Avatar
    What if BlackBerry made their own Android device....

    Posted via CB10
    On what basis is this a non-idiotic move?

    Posted via CB10
    04-14-14 10:24 AM
  4. rthonpm's Avatar
    On what basis is this a non-idiotic move?

    Posted via CB10
    On the basis that there's no money to be made in Android unless you're a major Korean manufacturer. Look at how well Android has done for HTC (bigger losses every quarter), Motorola (Google sold the hardware off for a reason), etc. Android is no panacaea and for all the apps people cry about missing, there's the Faustian bargain of surrendering control of the OS and your options to Google in exchange for Google Services. Not to mention the fact that BlackBerry may as well just shutter the doors and cease all operations as they would lose a large portion of their regulated customer base that doesn't allow any Android devices on their networks.

    All in all it's just a terrible idea and has no real value or benefit for the company.
    04-14-14 10:31 AM
  5. spikesolie's Avatar
    On the basis that there's no money to be made in Android unless you're a major Korean manufacturer. Look at how well Android has done for HTC (bigger losses every quarter), Motorola (Google sold the hardware off for a reason), etc. Android is no panacaea and for all the apps people cry about missing, there's the Faustian bargain of surrendering control of the OS and your options to Google in exchange for Google Services. Not to mention the fact that BlackBerry may as well just shutter the doors and cease all operations as they would lose a large portion of their regulated customer base that doesn't allow any Android devices on their networks.

    All in all it's just a terrible idea and has no real value or benefit for the company.
    Lol the amount of saturated android manufacturers with a head start on blackberry already made it a terrible idea. People just blow ideas out of their ****

    Posted via CB10
    04-14-14 10:39 AM
  6. Raddin's Avatar
    We always hear about how poorly the Android OEMs are doing. How they don't make any money, and how they are all about to close the doors down. So let's say you folks are right and it is a terrible idea.

    Now, can anyone here name a single Android OEM that has lost BILLIONS (with a "B") of dollars due solely to their decisions to manufacture devices running Android? Also, can anyone here name a single Android OEM that doesn't outsell legacy devices each quarter? I can't and I've tried. As far as I can tell, there isn't a single Android OEM on this planet that meets that surprising level of failure set by BlackBerry 10.

    No matter how bad of an idea it might be for BlackBerry to make a Android device, it is probably still a much worse idea for them to continue making BlackBerry 10 devices. We already know without a shadow of a doubt that creating BlackBerry 10 was a multi billion dollar mistake. We don't have a clue what would happen if they made Android devices though.
    04-14-14 11:00 AM
  7. cgk's Avatar
    We always hear about how poorly the Android OEMs are doing. How they don't make any money, and how they are all about to close the doors down. So let's say you folks are right and it is a terrible idea.

    Now, can anyone here name a single Android OEM that has lost BILLIONS (with a "B") of dollars due solely to their decisions to manufacture devices running Android? Also, can anyone here name a single Android OEM that doesn't outsell legacy devices each quarter? I can't and I've tried. As far as I can tell, there isn't a single Android OEM on this planet that meets that surprising level of failure set by BlackBerry 10.

    No matter how bad of an idea it might be for BlackBerry to make a Android device, it is probably still a much worse idea for them to continue making BlackBerry 10 devices. We already know without a shadow of a doubt that creating BlackBerry 10 was a multi billion dollar mistake. We don't have a clue what would happen if they made Android devices though.
    You forgot switching costs but leaving that aside - your plan seems to be lose hundreds of millions rather than billions so em...
    anon1727506 likes this.
    04-14-14 11:11 AM
  8. anon1727506's Avatar
    We always hear about how poorly the Android OEMs are doing. How they don't make any money, and how they are all about to close the doors down. So let's say you folks are right and it is a terrible idea.

    Now, can anyone here name a single Android OEM that has lost BILLIONS (with a "B") of dollars due solely to their decisions to manufacture devices running Android? Also, can anyone here name a single Android OEM that doesn't outsell legacy devices each quarter? I can't and I've tried. As far as I can tell, there isn't a single Android OEM on this planet that meets that surprising level of failure set by BlackBerry 10.

    No matter how bad of an idea it might be for BlackBerry to make a Android device, it is probably still a much worse idea for them to continue making BlackBerry 10 devices. We already know without a shadow of a doubt that creating BlackBerry 10 was a multi billion dollar mistake. We don't have a clue what would happen if they made Android devices though.
    They have months left.... based on how long it took to get email to work on the PlayBook OS. How long it took them to figure out that they were going to have to "graft" some of BBOS onto BB10 to make it communicate with the BlackBerry Network.... I'd say a minimum of one year would be required to customize an Android OS to provide the BlackBerry features and security (most likely it would take them MUCH longer, to rehire the talent needed to do that much coding). THEY DON"T HAVE THE TIME OR RESOURCES AT THIS POINT.

    What they should have done..... at this point it doesn't matter.
    Raddin likes this.
    04-14-14 11:43 AM
  9. Raddin's Avatar
    They have months left.... based on how long it took to get email to work on the PlayBook OS. How long it took them to figure out that they were going to have to "graft" some of BBOS onto BB10 to make it communicate with the BlackBerry Network.... I'd say a minimum of one year would be required to customize an Android OS to provide the BlackBerry features and security (most likely it would take them MUCH longer, to rehire the talent needed to do that much coding). THEY DON"T HAVE THE TIME OR RESOURCES AT THIS POINT.

    What they should have done..... at this point it doesn't matter.
    You aren't telling me anything I don't already know. I agree, at this point their hardware business is basically a lost cause.

    Chen can claim to not want to leave the hardware business as much as he wants, but how much longer can they continue doing what they are doing? How much more money will throw away on BB10?

    The damage done by the new platform is too much for them to recover from. All I was saying is at this point, I think you'd have to be at least a little bit delusional to believe that creating the new QNX based platform was a better idea than going with Android.
    04-14-14 11:50 AM
  10. spikesolie's Avatar
    You aren't telling me anything I don't already know. I agree, at this point their hardware business is basically a lost cause.

    Chen can claim to not want to leave the hardware business as much as he wants, but how much longer can they continue doing what they are doing? How much more money will throw away on BB10?

    The damage done by the new platform is too much for them to recover from. All I was saying is at this point, I think you'd have to be at least a little bit delusional to believe that creating the new QNX based platform was a than going Android.
    It would have been worse if they had tried making an android os anyways. Right now they are trying to market bb10 to enterprise... that would have been virtually impossible with android.

    Posted via CB10
    04-14-14 11:54 AM
  11. Raddin's Avatar
    It would have been worse if they had tried making an android os anyways

    Posted via CB10
    So let me get this straight. You honestly think that BlackBerry would have lost billions and billions and billions of dollars on a skinned version of Android?

    Really?
    04-14-14 12:01 PM
  12. anon1727506's Avatar
    It would have been worse if they had tried making an android os anyways. Right now they are trying to market bb10 to enterprise... that would have been virtually impossible with android.

    Posted via CB10
    Enterprise seems to be accepting Android and iOS just fine from other OEM's..... Enterprise does not mean defense contractors...
    04-14-14 12:05 PM
  13. spikesolie's Avatar
    So let me get this straight. You honestly think that BlackBerry would have lost billions and billions and billions of dollars on a skinned version of Android?

    Really?
    Yes!!! There's no way they can even expect to go up trying to compete with Sammy and HTC and Motorola.. even Google had the nexus! They had to offer something different.

    Posted via CB10
    anon1727506 likes this.
    04-14-14 02:44 PM
  14. Oscar_E's Avatar
    I'm pretty much sure I do. I'm sure you misunderstood my question. Please read the explanation above.

    Posted via CB10
    OK but I believe that what you mean is, what if we could install BB10 OS in any android base Phone.

    Posted via CB10
    04-14-14 03:01 PM
  15. Raddin's Avatar
    Yes!!! There's no way they can even expect to go up trying to compete with Sammy and HTC and Motorola.. even Google had the nexus! They had to offer something different.

    Posted via CB10
    I think you're missing the main point. Even if no one had bought one, BlackBerry still wouldn't have lost that much money bringing skinned Android devices to market.

    The amount of money that they would have invested in skinning Android wouldn't have been billions and billions and billions of dollars (unless they're even more incompetent than most people think they are) so how would it even be possible for them to lose that much money on adopting Android?

    They could have went to Android, brought over the Hub, their virtual keyboard and other goodies all for a fraction of the amount of money that they have wasted on creating an entirely new platform from the ground up. Not only would it have been cheaper for them, it would have also been faster and easier for them to bring to market and all of that money that they would have saved by not creating BB10 could have been used for marketing their devices that would have be running the world's most popular mobile OS.

    They arrogantly believed that they could do it all on their own and the numbers show that they couldn't.
    04-14-14 04:14 PM
  16. spikesolie's Avatar
    I think you're missing the main point. Even if no one had bought one, BlackBerry still wouldn't have lost that much money bringing skinned Android devices to market.

    The amount of money that they would have invested in skinning Android wouldn't have been billions and billions and billions of dollars (unless they're even more incompetent than most people think they are) so how would it even be possible for them to lose that much money on adopting Android?

    They could have went to Android, brought over the Hub, their virtual keyboard and other goodies all for a fraction of the amount of money that they have wasted on creating an entirely new platform from the ground up. Not only would it have been cheaper for them, it would have also been faster and easier for them to bring to market and all of that money that they would have saved by not creating BB10 could have been used for marketing their devices that would have be running the world's most popular mobile OS.

    They arrogantly believed that they could do it all on their own and the numbers show that they couldn't.
    Where are you getting your values of billions and billions? BlackBerry itself is valued at 4 billion btw

    You sound.like you are just pumping numbers out.of your *** and making ridiculous assumptions.

    Posted via CB10
    lnichols likes this.
    04-14-14 05:03 PM
  17. Kind Sir's Avatar
    A dual boot option from a external so card would be a nice option if this were to be come available
    04-15-14 10:10 AM
  18. Raddin's Avatar
    Where are you getting your values of billions and billions? BlackBerry itself is valued at 4 billion btw

    You sound.like you are just pumping numbers out.of your *** and making ridiculous assumptions.

    Posted via CB10
    Have you not been paying attention?

    Starting with the purchase of QNX, which by itself was $200 million, along with all of the PlayBook and Z10 write offs and you're already at over two billion dollars. That isn't even touching on the development cost, the developer promotions to get apps and other aqusitions and expenses they made for the new platform.

    It is funny that you mention their value today. Do you remember their value before they started using all of their resources on the new OS? They had around 3 billion in cash on hand and zero debt. The day BlackBerry bought QNX in April of 2010, their share price was around $73. Today it is $7.22. That warchest of cash is gone and they are in debt. That is pretty insane don't ya think?

    Where do you think that money burn went to if not to the new platform?

    I'm sure it seems like the numbers are just made up. They are so large that it is hard to belive. And I wish they were pretend, but they're not.
    Last edited by Raddin; 04-15-14 at 10:58 AM.
    richardat, JeepBB and Sergiu1337 like this.
    04-15-14 10:37 AM
  19. anon1727506's Avatar
    I think you're missing the main point. Even if no one had bought one, BlackBerry still wouldn't have lost that much money bringing skinned Android devices to market.

    The amount of money that they would have invested in skinning Android wouldn't have been billions and billions and billions of dollars (unless they're even more incompetent than most people think they are) so how would it even be possible for them to lose that much money on adopting Android?

    They could have went to Android, brought over the Hub, their virtual keyboard and other goodies all for a fraction of the amount of money that they have wasted on creating an entirely new platform from the ground up. Not only would it have been cheaper for them, it would have also been faster and easier for them to bring to market and all of that money that they would have saved by not creating BB10 could have been used for marketing their devices that would have be running the world's most popular mobile OS.

    They arrogantly believed that they could do it all on their own and the numbers show that they couldn't.
    To take a skinned Android and customize it to work with the BlackBerry network and to make it secure.... who know what it would have taken in time and resources. I will agree less than starting from scratch, but maybe more importantly it might have gained them a year. A launch back in 2012 might have been easier...

    But simply put with only the security aspect to differentiate BlackBerry Android from Samsung or HTC Android.... for consumers it would have still been a flop. The hardware would still have be classic BlackBerry one generation behind he premium device... yet they would have asked for a premium price.

    No a new different platform was needed. But it was need much sooner than the were able to deliver. It needed to be "better" than it was at launch. It needed to be MARKETED like there was no tomorrow. It needed to have the APPS. It needed to be a Z30 type device at launch, with a Z3 type introductory price....
    Raddin, richardat and JeepBB like this.
    04-15-14 10:38 AM
  20. Raddin's Avatar
    No a new different platform was needed. But it was need much sooner than the were able to deliver. It needed to be "better" than it was at launch.
    I agree completely with this.

    The big mistake was taking way too long to put out a serious iPhone competitor. I still remember the woman dancing to Black Eyed Peas at the Torch reveal. Things might have been interesting if they had the new OS out then.
    anon1727506 and richardat like this.
    04-15-14 10:55 AM
  21. anon1727506's Avatar
    I agree completely with this.

    The big mistake was taking way too long to put out a serious iPhone competitor. I still remember the woman dancing to Black Eyed Peas at the Torch reveal. Things might have been interesting if they had the new OS out then.
    Your implying that they have put out a serious iPhone competitor ... problem is the iPhone isn't just a device or an OS. Originally the iPhone was a music player that they added a phone to. Now it is a TV Show Player, and Movie Player and it also can run APPS - all VERY easily with almost not technical know how other than setting up an iTunes/iStore account.
    JeepBB, richardat and bbq10l like this.
    04-15-14 11:02 AM
  22. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    Guys, looks like you completely missed my point. I was trying to ask what it would be like if the same operating system and experience you are having on you new BlackBerry phone is available on any other phone, never mind if it's named BB10 or QNX, or anything else.
    Please check out this article:
    Should BlackBerry 10 Evolve into a Free-Licensed 'QNX Mobile'? - N4BB

    Posted via CB10
    I don't get all the people who keep asking this question and the other way around. If you want an Android phone, but an Android. If you want a BB10 phone, buy a BB10 one.
    howarmat likes this.
    04-15-14 11:07 AM
  23. Raddin's Avatar
    Your implying that they have put out a serious iPhone competitor ... problem is the iPhone isn't just a device or an OS. Originally the iPhone was a music player that they added a phone to. Now it is a TV Show Player, and Movie Player and it also can run APPS - all VERY easily with almost not technical know how other than setting up an iTunes/iStore account.
    Lol, well, I should have said the closest thing to an iPhone competetor that they've came up with so far.
    04-15-14 11:34 AM
  24. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    I think you're missing the main point. Even if no one had bought one, BlackBerry still wouldn't have lost that much money bringing skinned Android devices to market.

    The amount of money that they would have invested in skinning Android wouldn't have been billions and billions and billions of dollars (unless they're even more incompetent than most people think they are) so how would it even be possible for them to lose that much money on adopting Android?

    They could have went to Android, brought over the Hub, their virtual keyboard and other goodies all for a fraction of the amount of money that they have wasted on creating an entirely new platform from the ground up. Not only would it have been cheaper for them, it would have also been faster and easier for them to bring to market and all of that money that they would have saved by not creating BB10 could have been used for marketing their devices that would have be running the world's most popular mobile OS.

    They arrogantly believed that they could do it all on their own and the numbers show that they couldn't.
    The only one making money making Android phones are Samsung and it isn't much. Everyone else isn't making money and they didn't take the time to redesign it from the ground up. It would have to be redesigned from the ground up to get the same level of security as BB10. Putting layers on top like Knox isn't working. It would have taken billions to redesign and then you wouldn't make money either.
    04-15-14 11:40 AM
  25. Raddin's Avatar
    The only one making money making Android phones are Samsung and it isn't much. Everyone else isn't making money and they didn't take the time to redesign it from the ground up. It would have to be redesigned from the ground up to get the same level of security as BB10. Putting layers on top like Knox isn't working. It would have taken billions to redesign and then you wouldn't make money either.
    Surely you're exaggerating. You have to know that other Android OEMs are profitable besides Samsung. Samsung makes the most profit by far, but they don't make all of the profits.

    Android is so popular because it is so cheap and easy to make your own. Why else would so many OEMs use it? BlackBerry would have to try really hard to spend billions on skinning it. And security doesn't need to be a concern either. Why does everyone think BlackBerry has to make everything they do secure? Is that like a mandate for them now? Are they legally required to only make so-called "secure" devices that the vast majority of humans don't want or need?

    Besides, enterprise customers are already happily leaving BlackBerry for Android in droves. More and more move to Android or iOS each day so obviously any alledged security advantage BlackBerry may have isn't doing much to help them out.

    Why do you think BlackBerry was forced to make BES for iOS and Android? If enterprise wasn't moving to Android, would there be BES for it?

    BlackBerry won't survive much longer by aiming to meet the needs of the 1%.
    JeepBB and Troy Tiscareno like this.
    04-15-14 12:27 PM
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