12-05-13 08:17 PM
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  1. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    FYI

    11:47 AM Research In Motion (RIMM -1.7%) makes new lows following Friday's post-FQ1 bloodletting, as an upgrade to Buy from Hudson Securities fails to help. Activist investor Jaguar Financial is stepping up its calls for a sale, and is also demanding the removal of CEO Thorsten Heins and half of RIM's board. Expect some fireworks at RIM's July 10 shareholder meeting.

    Source: seeking "first greek letter" (I don't link them anymore)
    07-02-12 02:44 PM
  2. dandbj13's Avatar
    FYI

    11:47 AM Research In Motion (RIMM -1.7%) makes new lows following Friday's post-FQ1 bloodletting, as an upgrade to Buy from Hudson Securities fails to help. Activist investor Jaguar Financial is stepping up its calls for a sale, and is also demanding the removal of CEO Thorsten Heins and half of RIM's board. Expect some fireworks at RIM's July 10 shareholder meeting.

    Source: seeking "first greek letter" (I don't link them anymore)
    Finally! People who are losing truckloads of money are starting to act like it. At last, the world makes a little sense again.
    07-02-12 02:49 PM
  3. njblackberry's Avatar
    What's Prem Watsa saying. His paper losses should be in the $500mm range. That's a lot of money. Even for a successful investor.
    07-02-12 03:07 PM
  4. OMGitworks's Avatar
    What's Prem Watsa saying. His paper losses should be in the $500mm range. That's a lot of money. Even for a successful investor.
    It will very interesting to see if he raises or goes quietly. I think he's well over $500M in the hole at this point, but what do I know, as everyone pointed out, he's much smarter and more successful than I'll ever be.
    07-02-12 10:29 PM
  5. OMGitworks's Avatar
    What's Prem Watsa saying. His paper losses should be in the $500mm range. That's a lot of money. Even for a successful investor.
    Went back and checked one of the Prem threads and here was my post:

    You have it backwards. He invested starting last year paying $50+ for his first batch of shares. As of December he had lost $300 million, and got on the board to try to save his investment. Realizing the stock had to get to $40 just to break even, he doubled his position when the price was at $15 to lower his average cost of a share from $40 to $28 or so. First 11.8 M shares cost almost $480m, last 11.8 million cost "only" about $180M and gets him about 5%. Now he probably only needs the stock to get to around $28 to break even.... In that is is current trading in the $16 range he still needs it to gain 75% just to get even.

    So it looks like $500M is a very close number. Ouch.... Definitely not "paper losses" at this point.
    07-02-12 10:36 PM
  6. njblackberry's Avatar
    It is a paper loss until he sells and it becomes realized.
    In any event, OUCH
    07-02-12 10:47 PM
  7. oilgeo10's Avatar
    It is a paper loss until he sells and it becomes realized.
    In any event, OUCH
    And it's investor money too! Probably the portfolio's biggest loss right now.
    07-02-12 11:16 PM
  8. Doc Z's Avatar
    I'm so happy I got out when they were at $11. What a blow.
    JBenn911 likes this.
    07-02-12 11:28 PM
  9. ramxx's Avatar
    Come on man, this is predictable, the only thing RIM has is BBM. Seriously even their email is not that good comparing to android email system.

    Lets see some merging RIM you can use Android and software developers.
    07-03-12 12:48 AM
  10. the_sleuth's Avatar
    I have warned everyone to stay away from this speculative stock. Now as each quarter gets uglier for the next 9 to 12 months, Prem Watsa and other investors should worry about this fact:

    Major stock exchanges, like the Nasdaq, are exclusive clubs - their reputations rest on the companies they trade. As such, the Nasdaq won't allow just any company to be traded on its exchange. Only companies with a solid history and top-notch management behind them are considered.

    The Nasdaq has three sets of listing requirements. Each company must meet at least one of the three requirement sets, as well as the main rules for all companies.

    Listing Requirements for All Companies
    Each company must have a minimum of 1,250,000 publicly-traded shares upon listing, excluding those held by officers, directors or any beneficial owners of more then 10% of the company. In addition, the minimum bid price at time of listing must be greater than five dollars, and there must be at least three market makers for the stock. Each listing firm is also required to follow Nasdaq corporate governance rules 4350, 4351 and 4360. Companies must also have at least 450 round lot (100 shares) shareholders, 2,200 total shareholders, or 550 total shareholders with 1.1 million average trading volume over the past 12 months.

    Read more: What are the listing requirements for the Nasdaq?

    Will RIMM stay above $5 bucks in the short term?
    Shlooky likes this.
    07-03-12 09:05 PM
  11. addicted44's Avatar
    Will RIMM stay above $5 bucks in the short term?
    From the part you have quoted, it states that the minimum is $5 "at time of listing". It doesn't state that RIM needs to remain above $5 beyond that point to remain listed. (Note: I havent read the linked article).
    Last edited by addicted44; 07-04-12 at 02:53 AM. Reason: Trimmed Quote
    07-04-12 02:52 AM
  12. johnenglish's Avatar
    It's a bit more complex than that. A company needs to maintain a minimum market cap, so the number of shares multipled by the share price needs to equal a certain amount (I *think* for Nasdaq Global it needs to be $75 million). The volitality of a stock is also taken into consideration.
    07-04-12 03:53 PM
  13. palomartian's Avatar
    They won't be delisted. They also will not be saved by an unproven OS with no ecosystem running on year old, expensive hardware and squeezing data through a compression bottleneck. Everybody gets that now.
    07-04-12 10:20 PM
  14. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    They won't be delisted. They also will not be saved by an unproven OS with no ecosystem running on year old, expensive hardware and squeezing data through a compression bottleneck. Everybody gets that now.
    I really appreciate creative kitchen. But your recipe is approximate ... at least.
    Like "when it's hot" against "when it's boiling". You generously mix proper assessments and what I believe is BS (1 yo hardware ? squeezing ? bottleneck ?). You may prefer to stand more generic and say : I don't believe they'll make it. That - while thinking the exact opposite - would be more understandable.
    Respectfully .

    Edit: BTW the stock seems to have some kind of resistance around $7.30 /7.45 ($7.44 b4 opening) : a brutal "death spiral" ???
    Last edited by Superfly_FR; 07-05-12 at 03:34 AM.
    07-05-12 03:19 AM
  15. palomartian's Avatar
    I really appreciate creative kitchen. But your recipe is approximate ... at least.
    Like "when it's hot" against "when it's boiling". You generously mix proper assessments and what I believe is BS (1 yo hardware ? squeezing ? bottleneck ?). You may prefer to stand more generic and say : I don't believe they'll make it. That - while thinking the exact opposite - would be more understandable.
    Respectfully .

    Edit: BTW the stock seems to have some kind of resistance around $7.30 /7.45 ($7.44 b4 opening) : a brutal "death spiral" ???

    The carriers pay RIM for compressing data. You don't notice this, fine. It's still there and it still has a negative effect on performance.

    The OS will be unproven.

    The hardware will be comparable to an Android phone available the prior year, maybe even longer.

    There will be no ecosystem. Maybe a few apps, but just about every consumer will find there is something the phone CAN'T do as a result.

    RIM will price it $50 above the best stuff out there, and hundreds more than comparable kit.

    Granted that last one is a prediction, but I'm 99% confident based on what I've seen in the past.
    07-05-12 10:38 AM
  16. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    The carriers pay RIM for compressing data.
    Fact.
    You don't notice this, fine.
    Call me 1d1ot

    Now specultations :
    It's still there and it still has a negative effect on performance.
    You mean ease of use (truncated emails ?), maybe. But performance ... can't understand
    why. Besides, we actually don't know if BB10 will fully/partially rely on the NOC compression, in particular for ActiveSync. If you have infos, share please !
    The OS will be unproven.
    Just your personal (lack of) faith.

    The hardware will be comparable to an Android phone available the prior year, maybe even longer.
    You mean against January 2012 Android phones ? Moreover, "power is nothing" by itself. Run Vista and W7 on the same desktop and you'll know what I mean.

    There will be no ecosystem. Maybe a few apps, but just about every consumer will find there is something the phone CAN'T do as a result.
    There is already - what you call - an ecosystem. Extend concept will build a real ecosystem. And I pray for Netflix and Skype (that I won't use), just to stop about this recurring rant.

    RIM will price it $50 above the best stuff out there, and hundreds more than comparable kit.
    Granted that last one is a prediction (you meant speculation, right ?)

    but I'm 99% confident based on what I've seen in the past.
    I'm 90% not convinced.
    07-05-12 10:56 AM
  17. Astroglide's Avatar
    Bought rim @7.35....sold it @7.65...easy fill....

    Nasdaq - 0.36%

    Dow Jones - 0.06%

    Technology sector - 0.20%

    Rim - (as 2.07 PM EST) - 5.37%

    The word on the trading floor about rim is positive...at least for today..

    I don't have the exact figures but volume traded for rim today was above normal...
    07-05-12 02:10 PM
  18. OzarkaTexile's Avatar
    Bought rim @7.35....sold it @7.65...easy fill....

    Nasdaq - 0.36%

    Dow Jones - 0.06%

    Technology sector - 0.20%

    Rim - (as 2.07 PM EST) - 5.37%

    The word on the trading floor about rim is positive...at least for today..

    I don't have the exact figures but volume traded for rim today was above normal...
    The narrative behind today's bounce is that investors are speculating on a sale:

    RIM Shares Soar 6% On Speculation - International Business Times

    Shrug. Things bounce when they're dropped.
    07-05-12 02:25 PM
  19. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    I find it ironic that many people in this thread don't know the difference between Trading and Investing. Just sayin...
    JBenn911 likes this.
    07-05-12 06:46 PM
  20. terminatorx's Avatar
    If RIM doesn't announce that they have a buyer by the time the AGM rolls around next week, the stock could go to $3 or worse.
    Whatever you say Nostradamus. LOL
    Superfly_FR and drjay868 like this.
    07-05-12 07:24 PM
  21. johnenglish's Avatar
    I find it ironic that many people in this thread don't know the difference between Trading and Investing. Just sayin...
    I'l have you know that on the internet everyone is an expert at whatever it is they're discussing.
    Stewartj1 and drjay868 like this.
    07-05-12 09:14 PM
  22. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    I find it ironic that many people in this thread don't know the difference between Trading and Investing. Just sayin...
    What would be the appropriate word for "putting money into a company that you believe in" ?
    To me it's investing. Is that correct ?
    07-06-12 05:00 AM
  23. njblackberry's Avatar
    In either case you are trying to make money. Prem Watsa is trying to make money. Is he trading or investing?

    Don't fall in love with a company (and stock) - you won't see the warning signs that it is time to get out.

    Perhaps the only difference would be your investment timing - investing could be considered a long term strategy.
    07-06-12 05:11 AM
  24. leftypepper716's Avatar
    If? I had about $15K to just "play" with, knowing it'd be like going to Las Vegas for the week, I'd buy about 5K shares of RIMM stock. I know it would NEVER peak again at $144.00, but If? BlackBerry OS 10 can gain some traction in 2013 and keep up a decent profit, it could? get up to $45.00-$50.00 a share by 2016?
    07-06-12 07:36 AM
  25. ColdFistOfTruth's Avatar
    I find it ironic that many people in this thread don't know the difference between Trading and Investing. Just sayin...
    Trading requires luck.

    Investing requires a plan.

    -CFOT
    Superfly_FR and JBenn911 like this.
    07-06-12 08:05 AM
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