10-03-13 11:03 AM
197 1234 ...
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  1. krackerjack69's Avatar
    Don't always believe what a capitalist says !! You should know that by now !! They are like politicians say one thing do another! He will keep it together if it only makes sense and he makes money out of it, that is why he is in on this not because he is a fan boy from way back! Profit is the be all and end all for venture capitalists! There is no good news here unless BB was getting some injection of cash, which they are not! I am a bit peeved right now sorry for the exclamation marks! LOL
    greenberry666 likes this.
    09-23-13 06:31 PM
  2. mikeo007's Avatar
    Funny, the majority of the 700+ million iPhone users aren't struggling at all.
    It seems to only be Blackberry users who struggle with iPhones...lol
    ekv likes this.
    09-23-13 06:34 PM
  3. battleax78's Avatar
    People on this forum keep getting stuck at the denial stage of grief.

    Handsets are dead... gonzo... finished... 86'ed, etc.

    Blackberry CANNOT compete with the big boys and if you think their name was mud before, it's even worse now.
    Who's going to want to buy a Blackberry phone now after all this turmoil? People didn't want to buy them even when they were on their comeback trail.

    The Blackberry you all know is gone. There will be no consumer market - their last attempt will be putting all their eggs in the enterprise software basket.
    This speculation is no more valid than "Blackberry will make a huge comeback". Unless your only aim was to get likes from the anti-Blackberry folks who hover this website like vultures daily, you'd have to do a lot more digging if you wanted to make an educated guess at what this LOI really means for the future.

    Many folks, including those who do not own BB10 as a daily driver, are still impressed by the OS's core functionality.
    09-23-13 06:43 PM
  4. kevinnugent's Avatar
    This speculation is no more valid than "Blackberry will make a huge comeback". Unless your only aim was to get likes from the anti-Blackberry folks who hover this website like vultures daily, you'd have to do a lot more digging if you wanted to make an educated guess at what this LOI really means for the future.

    Many folks, including those who do not own BB10 as a daily driver, are still impressed by the OS's core functionality.
    Read the release again. Focus on these words "delivering superior and secure enterprise solutions" I've underlined the clue.
    mikeo007 likes this.
    09-23-13 06:48 PM
  5. EauRouge's Avatar
    I dont think a sale could have turned out better for BB. Thumbs up!
    der_mit likes this.
    09-23-13 06:56 PM
  6. Wiki Cydia's Avatar
    Funny, the majority of the 700+ million iPhone users aren't struggling at all.
    That 700 million figure is for iOS, not iPhone specifically, which has sold around 400 million units, though this doesn't alter the gist of your post.

    Many folks, including those who do not own BB10 as a daily driver, are still impressed by the OS's core functionality.
    Granted, but there's no slot on the balance sheet for people that are "impressed' but don't actually buy.
    badiyee, Skandalous1 and JeepBB like this.
    09-23-13 06:58 PM
  7. gfondeur's Avatar
    ....The JB runtime adds very little in terms of features or compatibility that weren't already there in the old runtime......
    do you F......G kidding me right?
    the JB runtime it's the best thing could happen to BB10, period!
    09-23-13 07:02 PM
  8. Jim Banks1's Avatar
    There is no enterprise business. That's part of the reason they got in the mess they are in now. Back when only the top executives had smart phones, enterprises were willing to pay a premium for them to have the devices. They won't pay that premium any longer now that the rank and file employees all have them as well.

    The consumer market drove the enterprise market. Long term the only hope they have is to go after kids...
    09-23-13 07:08 PM
  9. tmb2013's Avatar
    I really don't know why people have such a hard time understanding the way this works.

    Watsa cobbles together an "investment" group and get an initial read that the dough they need to do the deal can be placed and they get a range of what the price on the notes will be.

    On that basis they make an offer, subject to financing, and go trotting back to the Investment banks who have to do a dog and pony show to round up investors . Investors in high rate, essentially junk bonds. They certainly are not investment grade.

    The offering docs get drawn up and the offer goes out to current shareholders.

    by the time the deal is finalized they will have taken on approximately $5Billion in debt, at junk bond rates, and incurred costs to the lawyers and accountants of in or around $3 million.

    The Investment banks get a share of the $5 Billion too don't forget. So Watsa and his crew end up with around $4.25 Billion after all is said and done and now they have to do something with it. The first problem they have is that BB is losing money and that first interest payment on the notes is 30 days away, and then every 30 days after that. And BB is losing money.

    New handset development, or OS or software development or grand marketing schemes are not on the drawing board. There isn't enough money to pay for those and there's $5 billion dollars to pay back to hungry banks.

    The layoffs will start again and the company starts getting broken up into marketable segments and put on the market.

    Within 18 months what you all think of as Blackberry will no longer exist. Period.

    It's a simple formula that gets repeated 100's of time a year and the final outcome is usually pretty much predictable from the outset.

    And no, this isn't the best outcome for BB.
    09-23-13 07:14 PM
  10. scribacco's Avatar

    Fire-sale Z10s will broaden the userbase quickly, and the Jelly Bean runtime makes porting Android apps a much more attractive proposition for major publishers. By the end of the year this could be looking a lot brighter, WITHOUT meaning the dismantling of the company.
    The Z10 has been at $0 on contract for a while now and they still had to write it off...no one wants it
    09-23-13 07:17 PM
  11. mikeo007's Avatar
    do you F......G kidding me right?
    the JB runtime it's the best thing could happen to BB10, period!
    You forgot the sarcasm tags!
    09-23-13 07:22 PM
  12. m1a1mg's Avatar
    If you want Mike, why not Jim as well?

    09-23-13 07:24 PM
  13. grover5's Avatar
    It's like Christmas for the usual gaggle of negative posters. It is entertaining to see them fall all over each other with their sudden expertise in what watsa intends to do. They can't say cut it up and sell it for parts enough to satisfy that crazy itch.

    Posted via CB10
    dannykavs, pcguy514 and mkelley65 like this.
    09-23-13 07:30 PM
  14. SK122387's Avatar
    It's fair to be skeptical at this point. I don't agree with this assessment, though. For one thing, I'd bet that Mike L. WILL be coming back in the course of this deal (and I think they're avoiding mention of him right now due to the optics of returning the "old guard" back to leadership). I have trouble believing that Mike L would return just for the sake of dismantling his own baby.

    There's a way forward for BlackBerry. Fire-sale Z10s will broaden the userbase quickly, and the Jelly Bean runtime makes porting Android apps a much more attractive proposition for major publishers. By the end of the year this could be looking a lot brighter, WITHOUT meaning the dismantling of the company.
    Thunderbuck, your posts always find a balance between optimism and rationalism, and provide some bit of hope without going overboard and proclaiming BlackBerry to be the next Apple. Thanks.
    09-23-13 07:35 PM
  15. koool1's Avatar
    Awesome news. At the end of the day it needs to stay together if it is to survive. I have always said that.

    Posted via CB10
    09-23-13 07:35 PM
  16. grover5's Avatar
    Thunderbuck, your posts always find a balance between optimism and rationalism, and provide some bit of hope without going overboard and proclaiming BlackBerry to be the next Apple. Thanks.
    I couldn't agree more. It's great having him on the forums.

    Posted via CB10
    Thunderbuck likes this.
    09-23-13 07:37 PM
  17. codehut's Avatar
    Thunderbuck, your posts always find a balance between optimism and rationalism, and provide some bit of hope without going overboard and proclaiming BlackBerry to be the next Apple. Thanks.
    As a developer, you are absolutely 100% mistaken if you think the Jelly Bean news will make any difference. All the announcements to date from BB are a clear and direct signal they have no interest in participating in the consumer market and this is an immediate "drop tools - cease work" for that small handful of developers that were even interested in BB10 in the first place.
    09-23-13 07:41 PM
  18. chr1sny's Avatar
    From my experience in biglaw, this is a likely outcome.

    I really don't know why people have such a hard time understanding the way this works.

    Watsa cobbles together an "investment" group and get an initial read that the dough they need to do the deal can be placed and they get a range of what the price on the notes will be.

    On that basis they make an offer, subject to financing, and go trotting back to the Investment banks who have to do a dog and pony show to round up investors . Investors in high rate, essentially junk bonds. They certainly are not investment grade.

    The offering docs get drawn up and the offer goes out to current shareholders.

    by the time the deal is finalized they will have taken on approximately $5Billion in debt, at junk bond rates, and incurred costs to the lawyers and accountants of in or around $3 million.

    The Investment banks get a share of the $5 Billion too don't forget. So Watsa and his crew end up with around $4.25 Billion after all is said and done and now they have to do something with it. The first problem they have is that BB is losing money and that first interest payment on the notes is 30 days away, and then every 30 days after that. And BB is losing money.

    New handset development, or OS or software development or grand marketing schemes are not on the drawing board. There isn't enough money to pay for those and there's $5 billion dollars to pay back to hungry banks.

    The layoffs will start again and the company starts getting broken up into marketable segments and put on the market.

    Within 18 months what you all think of as Blackberry will no longer exist. Period.

    It's a simple formula that gets repeated 100's of time a year and the final outcome is usually pretty much predictable from the outset.

    And no, this isn't the best outcome for BB.
    TGR1 and The Aficionado like this.
    09-23-13 07:42 PM
  19. AnimalPak200's Avatar
    He probably just said what he said so that his clients don't think he's a crazy man going out to buy a broken company to just let it run the same way... What else did you expect him to say?

    "We're not going to change a thing!",
    or
    "We are going to focus on BB10 and the fickle consumer market where BlackBerry has failed" and not mention the Enterprise?.. the only place they haven't crashed and burned... yet.

    No one goes "Woohoo, I decided to buy that house because it only has some termite damage!" Instead they more likely mention a positive aspect in hopes of justifying their decision.

    Posted via CB10
    09-23-13 08:00 PM
  20. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    I've seen you make this claim before, but didn't bother commenting. However, you seem to be spreading it further than a single thread. This is patently untrue. The JB runtime adds very little in terms of features or compatibility that weren't already there in the old runtime. It will do almost nothing to draw developers into porting who weren't already interested in it before. Only a tiny fraction of current Android apps require 4.2.

    With blackberry moving to enterprise only, the majority of consumer market app developers will not have any reason to develop for BB10. Apps will once again be small niche products that fail to live up to their counterparts on other platforms (not like that isn't already the case).
    I take Flipboard as one example of an app that didn?t want to release on the old runtime. I've been left with the impression that Instagram and Netflix were waiting for it as well so they wouldn't have to support older Android apps.

    From the awesome PHYSICAL keyboard of my Q10
    pcguy514 likes this.
    09-23-13 08:08 PM
  21. FSeverino's Avatar
    BES devices still use carriers.
    But that was my point. They may open up device purchase to 'prosumers' just because the devices are already made

    Posted via CB10
    09-23-13 08:19 PM
  22. mikeo007's Avatar
    I take Flipboard as one example of an app that didn?t want to release on the old runtime. I've been left with the impression that Instagram and Netflix were waiting for it as well so they wouldn't have to support older Android apps.

    From the awesome PHYSICAL keyboard of my Q10
    That is downright untrue. Please stop making things up in an attempt to sounds like you know what you're talking about.

    Neither instagram, nor flipboard, nor Netflix require the JB runtime.
    https://play.google.com/store/apps/d....android&hl=en
    https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...iaclient&hl=en
    https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...oard.app&hl=en

    Again, according to Blackberry's own numbers (check their posts about Android runtime compatibility) about 90% of Android apps can run on the 2.3 runtime.
    richardat and JeepBB like this.
    09-23-13 08:21 PM
  23. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    My experience with private equity firms is that they gut orgs. Expect 4500 to be only the beginning. They'll strip it to the bone, turn it cash positive, pay for most of BlackBerry with its own cash, then take it public or sell it for a profit.
    09-23-13 08:21 PM
  24. grover5's Avatar
    That is downright untrue. Please stop making things up in an attempt to sounds like you know what you're talking about.

    Neither instagram, nor flipboard, nor Netflix require the JB runtime.
    https://play.google.com/store/apps/d....android&hl=en
    https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...iaclient&hl=en
    https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...oard.app&hl=en

    Again, according to Blackberry's own numbers (check their posts about Android runtime compatibility) about 90% of Android apps can run on the 2.3 runtime.
    He didn't say they required it.

    Posted via CB10
    09-23-13 08:25 PM
  25. battleax78's Avatar
    Read the release again. Focus on these words "delivering superior and secure enterprise solutions" I've underlined the clue.
    If you want to be taken seriously, quote someone fully to gain context. Don't be a tabloid drama queen.

    "“We believe this transaction will open an exciting new private chapter for BlackBerry, its customers, carriers and employees. We can deliver immediate value to shareholders, while we continue the execution of a long-term strategy in a private company with a focus on delivering superior and secure enterprise solutions to BlackBerry customers around the world.”

    This has always been Blackberry's differentiator and focus whether it was 2004 or 2013. They'd obviously want to continue that
    undone and pcguy514 like this.
    09-23-13 08:26 PM
197 1234 ...

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