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10-25-19 11:12 AM
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  1. Francon's Avatar
    I had a meeting with one of TCL insiders and got some information related to BlackBerry:
    TCL has dismantled BlackBerry Mobile division and transferred its executives to other company’s departments.
    TCL has stopped the production of all BlackBerry devices.
    TCL will end the support of all devices by August 2020.
    TCL will not renew or extend the contract with BlackBerry, which will expire by July 2021.
    TCL will most likely renew the Alcatel licensing contract with Nokia because of the big recognition that this brand enjoys in the western world.
    Key3 isn’t completely dead. The management doesn’t have any decision yet or not giving any update about it, but the insider said that 90% will not happen.

    When I asked the insider about the reason that TCL is very mysterious about BlackBerry Mobile future, he said, “The management in both companies don’t want to hear and read the crazy news about BlackBerry death in the media. The market share of Blackberry devices is almost non-existence, but the BlackBerry death story will have huge coverage everywhere and for weeks, and this will absolutely add damage to both companies’ reputation. This could also affect customers’ trust in Alcatel and the newly born TCL brand in the mobile industry. So, don’t expect any official news about the end anytime soon”
    I attached an interesting shot of a long folder.
    Take this story with a grain of salt. I can’t confirm all the information here, neither being accountable for the insider talk.
    TCL Insider Comments and Rumors.-20191013_043635.jpg
    whatnow00 and elfabio80 like this.
    10-13-19 05:02 AM
  2. conite's Avatar
    Sounds pretty much in line with what we've been hearing and seeing.
    Osei dagadu likes this.
    10-13-19 12:42 PM
  3. zer0ten's Avatar
    What a pitiful end to the brand. I feel like they could have succeeded in Android if they had better pricing. It seems like BlackBerry never could get past their addiction to the service fees they generated with BIS. And they seemed to never realize just how damaged their brand became.
    whatnow00 and elfabio80 like this.
    10-13-19 12:49 PM
  4. conite's Avatar
    What a pitiful end to the brand. I feel like they could have succeeded in Android if they had better pricing. It seems like BlackBerry never could get past their addiction to the service fees they generated with BIS. And they seemed to never realize just how damaged their brand became.
    You feel the $15-$40 per device made the difference?

    If TCL had had to develop all of that technology themselves, it would have cost them a LOT more than that.
    Last edited by conite; 10-13-19 at 01:03 PM.
    10-13-19 12:53 PM
  5. Thud Hardsmack's Avatar
    You feel the $15-$40 per device made the difference?

    If TCL had had to develop all of that technology themselves, it would have cost them a LOT more than that.
    They're still an upstart with a damaged brand. They should never have tried to charge premium out of the gate, especially with those cute manufacturing oopsies.
    10-13-19 01:21 PM
  6. conite's Avatar
    They're still an upstart with a damaged brand. They should never have tried to charge premium out of the gate, especially with those cute manufacturing oopsies.
    I still think it's a red herring. To me, the real issue was the lack of a substantive residual physical keyboard market. A $5-$20 rate cut wouldn't have changed a thing.
    10-13-19 01:24 PM
  7. Thud Hardsmack's Avatar
    I still think it's a red herring. To me, the real issue was the lack of a substantive residual physical keyboard market. A $5-$20 rate cut wouldn't have changed a thing.
    Same principle. Drop $100-$150 from the device cost and build up.
    10-13-19 01:29 PM
  8. conite's Avatar
    Same principle. Drop $100-$150 from the device cost and build up.
    I thought we were talking about BlackBerry Limited.

    "It seems like BlackBerry never could get past their addiction to the service fees they generated with BIS."
    10-13-19 01:30 PM
  9. Thud Hardsmack's Avatar
    I thought we were talking about BlackBerry Limited.
    We're talking about a company that has a problem announcing they made a tactical error in selling devices which would have elevated the name of another company had they sold well, but they didn't for various reasons, one being cost.
    whatnow00 and tazcubed like this.
    10-13-19 01:34 PM
  10. conite's Avatar
    We're talking about a company that has a problem announcing they made a tactical error in selling devices which would have elevated the name of another company had they sold well, but they didn't for various reasons, one being cost.
    All I know is that I was responding to this:

    "It seems like BlackBerry (Limited) never could get past their addiction to the service fees they generated with BIS."

    On a separate topic, as far as TCL goes, and whether or not they should have sold devices at a loss to build market share, I can't really speak to that. A boutique product/market like BBMo's makes that very difficult.
    skinnymike1 likes this.
    10-13-19 01:38 PM
  11. anon(10321802)'s Avatar
    None of this surprises me, if true. It's right in line with what little information (or lack thereof) we do have.

    The reason TCL execs still mention BlackBerry as one of their brands is because, as of right now, it still is. They still have inventory to sell and they still have a licensing agreement in effect.

    But nothing they have said gives any indication that they have plans for the future of the brand, let alone any new devices in the works.

    I doubt we will see a new BlackBerry device from TCL.

    I would say it's possible TCL and BlackBerry Ltd could come to an understanding and give it another try, but I think the results of the partnership have fallen far below expectations on both sides. The devices didn't sell in quantities needed to make the venture a profitable one.

    Regardless, I have to tip my hat to TCL/BlackBerry Mobile. I think they gave it an excellent effort at the outset. I think they built some positive energy and momentum around the launches of the KEYone and KEY2 - thanks in good part to CrackBerry for agreeing to use its own brand to help spread the word. The fact that we have still been able to buy brand new BlackBerry phones with that iconic, amazing physical keyboard in 2019 is nothing short of fantastic.

    But, as has been the common refrain for the past decade when it comes to BlackBerry phones, it appears to have been too little, too late. The positive vibes have dissipated, the momentum has been lost.

    Even if TCL/BlackBerry Mobile were to launch another BlackBerry device, the only ones who would care would be those like myself who can't stand typing lengthy chunks of text such as this on anything but a physical keyboard. And that just wouldn't be enough to sustain the current business model.

    I sincerely hope I'm wrong. But having had my hopes crushed with BB10, this feels all too familiar.

    Posted with clicky precision from my Atomic KEY2 LE
    skinnymike1 and tazcubed like this.
    10-13-19 01:39 PM
  12. Thud Hardsmack's Avatar
    All I know is that I was responding to this:

    "It seems like BlackBerry (Limited) never could get past their addiction to the service fees they generated with BIS."

    On a separate topic, as far as TCL goes, and whether or not they should have sold devices at a loss to build market share, I can't really speak to that. A boutique product/market like BBMo's makes that very difficult.
    It's all included. Most buyers aren't pulling up info on what company charges what to whom. They see a device for sale, see specs, look at something else with better specs that costs less, make purchase. This means no sale for TCL/BBMo.
    10-13-19 01:47 PM
  13. Paulelmar18's Avatar
    Aha!!!!
    10-13-19 01:48 PM
  14. conite's Avatar
    It's all included. Most buyers aren't pulling up info on what company charges what to whom. They see a device for sale, see specs, look at something else with better specs that costs less, make purchase. This means no sale for TCL/BBMo.
    I understand, but again I was responding to a statement that was strictly regarding licencing fees, and the opinion that BlackBerry Limited was charging too much. Anything else is completely beyond their control, as their licencees had to do whatever they each felt best for their own ROI and business case.
    skinnymike1 likes this.
    10-13-19 01:48 PM
  15. conite's Avatar
    Aha!!!!
    I don't think anyone had high confidence in sunshine and lollipops going forward.

    In my case, I was reluctant to absolutely accept rumours as 100% fact until HARD deadlines had passed. For me, that deadline came in Sep when there was no sign of Pie.

    Rumours are a tricky thing. Until I can substantiate with physical proof, I treat them as such. One never knows the true motivations of those initiating the rumours. Even corroboration is not proof of anything, as several rumours can originate from the same source and are simply being re-reported as new.
    anon(10321802) and Mecca EL like this.
    10-13-19 01:52 PM
  16. John Albert's Avatar
    No one would talk about September 100% growth in sales numbers lol.
    it seems this came from the thousand units that TCL sent to Gotalk and BestBuy 😂
    10-13-19 02:12 PM
  17. mrsimon's Avatar
    The ultimate deadline is the launch or news of a new device here in Barcelona at the MWC 2020. Of course, no PIE, no BlackBerry mobile, low stock and low sales, and no evidence of a new device being developed should cast a doubt on a Key3. or isn't that enough? Hope is the last thing to die.
    10-13-19 02:34 PM
  18. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    No one would talk about September 100% growth in sales numbers lol.
    it seems this came from the thousand units that TCL sent to Gotalk and BestBuy
    The Best Buy sales came from Best Buy recalling all unsold BB inventory from their stores and putting it up for online sales.

    The GoTalk inventory came from other retailers, who returned unsold inventory to their distributor for credit, and the distributor resold that inventory to GoTalk for clearance.
    valer466 likes this.
    10-13-19 02:36 PM
  19. John Albert's Avatar
    The Best Buy sales came from Best Buy recalling all unsold BB inventory from their stores and putting it up for online sales.

    The GoTalk inventory came from other retailers, who returned unsold inventory to their distributor for credit, and the distributor resold that inventory to GoTalk for clearance.
    Yes, Agree!.
    The interesting thing in this paper is that all Indian Key2 variants are made by TCL.
    Now, I understood why they didn't like Optiemus quitting.

    Still sales numbers in free fall. Did they reach the bottom yet?
    10-13-19 02:44 PM
  20. yamahammer's Avatar
    Still sales numbers in free fall. Did they reach the bottom yet?
    How can they sell product they are no longer making....????
    10-13-19 03:33 PM
  21. thurask's Avatar
    How can they sell product they are no longer making....????
    Sales slow enough that they're sitting on inventory?
    10-13-19 03:34 PM
  22. yamahammer's Avatar
    Sales slow enough that they're sitting on inventory?
    Good one!
    10-13-19 04:29 PM
  23. yamahammer's Avatar
    Still outselling the Titan...
    10-13-19 04:33 PM
  24. yamahammer's Avatar
    In the end they ended up selling much less than 1 million PKB phones after you remove the DTEK phones out of the figures.

    AND if you look at the sales of the Z10 in the first quarter of sales (3 months) it sold 2.7 million units and that was considered a huge failure.
    10-13-19 04:45 PM
  25. Sigewif's Avatar
    The Best Buy sales came from Best Buy recalling all unsold BB inventory from their stores and putting it up for online sales.

    The GoTalk inventory came from other retailers, who returned unsold inventory to their distributor for credit, and the distributor resold that inventory to GoTalk for clearance.
    Best Buy did a terrible job with BlackBerry devices. They had a place to display the KEY2 LE for weeks and maybe months and never put out a display model at our local store. The info that said there was supposed to be a BlackBerry KEY2 LE displayed there was in tiny print no one could read. There was not even a photo of the device. I posted photos of the display with no phone elsewhere on CB. I went looking because I tracked down the fact that the local store had some by checking online. The guy got a boxed one out of the drawer for me. He couldn't open that, of course.
    It is almost impossible sell a unique device when it is not displayed. They have them selves to thank. We will never know how many they could have sold if they had marketed them better.
    10-13-19 05:41 PM
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