05-31-14 10:22 PM
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  1. crazigee's Avatar
    I just really wish the Android performance was better.

    Although most apps work, I find most apps to be painfully slow--so much so that I simply delete them.

    Is BlackBerry is serious about using Android to fill in its app gap, then they have to fix the performance.

    I don't care about having Android 4.3. Only 8.5 percent of actual Android phones have Android 4.3!!! LOL

    They should stop updating the version and focus on getting 4.2.2 working faster (or I guess 4.3 since they've already started on it) and forget about getting versions working that no apps even require to run.

    They also need a workaround for notifications.

    FB messenger runs fine on BB10 but has no notifications, making the fact that it works a moot point. (leaving it open in an active frame is not a solution)

    My 2 cents

    Posted via CB10
    Apparently people don't want Android apps. They want native BB10 apps. So why bother with Android runtime at all?

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    05-29-14 07:38 PM
  2. DS1331's Avatar
    Stop gap measure, pure and simple. Something so that more dedicated BlackBerry users can have access to a wider range of apps so that they don't leave BlackBerry.

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    Exactly, the first two times I bought a Q10 I loved it but eventually felt like something was missing because I was so used to android, now that I have snap I feel a sense of relief, just knowing I can get whatever I want whenever, the phones perfect, eh maybe a bigger screen but it's all good

    Posted via CB10
    05-29-14 07:56 PM
  3. goku_vegeta's Avatar
    In addition to everything that's been said, I also think it's important to note that BlackBerry never did fully intend for the runtime to be an end user feature. They have never properly advertised it for this reason. I'm sure that quite a number of you already know that the runtime was meant to allow android developers to test their apps with BlackBerry 10 and if they were satisfied have them port their apps to the platform.

    Getting them to write a native app if their app gained popularity is another thing altogether. Although personally I don't see the android runtime as a negative. I do understand the concerns people have and some members have raised valid points but as both a consumer and enthusiast, the Android runtime allows me to have all the native BlackBerry experiences we are accustomed to, such as great email handling, efficient calendar, and the BlackBerry flow experience, some apps run perfectly fine on BlackBerry 10 while even integrating into the native side of BlackBerry 10. I've managed to convince Martin to bring Aedict 3 to BlackBerry 10 and that app works on all BlackBerry 10 devices just as well as any android device plus it's integration with the BlackBerry 10 clipboard and share framework are amazing. The new share framework will provide an even enhanced experience as we will be able to share from android apps to native ones.

    Long story short, depending on what you expect from the android runtime, that's the level of satisfaction you will get. I believe that I should be able to get the basics through BlackBerry World and for those 3-4 little apps which make the device work that much better, I'm totally accepting of the fact that the android runtime can handle these apps for me. It really is a what you make it type of experience.

    Posted via CB10
    05-29-14 10:19 PM
  4. Bbnivende's Avatar
    I agree with you Goku . I will say that I already have more Android apps than BlackBerry Apps. Between Mobile web sites, BB10 apps and Android apps . I too think too that I am fine as far as meeting my smartphone App needs.

    Gift that keeps on giving ... my old 9900 phone # was transferred to my Z10. The 9900 has a bank app that sends me an alert if someone (me) accessed my accounts. The bank now sends me the alerts to my Z10. Business as usual.
    Last edited by Bbnivende; 05-30-14 at 01:35 AM.
    goku_vegeta likes this.
    05-29-14 10:48 PM
  5. mnc76's Avatar
    Some apps do work really well. I just downloaded the Android Dropbox app from Snap : it has its stutters, but overall is much better/faster than the native Dropbox client (incorporated into File Manager) for browsing files and images on Dropbox.

    I also add that, unlike most other Android apps, it loads faster than some native apps!

    Posted via CB10
    05-30-14 05:38 AM
  6. qwerty4ever's Avatar
    I don't know where you got that notion, but Android apps ran headless on BB10 long before native BB10 apps ran headless.

    Notifications are another matter. BB10 obviously does not allow anyone to create "widgets" on a "desktop" and does not contain a customizable "tray" or "bar" like Android does, so there are limits to how far BB10 will ever replicate Android notifications precisely.




    Which is one of the reasons why I don't think BlackBerry will ever agree to join the OHA. May as well just take their toys and go home if they're going to be subject to all of Google's requirements for that now.

    BTW: Nokia X devices apparently are only running Jellybean 4.1.2. And yes, I know they are not part of the OHA.




    I believe they've been doing this since 2012, and not just in Canada.
    I'm not referring to the publicity stunts like "48 hours of BlackBerry." This needs to be a full-time commitment by BlackBerry with weekly presentations and hands-on development to supplement the material covered by the college instructors. The weekly sessions could be in-person or live video with two conversations.

    Posted via CB10 on BlackBerry Q5
    05-30-14 05:40 AM
  7. anon1727506's Avatar
    Some apps do work really well. I just downloaded the Android Dropbox app from Snap : it has its stutters, but overall is much better/faster than the native Dropbox client (incorporated into File Manager) for browsing files and images on Dropbox.

    I also add that, unlike most other Android apps, it loads faster than some native apps!

    Posted via CB10
    You should also try the Android CrackBerry App....
    05-30-14 11:31 AM
  8. mnc76's Avatar
    As for Android performance : why is tumblr so insanely slow? It's so painful to use (and the only native alternative, Trapeze, is way too limited in what it can do).

    Try doing a search in the Android tumblr app : there is like a 5-10 second delay between when you touch anything and when the app actually responds.

    The level of stuttering and delay that occurs for literally any action you want to perform is unbelievable. Watching paint dry is faster than waiting for the GIFs to load.

    Some Android apps (like Dropbox and Feedly) have very good network io, others (like tumblr) seem to download data at 1 tenth the speed of your actual connection speed. Some pictures simply never load... no matter how long you wait.

    Until BlackBerry fixes crazy slow performance issues like this on the vast majority of popular Android apps, I think it's a bad idea to promote Android on BB10. The user experience is unacceptably poor.

    Any who: My 2 cent rant LOL

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by mnc76; 05-31-14 at 03:12 AM.
    05-31-14 02:51 AM
  9. JeepBB's Avatar
    As for Android performance : why is tumblr so insanely slow? It's so painful to use (and the only native alternative, Trapeze, is way too limited in what it can do).

    ...

    Until BlackBerry fixes crazy slow performance issues like this on the vast majority of popular Android apps, I think it's a bad idea to promote Android on BB10. The user experience is unacceptably poor.

    Any who: My 2 cent rant LOL

    Posted via CB10
    I reckon you're not alone in thinking that.

    Many seem to depend on running Android apps under the BB10 runtime because the native app either doesn't exist or the native faux-app is too limited.

    And hoping for an influx of native apps anytime soon is a pipe-dream IMO. After 18 months of BB10 and its limited sales success, if Devs haven't built a native app yet, given the future prospects for seeing a return on their development effort, they likely never will. So, Android apps are likely to remain the only game in town.

    Much as the BB10 Hub is a nice feature to have, to paraphrase Bill Clinton: "It's the ecosystem, stupid!".

    There's another trending thread about Chen's curious "I can't comment on that" response to being asked whether BB would build an Android phone. So maybe BB's answer to "crazy slow performance issues" on the Android runtime under BB10 is to remove the BB10 element?

    As so many here seem to rely on Android apps to get stuff done, but apparently like BB10, if that rumour comes to pass I see heartache and difficult decisions for many here.
    05-31-14 03:53 AM
  10. lawguyman's Avatar
    As for Android performance : why is tumblr so insanely slow? It's so painful to use (and the only native alternative, Trapeze, is way too limited in what it can do).

    Try doing a search in the Android tumblr app : there is like a 5-10 second delay between when you touch anything and when the app actually responds.

    The level of stuttering and delay that occurs for literally any action you want to perform is unbelievable. Watching paint dry is faster than waiting for the GIFs to load.

    Some Android apps (like Dropbox and Feedly) have very good network io, others (like tumblr) seem to download data at 1 tenth the speed of your actual connection speed. Some pictures simply never load... no matter how long you wait.

    Until BlackBerry fixes crazy slow performance issues like this on the vast majority of popular Android apps, I think it's a bad idea to promote Android on BB10. The user experience is unacceptably poor.

    Any who: My 2 cent rant LOL

    Posted via CB10
    There are still performance issues on 10.3 with some apps and these need to be fixed. But, I have made an effort to try many apps and almost all of them work and of those that work, only a smaller percentage have performance issues. Most apps feel native.

    Still, I would not advertise it until the experience is perfect.

    Posted via CB10
    05-31-14 06:57 AM
  11. DS1331's Avatar
    Apparently people don't want Android apps. They want native BB10 apps. So why bother with Android runtime at all?

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    Lol do you realize how much 8.5 % of all android phones is? Yeah count that one and get back lol

    Posted via CB10
    05-31-14 08:36 AM
  12. DS1331's Avatar
    Apparently people don't want Android apps. They want native BB10 apps. So why bother with Android runtime at all?

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    Because after 2 years everyone also realized that native BlackBerry apps aren't going to happen, so they have to make us happy somehow, android runtime support seems to be doing the trick

    Posted via CB10
    05-31-14 08:36 AM
  13. JeepBB's Avatar
    Because after 2 years everyone also realized that native BlackBerry apps aren't going to happen, so they have to make us happy somehow, android runtime support seems to be doing the trick

    Posted via CB10
    Read up this thread (and the many, many others on the same topic)... there doesn't seem to be unbounded happiness over the level of performance and coverage of the Android ecosystem.

    Slow and with incomplete functionality ... Is my take-away from those reports of apps running under the BB10 runtime.

    The (leaked) 10.3 runtime may be better, but until the answer to the question: "Can BB10 run (insert any Top-50 Android app)?" is an unequivocal "yes" ... without caveats about this or that feature not working, or notifications only working if the app is active, or ignoring the error messages, etc, etc ... then I doubt that'll ever be enough for potential buyers. General "Joe Average" consumers won't put up with such nonsense!

    I'm always surprised by what I see in these forums as a general feeling of the Android runtime being the saviour of BB10. I don't believe that it is.

    Even ignoring the elephant in the room that is google play services, I doubt it can ever be developed to the point of universally answering "yes" to the question above, and has simultaneously reduced the chances that Devs will bring native apps to BB10.
    05-31-14 09:24 AM
  14. Banco's Avatar
    Read up this thread (and the many, many others on the same topic)... there doesn't seem to be unbounded happiness over the level of performance and coverage of the Android ecosystem.

    Slow and with incomplete functionality ... Is my take-away from those reports of apps running under the BB10 runtime.

    The (leaked) 10.3 runtime may be better, but until the answer to the question: "Can BB10 run (insert any Top-50 Android app)?" is an unequivocal "yes" ... without caveats about this or that feature not working, or notifications only working if the app is active, or ignoring the error messages, etc, etc ... then I doubt that'll ever be enough for potential buyers. General "Joe Average" consumers won't put up with such nonsense!

    I'm always surprised by what I see in these forums as a general feeling of the Android runtime being the saviour of BB10. I don't believe that it is.

    Even ignoring the elephant in the room that is google play services, I doubt it can ever be developed to the point of universally answering "yes" to the question above, and has simultaneously reduced the chances that Devs will bring native apps to BB10.

    People on this forum will moan about everything. Absolutely everything. If something doesn't work, then they'll complain long and loud about it.

    Some Android apps don't work on some Android phones either. I've installed a few from Snap and from Amazon, and they've been absolutely fine.

    Google Services is no more an issue for BB10 than it is for a Kindle Fire. For some reason BlackBerry is always held to an entirely different standard, and if it's not amaaaaaazing beyond all comparison, the reaction is that it's a disaster.

    Posted via CB10
    Thunderbuck and LuvULongTime like this.
    05-31-14 09:51 AM
  15. JeepBB's Avatar
    People on this forum will moan about everything. Absolutely everything. If something doesn't work, then they'll complain long and loud about it.

    Some Android apps don't work on some Android phones either. I've installed a few from Snap and from Amazon, and they've been absolutely fine.

    Google Services is no more an issue for BB10 than it is for a Kindle Fire. For some reason BlackBerry is always held to an entirely different standard, and if it's not amaaaaaazing beyond all comparison, the reaction is that it's a disaster.

    Posted via CB10
    Good, good... so, nothing to see here then?

    Pheww, if it's just down to a few malcontents needlessly complaining then you've put my mind at rest.

    Using the Kindle Fire to defend BB10 is a little strange. Amazon sell the Kf at cost I read, and it's a poor seller.

    I don't hold BB to a different standard. I believe I have the same expectation of BB's products as I do of every other product that I might consider buying. I expect them to work as advertised - if they don't, I return them, and tell all my friends. I kind of think I'm like most folks in that regard.
    05-31-14 10:05 AM
  16. Banco's Avatar
    Good, good... so, nothing to see here then?

    Pheww, if it's just down to a few malcontents needlessly complaining then you've put my mind at rest.

    Using the Kindle Fire to defend BB10 is a little strange. Amazon sell the Kf at cost I read, and it's a poor seller.

    I don't hold BB to a different standard. I believe I have the same expectation of BB's products as I do of every other product that I might consider buying. I expect them to work as advertised - if they don't, I return them, and tell all my friends. I kind of think I'm like most folks in that regard.
    The point about the Kindle Fire is that no one ever says there is a shortage of apps on it. It's not one of the criticisms yet it is in the same position.

    You are the one who went on about BB10 performing poorly with Android apps. It doesn't.

    Posted via CB10
    05-31-14 10:18 AM
  17. Raestloz's Avatar
    I actually don't see why there should be a difference in whether an app is native or not.

    An app is an app is an app. The only difference between Android and native right now is the performance and looks. If the app works, what was it written in hardly matters.

    This is not like a cookie that was baked in the same container that holds peanuts

    Z10 STL100-1/10.2.1.2141
    goku_vegeta likes this.
    05-31-14 11:05 AM
  18. goku_vegeta's Avatar
    I actually don't see why there should be a difference in whether an app is native or not.

    An app is an app is an app. The only difference between Android and native right now is the performance and looks. If the app works, what was it written in hardly matters.

    This is not like a cookie that was baked in the same container that holds peanuts

    Z10 STL100-1/10.2.1.2141
    Finally someone with little bit of logic.

    Posted via CB10
    05-31-14 11:27 AM
  19. Raestloz's Avatar
    Finally someone with little bit of logic.

    Posted via CB10
    Yeah, I've been looking for native apps ever since BlackBerry 10 came out, but I've been sideloading LINE and it's been working well enough. In this case, be it Android port or not, long as it does its job well and conforms to BlackBerry's standards, why not?

    What's wrong with Android apps?

    Note:
    I'm talking about apps that are written to run on and play nice with BlackBerry's Android runtime, not Android apps that are in Google Play and can barely run on BlackBerry 10.



    Z10 STL100-1/10.2.1.2141
    05-31-14 11:38 AM
  20. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    I have more native apps than Android apps, but Android apps play a critical role in my overall BlackBerry experience, so I see some form of Android support to be essential.

    And while Google Services may never be licensed to BlackBerry, perhaps there could be a BlackBerry "port plus" option where Android apks could be slightly modified to substitute in a BlackBerry services feature.

    I believe the combo of BB10 and Android compatible apps would be more powerful than Android alone, but only if done right. And I wonder if the low-spec internals of BlackBerry devices is partially to blame for performance problems running some Android apps?

    The BlackBerry ecosystem has both quality and quantity problems. Lately popular apps like Sayit have seemingly been abandoned. Third party BlackBerry apps rarely are as good as official apps, and many devs don't even support landscape orientation in BlackBerry apps.

    Posted via Z-10 100-3 running10.3.0.296/442 hybrid
    LuvULongTime likes this.
    05-31-14 11:54 AM
  21. mnc76's Avatar
    Even with the issues. I'm happy to have the runtime. I've found quite a few apps that fill gaps in the native ecosystem and have acceptable performance.

    Apps like Netflix, Feedly, Backgrounds HD, PicsArt, #SquareDroid, Waze, Google Maps, and BeyondPod I use all the time and run acceptably.

    Yes, the slow apps stick out like a sore thumb, but I'd rather see BlackBerry continue to improve the runtime rather than not have it.

    So I'm glad to have the runtime even if I don't believe it's "ready for primetime" yet. It's still at a "Preview" level for me -- but a Preview level that is very useful even with its issues.

    Posted via CB10
    05-31-14 12:52 PM
  22. JeepBB's Avatar
    Even with the issues. I'm happy to have the runtime. I've found quite a few apps that fill gaps in the native ecosystem and have acceptable performance.

    Apps like Netflix, Feedly, Backgrounds HD, PicsArt, #SquareDroid, Waze, Google Maps, and BeyondPod I use all the time and run acceptably.

    Yes, the slow apps stick out like a sore thumb, but I'd rather see BlackBerry continue to improve the runtime rather than not have it.

    So I'm glad to have the runtime even if I don't believe it's "ready for primetime" yet. It's still at a "Preview" level for me -- but a Preview level that is very useful even with its issues.
    Yes, but you are a BB fan... which is OK, you're among friends.

    And, whilst I'm delighted that, for you, the Android runtime seems to be "acceptable" (I think the expression I'm looking for here might be: "damning with faint praise" ) yet you don't believe that it's "ready for primetime". So, what conclusion do you think the average Joe/Jolene would come to about BB10 runtime readiness, especially after Chen's 98% Android compatibility statement has built expectations?

    If they spent their hard-earned money on a BB10 handset, how would the reality of running and obtaining Android apps be for them do you think? Do you reckon the BB10 Hub and limited Android app availability/functionality would be enough?

    I don't believe they'd be happy, and might even think they'd been oversold something.
    05-31-14 01:29 PM
  23. mnc76's Avatar
    Yes, but you are a BB fan... which is OK, you're among friends.

    And, whilst I'm delighted that, for you, the Android runtime seems to be "acceptable" (I think the expression I'm looking for here might be: "damning with faint praise" ) yet you don't believe that it's "ready for primetime". So, what conclusion do you think the average Joe/Jolene would come to about BB10 runtime readiness, especially after Chen's 98% Android compatibility statement has built expectations?

    If they spent their hard-earned money on a BB10 handset, how would the reality of running and obtaining Android apps be for them do you think? Do you reckon the BB10 Hub and limited Android app availability/functionality would be enough?

    I don't believe they'd be happy, and might even think they'd been oversold something.
    I would not recommend it to someone whose main goal was to run the latest apps.

    However, my GF runs her own daycare (and she is currently expanding) and I see that she uses her phone 95% of the time responding to emails from her staff, parents, and banks. She also uses IM, and does a lot of Web browsing (e.g.: for kids toys, books, etc... to stock the daycares), etc... She uses her phone to run her business and doesn't spend much time perusing app stores.

    For her use, I'd definitely suggest a Z30 to organize her work communications: she loves the fact the z30 has a big screen, the keyboard is close to perfect, it has long battery life, she has the ability to see all her email attachments organized by date, Priority Hub (she's on tons of mailing lists and would love to separate urgent business emails from them), "pinch" email filter, checking and jumping into notifications from the lock screen, appointment reminders in the hub, etc...

    However, often some app becomes a fad and she likes to jump on the bandwagon for a while (LOL), so for that, the runtime is useful (she'll use the app for a few weeks and then forget about it). Also, the Z30 runs Android apps better than my Z10.

    So the runtime compliments what BB10 has. She can satisfy her work needs, but also doesn't have to "miss out".

    If she mainly wanted the latest apps and didn't have her business needs, then I couldn't recommend BB10. But as it turns out, she is a "natural" for what BB10 has to offer.

    As the runtime and native OS features improve, the case for BB10 will only get better.


    Posted via CB10
    05-31-14 02:04 PM
  24. mnc76's Avatar
    I'll add that she currently uses a Windows Phone. I think Windows phone users are prime candidates for conversion to BB10.

    They also have a weak app ecosystem, so coming to BB10 (with the runtime) may in some cases be a step up in app selection.

    I think BB10 is a better OS than WP (and I have real reasons behind this belief -- I'm totally not irrationally hating on WP! ), and with the combination of the native app store and Android support, they would get a better overall experience than WP.

    (yes WP has more "big name" apps written by the original developers, but many are no better than the 3rd party versions on BB10. As an example: iGrann is better (has more features) than the WP Instagram client -- and the WP version was written by Instagram themselves!)

    Posted via CB10
    05-31-14 02:21 PM
  25. kbz1960's Avatar
    I'll add that she currently uses a Windows Phone. I think Windows phone users are prime candidates for conversion to BB10.

    They also have a weak app ecosystem, so coming to BB10 (with the runtime) may in some cases be a step up in app selection.

    I think BB10 is a better OS than WP (and I have real reasons behind this belief -- I'm totally not irrationally hating on WP! ), and with the combination of the native app store and Android support, they would get a better overall experience than WP.

    (yes WP has more "big name" apps written by the original developers, but many are no better than the 3rd party versions on BB10. As an example: iGrann is better (has more features) than the WP Instagram client -- and the WP version was written by Instagram themselves!)

    Posted via CB10
    Do you have 8.1 on it? I hear there is a lot of improvements.
    05-31-14 03:50 PM
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