06-27-14 05:22 AM
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  1. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    That's kind of what I alluded to earlier. While the human aspect sucks, Chen would look like a hero to Wall Street if he can trim BlackBerry's headcount by another 25%.
    When Chen has repeatedly--and recently--said they've hit bottom as far as headcount goes, it would be a major reversal to concede that they're letting go of another 2k.

    The past 3 years have taught me that when it comes to BlackBerry, you can never say "the bleeding has stopped", but if this report is true then that can only mean that things are truly catastrophic.
    mornhavon and Dave Bourque like this.
    06-15-14 01:30 AM
  2. crazigee's Avatar
    When Chen has repeatedly--and recently--said they've hit bottom as far as headcount goes, it would be a major reversal to concede that they're letting go of another 2k.

    The past 3 years have taught me that when it comes to BlackBerry, you can never say "the bleeding has stopped", but if this report is true then that can only mean that things are truly catastrophic.
    I'm with you on this. There a different between trimming to cut excess fat and increase profits and cutting to slow the bleeding.

    If Wall Street reacts in a positive fashion to this I'll be shocked. I'm betting that when this is officially announced or the rumor hits mainstream that BlackBerry stock will fall.

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    06-15-14 07:04 AM
  3. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    I'm with you on this. There a different between trimming to cut excess fat and increase profits and cutting to slow the bleeding.

    If Wall Street reacts in a positive fashion to this I'll be shocked. I'm betting that when this is officially announced or the rumor hits mainstream that BlackBerry stock will fall.

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    And the thing is, it's actually still early days for Chen. BB just took out more debt from Fairfax a while back, and with the Z3 just coming out I had the impression that expectations were relatively low for THIS quarter, but that they'd be higher for next quarter. I'm frankly surprised to see a rumor like this now, because to me it suggests that they've had absolutely no traction whatsoever on the Enterprise side.

    Again, that may not be impossible, but to my mind it would mean that they've fallen WAAAAY short of whatever meager targets you would expect them to set under these circumstances.
    06-15-14 08:04 PM
  4. birdman_38's Avatar
    This is all mere speculation. We'll find out for sure Thursday morning.
    06-15-14 11:43 PM
  5. Munx's Avatar
    The 2000 cuts are the dev relations peeps. So JC has an app plan.

    New 2000 cut + new app solution = major win for BBRY. Wallstreet will rejoice.

    Posted via CB10
    06-16-14 12:26 AM
  6. Solar 77's Avatar
    The 2000 cuts are the dev relations peeps. So JC has an app plan.

    New 2000 cut + new app solution = major win for BBRY. Wallstreet will rejoice.

    Posted via CB10
    Would you have a link on this?

    Posted via CB10
    06-16-14 01:05 AM
  7. Dave Bourque's Avatar
    Would you have a link on this?

    Posted via CB10
    Pure bs speculation

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.3175
    06-16-14 01:13 AM
  8. crazigee's Avatar
    The 2000 cuts are the dev relations peeps. So JC has an app plan.

    New 2000 cut + new app solution = major win for BBRY. Wallstreet will rejoice.

    Posted via CB10
    If you think that laying off 2000 people or 25% of the workforce is a win for BlackBerry you clearly don't know much about how the market works.

    If Wall Street (yes it's two words) rejoices I'll dance a jig in the middle of Main Street.

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    JeepBB and mornhavon like this.
    06-16-14 05:02 AM
  9. Raestloz's Avatar
    I say, laying off the ENTIRE team may not be a stellar idea. It may very well be good enough. That is, if they also replace them with some other people. Current dev relations may be toast, but you need some of those to keep the devs around.

    Z10 STL100-1/10.2.1.3175
    06-16-14 05:18 AM
  10. anon1727506's Avatar
    I say, laying off the ENTIRE team may not be a stellar idea. It may very well be good enough. That is, if they also replace them with some other people. Current dev relations may be toast, but you need some of those to keep the devs around.

    Z10 STL100-1/10.2.1.3175
    That's the point.... IF they are going another route, they don't need native developers so they don't need any one to support them.

    If there is a Google deal in the works..... (big if). BlackBerry will either have full Android or a hybrid - but the hybrid will be for security and maybe a few basic apps, but 3rd party apps will all be Android.

    Posted via Android CrackBerry App
    06-16-14 06:01 AM
  11. birdman_38's Avatar
    If you think that laying off 2000 people or 25% of the workforce is a win for BlackBerry you clearly don't know much about how the market works.

    If Wall Street (yes it's two words) rejoices I'll dance a jig in the middle of Main Street.
    Make sure you get it on video!
    06-16-14 06:31 AM
  12. crazigee's Avatar
    Make sure you get it on video!
    Will do.

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    06-16-14 10:05 AM
  13. allengeorge's Avatar
    Thinking about it, the issue isn't with the (rumored) cuts, per se - it's the opacity surrounding native development's future. The reactions to Chen's demurral on the Android phone, the sense that native developers are being ignored, the lack of visibility, roadmap and blog posts re: the native roadmap simply add to speculation that the native SDKs are going to be dropped in favor of Android. It's this vacuum regarding future direction that causes all the hysteria.
    06-16-14 11:07 AM
  14. Dave Bourque's Avatar
    Thinking about it, the issue isn't with the (rumored) cuts, per se - it's the opacity surrounding native development's future. The reactions to Chen's demurral on the Android phone, the sense that native developers are being ignored, the lack of visibility, roadmap and blog posts re: the native roadmap simply add to speculation that the native SDKs are going to be dropped in favor of Android. It's this vacuum regarding future direction that causes all the hysteria.
    The roadmap was always limited... when 10.2 was the roadmap we had no sign of 10.3.... it means nothing.

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.3175
    06-16-14 11:31 AM
  15. crazigee's Avatar
    The roadmap was always limited... when 10.2 was the roadmap we had no sign of 10.3.... it means nothing.

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.3175
    You're right. The road map isn't relevant.

    With regard to EOL, BlackBerry are going to stop supporting the first BB10 devices at some point. That's inevitable.

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    06-16-14 01:12 PM
  16. allengeorge's Avatar
    That's fair - if you assume that native development will always be supported. The concern is that it's going to silently die.

    Posted via CB10
    06-16-14 02:15 PM
  17. Munx's Avatar
    JC will not lay be laying off 2000 people, essentially shuttering an entire department, without addressing the services that department currently provides.

    Those thinking that he is going to hack another 2000 jobs and shut down dev relations as an isolated cost cutting effort are missing that JC has recently made public statements that no further cuts beyond those identified last year were planned. If on Thursday he BlackBerry does indeed announce 2000 additional cuts, as rumored, then it will only be a result of him securing a new agreement to allow him to make these cuts (ie Google Play, or another third party app solution).

    And yes Crazigee, both Wall Street and Bay Street will rejoice if this is the case.

    Posted via CB10
    06-16-14 02:28 PM
  18. crazigee's Avatar
    JC will not lay be laying off 2000 people, essentially shuttering an entire department, without addressing the services that department currently provides.

    Those thinking that he is going to hack another 2000 jobs and shut down dev relations as an isolated cost cutting effort are missing that JC has recently made public statements that no further cuts beyond those identified last year were planned. If on Thursday he BlackBerry does indeed announce 2000 additional cuts, as rumored, then it will only be a result of him securing a new agreement to allow him to make these cuts (ie Google Play, or another third party app solution).

    And yes Crazigee, both Wall Street and Bay Street will rejoice if this is the case.

    Posted via CB10
    If BlackBerry closes up that day I'll accept your statement. Since I happen to know a thing or two about markets and how they react to news such as this, I'm not worried that I will have to humiliate myself dancing in the street.

    When BlackBerry stock closes down what are you prepared to do as penance?

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    06-16-14 06:09 PM
  19. Munx's Avatar
    As you speak with certainty when it comes to your knowledge of market moves, I suggest I know quite a bit more than you. One thing in particular being humility. The markets are a great teacher.

    When it comes to the stock going up or down post earnings, there are a myriad of factors that may move the price. The rumoured 2000 person cut but being only one of them. Revenue projects and general indications of the turn around going as planned, or better that planned, will be other key factors. Google Play would be very welcomed news as well.

    Good luck crazigee. With great risk come great reward.

    Posted via CB10
    06-16-14 06:23 PM
  20. crazigee's Avatar
    As you speak with certainty when it comes to your knowledge of market moves, I suggest I know quite a bit more than you. One thing in particular being humility. The markets are a great teacher.

    When it comes to the stock going up or down post earnings, there are a myriad of factors that may move the price. The rumoured 2000 person cut but being only one of them. Revenue projects and general indications of the turn around going as planned, or better that planned, will be other key factors. Google Play would be very welcomed news as well.

    Good luck crazigee. With great risk come great reward.

    Posted via CB10
    OK. Looking at past layoffs at BlackBerry it doesn't seem that the market "rejoiced". Past behavior of the market is a good indicator of future behavior.

    I would also point out that your only evidence is that you "think" John Chen has a plan. You're only evidence of this plan is that you "believe" he wouldn't layoff that many people without a plan.

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    06-16-14 07:21 PM
  21. Munx's Avatar
    I don't think you can find correlation between previous BBRY layoffs and stock price. Second, historic performance is an incredibly poor indicator of future behaviour in this circumstance - and debatable in many other circumstances (Dogs of Dow, etc).

    Posted via CB10
    06-16-14 10:38 PM
  22. crazigee's Avatar
    I don't think you can find correlation between previous BBRY layoffs and stock price. Second, historic performance is an incredibly poor indicator of future behaviour in this circumstance - and debatable in many other circumstances (Dogs of Dow, etc).

    Posted via CB10
    You're right that historic performance isn't an indicator of general performance in the future. However, with regard to a specific historic event it is a very good indicator with regard to the same issue. So looking at the way the market reacted to previous layoffs is a very good indicator of how they will react to future layoffs.

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    06-17-14 05:53 AM
  23. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. Cutting an entire department making up 25% of your workforce is significan
    Developer relations is not 25% of BlackBerry's workforce. Never was. I'd be surprised if it's even 75 people at this point.
    06-17-14 06:14 AM
  24. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    The same patents that nobody wanted when BlackBerry explored selling the company?
    I don't think the patents were the problem in a BlackBerry sale, but rather the hardware business.

    Exclusive: BlackBerry board rejected proposals to break up company - sources | Reuters
    06-17-14 06:15 AM
  25. HabsSuck's Avatar
    BlackBerry has stated they will bring employee count to around 7,000 March 2014 FT count was 8,057 so the rumored cut could be from the already communicated job reductions

    Posted via BlackBerry Z30
    06-17-14 06:24 AM
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