06-27-14 06:22 AM
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  1. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    Thank you. Very informative.

    Most telling is the quote

    “Every time I say it’s done, somebody in my organization shows me it’s not done,” Chen said of the layoffs.
    Nice to know he's not making cuts, but instead is saying "Get the job done or I'll replace you." Something sorely needed.
    JeepBB and techvisor like this.
    06-25-14 12:53 PM
  2. JeepBB's Avatar
    Thank you. Very informative.

    Most telling is the quote

    Nice to know he's not making cuts, but instead is saying "Get the job done or I'll replace you." Something sorely needed.
    And, it occurs to me that that same quote is Chen's "get out of jail free" card.

    He can honestly say that BB is down to a handful of cuts... Until some minion points out another area that needs culling... And another handful leave... And so it goes...

    Whether all these handfuls will ultimately amount to 2,000 employees, I don't know.

    What I do know is that this rumour has passed every test so far, so we'll see if the 3rd part comes true too.
    06-25-14 01:51 PM
  3. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    Absolutely, Chen has left himself some wiggle room, but to say "cuts are largely done" one week and cut 25% of his workforce within a couple of weeks, that's a severe hit to credibility not just with employees but also with suppliers, customers, and investors.

    This is NOT in the same context as Heins bragging about glowing sales; without numbers everyone knows that's an empty boast.

    One would expect Chen to warn that there is still the chance for significant cuts if the company was downsizing before the end of calendar 2014.

    Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7
    06-25-14 02:13 PM
  4. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Absolutely, Chen has left himself some wiggle room, but to say "cuts are largely done" one week and cut 25% of his workforce within a couple of weeks, that's a severe hit to credibility not just with employees but also with suppliers, customers, and investors.

    This is NOT in the same context as Heins bragging about glowing sales; without numbers everyone knows that's an empty boast.

    One would expect Chen to warn that there is still the chance for significant cuts if the company was downsizing before the end of calendar 2014.

    Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7
    At least quote me...
    Or don't you like me anymore?
    Well, thinking about it, you probably never liked me to begin with

    BlackBerry's target of 10M smartphone sales a year, is a huge indication that their downsizing hasn't stopped.
    The way I see it, BlackBerry themselves don't know how many employees they exactly need...
    So cutting another 2000 jobs seems very reasonable when they realised that they just don't need that staff, for selling 10M phones a year.

    As BlackBerry underwent a huge restructuring (maybe you prefer another formulation) it would make sense for them not knowing exactly how many employees they need, as they didn't have enough data about their current and future workload.

    Apart from that, Chen's comment still holds true, when we use the BlackBerry from before T.Heins took over.
    Compared to that time, firing another 2000 employees "isn't that much".

    Posted via CB10
    06-25-14 02:43 PM
  5. RubberChicken76's Avatar

    He can honestly say that BB is down to a handful of cuts... Until some minion points out another area that needs culling... And another handful leave... And so it goes...
    That sounds like normal business. My last three companies would do that all the time. They weren't doing an "Oh crap - we didn't hit our numbers, we need to cut 15% to stay alive" cuts, but rather, "This team is redundant and other areas are fully staffed. Thanks for your service" cuts.

    One company I was at was blunt internally and externally. "We're done with the mass layoffs, but we'll continue to refine and prune the business in order to make sure we're as efficient as we need to be at achieving our goals"

    I don't think it's some sinister plot to quietly have 2500 people vanish without informing the shareholders.
    06-25-14 07:44 PM
  6. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    At least quote me...
    Or don't you like me anymore?
    Well, thinking about it, you probably never liked me to begin with

    BlackBerry's target of 10M smartphone sales a year, is a huge indication that their downsizing hasn't stopped.
    The way I see it, BlackBerry themselves don't know how many employees they exactly need...
    So cutting another 2000 jobs seems very reasonable when they realised that they just don't need that staff, for selling 10M phones a year.

    As BlackBerry underwent a huge restructuring (maybe you prefer another formulation) it would make sense for them not knowing exactly how many employees they need, as they didn't have enough data about their current and future workload.

    Apart from that, Chen's comment still holds true, when we use the BlackBerry from before T.Heins took over.
    Compared to that time, firing another 2000 employees "isn't that much".

    Posted via CB10
    I will quote you this time and OF COURSE I like you :-)

    They just turned a marginal profit. BB10 sales are actually growing (the Z3 is one BlackBerry I know I'll never own, but it will save the company).

    They're not losing 25% of their workforce before the end of 2014.

    Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    06-26-14 02:19 AM
  7. crazigee's Avatar
    I will quote you this time and OF COURSE I like you :-)

    They just turned a marginal profit. BB10 sales are actually growing (the Z3 is one BlackBerry I know I'll never own, but it will save the company).

    They're not losing 25% of their workforce before the end of 2014.

    Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7
    I don't see the Z3 saving BlackBerry, but maybe I'm just more skeptical than you.

    Posted using my Z10 via CB10
    06-26-14 11:14 AM
  8. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    I don't see the Z3 saving BlackBerry, but maybe I'm just more skeptical than you.
    I don't think any one thing is going to save them, nor do I think Chen believes any one thing is going to either. To me, the Z3 has a couple of specific purposes

    - It tests the model of having someone else produce the hardware for lower margins but lower risk
    - It brings in a more entry level phone for emerging and low-end markets to replace the Curve business than Q5 was able to provide
    - It brings the potential to grow the BlackBerry 10 base at perhaps a higher rate than the Z10 and Q10 were able to provide.

    I don't think it's intended to be a "company saver" at all, but rather to fill some specific leaks in the boat.
    howarmat and Vorkosigan like this.
    06-26-14 12:58 PM
  9. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    I don't think any one thing is going to save them, nor do I think Chen believes any one thing is going to either. To me, the Z3 has a couple of specific purposes

    - It tests the model of having someone else produce the hardware for lower margins but lower risk
    - It brings in a more entry level phone for emerging and low-end markets to replace the Curve business than Q5 was able to provide
    - It brings the potential to grow the BlackBerry 10 base at perhaps a higher rate than the Z10 and Q10 were able to provide.

    I don't think it's intended to be a "company saver" at all, but rather to fill some specific leaks in the boat.
    Yeah, you've nailed it. The Z3 will be minimal profit, but it will grow the ecosystem nicely.
    06-26-14 04:48 PM
  10. birdman_38's Avatar
    How many employees do you need to sell 10M phones?

    I'd say that cutting another 2000 jobs (or how many there will actually be) won't hurt if you only want to sell 10M phones a year.
    Keep in mind that BlackBerry's 7200 employees serve four divisions. It's not all about phones anymore.
    RubberChicken76 likes this.
    06-27-14 01:14 AM
  11. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Keep in mind that BlackBerry's 7200 employees serve four divisions. It's not all about phones anymore.
    Just wondering:
    How many employees does Apple have?
    Retail staff included. Anyone having a current number floating around?

    And yes, you are correct, it's not only phones.
    But selling less of your past "bread and butter product" usually also means that you sell less of your other products.
    So you have to scale back overall in terms of employees, not only the ones being used in the cell-phone division.

    Posted via CB10
    06-27-14 04:07 AM
  12. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Just wondering:
    How many employees does Apple have?
    Retail staff included. Anyone having a current number floating around?
    80,300 with more than half of those working in the Apple Stores.

    Apple - Job Creation
    http://www.macrumors.com/2013/10/30/...ores-and-more/
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    06-27-14 06:22 AM
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