04-17-15 02:03 AM
137 ... 456
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  1. CecilTsunami's Avatar
    Not sure why anyone thinks using your phone to pay for stuff is a good idea. There's no anonymity. Just use cash. I guess people don't care about financial privacy any more ...
    I submit all my purchase data to Nielsen Home Scan anyway. For what I buy using my phone, I could care less. Coffee, donuts and sandwiches. It's just convenient.

    Posted via CB10
    01-24-15 12:16 PM
  2. grahamf's Avatar
    Actually the NFC SIM is NOT required for the Tim Hortons' Timmyme app. But that's an entirely different app, which is linked to Tim Cards with a defined value.
    Posted via CB10
    Yeah I have it on my phone and it works great.

    I honestly don't believe we actually need the carrier's intervention. It makes sense for Android phones that are easily rooted and hacked byt the owner, but Blackberry is secure enough that it doesn't need a special sim, just an encrypted connection to the bank. I really hope Blackberry comes out with their own Blackberry Pay system, which is built into the OS and keeps the card information in an secure encrypted location.
    01-24-15 02:38 PM
  3. Lumute's Avatar
    Ok, i went back to my Z10 and using WiFi removed my cards from my wallet and uninstalled the RBC app. Then on the Passport deleted the app and installed again and was now able to add the cards, NFC payments with RBC are now working just fine!!!! Even thought the app is not officially supported and not optimized for the screen, but works...

    The problem is that the passport uses a different SIM (nano) so when changing sims you need to remove the cards on the old phone with the old SIM inserted (does not matter if you don't have mobile service anymore, you can do it with WiFi). Then add them on the new phone with the new SIM. Do not forget to destroy your old SIM once this is done...

    Posted via CB10
    timboalogo and bribert like this.
    01-24-15 03:06 PM
  4. timboalogo's Avatar
    Yeah I have it on my phone and it works great.

    I honestly don't believe we actually need the carrier's intervention. It makes sense for Android phones that are easily rooted and hacked byt the owner, but Blackberry is secure enough that it doesn't need a special sim, just an encrypted connection to the bank. I really hope Blackberry comes out with their own Blackberry Pay system, which is built into the OS and keeps the card information in an secure encrypted location.
    There is no data being exchanged during a tap to pay purchase other than what's stored on the Secure Element (SE) section if the NFC SIM card. And that data is simply the same as the chip in an NFC chipped credit card (they're are not very popular at all in the USA yet, but essentially all Canadian credit cards have them). So whether BlackBerry has a secure or encrypted connection is irrelevant to the way these mobile payment systems work. Indeed, according to their website, Ugo can be used without an active data connection.

    The Apple system is different and does require a data connection to work as it uses one time tokens to authenticate that what's stored on the SE in an iPhone 6 (which is NOT SIM based). To clarify, the actual credit card NFC info is not stored on the iPhone's SE, only a unique Apple code that requires a one (or at most a few) use token sent from Apple to work.

    The SE section of the NFC SIM card has the credit card data added to it (called provisioning) when you add your credit card to the app. And that's when you have to have the involvement of both the carrier and the bank: The bank sends the info to provision you NFC SIM via the carrier's network, all under the auspices of the Trusted Service Manager (TSM) who is the company that runs the app and supplies back end support (Ugo, in my phone's case).

    EDIT: I maybe not quite accurate saying Applepay needs a data connection. I understand through reading some industry info that tokens must be sent for each transaction, or maybe for a few transactions. But I'm not totally clear how Apple does this.



    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by timboalogo; 01-24-15 at 08:55 PM.
    01-24-15 08:05 PM
  5. grahamf's Avatar
    There is no data being exchanged during a tap to pay purchase other than what's stored on the Secure Element (SE) section if the NFC SIM card. And that data is simply the same as the chip in an NFC chipped credit card (they're are not very popular at all in the USA yet, but essentially all Canadian credit cards have them). So whether BlackBerry has a secure or encrypted connection is irrelevant to the way these mobile payment systems work. Indeed, according to their website, Ugo can be used without an active data connection.
    What I'm referring to is the initial setup of adding the card to the phone. I'd prefer it if the phone could first verify that I own the card I'm adding as opposed to just tapping anyone's card to the phone to add it. But what I'm referring to is that Blackberry doesn't need a SE enabled SIM card as the device itself is secure enough to store the card information.
    01-25-15 12:59 PM
  6. timboalogo's Avatar
    I had to enter my PIN after tapping the card to the phone when adding it to Ugo app. That seems pretty secure.

    I have read a couple of reports that BB10, as well as Android Kitkat, support HCE (Host card emulation), which DOES replace the need for a SE SIM. But at the expense of needing a data connection to download one use or limited use tokens. It would cut the carrier right out of the loop, since the SIM is usually actually owned by the carrier, but is not used by HCE. Carrier would just be needed for token data transmission.

    Posted via CB10
    01-25-15 06:01 PM
  7. Tranamal's Avatar
    Sorry I was not clear. Timmy Card you only need regular sim card with phone that have nfc. But you do need nfc enabled micro sim to use credit card type apps like UGO. And I use both for a while now.

    Two Z10 in this family - Windsor, ON, CA.
    02-14-15 02:51 PM
  8. timboalogo's Avatar
    I just used the Ugo app to pay for pizza delivered to our home. This is the first time I've tried it with a wireless terminal, and it worked flawlessly.

    Posted via CB10
    02-18-15 10:42 PM
  9. bribert's Avatar
    Awesome advise . I've been struggling to get the RB wallet working for months with my Passport. Even replace the Sim card which was NFC enabled anyways. And all I had to do is follow your advise... delete the RB app then reinstall. Thanks.

    Posted via CB10
    04-16-15 09:52 PM
  10. Soapm's Avatar
    Help out some of us slow folks, what is RB? Where do I get it?

    How does pay and tap work? Say at the grocery store, where do you tap your phone?

    Does the pizza guy carry something special, or how did you pay for pizza?

    I was trying to add google wallet to get this working but it seems you guys have the solution. Help me come to the 21st century please?

    Posted via CB10
    04-16-15 10:21 PM
  11. bribert's Avatar
    Help out some of us slow folks, what is RB? Where do I get it?

    How does pay and tap work? Say at the grocery store, where do you tap your phone?

    Does the pizza guy carry something special, or how did you pay for pizza?

    I was trying to add google wallet to get this working but it seems you guys have the solution. Help me come to the 21st century please?

    Posted via CB10
    RB is Royal Bank app (this thread relates to RBC). Works with Bell sims cards that have NFC. It would be equivalent to using an NFC enabled bank card or credit card. Nothing to do with google pay. I hope this helps explain.

    Posted via CB10
    04-16-15 10:44 PM
  12. Soapm's Avatar
    Sorta, so pay and tap is both carrier and bank dependent?

    Anyone know of TMobile software?
    04-17-15 02:03 AM
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