1. Prem WatsApp's Avatar
    Excellent post and excellent move.

    Posted via CB10
    Yep. Return some iPhones for a chenge... :-)

      Passposted while waiting for the Z-lider....  
    05-24-15 04:50 AM
  2. Prem WatsApp's Avatar
    The path to outsourcing their hardware business and diverting money to marketing and software is the right path.

    Posted via CB10
    iPhone is pretty much outsourced, too, apart from software and design... :-)

      Passposted while waiting for the Z-lider....  
    Superfly_FR likes this.
    05-24-15 04:51 AM
  3. lnichols's Avatar
    These articles are not clear at. They are painting a negative picture but in actuality it's a positive outcome. They don't specify that most of these jobs lost are from BlackBerry run factories that is costing them more to produce then by outsourcing to Asian companies with their expertise in manufacturing can produce better and cheaper phones.

    Don't forget our beloved Passport is still made in Mexico which is the last plant that BlackBerry have left. The Passport could be the last phones we will see made in Mexico. Moving forward, the Classic and Leap is now made in China by Foxconn.

    From the beginning when Chen came to power, he made it clear that he was going to shut down all factory and call on Foxconn to make their phones. Now that they eliminated the manufacturing business, they can focus their energy and resources on other important things like sales and marketing.
    You sure the Passport isn't made by Winstom for BlackBerry? Just like the Z30 was made by Jabil for BlackBerry. Winstrom also handled the 9900. BlackBerry has been outsourcing much of the manufacturing for a while.

    Posted via Z30
    05-24-15 05:51 AM
  4. lawguyman's Avatar
    What does hardware team cuts have to do with apps and Android?
    BlackBerry to Lay Off Undisclosed Number of Employees in Device Business - WSJ

    The Wall Street Journal specifically focused on the fact that the cuts are to jobs for smartphone software:

    "BlackBerry Ltd. said Friday it is laying off an undisclosed number of employees in its device business including those focused on development of smartphone software and applications."
    sentimentGX4 likes this.
    05-24-15 07:23 AM
  5. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    iPhone is pretty much outsourced, too, apart from software and design... :-)

    I've heard this before and it always makes me chuckle. There's a lot to go into hardware and software design and usually a lot of bodies. :-)

    It's not like one guy works part time for a month and then outsources all his hard work to thousands of low paid foreign workers to build it :-)
    blackmoe and KR2013 like this.
    05-24-15 07:25 AM
  6. lawguyman's Avatar
    You sure the Passport isn't made by Winstom for BlackBerry? Just like the Z30 was made by Jabil for BlackBerry. Winstrom also handled the 9900. BlackBerry has been outsourcing much of the manufacturing for a while.

    Posted via Z30
    As of a few years ago, I believe that the only hands-on manufacturing that BlackBerry did was in Canada. Everything else was contract manufacturing. As some point I remember the Canadian manufacturing jobs were cut. There may still be some but I don't know.
    05-24-15 07:26 AM
  7. madman0141's Avatar
    Sorry to here more Blackberry employees losing jobs. Can't be good for anyone.
    05-24-15 09:57 AM
  8. Vampiro's Avatar
    I guess there is something more interesting going on at BBRY than most of you state with the "oh no BBRY turns android ", "they will stop being an hardware manufacturer".

    I bet blackberry realized partnership with Foxconn wasn't that helpful but with Samsung even will be better. Samsung gets support for Knox and more security exclusively for their devices and BBRY will therefore get Samsung hardware for cheap price which they can use to put their OS on. That's not only smart but also an really good conclusion why BBRY is cutting down jobs in the hardware department.

    Posted via CB10
    Sulaco757 likes this.
    05-24-15 10:21 AM
  9. RyanGermann's Avatar
    Chen has let the hardware division die by releasing devices few want.
    BB's device sales problems are more about business issues than the devices themselves: the app gap isn't going to disappear overnight, their reputation isn't going recover overnight either, and it seems like Chen has been pursuing other business models including Samsung partnership and Foxconn outsourcing that have yet to bear fruit.

    I would love to see Samsung license all of BB'S tech and go wild: they can afford to take risks, and the downside costs of any risks can be easily absorbed by Sammy not by BlackBerry. BB10 running on a Galaxy Note, WITH the SPen support? An Android portrait slider with the toolbelt and BlackBerry keyboard? Why the hell not? these devices would not sell 40 million per quarter, but I bet they'd sell 10 million per year, and every one would put cash in BB's bank.

    Posted via CB10
    05-24-15 10:36 AM
  10. lnichols's Avatar
    BB's device sales problems are more about business issues than the devices themselves: the app gap isn't going to disappear overnight, their reputation isn't going recover overnight either, and it seems like Chen has been pursuing other business models including Samsung partnership and Foxconn outsourcing that have yet to bear fruit.

    I would love to see Samsung license all of BB'S tech and go wild: they can afford to take risks, and the downside costs of any risks can be easily absorbed by Sammy not by BlackBerry. BB10 running on a Galaxy Note, WITH the SPen support? An Android portrait slider with the toolbelt and BlackBerry keyboard? Why the hell not? these devices would not sell 40 million per quarter, but I bet they'd sell 10 million per year, and every one would put cash in BB's bank.

    Posted via CB10
    They haven't released a phone that a Z user, likely their largest installed base would upgrade to. They took a year to get a Q10 with a tool belt developed and delivered. The Passport while getting attention, isn't selling well. The Leap, well I hope someone committed to buy a lot because it is pretty lame compare to the Z30.

    Posted via Z30
    05-24-15 12:30 PM
  11. KemKev's Avatar
    The company I work for consistently generates record quarterly profits and did let go quite a bit of staff at the end of the last quarter. Without being privy to what Chen and company have in mind, it is interesting to see the range of opinions on the latest round of job cuts. Let the BBRY watch continue.
    techvisor likes this.
    05-24-15 02:50 PM
  12. Soapm's Avatar
    The company I work for consistently generates record quarterly profits and did let go quite a bit of staff at the end of the last quarter. Without being privy to what Chen and company have in mind, it is interesting to see the range of opinions on the latest round of job cuts. Let the BBRY watch continue.
    What is clear is they've outsourced hardware...
    05-24-15 03:23 PM
  13. KemKev's Avatar
    What is clear is they've outsourced hardware...
    I don't see that as a bad thing. If someone else can do it cheaper, why not?
    MarsupilamiX and thymaster like this.
    05-24-15 03:31 PM
  14. qwerty4ever's Avatar
    This is old news and relates to the TAT acquisition a few years back. Unfortunately, TAT turned out to be heavy on talk but light on practical applications.

    Posted via CB10
    Actually BlackBerry deliberately hold back innovation by TAT after the acquisition. Heins was under orders to liquidate the firm's assets and maintain the dog-and-pony show to distract governments in particular about the long-term plan to sell the company. Chen is overseeing the completion of this plan as we have witnessed many companies taking the same route.
    05-24-15 03:43 PM
  15. qwerty4ever's Avatar
    That, or he has just decided to further cut investment in devices. That would be sad because BB10 needs more investment to keep it current.


    If BlackBerry goes full Android I won't be buying any future BlackBerry smartphones.
    Posted via CB10
    05-24-15 03:50 PM
  16. Soapm's Avatar
    I don't see that as a bad thing. If someone else can do it cheaper, why not?
    I didn't say it was good or bad but often you get what you pay for. It's a shame phones are disposable since we pay a premium for them these days...
    05-24-15 04:21 PM
  17. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    What is clear is they've outsourced hardware...
    BB outsourced hardware from the very beginning, as most companies do. Like Apple, BB designed the hardware, but they only had a very small, low-volume production facility near Waterloo that made pre-production prototypes and low-volume production runs - a single-digit percentage of their overall hardware output. All of the rest were outsourced to companies like Jabil Circuit, Wistron, Quanta, and now Foxconn/Hon Hai. BB closed their Waterloo plant in 2013 and sold off the real estate in 2014.

    What has changed is not the manufacturing, but the fact that BB is now having Foxconn do the design work for a few phones (Z3, Leap) as well. The keyboard phones are still being designed in-house, but this recent news is that they are cutting some of that staff, so who knows?

    As far as the "rumor-that-just-won't-die" that Samsung might build BB phones, that is prohibited by the Open Handset Alliance, which bans members from manufacturing phones, for themselves or others, that use non-Google-Certified Android code. BB10 would cause BB phones to fall under that prohibition, so don't hold your breath waiting for Samsung to be designing or building phones for BB (they can sell individual components, though).
    05-24-15 04:48 PM
  18. ArmedHitman's Avatar
    If they only used TAT to their full potential!....
    05-24-15 07:06 PM
  19. Phone Guy 4567's Avatar
    Actually BlackBerry deliberately hold back innovation by TAT after the acquisition. Heins was under orders to liquidate the firm's assets and maintain the dog-and-pony show to distract governments in particular about the long-term plan to sell the company. Chen is overseeing the completion of this plan as we have witnessed many companies taking the same route.
    Heins had a very small window of opportunity to try and make BB10 a success and once that failed the plan was to sell the company. It would already be sold but the offers they did get weren't good so IMHO the board said why rush, since I'm sure many shareholders were already losing a lot of money. Chen's job coming in was to continue to slowly strip down Blackberry to the bare essentials, to make BB look more attractive to a possible buyer, and to sell for the best possible price he can get.
    techvisor likes this.
    05-24-15 08:56 PM
  20. Bold_until_Hybrid_Comes's Avatar
    RIP
    05-24-15 09:38 PM
  21. lnichols's Avatar
    Actually BlackBerry deliberately hold back innovation by TAT after the acquisition. Heins was under orders to liquidate the firm's assets and maintain the dog-and-pony show to distract governments in particular about the long-term plan to sell the company. Chen is overseeing the completion of this plan as we have witnessed many companies taking the same route.
    Source? Just curious. It does seem very plausible though. I hope if this was the case that the bad karma Prem is building up gets him at some point.

    Posted via Z30
    05-24-15 09:50 PM
  22. Prem WatsApp's Avatar
    Heins had a very small window of opportunity to try and make BB10 a success and once that failed the plan was to sell the company. It would already be sold but the offers they did get weren't good so IMHO the board said why rush, since I'm sure many shareholders were already losing a lot of money. Chen's job coming in was to continue to slowly strip down Blackberry to the bare essentials, to make BB look more attractive to a possible buyer, and to sell for the best possible price he can get.
    And then?
    Who's supposed to work with the "shell"?
    What's gonna happen to it?
    Continued, integrated, dismantled,
    etc. ...

    That is the interesting question, not whether BlackBerry will or can be sold, imho... :-)

      Passposted while waiting for the Z-lider....  
    05-25-15 12:32 AM
  23. Soapm's Avatar
    Don't know much about this site but read this short article...

    Apple looking to hire disenfranchised BlackBerry employees
    05-25-15 01:05 AM
  24. MarsupilamiX's Avatar

    As far as the "rumor-that-just-won't-die" that Samsung might build BB phones, that is prohibited by the Open Handset Alliance, which bans members from manufacturing phones, for themselves or others, that use non-Google-Certified Android code. BB10 would cause BB phones to fall under that prohibition, so don't hold your breath waiting for Samsung to be designing or building phones for BB (they can sell individual components, though).
    I understand the point, but I am not buying it, that this would apply to Samsung.
    Samsung is basically Android in the West. If they absolutely want to make things for BlackBerry, they can.
    They are simply too important for Android (currently).

    So, the bottleneck would be Samsung's willingness imho.
    And I see exactly no reason at all, that Samsung would start a little fight against Google just for BlackBerry and a few hundred thousand phones more per quarter.

    But overall, I think that the OHA argument is weak, when applied to Samsung.
    05-25-15 05:20 AM
  25. twiggyrj's Avatar
    I understand the point, but I am not buying it, that this would apply to Samsung.
    Samsung is basically Android in the West. If they absolutely want to make things for BlackBerry, they can.
    They are simply too important for Android (currently).

    So, the bottleneck would be Samsung's willingness imho.
    And I see exactly no reason at all, that Samsung would start a little fight against Google just for BlackBerry and a few hundred thousand phones more per quarter.

    But overall, I think that the OHA argument is weak, when applied to Samsung.

    They are under contract for another 9 years and would a legal battle just to make a few hundred thousand BB10 devices really be worth it? They have their own OS and plenty others to choose from which leaves the question, why choose BlackBerry?
    05-25-15 05:35 AM
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