02-15-15 09:32 AM
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  1. Toodeurep's Avatar
    It's funny how much hatred people have for Google.

    They open sourced their OS so anyone can use it years before John Chens plea for a universal standard for apps. This alone provided a life raft for BlackBerry. Funny how many defended the BlackBerry CEOs desperate statements yet vilify a company that voluntarily organized the closest that we will probably see to a universal mobile platform. Of course this serves their core ad business who does anything for free.

    Crackberry fan boys rant about how insecure/ messy/ inferior the platform is to BB10 then turn right around and pirate apps. Turn right around and hack in Google play to their pristine BB10 devices. Google play service dependency is one way of fighting piracy. It's also the key to the valuable ecosystem Google created that BlackBerry Microsoft and many others seem so desperate to steal.

    Here's a thought. Microsoft/ BlackBerry
    Develop your own ecosystem. Introduce products to market that people want to buy. Then all of this android talk will be moot.

    “My son, there’s a battle between two wolves inside us all. One is Evil. It’s anger, jealousy, greed, resentment, inferiority, lies and ego. The other is Good. It’s joy, peace, love, hope, humility, kindness & truth.” The boy thought about it, and asked: “Grandfather, which wolf wins?” The old man quietly replied: “The one you feed.”

    !
    OR

    The real "Crackberry fan boys" absolutely refuse to use Google at all on their BB10 devices. Also, there is a contingent in here that believes the runtime has killed BB, not propped them up.

    I think you antagonists need to circle your wagons and get your stories straight.
    01-31-15 06:14 AM
  2. Kurdis Blough's Avatar
    I think you antagonists need to circle your wagons and get your stories straight.
    What?

    There's no conspiracy here. Sorry if you don't agree. Also would add if this doesn't apply to you why take offense?

    Do you one better

    I apologize for the use of the term crackberry fan boys. It's inflammatory I should have chosen my words more precisely.

    Everything else I said stands

    !
    01-31-15 06:29 AM
  3. Toodeurep's Avatar
    Who took offense to anything? Not me.

    Apology accepted.
    01-31-15 06:41 AM
  4. ADGrant's Avatar
    ^^^Worth repeating.

    I don't know about anybody else in here, but I'd be really happy to have .5% (or whatever) stake in a market that continues to expand. We own less than one percent of our $9billion market and we have a pretty good time. That $9billion is down from $12billion back in 2008.
    A 0.5% stake in the Smartphone market is great if you don't want any third party apps.

    To slightly misquote Game of Thrones, in the Game Smartphones, you win or you die.
    01-31-15 07:27 AM
  5. ubizmo's Avatar
    Here's a thought. Microsoft/ BlackBerry
    Develop your own ecosystem. Introduce products to market that people want to buy. Then all of this android talk will be moot.
    I think the question is whether this is even possible, once the other players have a large enough headstart. There's nothing wrong with BB10 and WP, considered as operating systems (Well, each has its advantages and disadvantages, but there's nothing that puts either one out of contention), but considered as app platforms they fall far behind the other two. BlackBerry and Microsoft can't simply fill in the gaps by building all the missing apps themselves. Developers have to do it, but market forces give them little incentive to do so.

    I'm not making excuses for BlackBerry or Microsoft, since both of them did have a headstart. BBOS and WM existed well before iPhones and Android. Both companies failed in nimbleness and the result is what we have. Success is always the enemy of nimbleness, I suppose.

    At the moment, Android without Google Play Services is an Android ghetto. Whether Microsoft's deals with CM, or other machinations involving Amazon and BlackBerry can change this remains to be seen.
    01-31-15 10:12 AM
  6. LuvULongTime's Avatar
    It's funny how much hatred people have for Google.

    They open sourced their OS so anyone can use it years before John Chens plea for a universal standard for apps. This alone provided a life raft for BlackBerry. Funny how many defended the BlackBerry CEOs desperate statements yet vilify a company that voluntarily organized the closest that we will probably see to a universal mobile platform. Of course this serves their core ad business who does anything for free.

    Crackberry fan boys rant about how insecure/ messy/ inferior the platform is to BB10 then turn right around and pirate apps. Turn right around and hack in Google play to their pristine BB10 devices. Google play service dependency is one way of fighting piracy. It's also the key to the valuable ecosystem Google created that BlackBerry Microsoft and many others seem so desperate to steal.

    Here's a thought. Microsoft/ BlackBerry
    Develop your own ecosystem. Introduce products to market that people want to buy. Then all of this android talk will be moot.

    My son, theres a battle between two wolves inside us all. One is Evil. Its anger, jealousy, greed, resentment, inferiority, lies and ego. The other is Good. Its joy, peace, love, hope, humility, kindness & truth. The boy thought about it, and asked: Grandfather, which wolf wins? The old man quietly replied: The one you feed.

    !
    Not sure where you get the idea folks hate Google. Google and Apple are both awesome. They have innovated and done a lot of great things that have benefited consumers. Without iOS there would be no Android or BB10. Just because Android and iOS are awesome doesn't mean BlackBerry and Windows can't be equally as awesome. Competition is a great thing. The more the merrier I say. It is a shame that BB10 has to leverage Android app compatibility, and Microsoft is thinking of doing the same thing. But if devs won't support the platform what other choice do they have to bridge the gap? Fold up? If they did we would all be poorer for it, even folks that never ever once picked up either a Windows or BB10 device.
    01-31-15 10:42 AM
  7. lnichols's Avatar
    I think they are investing to fracture Android because Google is trying to lock it down through the use of Play Services to keep companies like Amazon And BlackBerry, and even Microsoft, from leveraging Android. A fractured and forked Android is way better for Microsoft than one unified under Google the OHA. Microsoft has the money to use these kinds of tactics.

    Posted via CB10
    JeepBB and app_Developer like this.
    01-31-15 10:54 AM
  8. ADGrant's Avatar
    I think they are investing to fracture Android because Google is trying to lock it down through the use of Play Services to keep companies like Amazon And BlackBerry, and even Microsoft, from leveraging Android. A fractured and forked Android is way better for Microsoft than one unified under Google the OHA. Microsoft has the money to use these kinds of tactics.

    Posted via CB10
    Android is already fractured and forked. However the only Android variants that matter are those with Google services.
    RyanGermann likes this.
    01-31-15 11:16 AM
  9. sk8er_tor's Avatar
    Microsoft, BlackBerry, Amazon, HTC, Samsung, Lenovo, and everyone else should team up to take Android from Google. Offer up a version of Android that's not Google-dependant and doesn't have all those restrictions in place and have an app store that's open to everyone to connect to and use. Google used the bait and switch technique on all the vendors, getting them to adopt Android and then after they were locking in screwed them over by requiring certain things in order to get Google Services and Google apps.
    Gykesdollars likes this.
    01-31-15 11:43 AM
  10. ADGrant's Avatar
    Microsoft, BlackBerry, Amazon, HTC, Samsung, Lenovo, and everyone else should team up to take Android from Google. Offer up a version of Android that's not Google-dependant and doesn't have all those restrictions in place and have an app store that's open to everyone to connect to and use. Google used the bait and switch technique on all the vendors, getting them to adopt Android and then after they were locking in screwed them over by requiring certain things in order to get Google Services and Google apps.
    Microsoft isn't really interested in a viable independent platform. They want device makers to ship Windows Phones. The device makers just want to sell devices.
    01-31-15 11:52 AM
  11. Toodeurep's Avatar
    A 0.5% stake in the Smartphone market is great if you don't want any third party apps.

    To slightly misquote Game of Thrones, in the Game Smartphones, you win or you die.
    .5% of a growing market is enough to thrive if you do it correctly. Besides, there are many fantastic 3rd party apps in BBW. I would guess that what currently exists would satisfy over 50% of the current market. I would also expect, as the feature phone market begins to die off at a quicker pace, more and more of those people would be perfectly satisfied with the existing BBW apps. All BlackBerry has to do is survive.
    01-31-15 01:46 PM
  12. Kurdis Blough's Avatar
    Microsoft, BlackBerry, Amazon, HTC, Samsung, Lenovo, and everyone else should team up to take Android from Google. Offer up a version of Android that's not Google-dependant and doesn't have all those restrictions in place and have an app store that's open to everyone to connect to and use. Google used the bait and switch technique on all the vendors, getting them to adopt Android and then after they were locking in screwed them over by requiring certain things in order to get Google Services and Google apps.
    What are you talking about?

    There was no bait and switch.

    When Android was new and on one lowly device. No one cared, especially not Microsoft or BlackBerry. now that's it's proven a success suddenly longstanding agreements are Google controlling Android?

    Free for everyone to use? It is

    Google Play and Android are two totally different things. Google play has always been closed source and owned by Google.

    Manufacturers aren't bound to continue using Android. everyone is free to move on. Problem is move to what? IOS/ BB10 are completely locked down and aren't even licensed to other manufacturers.
    Windows Phone is just not performing well in the marketplace but is now being licensed for free.

    !
    mornhavon likes this.
    01-31-15 02:00 PM
  13. ADGrant's Avatar
    .5% of a growing market is enough to thrive if you do it correctly. Besides, there are many fantastic 3rd party apps in BBW. I would guess that what currently exists would satisfy over 50% of the current market. I would also expect, as the feature phone market begins to die off at a quicker pace, more and more of those people would be perfectly satisfied with the existing BBW apps. All BlackBerry has to do is survive.
    The people still on feature phones will be buying low end Android or Windows Phone devices.

    If BB didn't have an app problem, it would not need the Amazon App Store and John Chen wouldn't have asked the U.S. government to force developers to support the platform.

    OTOH there are plenty of corporately owned 9900s which could be replaced by the Classic. The corporate market may be enough to keep BB's handset business going.
    01-31-15 02:20 PM
  14. Toodeurep's Avatar
    The people still on feature phones will be buying low end Android or Windows Phone devices.

    If BB didn't have an app problem, it would not need the Amazon App Store and John Chen wouldn't have asked the U.S. government to force developers to support the platform.

    OTOH there are plenty of corporately owned 9900s which could be replaced by the Classic. The corporate market may be enough to keep BB's handset business going.
    Excluding BlackBerry from your feature phone convert list is just a guess. You are entitled to your guess, but that is what it is at best, a guess.

    I know this is hard for some people, and maybe you, but go back and re-read what Chen said in the letter to the Senate Committee Chair. Not from your current opinion, re-read it for what it says. You might catch on. If not, I'll explain it to you later. Hopefully, it won't be necessary.
    01-31-15 03:34 PM
  15. ADGrant's Avatar
    Excluding BlackBerry from your feature phone convert list is just a guess. You are entitled to your guess, but that is what it is at best, a guess.

    I know this is hard for some people, and maybe you, but go back and re-read what Chen said in the letter to the Senate Committee Chair. Not from your current opinion, re-read it for what it says. You might catch on. If not, I'll explain it to you later. Hopefully, it won't be necessary.
    I know what Chen said.

    As for feature phone conversion, I haven't seen any evidence that BB is even targeting that market (John Chen has been very clear that he is targeting the enterprise market). There is plenty of evidence that Microsoft and low cost Android vendors are though.
    01-31-15 04:15 PM
  16. fishlove73's Avatar
    There's enough room for Ford, GM, Honda, Toyota, BMW etc.... BlackBerry will be fine. Google did the bait and switch because they said "oh, yeah, no evil, we won't share your information" Now they are nothing more than a network marketing firm just like Amway...only with software.

    Posted via the pure awesomeness of blackberry.
    01-31-15 05:05 PM
  17. ADGrant's Avatar
    There's enough room for Ford, GM, Honda, Toyota, BMW etc.... BlackBerry will be fine. Google did the bait and switch because they said "oh, yeah, no evil, we won't share your information" Now they are nothing more than a network marketing firm just like Amway...only with software.

    Posted via the pure awesomeness of blackberry.
    Terrible analogy. Auto companies don't require third party app developer support.
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    01-31-15 05:24 PM
  18. fishlove73's Avatar
    No...just third party engineering and third party parts manufacturing....oh, yeah...no similarities at all.

    Posted via the pure awesomeness of blackberry.
    01-31-15 05:48 PM
  19. ADGrant's Avatar
    No...just third party engineering and third party parts manufacturing....oh, yeah...no similarities at all.

    Posted via the pure awesomeness of blackberry.
    No none at all. Most people aren't customizing their cars with third party add-ons.
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    01-31-15 05:53 PM
  20. fishlove73's Avatar
    ???? Lol

    Posted via the pure awesomeness of blackberry.
    01-31-15 07:41 PM
  21. early2bed's Avatar
    A better comparison would be PC operating systems. You have your Windows, Mac, occasional Linux and I can't name any other.
    01-31-15 08:27 PM
  22. ADGrant's Avatar
    A better comparison would be PC operating systems. You have your Windows, Mac, occasional Linux and I can't name any other.
    Linux is a very popular OS for servers (database, web etc), it's also embedded in a lot of other platforms (Android, Tivo etc). On the desktop it is almost non existent. It's basically used by IT pros and hobbyists. So what you really have in the desktop/laptop market is a duopoly. We seem to be heading that way in the mobile space too. BB may hold on to some business customers (lawyers, bankers, politicians etc). However, if anyone is able to disrupt the current duopoly it will be Microsoft. They at least have deep pockets and a very smart CEO. BB does not have deep pockets and I am starting to have serious doubts about its CEO.
    mornhavon likes this.
    01-31-15 10:03 PM
  23. DaedalusIcarusHelios's Avatar
    The Google bait and switch was Android being open, and then suddenly not, due to the Google Play dependence which was so Google had control with all the requirements of using it, and to squeeze out those riding the coattails of Android (BlackBerry with its runtime, Amazon Kindle, etc.).
    sk8er_tor likes this.
    01-31-15 10:59 PM
  24. Kurdis Blough's Avatar
    The Google bait and switch was Android being open, and then suddenly not, due to the Google Play dependence which was so Google had control with all the requirements of using it, and to squeeze out those riding the coattails of Android (BlackBerry with its runtime, Amazon Kindle, etc.).
    There was no bait and switch.

    Google play is totally separate from Android OS and was NEVER OPEN SOURCE.

    !
    01-31-15 11:41 PM
  25. randomroyalty's Avatar
    It would be far better to build MS or Google services or iOS services on top of QNX rather than on BSD or Linux.

    This is the problem of all OSes and seeing how Samsung has invested so much in parallel services to Google, and seeing what a PITA developing in Java for Android is (memory leaks abound even in Android 5 ART) , BBRY must be highly coveted.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    02-01-15 09:40 AM
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