07-21-15 10:00 AM
39 12
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  1. early2bed's Avatar
    Why does the appliance have to be a dumb simple sensor? Like a Nest, each device is custom configured to do a specific job including monitoring. Even a Dropcam has its own schedule, motion sensor, account with various permissions, and recording capability. These devices already already connected to my smartphone and these are first generation.

    I'm pretty sure a smartphone app can be developed that adds additional brain functions well before BlackBerry can get a hardware brain designed and built and probably do it for free. Google bought both Nest and Dropcam and has started getting them to talk to each other already.
    07-15-15 06:21 PM
  2. BCITMike's Avatar
    Why does the appliance have to be a dumb simple sensor? Like a Nest, each device is custom configured to do a specific job including monitoring. Even a Dropcam has its own schedule, motion sensor, account with various permissions, and recording capability. These devices already already connected to my smartphone and these are first generation.

    I'm pretty sure a smartphone app can be developed that adds additional brain functions well before BlackBerry can get a hardware brain designed and built and probably do it for free. Google bought both Nest and Dropcam and has started getting them to talk to each other already.
    Doesn't HAVE to be. But you want a device that is aware of everything, and only talk to or manage that device so that all control and management is done in one place, not in every individual sensor. 15 sensors shouldn't all be making direct connections to your phone, they should talk to the controller/brains and your phone just has to talk to the controller through one central point.

    So temperature sensors should talk to the Nest. Your doorbell talks to the Nest. Your lights talk to your Nest. Your phone talks to the Nest. Your sensors don't talk to your phone, they talk to the central controller/brains. The phone should be talking to the controller/brains via the controller's webserver.

    BlackBerry has already produced source code to interface with different IoT things. It's one thing to connect phone to your thermostat on demand to find out the current temperature and change it, or for one time config, but its entirely different for the thermostat to be sending temperature readings every 60 seconds 24/7 to your mobile phone so that you can see when the temperature changes. This is what you want a plugged in device doing with storage. The phone should never be the brains, only a way to access the brains. Mainly for battery and connectivity reasons, the phone will never be a reliable controller vs a plugged in controller sitting in your home.
    LoganSix likes this.
    07-15-15 06:36 PM
  3. marameansdemon's Avatar
    I absolutely agree but I'm the typical crazy exception to the rule...

    ...I also run security cameras and a complex security system that I maintain ... and I'm a bit paranoid. To your point I think though the average user these days has very little chance of protecting their data. Especially when you look at the NSA firmware level hacks for harddrive controllers that they have used for data logging in DoD clean rooms.
    Like you already stated, you are an exception to the rule. People usually pay for those services and look for the cheapest one, which usually isn't the greatest idea. They just look for convenience and forget about everything else. They make things easy to the infiltrators.


    Posted via CB10
    07-15-15 09:44 PM
  4. k1rkland's Avatar
    Most consumers aren't going to drop thousands of dollars all at once to set up a system in their house. They are much more likely to acquire a Nest thermostat and perhaps a Dropcam to watch the nanny. Then maybe a doorbell or garage opener. Then some of the new appliances will come with connectivity options. At first, each device has a separate app. Soon after, they will incorporate Apple HomeKit or whatever protocol Google has to control appliances in a single app.
    07-15-15 10:08 PM
  5. KermEd's Avatar
    Like you already stated, you are an exception to the rule. People usually pay for those services and look for the cheapest one, which usually isn't the greatest idea. They just look for convenience and forget about everything else. They make things easy to the infiltrators.


    Posted via CB10
    Sad, scary and true. I think that's also the Google business model

    Posted to CB via my Passport | Lloyd Summers | FileArchiveHaven
    07-16-15 08:33 AM
  6. LoganSix's Avatar
    The Nest thermostat would be better choice for the "brains" than the cell phone.
    But I wouldn't want my thermostat to be the "brains". I would rather the thermostat be a little smart, smarter than the wall plugs, but maybe not smarter than the face recognition door monitor, but the real "brains" be a controller that lives in it's own little place in the house that isn't easily accessible (ie... knocked off the wall, which disables your smarthome and smarthome security).
    07-16-15 08:35 AM
  7. LoganSix's Avatar
    Most consumers aren't going to drop thousands of dollars all at once to set up a system in their house. They are much more likely to acquire a Nest thermostat and perhaps a Dropcam to watch the nanny. Then maybe a doorbell or garage opener. Then some of the new appliances will come with connectivity options. At first, each device has a separate app. Soon after, they will incorporate Apple HomeKit or whatever protocol Google has to control appliances in a single app.
    True. Which is why most base systems are "free" from security systems. The easiest way into home IoT.
    However, as home IoT grows, more appliances will come IoT ready. Hopefully there will be open standards so that people won't be limited to a manufacturers system (looking at you Zigbee).

    Unfortunately, most people will prefer easy or secure, but that shouldn't stop BlackBerry from offering the HBox for Home as a method that provides the controller without hooking into services (i.e. Apple HomeKit and Google Next/Dropcam).


    Believe me, I am really annoyed by Dropcam selling out to Google, because I was on the verge of getting a few.
    07-16-15 08:40 AM
  8. dbq10's Avatar
    Hacking aside, why assume these software programs will be the exception that works flawlessly? Do you want to wait for the update or bug fix to be released during extreme weather? What happens when the power fails? Picture the suburban homeowner who's late for work because the garage door keeps going up and down and he's pleading with his phone assistant to make it stop.
    07-16-15 12:40 PM
  9. k1rkland's Avatar
    LOL. Do you have a garage? Mine fails all the time among the safety sensor, the motor, logic board, the tension spring, power outages, etc. Every homeowner knows how to unlatch the door from the drive chain and open or close it manually. My connected garage door controller sends me a notification if I leave it open and allows me to let people in the house who call when I'm not there. It has never once tried to kill me by activating on its own.

    What happens when the power fails? Picture the suburban homeowner who's late for work because the garage door keeps going up and down and he's pleading with his phone assistant to make it stop.
    mornhavon likes this.
    07-16-15 02:51 PM
  10. LoganSix's Avatar
    Hacking aside, why assume these software programs will be the exception that works flawlessly? Do you want to wait for the update or bug fix to be released during extreme weather? What happens when the power fails? Picture the suburban homeowner who's late for work because the garage door keeps going up and down and he's pleading with his phone assistant to make it stop.
    Pretty much all home automation items have a manual back-up method of operation.

    It helps that most of these items don't do much. A lot are just on/off switches or basic information. Another reason not to have a phone as the controller or an individual item (like a thermostat) as the brains. The individual items should be able to work independently of the "brains".


    BTW, the misconception about the NEST is that it will allow you room by room control of your HVAC. Unless your HVAC has already been built with multi-zone, NEST isn't going to magically give you multi-zone. Even with register covers that have controllers, it is only recommended to turn off 30% of the registers at a time. So, adding on items after the fact will not be the final solution. Homes will eventually have to be retrofitted or rebuilt.
    07-16-15 03:27 PM
  11. KermEd's Avatar
    It's also important to remember there is what IoT was, and what it's becoming. That is, it was the makers that built a DIY community of making anything hackable and flexible.

    ... and then big corporations that realized at some point last year that they are missing billions of dollars. And sunk a bunch of cheap(er) low hanging hardware in the lake to see if people will bite.

    The idea behind IoT is to do as much yourself so you can learn, maintain and develop your own world of things around you. So if you want your coffee maker, for example, to send you an SMS saying something is wrong... well it can. Or if you want to be able to see who has come to your door and interact with them, you can. But if you choose to go the prefab route - you give the manufacturers even more control and access to your data. And they don't always have a good record of keeping it smart or safe

    Posted to CB via my Passport | Lloyd Summers | FileArchiveHaven
    07-17-15 12:37 AM
  12. LoganSix's Avatar
    It's also important to remember there is what IoT was, and what it's becoming. That is, it was the makers that built a DIY community of making anything hackable and flexible.

    ... and then big corporations that realized at some point last year that they are missing billions of dollars. And sunk a bunch of cheap(er) low hanging hardware in the lake to see if people will bite.

    The idea behind IoT is to do as much yourself so you can learn, maintain and develop your own world of things around you. So if you want your coffee maker, for example, to send you an SMS saying something is wrong... well it can. Or if you want to be able to see who has come to your door and interact with them, you can. But if you choose to go the prefab route - you give the manufacturers even more control and access to your data. And they don't always have a good record of keeping it smart or safe

    Posted to CB via my Passport | Lloyd Summers | FileArchiveHaven
    And that's the rub.

    I did just find a health monitor IoT company that has the sole purpose of taking your recordings and securely transferring them to the corporation in order for you to get health rebates. dacadoo This is obviously something BlackBerry should be involved in, if not the leader in. If you check out dacadoo's supported devices, you will notice the lack of BlackBerry apps and devices that support BlackBerry, even if there is apparently a semi-open format of Garmin's GPX (GPS XML) and TCX (Training Center XML).

    Anyway, BlackBerry could find that sweet spot of offering a platform for the DIY IoT maker and those who want a pre-built system. Both could be secure systems, but maybe BlackBerry could provide a Cloud backup for those who don't mind storing their data in the cloud. The key being flexibility and not being locked into one company's products and services.
    07-17-15 08:19 AM
  13. early2bed's Avatar
    BlackBerry isn't going to do anything in consumer IoT for one big reason. It doesn't have any significant presence in any consumer device category with the exception of QNX in vehicle in-dash systems and even that seems to be making way for Apple and Google right now. Every major consumer device maker is already connecting their device to the internet or soon will be. You get into this by selling the consumer a "T" or two and then signing them up for the "I" functionality on day 1.

    While there may be room for some kind of intermediary, I doubt that Google, Microsoft and Apple are going to sit by and allow Nests, Dropcams, XBox's, and Apple TV's to go through some other kind of service. They have plenty of cloud infrastructure to manage the consumer IoT and probably more resources to put towards security than BlackBerry ever could.
    07-19-15 02:37 PM
  14. LoganSix's Avatar
    BlackBerry isn't going to do anything in consumer IoT for one big reason. It doesn't have any significant presence in any consumer device category with the exception of QNX in vehicle in-dash systems and even that seems to be making way for Apple and Google right now. Every major consumer device maker is already connecting their device to the internet or soon will be. You get into this by selling the consumer a "T" or two and then signing them up for the "I" functionality on day 1.
    Yes, QNX supports Apple and Google's plugins. Apple and Google aren't making infotainment systems.

    While there may be room for some kind of intermediary, I doubt that Google, Microsoft and Apple are going to sit by and allow Nests, Dropcams, XBox's, and Apple TV's to go through some other kind of service. They have plenty of cloud infrastructure to manage the consumer IoT and probably more resources to put towards security than BlackBerry ever could.
    BES is being marketed as the IoT secure network. Google, Microsoft and Apple have devices that currently run on BES, having their other cameras run on BES wouldn't be an issue to them.

    Frankly, if BlackBerry keeps heading down the "software only" route, they will need to be the secure network for IoT on the enterprise and consumer level. Consumer is the same, as long as you envision a household as just a very small enterprise.
    07-21-15 10:00 AM
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