04-08-15 03:13 AM
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  1. LuvULongTime's Avatar
    I meant with zero Android app compatibility. But yeah, it was a bigger task than anybody had fathomed.
    Gotcha. But realistically, do you think things would have gone any differently from an app/ecosystem perspective? I don't. If a dev refused to port their Android app over to BBW, I doubt they would have written a native one from scratch.
    JeepBB and RyanGermann like this.
    03-20-15 12:23 PM
  2. birdman_38's Avatar
    Gotcha. But realistically, do you think things would have gone any differently from an app/ecosystem perspective? I don't. If a dev refused to port their Android app over to BBW, I doubt they would have written a native one from scratch.
    Some did. I've always given BBRY credit for that. They were able to get some big players on board before they even sold the first BB10 device. But with the comedy of errors in 2013 they couldn't keep that momentum going.
    LuvULongTime likes this.
    03-20-15 12:29 PM
  3. Charliefr3sh's Avatar
    Samsung built hardware would be more feasible than blackberry realising a BlackBerry 10 rom. Samsung makes great hardware and are not known much about their software. If anything, Samsung might be in this partnership to supply BlackBerry with the hardware for future devices as we all know that BlackBerry kinda lacks in that department. I'm hoping all this silence about a full touch flagship phone means there's something cooking between BlackBerry and Samsung to provide a Samsung built phone. "Fingers crossed "

    Posted via CB10
    03-20-15 02:21 PM
  4. RyanGermann's Avatar
    I would install BB10 on my Nexus 7 FHD tablet immediately. A 2.2 GHz 1080p Wifi tablet that runs BB10? Yes, please!
    03-20-15 02:59 PM
  5. tchocky77's Avatar
    I would install BB10 on my Nexus 7 FHD tablet immediately. A 2.2 GHz 1080p Wifi tablet that runs BB10? Yes, please!
    The processor is clocked at 1.5 GHz. Not 2.2.

    That said,...I have one and LOVE it with Android 5.1. I'm using it to post this as a matter of fact.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    03-20-15 03:11 PM
  6. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    But yeah, it was a bigger task than anybody had fathomed.
    Actually, many people fathomed it back in 2010 when the QNX purchase was announced. I remember talking to the BB people I knew at the time that BB was signing its own death warrant (for the hardware and OS, anyway) because there's no way they'd ever get the developer support they needed to build a competitive ecosystem (which is why I was astounded that they didn't build on top of Android to begin with). I remember reading articles saying much the same thing in the tech press at the time too.

    It was just BB fans who couldn't fathom it. And, yes, I fully understand the advantages of BB10 - it's just that they don't outweigh the disadvantages for enough people to keep the hardware business alive, which means, those disadvantages are ultimately what will be responsible for killing BB10 and hardware.
    anon(5818411), JeepBB and pl212 like this.
    03-20-15 04:57 PM
  7. Jas00555's Avatar
    The security built in to BB10 requires all the hardware devices to sign themselves at startup. To get BB10 on random devices, you'll have to strip that out, thereby defeating half the reason of using BB10. Putting the hub on android devices makes a lot more sense.
    Windows 10 on phones and small tablets also require the same thing. If you have a Windows 8 machine, then you may be familiar with something called SecureBoot which requires that, prior to booting up the OS, the OS must be signed with the right key, otherwise it won't boot up at all. This is the reason that Microsoft is partnering with OEMs like Xiaomi and OnePlus, so that way these phones can use a Windows 10 ROM.

    Edit: Also, reading through this again, there seems to be confusion as to how you would get BB10 on a device. Many smartphones come with a locked bootloader, which means that you can't simply change the ROM at will. Some OEMs (like Xiaomi and Oneplus) leave their bootloaders unlocked, so that way you can change the ROM at will. To get it running on a device like the Note 4, you would need to either unlock the bootloader yourself (which idk if that's even possible **DOUBLE EDIT: yes, it's apparently possible to unlock a bootloader, so this could potentially work for any high end phone**) or buy a phone with an unlocked bootloader.

    Frankly, I think Microsoft's idea is brilliant. The only people who would want to do this are the enthusiast crowd and in an era where iOS and Android control 95% of the market, getting on the good side of enthusiasts and tinkers could only be great for the platform.
    Last edited by Jas00555; 03-20-15 at 09:13 PM.
    Superfly_FR likes this.
    03-20-15 05:10 PM
  8. AnimalPak200's Avatar
    Actually, many people fathomed it back in 2010 when the QNX purchase was announced. I remember talking to the BB people I knew at the time that BB was signing its own death warrant (for the hardware and OS, anyway) because there's no way they'd ever get the developer support they needed to build a competitive ecosystem (which is why I was astounded that they didn't build on top of Android to begin with). I remember reading articles saying much the same thing in the tech press at the time too.

    It was just BB fans who couldn't fathom it. And, yes, I fully understand the advantages of BB10 - it's just that they don't outweigh the disadvantages for enough people to keep the hardware business alive, which means, those disadvantages are ultimately what will be responsible for killing BB10 and hardware.
    Eh... they might have had a chance to reach at least the current Windows Phone scale (I don't know what that means, but I see many more windows phones than BlackBerry devices). But they not only faced a challenging (although not entirely impossible at first) endeavor,.. they executed horribly.



    Posted via CB10
    03-20-15 05:36 PM
  9. ChicaneBT's Avatar
    Blackberry can't even make a proper working bug free OS for their own devices with very little hardware deviations. Imagine what it would look like on all the different hardware used in Android phones.
    anon(5818411), vbdwork and JeepBB like this.
    03-20-15 06:19 PM
  10. Jas00555's Avatar
    Blackberry can't even make a proper working bug free OS for their own devices with very little hardware deviations. Imagine what it would look like on all the different hardware used in Android phones.
    They don't have to support every Android device. BB10's hardware requirements are ridiculous, so they could just limit support to only high end Android phones, and even then they would only have to make it for the phones that have unlocked bootloaders.

    Let's use the OnePlus One for example: It has the same SoC and RAM that the Passport does, and the same screen resolution and aspect ratio as a Z30. So the majority of the support is already there. The only thing they would need to fix is support for capacitive buttons and for a 5.5 inch screen, which aren't really that hard.

    Since BB10's hardware requirements make it so a mid end or low end can't run the software (unless they figured out a way to get rid of the Android Runtime), all they would have to do is support the Snapdragon 8XX series, give support up to like 5.7 inches, then figure out what to do with the capacitive buttons and they'll be good to go for the most part.
    03-20-15 07:27 PM
  11. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Samsung built hardware would be more feasible than blackberry realising a BlackBerry 10 rom. Samsung makes great hardware and are not known much about their software. If anything, Samsung might be in this partnership to supply BlackBerry with the hardware for future devices as we all know that BlackBerry kinda lacks in that department. I'm hoping all this silence about a full touch flagship phone means there's something cooking between BlackBerry and Samsung to provide a Samsung built phone. "Fingers crossed "

    Posted via CB10
    I'll take it the other way round : samsung device that is branded Android but can also run BB10 OS. Call it 'the next one' probably (or maybe the 6 series with Knox enabled ? ).

    Edit: probably a fantasy of mine : what would forbid a device to have TWO ROMS (I mean, physical chips) ?
    03-20-15 08:31 PM
  12. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    to be honest, i'd rather run win10, ios8 or lollipop on my passport right now. I was happy with the progress until 10.2.1 then it took a year for a less stable UI revamp to come out (we would have been on 10.4 by now most likely with the 4-6month updates).

    I can't see 10.3.2 bringing anything ground breaking, which most likely won't be out until summer.

    Before I had a blackberry for hardware and software, now it's just hardware.
    Last edited by khehl; 03-21-15 at 10:23 AM.
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    03-21-15 10:12 AM
  13. THBW's Avatar
    Blackberry can't even make a proper working bug free OS for their own devices with very little hardware deviations. Imagine what it would look like on all the different hardware used in Android phones.
    Actually, BlackBerry has done a reasonably good job with updates. A few bugs here or there but nothing major. Compare this to the major screw ups over at Apple with Apple Pay. Basically 6-8 dollars out of a hundred spent are fraudulent and it is a direct result of Apple's sloppy security implementation. As noted in the New York Times, the big banks have given Apple 6 months to get its act together or they pull the plug. Now that is a screw up.

    Posted via CB10
    03-21-15 11:39 AM
  14. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    Actually, BlackBerry has done a reasonably good job with updates. A few bugs here or there but nothing major. Compare this to the major screw ups over at Apple with Apple Pay. Basically 6-8 dollars out of a hundred spent are fraudulent and it is a direct result of Apple's sloppy security implementation. As noted in the New York Times, the big banks have given Apple 6 months to get its act together or they pull the plug. Now that is a screw up.

    Posted via CB10
    that's not the point. In the beta group all the issues we are seeing now have been reported since July. For a company that boasts being a secure productivity machine shouldn't have to pull a carrier update. 10.3.1 is a mess and all it was, was a UI revamp that took a year of constant development.

    Apple on the other hand spends like 4-6 months on the OS and throws it out there without it being thoroughly tested, which is starting to change. Apple is completely a different company than BlackBerry, it's a hardware (you can argue and say it's an ecosystem company, not a hardware company) and marketing type company which Chen is saying that "he is all about software". Apple is geared toward consumers who don't really care about security vs BlackBerry who boasts being secure, productive and stable. Apple's target is on point out of the box and BlackBerry's isn't. Once again, Apple is not a software company.

    Security wise, BlackBerry phones has stuff like freak and SSL that Apple is having issues with. Not saying Apple is just as secure but BlackBerry as a consumer phone, it isn't as secure as everyone is making it to be. With BES and secusmart, it's a different story, but out of the box it is exactly like the other 3 OS'.
    Isn't BlackBerry the only platform that doesn't encrypt emails out of the box?
    Last edited by khehl; 03-21-15 at 01:44 PM.
    gvs1341 likes this.
    03-21-15 12:00 PM
  15. howarmat's Avatar
    Actually, BlackBerry has done a reasonably good job with updates. A few bugs here or there but nothing major. Compare this to the major screw ups over at Apple with Apple Pay. Basically 6-8 dollars out of a hundred spent are fraudulent and it is a direct result of Apple's sloppy security implementation. As noted in the New York Times, the big banks have given Apple 6 months to get its act together or they pull the plug. Now that is a screw up.

    Posted via CB10
    actually it seems like the issue is the banks and not apple pay itself. They banks don't verify enough info to make sure the card being added is legit. Apple pay security itself is very good.
    JeepBB likes this.
    03-21-15 12:05 PM
  16. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    actually it seems like the issue is the banks and not apply pay itself. They banks don't verify enough info to make sure the card being added is legit. Apple pay security itself is very good.
    I to think Apple Pay is very good, it doesn't directly take your money, they are basically a middle man.

    Apple Pay won't make it anywhere out of the U.S. and it will die eventually but it's a really good idea.

    In a perfect world, if every store supported it, it would be the best option and trump google wallet. Much like BB10 and it's app ecosystem.
    03-21-15 12:17 PM
  17. THBW's Avatar
    actually it seems like the issue is the banks and not apply pay itself. They banks don't verify enough info to make sure the card being added is legit. Apple pay security itself is very good.
    The typical rate of fraud on all other forms of debit and credit card transaction is 0.01% not 6-8%. The only difference is that Apple is the middle man in the latter and not the former. The problem is clear and like it or not, it can't continue as banks are losing money big time on this venture. The only reason Apple Pay hasn't been ****canned is because of Apple's position in the market place.

    Posted via CB10
    03-21-15 12:22 PM
  18. howarmat's Avatar
    The typical rate of fraud on all other forms of debit and credit card transaction is 0.01% not 6-8%. The only difference is that Apple is the middle man in the latter and not the former. The problem is clear and like it or not, it can't continue as banks are losing money big time on this venture. The only reason Apple Pay hasn't been ****canned is because of Apple's position in the market place.

    Posted via CB10
    you are correct, banks are losing money, hence they need to step up THEIR verification process before allowing CC to be used for apple pay.
    03-21-15 12:25 PM
  19. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    The typical rate of fraud on all other forms of debit and credit card transaction is 0.01% not 6-8%. The only difference is that Apple is the middle man in the latter and not the former. The problem is clear and like it or not, it can't continue as banks are losing money big time on this venture. The only reason Apple Pay hasn't been ****canned is because of Apple's position in the market place.

    Posted via CB10
    the issue isn't apple pay itself, it's credit card numbers are being used on the internet and etc. People are taking that number and inputting it in their apple pay. There needs to be more information given to the banks than just the number the banks require.

    The issue is with the banks not the app. The banks need to ask for more info then just the credit card number. It needs to be a multiple step process, not just input your number and go. Apple does provide more services for multi-step verification but some banks choose not to do it.

    Howaremat is completely right. Banks end not Apples end. I to am use to blaming Apple but this time it's not them.

    When you call the bank, you get a series of questions to verify that it's the real you. They don't just let you input your credit card number and mess with your account settings. Why is Apple Pay any different? Even logging into the RBC's website site i get asked one of my 10 security questions on top of the password.

    At 1:41


    Apple Pay gives option to call you bank to verify that it's you. Not all banks have that mandatory when it should be. Let me rephrase it, this is a service that Apple is providing but the banks are not taking advantage of it.

    hopefully this clears up the confusion. Sorry for the repetitiveness and just watch the video at 1:41. It will all make more sense.
    Last edited by khehl; 03-21-15 at 12:54 PM.
    03-21-15 12:29 PM
  20. THBW's Avatar
    you are correct, banks are losing money, hence they need to step up THEIR verification process before allowing CC to be used for apple pay.
    Your justifications are backwards. Debit and credit card verification has been going on for decades with absolutely no problems. Indeed, there is a good bit of money to make in this business. Then Apple steps in and within a few months banks start to hemorrhage money at rates, never ever seen sine the advent of credit cards. This is an abject failure, end of story.

    Clearly Apple inserted in self into the process and didn't understand what they were doing. They created a middle man solution that failed. It is not up to the banks to work with a flawed system. It is up to Apple to make sure the platform is reliable, secure and effective. You are blaming the victims.

    Posted via CB10
    03-21-15 01:15 PM
  21. tchocky77's Avatar
    Your justifications are backwards. Debit and credit card verification has been going on for decades with absolutely no problems. Indeed, there is a good bit of money to make in this business. Then Apple steps in and within a few months banks start to hemorrhage money at rates, never ever seen sine the advent of credit cards. This is an abject failure, end of story.

    Clearly Apple inserted in self into the process and didn't understand what they were doing. They created a middle man solution that failed. It is not up to the banks to work with a flawed system. It is up to Apple to make sure the platform is reliable, secure and effective. You are blaming the victims.

    Posted via CB10
    Another case of crackberry not knowing how something works.

    The fault is with the banks. Not Apple Pay. And moreover, they're fixing it.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    JeepBB likes this.
    03-21-15 01:20 PM
  22. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    Your justifications are backwards. Debit and credit card verification has been going on for decades with absolutely no problems. Indeed, there is a good bit of money to make in this business. Then Apple steps in and within a few months banks start to hemorrhage money at rates, never ever seen sine the advent of credit cards. This is an abject failure, end of story.

    Clearly Apple inserted in self into the process and didn't understand what they were doing. They created a middle man solution that failed. It is not up to the banks to work with a flawed system. It is up to Apple to make sure the platform is reliable, secure and effective. You are blaming the victims.

    Posted via CB10
    you didn't read or watch my comment did you. Everything you said is redundant to what i put. I explained it in 4/5 different ways. I don't know how many more ways i can rephrase it.
    03-21-15 01:21 PM
  23. tchocky77's Avatar
    Here ya go...
    http://www.newsweek.com/apple-pay-fr...-street-314449

    By the by, that 6% number is likely an exaggeration.

    You're welcome.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    JeepBB likes this.
    03-21-15 01:24 PM
  24. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    Another case of crackberry not knowing how something works.

    The fault is with the banks. Not Apple Pay. And moreover, they're fixing it.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    black sheep are becoming much worse than isheep...
    03-21-15 01:24 PM
  25. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    Here ya go...
    http://www.newsweek.com/apple-pay-fr...-street-314449

    By the by, that 6% number is likely an exaggeration.

    You're welcome.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    that article doesn't explain how the credit card are stolen before they are inputted into apple pay which is the main issue. Then the banks just automatically verify them basically haha

    There is no way to get a credit card number through apple pay like there is swiping your credit card.
    That is why in canada, we have had chips and pay pass on our cards for like 5-10 years so vendors can't get credit card info. America is just a bit slow to adapt to new tech :P I still get looked at funny when vendors in the states see a chip on my card, i've been asked multiple times if my card has wifi because of the pay pass symbol...
    Last edited by khehl; 03-21-15 at 01:40 PM.
    03-21-15 01:27 PM
110 1234 ...

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