10-17-13 07:06 PM
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  1. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    Remember a while back how Cerberus was going to save Chrysler?
    10-15-13 11:15 PM
  2. badiyee's Avatar
    Remember a while back how Cerberus was going to save Chrysler?
    didn't they take 100 investors with them for that?
    10-15-13 11:23 PM
  3. Omnitech's Avatar
    You can review their history here:

    Cerberus Capital Management - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    10-15-13 11:26 PM
  4. jtfolden's Avatar
    Cerberus is a multi-faced faced dog for a reason.
    mopar_fxr and jupiter8 like this.
    10-15-13 11:30 PM
  5. mopar_fxr's Avatar
    Remember a while back how Cerberus was going to save Chrysler?
    Yea, they bought it and flipped it and sold it right away to fiat...
    Though, they did enough for a short term to make it look good by paying back the gov loans quicker than expected so they could gain more money on the sale to fiat...
    Yes, I know a bit about that sale and what has happened with Chrysler besides just fixing them

    Posted via CB10
    10-15-13 11:30 PM
  6. bb4life21's Avatar
    Business Week just reported that Cerberus has signed an undisclosed confidential agreement for a possible bid for the whole company!

    Posted via Harry
    If it helps with the progress of bb10 I'm with it.
    10-15-13 11:37 PM
  7. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Thank you Troy Tiscareno, I was just about to ask what on earth is Cerberus (didn't get much info / picture about who they are and how they work)

    So let's say BB10 does get taken over, and it seems that general sentiments are negative on Cerberus..

    What kind of "cheapen things out" will happen?

    I think Q5 may be the 'flagship' devices / promoted instead of any new up and coming phones in the pipeline . (hmm, not exactly a good idea)
    Simple: Cerberus will look and see that BB has a sizable inventory of BB10 phones, so they'll cut BB10 OS development to the bone, dump everyone involved on the hardware side, and focus on trying to sell BES10 to companies, along with as many of the existing BB10 phones as they have. Margins for these sales will be better, and they won't have to advertise - these sales are normally done via corporate account reps, so those guys will keep their jobs. I'd guess you'd see BB's headcount get reduced to 3,000 or less, total, which means another halving after this current 4,500 headcount reduction.

    The consumer market will be abandoned completely - consumer support staff eliminated, advertising eliminated, and dev promotions limited to business-relevant apps (maybe pushing for clients from SAP, Salesforce, Cisco, Citrix, etc.). You might be able to buy the phones direct from the website, but consumer carrier support will be withdrawn.

    After a year or 18 months, BB will be "profitable" on the books, and they'll either try to find a sucker to sell it to that can't figure out that they made the profit by sacrificing their future completely, OR they'll shutter the company at that point, after having milked every last dollar of profit out of it, and selling off the patents and anything else of value once they are no longer of use.

    Despite what they say (they made similar assurances to the gun companies: "It will be business as usual"), all they're looking to do is to extract the maximum dollars is the shortest time possible. That's what Private Equity does. There's no desire for a "long term plan" because they aren't in business to be manufacturers or tech companies, but rather to extract money from companies for a while, then moving on to the next opportunity.
    10-15-13 11:50 PM
  8. mopar_fxr's Avatar
    Simple: Cerberus will look and see that BB has a sizable inventory of BB10 phones, so they'll cut BB10 OS development to the bone, dump everyone involved on the hardware side, and focus on trying to sell BES10 to companies, along with as many of the existing BB10 phones as they have. Margins for these sales will be better, and they won't have to advertise - these sales are normally done via corporate account reps, so those guys will keep their jobs. I'd guess you'd see BB's headcount get reduced to 3,000 or less, total, which means another halving after this current 4,500 headcount reduction.

    The consumer market will be abandoned completely - consumer support staff eliminated, advertising eliminated, and dev promotions limited to business-relevant apps (maybe pushing for clients from SAP, Salesforce, Cisco, Citrix, etc.). You might be able to buy the phones direct from the website, but consumer carrier support will be withdrawn.

    After a year or 18 months, BB will be "profitable" on the books, and they'll either try to find a sucker to sell it to that can't figure out that they made the profit by sacrificing their future completely, OR they'll shutter the company at that point, after having milked every last dollar of profit out of it, and selling off the patents and anything else of value once they are no longer of use.

    Despite what they say (they made similar assurances to the gun companies: "It will be business as usual"), all they're looking to do is to extract the maximum dollars is the shortest time possible. That's what Private Equity does. There's no desire for a "long term plan" because they aren't in business to be manufacturers or tech companies, but rather to extract money from companies for a while, then moving on to the next opportunity.
    Exactly... their track record isn't exactly the best... somehow Chrysler survived them...

    Posted via CB10
    10-15-13 11:59 PM
  9. SkinEgg's Avatar
    I personally do not trust Cerberus much. I have a feeling that a few months after they will make up excuses saying it is not possible to turn around and then will break the company apart.
    10-16-13 12:00 AM
  10. ankush77's Avatar
    I just want BB to remain building and improving on bb10. Don't care who owns them in the end.
    I think you are right in this regard ,but sometimes i think how the new company will turn out for more innovation in Harware

    Sent from my Z10 using Tapatalk now Free
    10-16-13 01:02 AM
  11. ankush77's Avatar
    you are right,lets see they dont tamper the good things which bb is known for
    10-16-13 01:04 AM
  12. bloodyrek's Avatar
    As a consumer, I could give a rat's rear about your investment. You took the risk knowing you might lose, just like any other investor.

    How quickly we forget about the employees and their families. I want BlackBerry to succeed but I mostly don't want to see the little people hurt because of executives who made poor decisions.
    BOLD: Yet they launching class action suits left and right but forgot "THEY" took the risk.


    Shame.
    10-16-13 01:17 AM
  13. szlevi's Avatar
    Simple: Cerberus will look and see that BB has a sizable inventory of BB10 phones, so they'll cut BB10 OS development to the bone, dump everyone involved on the hardware side, and focus on trying to sell BES10 to companies, along with as many of the existing BB10 phones as they have. Margins for these sales will be better, and they won't have to advertise - these sales are normally done via corporate account reps, so those guys will keep their jobs. I'd guess you'd see BB's headcount get reduced to 3,000 or less, total, which means another halving after this current 4,500 headcount reduction.

    The consumer market will be abandoned completely - consumer support staff eliminated, advertising eliminated, and dev promotions limited to business-relevant apps (maybe pushing for clients from SAP, Salesforce, Cisco, Citrix, etc.). You might be able to buy the phones direct from the website, but consumer carrier support will be withdrawn.

    After a year or 18 months, BB will be "profitable" on the books, and they'll either try to find a sucker to sell it to that can't figure out that they made the profit by sacrificing their future completely, OR they'll shutter the company at that point, after having milked every last dollar of profit out of it, and selling off the patents and anything else of value once they are no longer of use.

    Despite what they say (they made similar assurances to the gun companies: "It will be business as usual"), all they're looking to do is to extract the maximum dollars is the shortest time possible. That's what Private Equity does. There's no desire for a "long term plan" because they aren't in business to be manufacturers or tech companies, but rather to extract money from companies for a while, then moving on to the next opportunity.
    You left out the key part, where they take out a huge loan, pay it out as profits then shut down everything that's not sold off.
    10-16-13 02:05 AM
  14. Omnitech's Avatar
    BOLD: Yet they launching class action suits left and right but forgot "THEY" took the risk.

    Hardly unique to these companies. Many people these days seem to think that their role as an investor is to stick money in like a vending machine, and then automatically get profit out at the bottom.
    Nharzhool likes this.
    10-16-13 02:07 AM
  15. scribacco's Avatar
    Link to an article discussing it. BlackBerry Signs NDA with Cerberus Capital [REPORT]

    Cerberus has $10 billion less than FFH in assets, however, it sounds like they actually have their finances prepared, unlike FFH.

    I wouldn't mind if Cerberus took BB private. As long as it continues to produce competitive consumer items, I'm down.
    Cerberus almost ran Chrysler out of business
    10-16-13 02:30 AM
  16. scribacco's Avatar
    If Canada won't allow it then they should bail BlackBerry out.

    BBM channels: c00121c99 for some knowledge and c00123fca for some real hip hop
    yep let's throw taxpayer money in the toilet..didn't they write a letter saying that they are fine and all its good "we have lots of money in the bank and no debt"?
    Bailouts are for company with debts not companies that say they are fine. BB management is plain incompetent.
    kbz1960 likes this.
    10-16-13 02:36 AM
  17. Omnitech's Avatar
    ..didn't they write a letter saying that they are fine and all its good "we have lots of money in the bank and no debt"?
    Bailouts are for company with debts not companies that say they are fine. BB management is plain incompetent.

    One could certainly argue that a company that has no debt and nearly $3B in cash is not completely incompetent.
    Undbiter65 likes this.
    10-16-13 03:09 AM
  18. Dave79's Avatar
    All kinds of companies, and it's rarely good for them.

    About 10 years ago, they bought up a bunch of US gun manufacturers, many that had been in business for 60+ years (Marlin, Remington, Bushmaster, and several other big names, and some smaller ones). They immediately fired the most senior, experienced employees, discontinued 1/3 of the models, and consolidated production to the cheapest areas. Quality took a severe nosedive, and many popular models simply are no longer made. Of the dozen companies they bought, only 2/3 of the brands still exist, but there are only about half of the actual companies, as others are just brand names made by someone else today.

    They've done similar things in other industries as well. Make no mistake, PE companies aren't looking to run companies, they're looking to slash costs and "drive efficiencies" through contraction and consolidation, and then sell the companies for a profit quickly, before the effects of those changes become too apparent to the buyers.
    Well what do you expect? BB management screw up their own company and now you expect a charity organization to come in and help?!? Of course private equity come in to make profit but at least they have a small chance on keeping BB alive, well parts of it. The other alternative is selling the parts to the best bidder.
    10-16-13 03:59 AM
  19. Dave79's Avatar
    As a consumer, I could give a rat's rear about your investment. You took the risk knowing you might lose, just like any other investor.

    How quickly we forget about the employees and their families. I want BlackBerry to succeed but I mostly don't want to see the little people hurt because of executives who made poor decisions.
    Why would employees have less risks than an investor? The same risks that you mention for investors apply to employees too, it's not because you are hired by a company that you're getting the right of a life long employment there regardless of the performances. While I think the management made humongous mistakes I'm starting to think that BB is permeated by a slack off culture across the whole company.
    10-16-13 04:04 AM
  20. Bla1ze's Avatar
    Cerberus. Bad.

    (But alas, I believe nothing until it's signed, sealed and delivered)
    10-16-13 04:05 AM
  21. Dave79's Avatar
    Exactly... their track record isn't exactly the best... somehow Chrysler survived them...
    That was solely thank to FIAT ceo.
    hf199 likes this.
    10-16-13 04:09 AM
  22. Dave79's Avatar
    BOLD: Yet they launching class action suits left and right but forgot "THEY" took the risk.


    Shame.
    Fraud is different. The class action intent is to find out if the management committed a fraud. A fraud isnt part of the investment risk.
    10-16-13 04:14 AM
  23. BergerKing's Avatar
    Understand the distasteful aspects of this, but let's not go governmental and cause a shutdown. Thanks!
    kbz1960 likes this.
    10-16-13 09:08 AM
  24. BoldPreza's Avatar
    If Cerberus gets them say goodbye to BlackBerry.

    If its anything like the Chrysler deal where all they wanted was Chrysler Financial, well you get the idea of what will happen here only less publicly.
    jupiter8 likes this.
    10-16-13 09:26 AM
  25. kfh227's Avatar
    How about as a human being?


    Posted via CB10
    I'm not human

    Posted via CB10
    10-16-13 09:51 AM
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