04-01-14 10:24 PM
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  1. birdman_38's Avatar
    We should have seen TH and Mallick camped out on Instagram's doorstep begging for an app.... it was that important back then.
    What makes you think Thorsten Heins cared about big name apps?
    04-01-14 11:13 AM
  2. maddie1128's Avatar
    In case he checks the thread again.

    From where you sit, do you think BlackBerry will succeed and still be around in another 5 years?
    He went out and bought himself a BlackBerry AFTER getting let go......that shows he has some confidence in BB's future. IMO.
    Clanked likes this.
    04-01-14 12:00 PM
  3. Clanked's Avatar
    And Wii U.
    Good point, not only is it on wii U.....But they clearly customized the app for it, cause its phenomenal as I have it on my wii U.

    Posted via CB10
    04-01-14 12:25 PM
  4. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    Good point, not only is it on wii U.....But they clearly customized the app for it, cause its phenomenal as I have it on my wii U.

    Posted via CB10
    Wii U is in the same situation as Blackberry as well, they only sold 5.8 million units since it's launch in 2012. If anything, it's worse.
    IR Information : Sales Data - Hardware and Software Sales Units
    04-01-14 12:35 PM
  5. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    And Wii U.
    To be fair, the Wii U had a predecessor that sold 100 million units and was very successful for Netflix as an app platform. No doubt they probably expected a lot more out of it than they got.

    I'd wonder if they would be so excited to release on Wii U's successor ...
    04-01-14 12:37 PM
  6. 1magine's Avatar
    BS. RSA was not a big name app. But it is the biggest app for Enterprise users. Not available for Enterprise for months after launch. For those that don't know, RSA provides 128 bit secure authorization for enterprise users to gain remote access. Without RSA support most large government and enterprise houses would not even test the Z10 or Q10, let alone start buying them. Users in BYOD situations couldn't get them approved for use, and hence could not buy them. Not to mention the full BES solution BB10 devices relied on, was not available for months following launch. Everyone in mid management position and higher responsible for Enterprise development and developer relations should have been canned on launch day. The fact they weren't shows how utterly broken RIM/ BBRY was at the time. In fact how broken was RIM/BBRY, they made the guy responsible for bringing the Tour, Storm and Torch 9850 into this world the CEO (Thorstein). Now Chen is left to come in and start cleaning up. I would hope he would use a scalpel where necessary and a bozooka where necessary. Anyone defending Marty, TH or anyone making decisions at that time doesn't deserve to hold a BB.
    04-01-14 12:48 PM
  7. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Anyone defending Marty, TH or anyone making decisions at that time doesn't deserve to hold a BB.
    Really? And armchair know-it-alls who act as though they have all the answers, act like they're personally there to witness everything and a keen understanding of all the factors at play have that right?
    04-01-14 01:00 PM
  8. Clanked's Avatar
    Really? And armchair know-it-alls who act as though they have all the answers, act like they're personally there to witness everything and a keen understanding of all the factors at play have that right?
    We may or may not have the answers(i certainly dont) but Marty came out on launch day AND LIED to the community and public in general, the fact he is still working and in fact was promoted makes me feel sick as thats the type of guy that put blackberry in the position they are in.

    An if im wrong then someone from Crackberry come on here and tell me, but judging by Blazes comments he is as disturbed as I am by Brian being layed off, and guys like Marty still there.

    IMHO there is no defence for Mallick....go watch the launch day presentation he did......its damming.

    Posted via CB10
    04-01-14 01:05 PM
  9. 1magine's Avatar
    Lot of armchair CEOs nowadays :/

    Posted via CB10
    Partially wrong. Before BB10 launched, there were dozens of folks, myself included who were very vocal and concerned about the app situation. The situation started because BBOS was used well past it's useful life. The BBOS was ancient Java code and did not allow for any real storage. Hence apps had to be very small. As memory got cheaper and cheaper, handhelds began to use more RAM and storage. By 2010, most devices had a few gigs while BBs still had 256 megs or less of app space. While other platforms began to see rich app development BB saw developers giving up. They constantly had roadblocks put in their way because of the JAVA platform, because of BBRY management, because of the lack of development tools etc.. Eventually, you had major development houses bring really nice apps to market that would not even fit on a BB device. All this long before the expected and then delayed launch of BB10. The Playbook had a few purposes - one of the main ones was proof of concept. It was to be taken to developers to get the to start developing for BB10. And the biggest proof of how important apps was, was how the forums reacted to the ability to sideload android apps onto the playbook. That was many, many months before BB10 launched.

    SO yes lots of armchair CEOs, but many of us were saying the same thing those days as nowadays. This is not all 20/20 hindsight.
    04-01-14 01:06 PM
  10. sayf777's Avatar
    Truth be told until you know EVERYthing that happens behind the scenes it's very hard to judge.

    Posted via CB10
    04-01-14 01:15 PM
  11. 1magine's Avatar
    Really? And armchair know-it-alls who act as though they have all the answers, act like they're personally there to witness everything and a keen understanding of all the factors at play have that right?

    I've been here since 2008. Go back and find me one statement I've made now that is inconsistant with what I said then. In fact go back and look at warnings I repeatedly gave in 2009, 2010, 2011 and 2012. I warned about how much people liked those big touch screen devices. How while CRTs were way better than cheap flat panels, no one was still manufacturing them becuae that's not what people wanted. I identified the BYOD phenomenon well before BBRY/RIM and warned that all I saw were young professionals carrying two devices and begging IT to allow a switch. I warned that those young 20 somethings would soon rise up and have the power to demand more change. And I was not alone. So yeah, I had allot of the answers. And yeah I've been a member of this community for a long time. And yeah that's what these forums are for And yeah, I have the right, in my opinion, to come on in here and say those responsible for failure should be canned. That's my opinion. You disagree. I'm happy for you. I think you're wrong. And PS. - you don't have the first clue in Hades what I know of the internal workings at RIM.
    richardat likes this.
    04-01-14 01:16 PM
  12. 1magine's Avatar
    Res Ipsa Loquituer. If an air conditioner falls out of your apartment building on my head, I don't need to know everything that happened. In the very least it is negligence. In the case of RIM/BBRY not getting necessary apps and development done in a timely manner. I don't need to have heard every conversation, or read every e-mail. In the end the app and development situation cost RIM/ BBRY billions of dollars in lost sales, share price, and market share. There were failures here. In developing relationships. In setting goals, and timelines. in communication and expectation. The thing speaks for itself.
    04-01-14 01:29 PM
  13. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Go back and find me one statement I've made now that is inconsistant with what I said then. In fact go back and look at warnings I repeatedly gave in 2009, 2010, 2011 and 2012.
    You have a seriously inflated view of your own importance in the universe. Perhaps you should march on over to Waterloo and tell that chump, Chen to get out of your chair? Perhaps then you can show us how to turn BlackBerry around in 1 quarter, how to get all the brand name apps to sign up, increase BlackBerry 10 adoption and become profitability immediately.

    And PS. - you don't have the first clue in Hades what I know of the internal workings at RIM.
    Nor you of mine.
    04-01-14 02:24 PM
  14. 1magine's Avatar
    You have a seriously inflated view of your own importance in the universe. Perhaps you should march on over to Waterloo and tell that chump, Chen to get out of your chair? Perhaps then you can show us how to turn BlackBerry around in 1 quarter, how to get all the brand name apps to sign up, increase BlackBerry 10 adoption and become profitability immediately.



    Nor you of mine.
    You addressed me first with "...armchair know-it-alls who act as though they have all the answers, act like they're personally there to witness everything and a keen understanding of all the factors at play have that right..."

    I did not address you. My relation to the universe is not and was not at issue. You brought me into the darkness that is your universe. I merely responded with why I felt I knew better, because in-fact I did. Next, I dd not question what you knew about RIM, you questioned me about what I knew, and again I responded. So stop. If you are uncomfortable with airchair CEOs commenting on Blackberry, you should be no part of this forum or this site. You may disagree with the prevailing sentiment that Brian's departure and Marty's ascension is a travesty of justice and an abortion of common business sense; but attacking the messengers is petty and useless.
    04-01-14 02:59 PM
  15. mf1982's Avatar
    To be fair, the Wii U had a predecessor that sold 100 million units and was very successful for Netflix as an app platform. No doubt they probably expected a lot more out of it than they got.

    I'd wonder if they would be so excited to release on Wii U's successor ...
    Just like Sony, it's on Nintendo. They sell millions upon millions of DS's that are valuable to Netflix.

    I'm satisfied with the Android version and BB probably made the decision that it was better to do it that way than to pay Netflix et al ransom amount.

    I was going to email an acquaintance about possibly picking up a few PlayBooks for cheap, but now that I know there was some cleaning house I'm not sure I want to go down that road if he got swept up in any of it. He mentioned they were selling them off a couple of months ago and I could use a couple of cheap ones for various purposes still.
    04-01-14 03:40 PM
  16. Omnitech's Avatar
    What makes you think Thorsten Heins cared about big name apps?

    You get the prize for the most ridiculous thing I've seen written on Crackberry this week.

    That's a patently absurd statement. Mind bogglingly absurd.
    04-01-14 04:00 PM
  17. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    Just like Sony, it's on Nintendo. They sell millions upon millions of DS's that are valuable to Netflix.

    I'm satisfied with the Android version and BB probably made the decision that it was better to do it that way than to pay Netflix et al ransom amount.
    BINGO. If one thinks outside the box, it becomes apparent.
    04-01-14 04:16 PM
  18. mf1982's Avatar
    I think that's what hurts BlackBerry and other phone only (or primarily) companies. They don't have the power to demand those apps.

    What's 5 or 6 million BlackBerry 10 phones compared to 43 million 3DS's and 100 million Wii's or how many millions upon millions of PlayStations and Blu-ray players? Sony and Nintendo can go to Netflix and say "take all or take none" and it all of a sudden becomes valuable to create Vita or Wii U apps (although I am sure everyone involved in Wii U expected more).

    Even if Nokia had come up with their own real smartphone platform or the smaller guys like Firefox, they'll face that same challenge.

    Windows Phone has Windows and Xbox to work with. MSFT can strong arm developers to some extent. Imagine no Netflix on Xbox One. I'm pretty sure that there are enough 360 users on Netflix (it's my primary box) to ensure Netflix keeps that relationship going. Of course hardcore Netflix users would find other solutions, but it's those casual, "yeah I can get it on my console so what the heck" people that they'll lose (probably cheaper customers to service if they are just casual).

    Apple and Android simply have numbers.

    Posted via CB10
    UnlimitedEra likes this.
    04-01-14 04:45 PM
  19. birdman_38's Avatar
    That's a patently absurd statement. Mind bogglingly absurd.
    Ok, do you have anything to refute that statement?
    04-01-14 05:08 PM
  20. sixpacker's Avatar
    I think that's what hurts BlackBerry and other phone only (or primarily) companies. They don't have the power to demand those apps.

    What's 5 or 6 million BlackBerry 10 phones compared to 43 million 3DS's and 100 million Wii's or how many millions upon millions of PlayStations and Blu-ray players? Sony and Nintendo can go to Netflix and say "take all or take none" and it all of a sudden becomes valuable to create Vita or Wii U apps (although I am sure everyone involved in Wii U expected more).

    Even if Nokia had come up with their own real smartphone platform or the smaller guys like Firefox, they'll face that same challenge.

    Windows Phone has Windows and Xbox to work with. MSFT can strong arm developers to some extent. Imagine no Netflix on Xbox One. I'm pretty sure that there are enough 360 users on Netflix (it's my primary box) to ensure Netflix keeps that relationship going. Of course hardcore Netflix users would find other solutions, but it's those casual, "yeah I can get it on my console so what the heck" people that they'll lose (probably cheaper customers to service if they are just casual).

    Apple and Android simply have numbers.

    Posted via CB10
    The key was bb10 launch day.
    All major apps HAD to be available at this time. BlackBerry had to pay whatever was necessary to get these apps. If this was impossible then android runtime had to be made available to run android versions.
    Not having them killed bb10 from day 1.
    richardat likes this.
    04-01-14 05:20 PM
  21. Clanked's Avatar
    The key was bb10 launch day.
    All major apps HAD to be available at this time. BlackBerry had to pay whatever was necessary to get these apps. If this was impossible then android runtime had to be made available to run android versions.
    Not having them killed bb10 from day 1.
    It significantly hurt bb10 success chanes. No Netflix, and Instagram took a lot of people by surprise at the time even Kevin and Blaze if memory serves me.......Not to mention many of the apps Marty mentions in his cocky "WHERE ARE THEY....THEY'RE ON BLACKBERRY 10!!" never even came........such a debacle at the time. Such an embarrassment!

    Posted via CB10
    richardat likes this.
    04-01-14 05:29 PM
  22. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Ok, do you have anything to refute that statement?
    Um - the fact that he had two teams, hundreds of millions of dollars and a load of recruiting to get apps on board

    Posted via CB10
    04-01-14 05:41 PM
  23. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    I did not address you. My relation to the universe is not and was not at issue. You brought me into the darkness that is your universe.
    You're right. I lost my temper and it isn't cool. But I confess, ignorance bothers the hell out of me. Ditto for the snap judgements about what people do or don't do and deserve/don't deserve based upon people who haven't walked a mile in their shoes. And it burns my *** when people suggest that anyone who comes to CrackBerry.com doesn't deserve to hold a BlackBerry because they don't personally agree with statements that are - in many respects, formed out of (at least some substantial) ignorance of the situation.


    Let's be honest here as well: Thorsten Heins and John Chen both showed they were more than willing to fire C levels and VPs ... as both quickly and decisively got rid of them when necessary. Given the fact that Marty has now served under four CEOs (Mike and Jim too), there's obviously something about him that has made people want to keep him on and give him more responsibility when others like Frank Boulben, Karima Bawa, David Yach, Al Brenner and others did not survive. And it's also possible that they have complete visibility of what he was up against and how he performed against those obstacles. Maybe he's really adept at quickly getting blackmail material on CEOs, but I doubt it.

    If you are uncomfortable with airchair CEOs commenting on Blackberry, you should be no part of this forum or this site.
    You are right. Unfortunately, they still haven't created the "weed out armchair know-it-all" filters in order to get to the good discussions so if I avoided the site, I'd miss a lot of the good that comes from here too, like news about apps, how to resolve issues, the latest news etc.
    TGR1 and Omnitech like this.
    04-01-14 05:50 PM
  24. richardat's Avatar
    You addressed me first with "...armchair know-it-alls who act as though they have all the answers, act like they're personally there to witness everything and a keen understanding of all the factors at play have that right..."

    I did not address you. My relation to the universe is not and was not at issue. You brought me into the darkness that is your universe. I merely responded with why I felt I knew better, because in-fact I did. Next, I dd not question what you knew about RIM, you questioned me about what I knew, and again I responded. So stop. If you are uncomfortable with airchair CEOs commenting on Blackberry, you should be no part of this forum or this site. You may disagree with the prevailing sentiment that Brian's departure and Marty's ascension is a travesty of justice and an abortion of common business sense; but attacking the messengers is petty and useless.
    Yeah....many of us called the apps...and their importance many times during, before, and after launch. It was of primary importance to me.
    Last edited by sleepngbear; 04-01-14 at 07:35 PM. Reason: Flushed personal insult
    04-01-14 06:36 PM
  25. Omnitech's Avatar
    Ok, do you have anything to refute that statement?
    Are you serious?

    It is so completely ridiculous that it would be like someone asking me to prove that humans breathe air.

    YOU suggested that Thorsten Heins did not care about big name apps. I suggest YOU prove YOUR mind-bogglingly ridiculous assertion before asking others to prove to you that the sky is blue.
    04-01-14 06:48 PM
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