09-27-13 06:41 PM
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  1. Jennifer Ryans's Avatar
    And because of that debt... I don't see them being interested in taking any chances with BB10.
    Of course, aside from Fairfax there are other pension and investment organizations involved, they are not in this for the long run.
    09-23-13 03:26 PM
  2. LP_Rigg's Avatar
    Of course there are some external factors that affect the market, the Quantitative Easing that has been going on has propped up a very weak market. But, none of that really comes into play in the BBRY situation. BBRY has dug their own grave, now they have to lie in it.
    Could not agree more. But, there has been a confluence of events over the last years, months, weeks and days, some within BBRY's control and some not. The one thing, in my opinion, they did right was produce a solid OS and phone (Z10 for me). But timing and execution of deployment has been nothing less than horrific.
    Grumblegrumble likes this.
    09-23-13 03:27 PM
  3. co4nd's Avatar
    If I were Heins, I would be embarrassed by that offer.
    It's a fair offer. Nobody else wants to buy them.
    LP_Rigg likes this.
    09-23-13 03:27 PM
  4. Jennifer Ryans's Avatar
    Could not agree more. But, there has been a confluence of events over the last years, months, weeks and days, some within BBRY's control and some not. The one thing, in my opinion, they did right was produce a solid OS and phone (Z10 for me). But timing and execution of deployment has been nothing less than horrific.
    Unfortunately for BBRY they already hemorrhaged so much market share, getting that back is near impossible right now. The mistakes made back in 2007- 2009 are the ones hurting this company now.
    LP_Rigg likes this.
    09-23-13 03:32 PM
  5. LP_Rigg's Avatar
    Get ready for a CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT... this deal will not fly
    Well that would quite possibly be the death knell for BlackBerry. Assuming from your moniker you are a shareholder in BBRY. Godspeed to you with that...
    09-23-13 03:33 PM
  6. LP_Rigg's Avatar
    Unfortunately for BBRY they already hemorrhaged so much market share, getting that back is near impossible right now. The mistakes made back in 2007- 2009 are the ones hurting this company now.
    Yes "near" impossible. I just hope I can get my hands on a Z30 before/if they pull up their tents. I will worry about moving to some other crappy OS in a couple years.
    09-23-13 03:38 PM
  7. mkmilan's Avatar
    Going private isn't going to make BB management smarter.
    09-23-13 03:39 PM
  8. shiftymagoo's Avatar
    No it will not be the BlackBerry as we know it, which is a good thing.

    It will no longer be beholden to shareholders, subject to the whims of crass stock analysts and others. The owners will be beholden only to themselves and to protect their capital investment.
    Umm the company buying them is still public.... and come from a "we're here to make money" kind of mindset not a "lets develop new products and go to market and compete" kind of mindset.

    If we all take a step back its pretty clear that they bought a parts car and plan to part it out and sell the parts quick to make a buck. NO ONE WILL BE TRYING TO RESURECT ANYTHING.
    09-23-13 03:41 PM
  9. currentodysseys's Avatar
    Fairfax Financial - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Look at the general investment line of Fairfax and then second grade (stock acquisitions). Also looking at the board should tell you something.

    three layers deep to see where Fairfax is moving its assets would be a good start to have a look as to how BBRY would be able to play a role in their portfolio (since it is a buy out).

    Somehow Rogers seem to be a part of it and when you see banks, property and insurance along with tec.
    have a look at MFXchange Holdings, Inc.: Private Company Information - Businessweek as well.

    I think it shows what kind of sectors can be serviced by BBRYs assets. I am not fully into it, as to just have had a look, but it looks like BB10 can play a quite significant role as the "carrying platform" to connect these solutions in servicing the industries involved.

    Just food for thought, my guess is as good as anyone's...

    Lets wait and see
    09-23-13 03:41 PM
  10. bobshine's Avatar
    Really? Want to bet they dont sell off pieces of the company? The profit is from breaking up the company, not trying to revive it.
    Watsa had been very vocal about believing in BlackBerry. Also it's a consortium of buyer, most probably including Mike L since he still owns 5% of BlackBerry. I doubt he'll want to break up his baby

    Posted via CB10
    09-23-13 03:54 PM
  11. xandermac's Avatar
    How long do you think they are going to want to hold onto it for?? They certainly are not going to want to continue manufacturing phones that do not sell. That leaves the operating system and the patents. Doesnt take long to unload those.
    Won't even take a year. No one wants that liability on the books. They may keep the patents and license them but that's about all they'll keep, if anything.


    Sent from my 4s using TapaTalk
    09-23-13 04:47 PM
  12. mopar_fxr's Avatar
    not to be terribly optimistic, but Prem Watsa was indeed ( for a short stint none the less) chairman of RIM correct?
    maybe it is an attempt at a save.
    Working for Chrysler (dealer level but still Chrysler) these were fears when Mercedes and more recently Fiat had bought into Chrysler (now LLC). Granted neither bought Chrysler as a whole, but there were the splitting talks and what not. Guess what... Mercedes bought Chrysler in 1998, Fiat almost 2 years ago... All brands are still under one roof.
    Figure if some of us where hopeful and optimistic enough to keep it to this time in the game why jump now. Yes, 4.7 bid is in, 2.6 is sitting there, possible 3 branches to sell, but how much are they really worth separate? true, BBM could survive on its own, handsets, they would most likely struggle and die, enterprise, thats a lot, but to integrate into some other companies server or software... how well would that really work and be worth it? Now by no means do I say I know MUCH a bout the topic at all, so please dont slam me. Just a blue collar worker that tries to keep some tabs and understand.
    Maybe a little better marketing, a little better business sense, less worrying from the public and things may turn around. I dont see a complete 180 and 50% of the market again, but maybe a niche market and survive?
    As said before by many others, none of us REALLY know what is going on, and wont until Nov 4th... and that is IF it goes. Until then, we are all arm chair CEO's and either the glass is half empty or half full.
    Me personally, look at it half full... of whiskey. It has the potential to go up, but it is a little fuzzy.
    Pdinos3 likes this.
    09-23-13 04:52 PM
  13. kevinnugent's Avatar
    I realize words and actions often differ, but it doesn't sound like they're intending to break up BB:
    Prem Watsa, Chairman and CEO of Fairfax, said: "We believe this transaction will open an exciting new private chapter for BlackBerry, its customers, carriers and employees. We can deliver immediate value to shareholders, while we continue the execution of a long-term strategy in a private company with a focus on delivering superior and secure enterprise solutions to BlackBerry customers around the world."
    But you also note he says Enterprise customers. Not consumers.
    09-23-13 04:54 PM
  14. ssbtech's Avatar
    But you also note he says Enterprise customers. Not consumers.
    Unless they're getting out of the handset business altogether and ditching BB10, there will be consumer phones. No phone manufacturer can exist selling only business phones. Case in point: BlackBerry.
    09-23-13 05:02 PM
  15. bambinoitaliano's Avatar
    Someone ought to investigate the CEO and the board of directors in collude with Prem Watsa intentionally devaluing the company. The timing of negative news release by the company one after another that leads to today stock market price. Talk about insider trading.
    qwerty4ever likes this.
    09-23-13 05:04 PM
  16. kevinnugent's Avatar
    Unless they're getting out of the handset business altogether and ditching BB10, there will be consumer phones. No phone manufacturer can exist selling only business phones. Case in point: BlackBerry.
    BES is the jewel he wants. The rest will be sold IMO..
    09-23-13 05:11 PM
  17. Jennifer Ryans's Avatar
    Watsa had been very vocal about believing in BlackBerry. Also it's a consortium of buyer, most probably including Mike L since he still owns 5% of BlackBerry. I doubt he'll want to break up his baby

    Posted via CB10
    Stop with all the Mike L crap, he isnt a part of this now and will not be in the future. The other players are pension funds and other investment firms. Watsa doesnt need or want Mike L in this deal.
    09-23-13 05:21 PM
  18. danprown's Avatar
    To succeed in "enterprise" Blackberry's BES needs to overcome several hurdles:

    1. BYOD (companies like to offload the cost of devices to their employees);
    2. App Containererization (obliviating the need for a hardware devices);
    3. Competition in the field (which is increasingly backed by deep pockets and the whole pie is not that big anyway; see the Garnter reports; Blackberry does not even tell you how many customers it has signed up! I bet half of the reported number are test servers in India since the India chief said they had 14,000 a while ago. How many of those customers will continue to be customers if BYOD is out of the question);
    4. Talent (Blackberry is devoid of Sillicon Valley talent necessary for survival in a pure software setting; its "talent" comes form telecommunications firms, carriers, and now... drumroll... an Insurance/Investment wonder-boy (called the N-word by incredibly influential US hedge funds) will be at the helm.);
    5. Security theatre upside down (Snowden leaks have shown that the NSA is so deep in corporations in Australia, Canada, New Zealand, the United Kingdom, and the United States, not to mention international security standards, that anything these corporations say cannot be trusted about "security").

    Going private does not address 1 point. If Fairfax Financials had so much clout that it can mandate subsidiaries or companies it has an interest in to use Blackberry, then why wait until now when it will carry 2.5 Bil in financing and has to pay interest on it? So, a Larry-the-liquidator outcome is what remains likely.
    richardat likes this.
    09-23-13 06:05 PM
  19. Wilsonia Goldens's Avatar
    And the rich 1% just got richer and the rest of us got the shaft!
    FSeverino likes this.
    09-23-13 06:06 PM
  20. FSeverino's Avatar
    BES is the jewel he wants. The rest will be sold IMO..
    I think BES is the reason for the buy, but that they will want to grow the rest of the company a bit before a sale of the parts... IF what you think is true.

    personally, i think that if they bring in a solid management group with a guided direction for the company they can grow the company back very well in about a year or two... then it becomes an issue of selling for a profit or holding/growing for a potentially bigger profit.

    I do agree 100% that right now BBs only chance is with BES and the enterprise market... but i think that the mention of carriers is because they would still like to sell hardware, and if they are doing that for enterprise it would make sense to open the sales up to anyone who wanted to buy it. No marketing, advertising... just the ability for a regular consumer to KNOW that they can buy the phone if they wish. im not sure how this would work, but i know many phones are sold only through request.
    09-23-13 06:07 PM
  21. M65c02's Avatar
    Here it is baby, any more questions?? Right on time and almost exactly as forecast: Concurrent with the expected horrendous earnings results this week. "Wait for them to come pounce." BB was forced to let the cat out of the bag last week with prelim earnings knowing that a couple of suitors (okay maybe only one) were waiting in the wings.

    Fairfax goes way, way back. Lots and lots of investment history here guys. ... and this isn't the prettiest of marriages albeit it is expedient and stays in the Canadian backyard. Only one thing is guaranteed: Notwithstanding the Canadian govt somehow tweeting in the Fairfax ears to be nice, there won't be any silk purses soon made in Waterloo. These guys are as clean as a dirt bike racer in a rain storm. (I would also not expect an increase in any sensitive govt (outside Canada) contracts coming with this new structure.)

    H'mm, still I'm shocked ... tough to see value for more than $7 a share for a private suitor and especially for Fairfax. Projections were for much closer to $7-8/share but the deal isn't done yet. Actually the price appears to be close to $9 on the ~485mm shares of float (not on the market cap), Still, as already the largest institutional holder of BB shares, Fairfax can play on its financials with this private investment valuation for a few extra years. So, be assured, Fairfax knows all the tricks to turn a profit.

    Look for a relatively quick sale of some BB assets to get back maybe half its investment concurrent with a patch job on the remainder to dump it in another sale, or back on the market, in three years. Still, Prem might look at this as a personal ego challenge to take on the big boys in the industry .... Nahhh, LOL, just kidding, it's all about turning the BB investment buck quickly.

    [Note: If this stalls, BB will fall to $5/share overnight. This would just be history repeating itself. Our BB should--and will--take $9 and run...]
    Last edited by M65c02; 09-25-13 at 01:32 PM.
    richardat likes this.
    09-23-13 06:24 PM
  22. bobshine's Avatar
    Stop with all the Mike L crap, he isnt a part of this now and will not be in the future. The other players are pension funds and other investment firms. Watsa doesnt need or want Mike L in this deal.
    What makes you think they don't want him in? If Mike L wasn't interested, be would had sold his stake in BlackBerry a long time ago... especially knowing that Watsa had became the biggest shareholder and had been very vocal about bringing the company private.

    Posted via CB10
    09-23-13 06:30 PM
  23. kevinnugent's Avatar
    What makes you think they don't want him in? If Mike L wasn't interested, be would had sold his stake in BlackBerry a long time ago... especially knowing that Watsa had became the biggest shareholder and had been very vocal about bringing the company private.

    Posted via CB10
    If Mike L isn't included in this deal he's toast with the rest of the shareholders. He doesn't get to keep his 5% aside.
    09-23-13 06:38 PM
  24. kevinnugent's Avatar
    You know, just thinking about this for a minute, Microsoft may think this is very cheap. Consider this. They bid $4.8bn. They get 2.6bn in cash straight back, the NOC, Enterprise everything..... They pee that amount every week. This bid may draw them out.
    Poirots Progeny likes this.
    09-23-13 06:45 PM
  25. freedomx20a's Avatar
    Obvious BID was coming when 4500 people were laid off.
    09-23-13 06:51 PM
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