11-10-13 02:21 AM
47 12
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  1. Bold_until_Hybrid_Comes's Avatar
    I think you don't understand that there are people buying the phones. We have a kinds of Z10s, Q10s and now a Z30 in our company. Just because it isn't selling in the tens of millions, it doesn't mean it is a failure. If Blackberry has to limit production to meet demand and make money, then that is a goal to try and achieve.
    People are not buying the phones. Just because your company has them does not mean the whole world does. And yes, just because it hasn't sold tens of millions does mean it's a failure. The admitted goal was to be the third largest platform. The claim was that tens of millions would sell. Also, the main thing to focus on is the horrendous quarterly financial numbers. If you don't think the numbers represent BlackBerry 10 as a failure you are delusional. The 4500 layoffs weren't planned a year ago- it is a result of the failure of BlackBerry 10.
    JeepBB, mikeo007 and CairnsRock like this.
    11-05-13 02:16 PM
  2. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    Personally, I think you are wrong and I don't see any future handsets. The cash burn rate is way too high to develop and launch new products. Plus they've destroyed key relationships with carriers, suppliers and partners. They are pushing their valuable assets, BBM,
    Mdm, plus patents.
    Also, Xiaomi just sell apple clones in China, can't see this model having much bearing on the global market.
    First, if anything, Xiaomi sells Samsung or Sony clones. Xiaomi phones look nothing like iPhones. Maybe a tiny bit like the 5C since Xiaomi comes in a lot of colors. Regardless, the point was that in 2012, they were a much smaller company than BlackBerry, but they managed to sell a similarly specced phone to the Z10 for half the price. Various analysts have stated they believe Xiaomi makes about 10% on their handsets. As for whether they can make a global impact..... who knows, but they have big ambitions.

    Now back on point, there might not be any NEWLY DESIGNED future handsets, but they'll keep making phones. Let's say by some miracle they sell out of their inventory of Z10s. $1B write down probably means they started with 4-5 million phones, not too far a stretch to say they'll sell out by first quarter of next year or middle of next year. They'll make more. By then BoM on the Z10 will probably be close to $100, at which point, selling them for $200-300 isn't a bad proposition. Maybe they'll make a Z11 with slightly more modern specs and try to sell it for $400 like the Q5.
    11-05-13 02:19 PM
  3. SEAWARRIOR's Avatar
    Actually Chen isn't even in the seat yet.. not for another few weeks. But I believe his statement today was very clear. BlackBerry will not be shutting down the handset division at this time.

    That said, it was announced that Chen is an interim CEO, and it remains to be seen what that means. Is he in the chair for s few weeks? A few months? Until they find the right guy? Or is he the turn around CEO who will remain until the company returns to profit, even if that's years and then exit with a big bonus? No idea as of yet.. and it's possible his successor could have different plans.. BUT I would think that statement was made today will the full support of Prem, the new chairman of the board, who both Chen and any potential new CEO will answer to.. so I believe the vision for the forseable future will be to maintain the handset division.
    Posted via CB10
    just because they've changed drivers, doesn't mean they've changed the road they're on, or that they're any more trustworthy,,, "won't be shutting down the handset division ***@ this time***", sounds similar to "all playbooks" will be getting bb10,,, consider everything to be a possible option,,, unless you're sitting in the room w/ 1st hand knowledge, it's all speculation...
    11-05-13 02:29 PM
  4. FFR's Avatar
    You did by saying BB10 is dead. What will they do?
    SAAS, hence the new CEO, it's kind of his specialty.
    Sucks to be blackberry.
    JeepBB likes this.
    11-05-13 04:13 PM
  5. FFR's Avatar
    Because for BlackBerry in their current situation, there is no alternative. All of their other businesses flow from the handsets. Stop making the handsets, they may as well close the doors, turn the lights out, and call it a decade. The fact they went out and got another billion in financing says they're not planning to shut down operations any time in the immediate future.. Now, whether they succeed in their newest attempt at a revival is another matter entirely. I have very strong doubts about their long term viability, but they're not going to stop making handsets.
    BB's hardware days are over. The writing is on the wall. Releasing cross platform bbm was the fat lady singing.



    Whether it'll be any more successful than BB10 is up for question, but at this time, it couldn't possibly do any worse.
    Actually they could.
    JeepBB likes this.
    11-05-13 04:19 PM
  6. richardat's Avatar
    Two things to say:
    1.I've long said that BB10 is DOA, and thus, Bb's time as a large manufacturer of handsets as well. Maybe if any part of BB survives and they can make a go of a boutique/business niche handset businesss....so it's only a matter of time before the reality is public on this matter

    2.Chen only said he has "no plans' at the moment...he also said when asked about whether they would discontinue hardware that nothing was off the table....so no, "no plans" is no assurance - even if you believe he would never lie or never change his mind! According to him, he hasn't made up his mind yet - or perhaps more accurately hasn't committed to any detailed plan yet.
    JeepBB likes this.
    11-05-13 06:15 PM
  7. CairnsRock's Avatar
    Blackberry doesn't make the hardware, so they need to order in large amounts to bring the cost/unit down in order to turn a profit. They're currently not selling enough units to make a profit, and limiting their production to meet demand will increase the cost/unit resulting in a loss.
    They lose money either way.
    Totally correct. Bbry is currently behaving like a charity not a business while they are still in the handset business.

    Also Chen said employees need to think in terms of phones for software and services solutions. He did NOT say bbry phones.
    JeepBB likes this.
    11-05-13 07:40 PM
  8. Bold_until_Hybrid_Comes's Avatar
    From the Kevin interview, here is a quote from Chen:

    "People are asking me about handsets -- “are you going to get out of the handset business” -- and that’s really ridiculous of them to say that. I don’t even know what that means "



    I find it concerning that he doesn't know what getting out of the handset business means...
    11-05-13 07:52 PM
  9. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    From the Kevin interview, here is a quote from Chen:

    "People are asking me about handsets -- “are you going to get out of the handset business” -- and that’s really ridiculous of them to say that. I don’t even know what that means "



    I find it concerning that he doesn't know what getting out of the handset business means...
    And it is nice to know you don't post the whole quote. I find it concerning that you don't know what Blackberry is and the services it provides. Chen knows..
    and on top of that, the majority of all our revenue and our customer interaction is with handsets, so I’m not quite sure why anybody would say that on account of a “big picture” thing. I know a lot of people like those sound bytes, but those sound bytes coming from somebody like me right now being reasonably new to the picture, it’s irresponsible.
    I have to say this Kevin, and you know this very well... what is BlackBerry without the device? The question is, can we do more in that?
    The SAAS that Blackberry provides integrates with a handset device that is integrated at the OS level. Thanks for playing.
    just_luc likes this.
    11-05-13 08:24 PM
  10. Bold_until_Hybrid_Comes's Avatar
    And it is nice to know you don't post the whole quote. I find it concerning that you don't know what Blackberry is and the services it provides. Chen knows..




    The SAAS that Blackberry provides integrates with a handset device that is integrated at the OS level. Thanks for playing.
    It still says what I quoted. Not sure where you are trying to go with this
    11-05-13 08:26 PM
  11. just_luc's Avatar
    I know where he is trying to go and I agree with him wholeheartedly. Chen has been very clear in that statement and in the others he has made. He intends to focus on software and services by selling devices with said software on them. That's what he's saying.. anyone reading diffrent in his statements doing so purely because they want to.

    I'm not saying that may not change in the future.. I don't claim to know that. I don't think he could know that himself at this time. But that's what he is saying at this moment.

    Posted via CB10
    11-06-13 11:21 PM
  12. trsbbs's Avatar
    It's way to early for the new interm CEO to know or anyone else at BlackBerry to know.
    All future plans are probably up in the air until the new management get put into place and they find out exactly what's going on.

    Give it a month or two.

    Posted via CB10 on a Verizon Z10 running 10.2.0.1791
    11-06-13 11:40 PM
  13. guitarrista's Avatar
    Now that I have had some time to mull over the interviews, quotes, and outside commentary, is it starting to look to me like handsets are unlikely to be part of the way forward for BBRY.

    The new boss is a software guy. He wants to focus the company on software and services. He will look for a new CEO who comes from a software background. The hardware business bleeds cash and has a deeply negative valuation. Sales of the new BB10 devices have been poor and show little momentum.

    We will have to wait and see what happens, but my suspicion is BBRY will get out of the hardware business. The decision won't be long in coming, as the cash infusion from the convertible issue was not that large, and the burn rate is significant - if slowing somewhat.
    11-07-13 09:01 AM
  14. The Aficionado's Avatar
    I suspect that what they will do is manufacture them on a more limited basis and market them directly to companies who are getting bes10 servers

    Consumers will be able to buy them online. But they won't try to distribute them to the regular say Rogers or Verizon stores anymore. Maybe they could have them avaliable at select stores in areas where blackberry is comparatively popular like toronto, nyc, Bali

    Posted via CB10
    11-07-13 07:54 PM
  15. app_Developer's Avatar
    First, if anything, Xiaomi sells Samsung or Sony clones. Xiaomi phones look nothing like iPhones. Maybe a tiny bit like the 5C since Xiaomi comes in a lot of colors. Regardless, the point was that in 2012, they were a much smaller company than BlackBerry, but they managed to sell a similarly specced phone to the Z10 for half the price. Various analysts have stated they believe Xiaomi makes about 10% on their handsets. As for whether they can make a global impact..... who knows, but they have big ambitions.
    Well, Xiaomi isn't paying thousands of salaries at Canadian rates, with Canadian payroll taxes, and Canadian benefits. I don't know if BlackBerry can really compete in a low margin field.

    Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
    11-07-13 08:08 PM
  16. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    It's the typical double speak that changes according to the audience.

    Posted via CB10
    11-08-13 04:45 AM
  17. Admorris's Avatar
    All I know is that this entire debacle is becoming laughable. Not sure where BB goes to find their management, but they appear to be consistently horrible at it. You guys will build this guy up to be the next coming of Christ over the next several monts...chastise anyone that says any different...then be shocked in about a year when BB tanks even further (if possible). This is just like an ugly replay over the last several years...lol

    Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
    11-08-13 02:57 PM
  18. FFR's Avatar
    All I know is that this entire debacle is becoming laughable. Not sure where BB goes to find their management, but they appear to be consistently horrible at it. You guys will build this guy up to be the next coming of Christ over the next several monts...chastise anyone that says any different...then be shocked in about a year when BB tanks even further (if possible). This is just like an ugly replay over the last several years...lol

    Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

    Everybody keeps blaming management, but it's the board that NEEDS to be replaced.
    11-09-13 08:44 AM
  19. richardat's Avatar
    Also want to mention that what Chen meant in the quote here is, what I have also said: what else is there? What are we going to do??

    As in, handsets are/was our primary business, even though it has died, what else can we do?? It's what I answered when people questioned why z30 was released....well what else is there to do??

    That doesn't mean that handsets are in the long-term or even medium to short term plan...it just means that at the moment, that's we do. The real plan (if there is one aside from selling) may well be: get out of handsets ASAP, and into other business models entirely, but at the moment Chen is right: what is BB if they stop making handsets right now...well....it is...not much (compared to what they were). A few very small (relatively) other products.

    Of course even if that were the plan, Chen would not want to ever say that...and to his credit so far...he has not promised - or even really implied - it isn't.
    11-09-13 07:23 PM
  20. rim_investor's Avatar
    The heavy lifting by getting BB10 out the door has been done. Future phones and software releases should require less resources.

    Posted via my AWESOME Z10 on CB10
    11-09-13 09:06 PM
  21. rim_investor's Avatar
    Can you say the launch and roll out of BB10 phones was poorly executed with little carrier support or were the BB10 products just bad. Pretty sure it's the former. This can be fixed with much better execution. That is the reality. Sentiment can be changed.

    Posted via my AWESOME Z10 on CB10
    11-09-13 09:16 PM
  22. FFR's Avatar
    The heavy lifting by getting BB10 out the door has been done. Future phones and software releases should require less resources.

    Posted via my AWESOME Z10 on CB10
    Actually the industry is shifting to 64 bit architecture & bb does not have the resources or the talent left to successfully transition bb10 from 32 bit to 64.

    Bb are just unable to compete vertically (software + hardware) any more.
    11-10-13 02:21 AM
47 12

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