11-10-13 01:21 AM
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  1. popengchan's Avatar
    I've read in some articles that John Chen has no plans in shutting down its smartphone making business, like so in this article:

    BlackBerry handset division future: company will still make phones | BGR

    But I saw another one that they may focus more on the software rather than devices, and later focus on getting out of the device production, like this recent article:

    APPY Geek

    So which is it? I know that this is to early to tell, as John Chen is not even two minutes on the CEO seat, but two different articles stating the opposite is just something to notice right? So which statement is really the most accurate?

    I'm really interested with this one, as shutting down their beautiful devices is much too horrid to think about

    Sent from my GT-N7105 using CB Forums mobile app
    Last edited by popengchan; 11-04-13 at 11:36 PM.
    11-04-13 05:13 PM
  2. Elite1's Avatar
    It's all conjecture at this point.

    The most current public info is what John Chen said today.

    Cliche, but only time will tell.
    11-04-13 05:16 PM
  3. diegonei's Avatar
    You really shouldn't be going to BGR for any serious news...

    Answer is: not.

    BlackBerry has no plans to shut down handset business | CrackBerry.com
    11-04-13 05:17 PM
  4. c_legaspi's Avatar
    I don't think bgr was the only one that reported it. I could be wrong tho

    Posted via CB10
    11-04-13 09:36 PM
  5. just_luc's Avatar
    I know that this is to early to tell, as John Chen is not even two minutes on the CEO seat, but...
    Actually Chen isn't even in the seat yet.. not for another few weeks. But I believe his statement today was very clear. BlackBerry will not be shutting down the handset division at this time.

    That said, it was announced that Chen is an interim CEO, and it remains to be seen what that means. Is he in the chair for s few weeks? A few months? Until they find the right guy? Or is he the turn around CEO who will remain until the company returns to profit, even if that's years and then exit with a big bonus? No idea as of yet.. and it's possible his successor could have different plans.. BUT I would think that statement was made today will the full support of Prem, the new chairman of the board, who both Chen and any potential new CEO will answer to.. so I believe the vision for the forseable future will be to maintain the handset division.



    Posted via CB10
    popengchan likes this.
    11-04-13 10:14 PM
  6. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    They can't shut down the handset division. What are they going to do if they stop making handsets? Sell BBM? It's free. I guess they could go into the sticker and social game business like Line, but that's not going to happen any time soon. Survive on selling BES? Who's going to buy BES without any handsets? What else is left? The NOC? Stop selling handsets and where's that going? That business is already going down, but you stop making the handsets and it goes down even faster. Basically for BlackBerry, no handsets = no business. They just have to figure out a way to make money on the handset business, maybe take some lessons from the Chinese makers.
    Bluenoser63 and popengchan like this.
    11-04-13 10:28 PM
  7. FFR's Avatar
    They can't shut down the handset division. What are they going to do if they stop making handsets? Sell BBM? It's free. I guess they could go into the sticker and social game business like Line, but that's not going to happen any time soon. Survive on selling BES? Who's going to buy BES without any handsets? What else is left? The NOC? Stop selling handsets and where's that going? That business is already going down, but you stop making the handsets and it goes down even faster. Basically for BlackBerry, no handsets = no business. They just have to figure out a way to make money on the handset business, maybe take some lessons from the Chinese makers.
    What's the point in making a handset that attracts little to no demand?

    What's the alternative becoming an android handset vendor?
    JeepBB likes this.
    11-05-13 04:19 AM
  8. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    What's the point in making a handset that attracts little to no demand?

    What's the alternative becoming an android handset vendor?
    Please stop with the Android crap. That would kill the company faster than anything.
    11-05-13 04:32 AM
  9. FFR's Avatar
    Please stop with the Android crap. That would kill the company faster than anything.
    Your mistaken if you think I'm a proponent of blackberry going android, I'm not.
    However the fact remains bb10 is practically dead. What is the alternative?
    Bb11? Blackberry no longer commands the resources for such an endeavor.
    JeepBB and richardat like this.
    11-05-13 04:37 AM
  10. JasW's Avatar
    On the one hand, you have a BBRY executive saying one thing. As we all know, everything every BBRY executive has ever said has turned out to be the truth and nothing but the truth.

    On the other hand, you have the opinions of various analysts to the contrary, as reflected in this AP wire story:

    News from The Associated Press

    Of course, the analysts have all been wrong about BBRY given the incredible success of BB10 in the marketplace and all of the developers clamoring to get into BB World.

    Cue the Squircle of Denial: "But, but $1 billion!" "But, but BBM!"

    The Z30 is the end of the line, IMHO.
    11-05-13 06:09 AM
  11. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    Your mistaken if you think I'm a proponent of blackberry going android, I'm not.
    However the fact remains bb10 is practically dead. What is the alternative?
    Bb11? Blackberry no longer commands the resources for such an endeavor.
    WP7 was dead too. WP8 was too until recently. It would take much more resources to throw away BB10 and start over.
    11-05-13 06:11 AM
  12. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    On the one hand, you have a BBRY executive saying one thing. As we all know, everything every BBRY executive has ever said has turned out to be the truth and nothing but the truth.

    On the other hand, you have the opinions of various analysts to the contrary, as reflected in this AP wire story:

    News from The Associated Press

    Of course, the analysts have all been wrong about BBRY given the incredible success of BB10 in the marketplace and all of the developers clamoring to get into BB World.

    Cue the Squircle of Denial: "But, but $1 billion!" "But, but BBM!"

    The Z30 is the end of the line, IMHO.
    And that is only an opinion.
    treidnote likes this.
    11-05-13 06:12 AM
  13. Patrick Pierobon's Avatar
    These reporters just have to chill out and let the news come out over a few days. They think because they have been doing this for years maybe months, most a few days, that they are god's gift to world of blackberry news. It drives me insane how much crap is written on nothing about blackberry. You want news, hear it from the CEO and public interview from blackberry.
    11-05-13 06:17 AM
  14. cgk's Avatar
    Does it matter what BBRY plans to do with handsets because the more powerful bodies - carriers and consumers have already spoken and we know their answer.

    If you build a handset and nobody buys or stocks it - does it exist?
    JeepBB and bbq10l like this.
    11-05-13 07:25 AM
  15. ElGusta's Avatar
    Blackberry has no plan.

    The will do whatever they're prime investor of the day wishes.
    11-05-13 07:53 AM
  16. ElGusta's Avatar
    These reporters just have to chill out and let the news come out over a few days. They think because they have been doing this for years maybe months, most a few days, that they are god's gift to world of blackberry news. It drives me insane how much crap is written on nothing about blackberry. You want news, hear it from the CEO and public interview from blackberry.
    Yeah the problem is BBs former CEO, Heins the Incompetent was in hiding for months.

    Don't blame the media for BlackBerry 's continued lack of media relations. They choose to be silent and now they must cope with the outcome.
    11-05-13 07:57 AM
  17. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    Does it matter what BBRY plans to do with handsets because the more powerful bodies - carriers and consumers have already spoken and we know their answer.

    If you build a handset and nobody buys or stocks it - does it exist?
    I think you don't understand that there are people buying the phones. We have a kinds of Z10s, Q10s and now a Z30 in our company. Just because it isn't selling in the tens of millions, it doesn't mean it is a failure. If Blackberry has to limit production to meet demand and make money, then that is a goal to try and achieve.
    toneytone likes this.
    11-05-13 08:02 AM
  18. berklon's Avatar
    I think you don't understand that there are people buying the phones. We have a kinds of Z10s, Q10s and now a Z30 in our company. Just because it isn't selling in the tens of millions, it doesn't mean it is a failure. If Blackberry has to limit production to meet demand and make money, then that is a goal to try and achieve.
    Blackberry doesn't make the hardware, so they need to order in large amounts to bring the cost/unit down in order to turn a profit. They're currently not selling enough units to make a profit, and limiting their production to meet demand will increase the cost/unit resulting in a loss.
    They lose money either way.
    JeepBB likes this.
    11-05-13 08:22 AM
  19. FFR's Avatar
    WP7 was dead too. WP8 was too until recently.
    I dont understand your comparison.
    Are you comparing Microsoft to Blackberry?
    Just stop. No really. Stop. Microsoft spent more on advertising in the past two years than Blackberry is worth as a whole.
    Microsoft is not comarple to Blackberry, not even if you want to compare one of Microsoft's Divisions to Blackberry as a whole, the comparison is **** poor.

    Regarding Wp7; it isn't dead they transitioned to a different kernel. however Microsoft's can afford their mistakes, Blackberry cannot.

    It would take much more resources to throw away BB10 and start over.
    Who said anything about starting over?
    JeepBB and richardat like this.
    11-05-13 08:24 AM
  20. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    I dont understand your comparison.
    Are you comparing Microsoft to Blackberry?
    Just stop. No really. Stop. Microsoft spent more on advertising in the past two years than Blackberry is worth as a whole.
    Microsoft is not comarple to Blackberry, not even if you want to compare one of Microsoft's Divisions to Blackberry as a whole, the comparison is **** poor.

    Regarding Wp7; it isn't dead they transitioned to a different kernel. however Microsoft's can afford their mistakes, Blackberry cannot.


    Who said anything about starting over?
    You did by saying BB10 is dead. What will they do?
    11-05-13 10:29 AM
  21. JasW's Avatar
    And that is only an opinion.
    Actually, no, "IMHO" stands for "I Make Hotcakes Often."
    trwrt likes this.
    11-05-13 10:30 AM
  22. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    What's the point in making a handset that attracts little to no demand?
    Because for BlackBerry in their current situation, there is no alternative. All of their other businesses flow from the handsets. Stop making the handsets, they may as well close the doors, turn the lights out, and call it a decade. The fact they went out and got another billion in financing says they're not planning to shut down operations any time in the immediate future.. Now, whether they succeed in their newest attempt at a revival is another matter entirely. I have very strong doubts about their long term viability, but they're not going to stop making handsets.

    What's the alternative becoming an android handset vendor?
    That's quite possibly something they could try. Other companies from Sony to Samsung to Lenovo have had varying degrees of success doing so. Look at it this way, at this point in time, what has BlackBerry got to lose?

    As it stands in 2013, Android is very much a 3 factor race. The companies compete on hardware, on price, and name brand recognition. The one front where they aren't really fighting is software. Samsung is trying with all their added on software and services which most people commonly refer to as "bloatware." Their software for the Note 2 however, is actually very good, and I hear it's even better for the Note 3. Xiaomi claims they make all their money on software. BlackBerry could conceivably compete on the software angle by similarly offering their security and enterprise services on an Android version. Whether it'll be any more successful than BB10 is up for question, but at this time, it couldn't possibly do any worse.
    11-05-13 11:13 AM
  23. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    Blackberry doesn't make the hardware, so they need to order in large amounts to bring the cost/unit down in order to turn a profit. They're currently not selling enough units to make a profit, and limiting their production to meet demand will increase the cost/unit resulting in a loss.
    They lose money either way.
    Again, it's the whole "economies of scale" argument. It's not a good argument. Look at companies like Xiaomi, they're expecting to sell 15M units in 2013, and be profitable. That's less than 4M per quarter. The fact of the matter is, once you hit a certain number of units in your ordering from suppliers, the price doesn't drop any further, or only marginally. For example, if you order SoC from Qualcomm, after 500K-1M units (depends on the part), the price doesn't drop. So unless you're ordering less than 500,000, there is no significant economy of scale to be had. I guess you could say there's economy of scale to assembly, but assembly is typically less than 10% of the bill of materials. If bill of materials is $200, the assembly cost is usually less than $20. Even if you pay 50% more for assembly, that's only a $10 difference to total BoM. The BoM for a Z10 is less than $200, closer to $160 if I remember. Their total gross unit cost is probably in the $200 range if you add IP costs. They were originally selling the phone for $600.

    When the Z10 was introduced, the Xiaomi 2 was out on the market for 3-4 months with similar specs and selling for about $300. Xiaomi was a much smaller company then. Their total revenue for 2012 was $1B. BlackBerry gets that from BES alone. Yet, Xiaomi managed to release a $300 phone with virtually identical specs at half the price of a Z10, and sold 200,000 of them on their website in 45 seconds. It's not economies of scale, it's gross misread of the market by BlackBerry believing they can charge significantly more than other smartphone vendors for their value added services. Obviously the casual smartphone user decided those services were not worth what BlackBerry was charging.
    11-05-13 11:32 AM
  24. lnichols's Avatar
    It's statements from a BlackBerry CEO and we know how reliable those turn out.
    11-05-13 11:56 AM
  25. sixpacker's Avatar
    Because for BlackBerry in their current situation, there is no alternative. All of their other businesses flow from the handsets. Stop making the handsets, they may as well close the doors, turn the lights out, and call it a decade. The fact they went out and got another billion in financing says they're not planning to shut down operations any time in the immediate future.. Now, whether they succeed in their newest attempt at a revival is another matter entirely. I have very strong doubts about their long term viability, but they're not going to stop making handsets.



    That's quite possibly something they could try. Other companies from Sony to Samsung to Lenovo have had varying degrees of success doing so. Look at it this way, at this point in time, what has BlackBerry got to lose?

    As it stands in 2013, Android is very much a 3 factor race. The companies compete on hardware, on price, and name brand recognition. The one front where they aren't really fighting is software. Samsung is trying with all their added on software and services which most people commonly refer to as "bloatware." Their software for the Note 2 however, is actually very good, and I hear it's even better for the Note 3. Xiaomi claims they make all their money on software. BlackBerry could conceivably compete on the software angle by similarly offering their security and enterprise services on an Android version. Whether it'll be any more successful than BB10 is up for question, but at this time, it couldn't possibly do any worse.
    Personally, I think you are wrong and I don't see any future handsets. The cash burn rate is way too high to develop and launch new products. Plus they've destroyed key relationships with carriers, suppliers and partners. They are pushing their valuable assets, BBM,
    Mdm, plus patents.
    Also, Xiaomi just sell apple clones in China, can't see this model having much bearing on the global market.
    11-05-13 01:04 PM
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