10-26-16 03:01 AM
51 123
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  1. koool1's Avatar
    10-03-16 10:01 AM
  2. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    Yeah I imagine he'll look at sales info on the DTEK50 and DTEK60... and then forget about it.
    JeepBB, IndianTiwari and P2 SK like this.
    10-03-16 10:05 AM
  3. ardakca's Avatar
    I don't think the sales figures will be available until February 2017 date. Production should start if January release is correct.
    10-03-16 10:46 AM
  4. JohnGrey's Avatar
    There's a simple question here: what would BBRY, as a company, gain from producing and releasing this design, given their handset unit sales? A low-run bespoke design is going to price this entirely out of the range of the general market and the company has even less brand equity to foster sales at a premium price point that it did when it released the Priv, especially now that the company has communicated that its general stance going forward to be one of not-my-problem licensing. Even though that stance wouldn't apply to that device and any made recently, it has irrevocably altered the how consumers are going to perceive the company and its product, and that's assuming that they're receptive to BBRY at all.

    I know that the EIC is convinced that this is a done deal, and I respect his opinion insofar as he undoubtedly has connections that I don't. That said, I can think of no reason other than sentiment to release this and ten or twenty to absolutely avoid doing so. If Chen is the rational, cost-cutting CEO that many diehards complain that he is, the Mercury will remain a curio given pride of place in a Blackberry museum in Waterloo.
    JeepBB likes this.
    10-03-16 11:01 AM
  5. ohaiguise's Avatar
    If it's all been outsourced already, how is it even possible to design another one in-house? Come on Chen, make up your mind!
    10-03-16 11:05 AM
  6. koool1's Avatar
    If it's all been outsourced already, how is it even possible to design another one in-house? Come on Chen, make up your mind!
    My guess is its a qwerty Android handset.

    Because Alcatel probably has no intention of making a qwerty this could make sense to build if the demand was there.

    I'm not sure many people care anymore though.

    Posted via BlackBerry PRIV
    10-03-16 11:13 AM
  7. JeepBB's Avatar
    I don't think the sales figures will be available until February 2017 date. Production should start if January release is correct.
    The sales figures aren't available to you and me until the ER's, but Chen knows exactly how the DTEK50 has sold, possibly on a weekly basis. And if he doesn't use the sales figures from the forthcoming DTEK60 to gauge whether it is worth releasing the Mercury then he isn't the smart businessman I believe him to be!
    10-03-16 01:26 PM
  8. ardakca's Avatar
    The sales figures aren't available to you and me until the ER's, but Chen knows exactly how the DTEK50 has sold, possibly on a weekly basis. And if he doesn't use the sales figures from the forthcoming DTEK60 to gauge whether it is worth releasing the Mercury then he isn't the smart businessman I believe him to be!
    If he was smart he wouldn't release the DTEK60 in the first place )
    10-03-16 01:51 PM
  9. JeepBB's Avatar
    If he was smart he wouldn't release the DTEK60 in the first place )
    The money is already spent. It must be, or it wouldn't be available to buy in a couple of weeks. Chen might as well see if he can make some of that money back in sales.

    However, your point is valid... which is why the Mercury won't be released.
    10-03-16 01:59 PM
  10. ardakca's Avatar
    The money is already spent. It must be, or it wouldn't be available to buy in a couple of weeks. Chen might as well see if he can make some of that money back in sales.

    However, your point is valid... which is why the Mercury won't be released.
    Nope. Mercury is commin like the winter. You miss the point, Chen does not understand a bit about hardware.
    10-03-16 02:04 PM
  11. Nguyen1's Avatar
    Chen has a twitter account. Let's all twitter him about mercury!

    Passport!
    10-03-16 02:12 PM
  12. JeepBB's Avatar
    There's a simple question here: what would BBRY, as a company, gain from producing and releasing this design, given their handset unit sales? A low-run bespoke design is going to price this entirely out of the range of the general market and the company has even less brand equity to foster sales at a premium price point that it did when it released the Priv, especially now that the company has communicated that its general stance going forward to be one of not-my-problem licensing. Even though that stance wouldn't apply to that device and any made recently, it has irrevocably altered the how consumers are going to perceive the company and its product, and that's assuming that they're receptive to BBRY at all.

    I know that the EIC is convinced that this is a done deal, and I respect his opinion insofar as he undoubtedly has connections that I don't. That said, I can think of no reason other than sentiment to release this and ten or twenty to absolutely avoid doing so. If Chen is the rational, cost-cutting CEO that many diehards complain that he is, the Mercury will remain a curio given pride of place in a Blackberry museum in Waterloo.
    Yeah, I agree, and I suspect my list of reasons for not releasing the Mercury is much the same as yours.

    I think Chen's "it's on my desk for testing" statement is him kicking the Mercury into the long grass. If, miracle of miracles, sales of the DTEK50/60 pick-up and go like gangbusters then Chen's "testing" will be complete and the Mercury will go into production.

    Much more likely is that the poor sales of the BB Android handsets continue to be pitiful (and if they weren't poor, Chen wouldn't have quit Hardware!) and the costs of producing the Mercury will continue to make zero business sense. In this much more likely second scenario, then Chen's "testing" will continue until April 2017 and then the Mercury will be quietly forgotten.

    Like you, I can think of only one reason for the Mercury to be released - that of Chen being a sentimental old softie and wanting to build one last true PKB BlackBerry... for the fans! And Chen doesn't strike me as the sentimental type either!

    The Mercury isn't even DOA... it'll never arrive. It'll stay on Chen's desk forever.
    10-03-16 02:13 PM
  13. PantherBlitz's Avatar
    Their DTEK strategy is solid, but of course only BlackBerry could find a way to not sell Android phones.
    Unless enough fleet customers demand a PKB, the Mercury is just another "what might have been".
    dalinxz likes this.
    10-03-16 04:37 PM
  14. koool1's Avatar
    Their DTEK strategy is solid, but of course only BlackBerry could find a way to not sell Android phones.
    Unless enough fleet customers demand a PKB, the Mercury is just another "what might have been".
    As far as I know Dtek phones are primarily for BlackBerry diehards and fleet only. There is no marketing to the public planned.

    Trying to complete with the 50 other Android makers is suicide so perhaps it's the best strategy in the end.

    Posted via BlackBerry PRIV
    10-04-16 09:29 AM
  15. curves2000's Avatar
    This device, which I hope does launch as it MAY be the device I would upgrade to in the future as an Android. I need a keyboard and don't want Android but sooner or later BlackBerry 10 devices will have issues with browser, most apps I use (mostly news, sports, Bloomberg etc)


    Alex Thurber who was brought in to sell devices has tweeted in many forms that a "keyboard was coming this fiscal year" so I suspect they have some idea they will release it.

    The device may also hinge on how successful BlackBerry is with this new "licensing" deals are. If they have modest success in Indonesia and their potential deals they are working on in China and India, they may not launch it.

    Don't forget, despite the fact that the hardware lost $8 mil last quarter, it still brought in over $100 mil in revenue. If that revenue disappears very quickly it, it leaves a cash flow void.

    Another thing is if you follow Alex Thurber on Twitter, he has tweeted about several trips to Washington, DC and London etc for "client meetings". If he isn't meeting with potential hardware clients, what would he be doing?

    Hopefully they launch it!

    Posted via CB10
    10-04-16 06:14 PM
  16. StephanieMaks's Avatar
    Don't forget, despite the fact that the hardware lost $8 mil last quarter, it still brought in over $100 mil in revenue. If that revenue disappears very quickly it, it leaves a cash flow void.
    Posted via CB10
    How do you spin this as a positive? You're saying that $100M is good even it cost him $108M to get there? So net loss of $8M is 'good' cash flow?

    I agree losing $100,000,000 of revenue can look bad on a financial statement, but I think not-losing $8,000,000 of actual profit is better for cash flow in the long run.

    Unless that $108,000,000 in costs are something he can put off paying till long after he's actually collected the $100,000,000 from the customers.
    nico2004 likes this.
    10-04-16 06:48 PM
  17. curves2000's Avatar
    Well I can agree that losing money on the hardware division isn't good, having a revenue stream come in while attempting to build up the software business is needed.

    BlackBerry has 3 different "buckets" of business from a reporting perspective.

    Mobility Solutions: Devices and licensing
    Service Revenue: Fee's generated from older devices such as BB7 and older

    Software and services: The future business providing security solutions to corporate clients.

    Both of the first revenue streams are going down, with the service revenue stream going to zero with nothing BlackBerry can do.

    BlackBerry has also shrunk the losses in the device business from $21 mil last quarter to $8 mil this past quarter so it's trending in the right direction. The revenue from the device business provides cash in order for them to fund other expenses with the business.

    The current plan is for BlackBerry to get out of the device business from an internal perspective and deploy some of those financial resources used to try and grow the software side of it. We will see how successful that becomes and how much revenue they get from these licensing deals. Best of luck though



    Posted via CB10
    10-04-16 07:58 PM
  18. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Well I can agree that losing money on the hardware division isn't good, having a revenue stream come in while attempting to build up the software business is needed.
    This is absolutely true, and is exactly why Chen didn't shut down the hardware business in 2013 - back when revenues were 10X the size they are today. But phone revenues are small enough today (in relative terms) that he and the board are ready to let it go and finally bring an end to the on-going losses.

    In other words, this argument WAS valid for a couple of years, but it no longer is anymore.
    anon(9353145) likes this.
    10-04-16 09:45 PM
  19. anon(9353145)'s Avatar
    This is absolutely true, and is exactly why Chen didn't shut down the hardware business in 2013 - back when revenues were 10X the size they are today. But phone revenues are small enough today (in relative terms) that he and the board are ready to let it go and finally bring an end to the on-going losses.

    In other words, this argument WAS valid for a couple of years, but it no longer is anymore.
    Yeah, makes total sense that he'd wait for it to shrink organically. And it probably was the plan from the beginning.

    Having said that, I still hope to see the Mercury released as the final handset. It may not make business sense from a purely financial POV, but it seems fitting as a 'narrative' that BlackBerry ends their run with a PKB device, imho.
    phuoc likes this.
    10-04-16 11:02 PM
  20. curves2000's Avatar
    The more I think about it the more I think they may NOT release it.

    If your literally 3 months or so away from launching your last BlackBerry built handset, why announce your getting out of internal handsets and then proceed to launch one later.

    If the National Post article is correct, looks like the design and completion of the device is almost complete and they announced this.

    On the flip side on the earnings call John Chen did say that he was looking to completely exit the internal hardware division by the end of the fiscal year which ends February. This could mean once the Android keyboard device launches etc than its game over after that. Who knows??? Wait and see I guess

    Posted via CB10
    10-04-16 11:51 PM
  21. acovey's Avatar
    One thing is you will NEVER get the truth from BlackBerry. They are the best at half truths and if there was a market for that they would have more money then anyone.
    10-05-16 12:47 AM
  22. anon(9353145)'s Avatar
    One thing is you will NEVER get the truth from BlackBerry. They are the best at half truths and if there was a market for that they would have more money then anyone.
    No offense but you say that as if BlackBerry is the first Corporation that obfuscated when it came to the consumer. Not sure why people are so surprised at this to be honest. How's Apple doing lately on the whole Bend Gate / Touch Screen controversy, for example?

    Anyone who thinks a for profit corporation is going to put the truth before profits is naive, imho.
    JeepBB likes this.
    10-05-16 01:00 AM
  23. Bla1ze's Avatar
    Another thing is if you follow Alex Thurber on Twitter, he has tweeted about several trips to Washington, DC and London etc for "client meetings". If he isn't meeting with potential hardware clients, what would he be doing?
    I dunno, maybe pushing their software. You know, the business area they're focused on now lol.
    10-05-16 01:38 AM
  24. curves2000's Avatar
    I dunno, maybe pushing their software. You know, the business area they're focused on now lol.

    Wouldn't that be the software and services team selling software and BlackBerry suites to corporate and government clients?

    I maybe looking into this a bit too much, mostly as a long time suffering shareholder than anything. I just figured the tops tier device guys traveling would be pushing the hardware, or what's left of it anyway. Thurber and Pini were hired/promoted to sell devices and push forward the licensing strategy.

    In a few posts you have said you think the keyboard Android device is coming so I would take your word for it since your more of an insider than myself.

    Regardless of what happens I hope they are successful at it as its been a long time since this company had anything of significance to cheer about.

    Posted via CB10
    10-05-16 02:50 AM
  25. Nindia's Avatar
    No idea why they alienate their core userbase that demands a candy bar qwerty phone. Why there isn't a BB Classic with Android by now is beyond me.

    They're absolutely clueless at BlackBerry.
    10-05-16 08:10 AM
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