01-12-15 04:15 PM
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  1. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    No it's not, it's well known that they have a market share under 10%.

    Posted via CB10
    I think it depends on where you are. I've only ever seen a couple in Canada and the USA, but I imagine I'd see them a lot more frequently in Europe.

    It's the same thing with BlackBerry. When I've been in the US airports, I've only ever seen 1 or 2 BlackBerry 10's in the wild, but see them frequently in Canadian airports.
    01-20-14 04:54 PM
  2. anon1727506's Avatar
    LOL Wait, BlackBerry has 4500+ working in the BBM team? Wow nice man, do yourself a favour, use your htc one to google that

    Posted via CB10
    I almost sure that there is at least a team of six dedicated and hard working software engineers at BlackBerry - and they split their time between BB10 and BBM.



    We don't know the numbers, just the results.... and that isn't something to LOL at.
    01-20-14 04:56 PM
  3. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Given that WP is 8% worldwide and growing it's not small and insignificant.
    How do you define that ... percentage of new phone shipments or actively in use? Can you share the data? Not disputing you but curious.

    The point still stands for me ... it's likely a matter of opportunity cost. If you have finite developers and a big roadmap, you put it on the biggest things first. Even if Windows has 8%, it's going to get trumped by Android, iOS and homegroup BlackBerry features in priority.

    BTW did you know whatsapp has 45 employees? Blackberry has 4500+...
    BlackBerry has about 10000 ... but that's not a fair comparison because WhatsApp does not make their own OS, own hardware, own NOC, own enterprise management software etc etc etc. Even if BlackBerry has 10,000 employees, I'd be surprised if the BBM team was proportionately much bigger than the WhatsApp team.
    Thesmartmale likes this.
    01-20-14 04:58 PM
  4. propeller10's Avatar
    I'm sure Blackberry has the resources to build the app for Windows Phone.

    This is really humorous in a twisted way. Most Developers make apps for Ios and Android due to Market share and the blackberry mindset is no different.
    JeepBB and kbz1960 like this.
    01-20-14 05:18 PM
  5. sixpacker's Avatar
    LOL Wait, BlackBerry has 4500+ working in the BBM team? Wow nice man, do yourself a favour, use your htc one to google that

    Posted via CB10
    Who said working in the bbm team?
    I was indicating you don't need massive resources to provide a truly cross platform messenger.

    Leave off with the aggression..

    Posted via SwiftKey / htc one
    JeepBB likes this.
    01-20-14 05:23 PM
  6. Thesmartmale's Avatar
    Who said working in the bbm team?
    I was indicating you don't need massive resources to provide a truly cross platform messenger.

    Leave off with the aggression..

    Posted via SwiftKey / htc one
    Oh well then that's not even a comparison to make or am I wrong? Comparing BlackBerry which makes phones, OS and a lot more with whatsapp that is only an IM app, even if you compare whatsapp team with BBM team, BBM has a lot more features like voice, video, screen sharing, the D&R system and a lot more so I yeah I'm pretty sure they need more resources than whatsapp.

    Posted via CB10
    01-20-14 05:28 PM
  7. Thesmartmale's Avatar
    I'm sure Blackberry has the resources to build the app for Windows Phone.

    This is really humorous in a twisted way. Most Developers make apps for Ios and Android due to Market share and the blackberry mindset is no different.
    Count in Microsoft too for not making Skype for BB10.

    Posted via CB10
    01-20-14 05:30 PM
  8. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Who said working in the bbm team?
    What would you expect people to think? You compared the resources of WhatsApp to the Resources of BlackBerry.


    I was indicating you don't need massive resources to provide a truly cross platform messenger.
    No, but you likely need time. The 45 resources at WhatsApp didn't make all features and all platform versions simultaniously. They did it over years over the course of a pre-defined roadmap.

    BlackBerry will do the same. Just because they don't have a Windows Phone app now, does not mean there will never be one. It's probably sitting somewhere on a roadmap in BlackBerry *AFTER* bringing iOS and Android to parity with BlackBerry 10 and *AFTER* enterprise/desktop BBM.
    Thesmartmale likes this.
    01-20-14 05:34 PM
  9. propeller10's Avatar
    Count in Microsoft too for not making Skype for BB10.

    Posted via CB10
    It's available in BB World isn't it? And it works fine atleast for me. If Blackberry sees Windows phone as a platform not worth immediate attention, what does that make BB10?
    kbz1960 and JeepBB like this.
    01-20-14 05:37 PM
  10. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    It's available in BB World isn't it? And it works fine atleast for me. If Blackberry sees Windows phone as a platform not worth immediate attention, what does that make BB10?
    A product that they need to (for revenue's sake) make a success. Even if they haven't so far, BlackBerry 10 succeeding will keep the lights on. BBM will not right now
    01-20-14 05:39 PM
  11. Thesmartmale's Avatar
    It's available in BB World isn't it? And it works fine atleast for me. If Blackberry sees Windows phone as a platform not worth immediate attention, what does that make BB10?
    Sorry? In BlackBerry world? Lettme tell you it's an Android port, it's like you asking for BBM and BlackBerry giving you a link to BBM for Android and tell you to use it (if we imagine WP plays Android apps).

    Posted via CB10
    01-20-14 05:49 PM
  12. sixpacker's Avatar
    Oh well then that's not even a comparison to make or am I wrong? Comparing BlackBerry which makes phones, OS and a lot more with whatsapp that is only an IM app, even if you compare whatsapp team with BBM team, BBM has a lot more features like voice, video, screen sharing, the D&R system and a lot more so I yeah I'm pretty sure they need more resources than whatsapp.

    Posted via CB10
    All I'm saying is to make bbm competitive and a success they have to make it truly cross platform. They have huge resources available and need to invest properly in engineering and R&D. The resource argument is just garbage. Hell , Chen spends more on his commuting than a startups development budget.

    Posted via SwiftKey / htc one
    kbz1960 likes this.
    01-20-14 05:56 PM
  13. propeller10's Avatar
    Sorry? In BlackBerry world? Lettme tell you it's an Android port, it's like you asking for BBM and BlackBerry giving you a link to BBM for Android and tell you to use it (if we imagine WP plays Android apps).

    Posted via CB10
    I realize it is a port. But I can use Skype on BB10 but I cant use BBM on a Windows phone. That's the difference.

    Also people here love to say that BB10 is better Android than android so why complain?
    JeepBB and kbz1960 like this.
    01-20-14 06:01 PM
  14. n8ter#AC's Avatar
    I realize it is a port. But I can use Skype on BB10 but I cant use BBM on a Windows phone. That's the difference.

    Also people here love to say that BB10 is better Android than android so why complain?
    Zing?!

    Because they're clearly being dishonest when they make asinine statements like that.

    BB10 doesn't deserve a Native Skype port, because their marketshare is too poor. Moreso than WP8, and MUCH moreso when you remove BB7 from their marketshare figures as well. WP8's marketshare is probably 5-6x that of Blackberry 10. Nokia has probably sold more Lumia 520s than Blackberry has sold BB10 devices, Q and Z series, combined.

    The reasons for ignoring BB10 is much, much stronger than for ignoring WP8 at this point. Even then, Microsoft didn't do that. They at least offered something and the reason why it's an Android port is because Blackberry chose a bad strategy moving forward in BB10. One that helps in the short term but hurts in the long term.

    In the short term, you can "side load" tons of Android apps. In the long term, since it's so easy to port them over, there is very little incentive for investing in a native app from scratch for a platform with such poor user base size.

    Blackberry has always been striving to fail, though, so this is not surprising.
    JeepBB and kbz1960 like this.
    01-20-14 07:17 PM
  15. nemo7's Avatar
    Resources, resources , recources, cmon guys are You serious?? Give the BBM rights to the Developer "Rudy Huyn " and he will develop You an outstanding app in couple of days. He develop Sapchat, vine, 9gag, Tindr, Wikipedia and more just alone and the apps working perfect but BB has no resources??
    Talk out.


    Lumia 1620
    JeepBB and kbz1960 like this.
    01-20-14 07:30 PM
  16. breakingpoint0's Avatar
    I'm sure WP support will come in the future for BBM. If I recall I saw comments that BES10 would support WP8 eventually. I would guess BBM would support WP8 around that same time. When you look at market share it makes sense why BlackBerry is going for Android and IOS first. Yes WP8 is growing, but Android and iOS still have the largest slice of the piece so it makes sense to start there.
    Morty2264 and Loc22 like this.
    01-20-14 11:09 PM
  17. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    The reasons for ignoring BB10 is much, much stronger than for ignoring WP8 at this point.
    If BBM were an independent company of BlackBerry, yes. However, it's not. And BlackBerry handset sales have a much more meaningful impact to BlackBerry (the company) than BBM on Windows Phone - and will for the foreseeable future.
    01-21-14 12:09 PM
  18. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Resources, resources , recources, cmon guys are You serious??
    Even if they contracted it out to a whiz kid developer to do the work, he or she wouldn't be able to work in a vaccum. They'd have to spend resources getting him up to speed on the architecture, network standards, testing his work, code reviewing his work, writing documentation etc.
    01-21-14 12:10 PM
  19. kbz1960's Avatar
    Your statement is completely false. They have plans to bring BBM to WP8 when WP gets big enough. They even said that in the link. They are simply focusing their resources on the BlackBerry, Android and iOS app first. There is no short term plan to bring BBM to WP, but doesn't mean it isn't in the long term plan.



    Posted via CB10
    What is big enough? When they surpass BBRY for third place? That's done. When they have 100 million users? 1 billion users?

    What is this "big enough"?
    JeepBB likes this.
    01-21-14 12:40 PM
  20. sixpacker's Avatar
    Even if they contracted it out to a whiz kid developer to do the work, he or she wouldn't be able to work in a vaccum. They'd have to spend resources getting him up to speed on the architecture, network standards, testing his work, code reviewing his work, writing documentation etc.
    Well yes. That's what has to be done if you want to be the market leader, rather than forever playing catch up. This is small money for BlackBerry.

    Posted via SwiftKey / htc one
    01-21-14 12:59 PM
  21. Loc22's Avatar
    I give up... people just like to listen to half the statement & form their opinion based on that and just do not want to listen to other opinions.

    Posted via CB10
    01-21-14 01:01 PM
  22. JeepBB's Avatar
    I think it depends on where you are. I've only ever seen a couple in Canada and the USA, but I imagine I'd see them a lot more frequently in Europe.

    It's the same thing with BlackBerry. When I've been in the US airports, I've only ever seen 1 or 2 BlackBerry 10's in the wild, but see them frequently in Canadian airports.
    Yes, you would see more in Europe I reckon.

    The last Kantar figures (measured as new device sales by Kantar's metrics IIRC) were 11.4% in the UK, and seem to be around 10% elsewhere in Europe. WinPhone doesn't seem to have captured much market share in North America. I've seen quoted figures as low as 5% and as high as 8% for global market share. The quarter to quarter figures seem to be steadily increasing everywhere though and WinPhone can comfortably claim the #3 slot, for whatever that's worth in what is still largely a two-horse race.

    My personal experience seems to correspond with those figures as I see around 1 WinPhone in every 10 "others" - the bright colours of Lumias (and they all seem to be Nokias!) make them easy to spot amongst the black/white iPhones and Androids. Cyan seem to be particularly popular.

    I've only ever seen and handled one Z10 handset that was sitting forlornly and largely unnoticed in a phone shop. I've never seen a BB10 phone in the wild - either at the large engineering company where I work, or in the pubs/clubs/streets generally. I am a little surprised that I haven't seen a single "wild" BB10 handset in my travels given that the UK was always a very strong BB market. I see a few legacy BB handsets still - mostly in the hands of managers. So the BB market share collapse in the UK shown in those same Kantar numbers seems consistent with my own experience.
    01-21-14 01:28 PM
  23. Sayumi Whisp's Avatar
    I'm not using other Phones beside my z10 but what's with bbm4all?



    Wenn du mir sagst, was dort drauen richtig ist, werde ich nicht mehr versuchen dich zu kssen... (Sayumi Whisp) www.sayumi.de
    01-21-14 04:31 PM
  24. FFR's Avatar
    Yes, you would see more in Europe I reckon.

    The last Kantar figures (measured as new device sales by Kantar's metrics IIRC) were 11.4% in the UK, and seem to be around 10% elsewhere in Europe. WinPhone doesn't seem to have captured much market share in North America. I've seen quoted figures as low as 5% and as high as 8% for global market share. The quarter to quarter figures seem to be steadily increasing everywhere though and WinPhone can comfortably claim the #3 slot, for whatever that's worth in what is still largely a two-horse race.

    My personal experience seems to correspond with those figures as I see around 1 WinPhone in every 10 "others" - the bright colours of Lumias (and they all seem to be Nokias!) make them easy to spot amongst the black/white iPhones and Androids. Cyan seem to be particularly popular.

    I've only ever seen and handled one Z10 handset that was sitting forlornly and largely unnoticed in a phone shop. I've never seen a BB10 phone in the wild - either at the large engineering company where I work, or in the pubs/clubs/streets generally. I am a little surprised that I haven't seen a single "wild" BB10 handset in my travels given that the UK was always a very strong BB market. I see a few legacy BB handsets still - mostly in the hands of managers. So the BB market share collapse in the UK shown in those same Kantar numbers seems consistent with my own experience.
    I have only seen 2 bb10 devices on in the Uk and one was promptly returned for an iPhone 5s.
    01-21-14 04:55 PM
  25. Thesmartmale's Avatar
    Since everyone is talking about which phone they saw then, I only saw 3 WP users and about 24 BlackBerry10 users in 3 different countries.

    Posted via CB10
    01-21-14 06:15 PM
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