10-08-15 12:59 PM
31 12
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  1. DamianWarS's Avatar
    Rumour has it 10.3.3 will officially support lollipop and Google Playstore. But if this is true does this mean it will bump the Amazon App store? I know users are free to download amazon but can a device have google playstore and another android market preinstalled or with google is it all or nothing?

    Posted via CB10
    10-02-15 12:08 PM
  2. conite's Avatar
    Rumour is wrong.

    If anything, 10.3.3 is more likely to remove the Android Runtime entirely - although I would bet they just keep the old one in there.

    If, on the other hand you are referring to the switch to pure Android with the new Priv, then yes we will have Google Play Services and all of the Google apps including the Play Store. You can go ahead and install any other appstore you want.

    PassportSQW100-4/10.3.2.2639
    Troy Tiscareno and DaFoxGrey like this.
    10-02-15 12:10 PM
  3. DamianWarS's Avatar
    10.3.3 is what I'm referring to not pure android. As stated amazon app store is available for any android device and anyone is free to download it. The question is more about would the playstore and amazon be both preinstalled or would amazon have to be bumped with google playstore?

    Pics have been released with what appears to be a BB10 bootscreen with "powered by android" message. Perhaps this is just new compliance with google and no real changes or perhaps this is the step for official google play support. At the very least, if real, it would suggest continued support for the android runtime.

    BB10.3.3 Google or Amazon?-crackberry-image-1-.jpg

    Posted via CB10
    10-02-15 12:48 PM
  4. conite's Avatar
    10.3.3 is what I'm referring to not pure android. As stated amazon app store is available for any android device and anyone is free to download it. The question is more about would the playstore and amazon be both preinstalled or would amazon have to be bumped with google playstore?

    Pics have been released with what appears to be a BB10 bootscreen with "powered by android" message. Perhaps this is just new compliance with google and no real changes or perhaps this is the step for official google play support. At the very least, if real, it would suggest continued support for the android runtime.

    Posted via CB10
    These pictures are not authentic. BB10 will not see anything related to Google. As I said, according to strict OHA rules, BlackBerry may be forced to remove the Android Runtime completely from its future BB10 OS maintenance updates (but they will probably look the other way and allow us to keep the antiquated one we have now).

    If you want Google, you will have to buy a Priv.

    PassportSQW100-4/10.3.2.2639
    LuvULongTime likes this.
    10-02-15 12:51 PM
  5. playbookster's Avatar
    Rumour is wrong.

    If anything, 10.3.3 is more likely to remove the Android Runtime entirely - although I would bet they just keep the old one in there.

    If, on the other hand you are referring to the switch to pure Android with the new Priv, then yes we will have Google Play Services and all of the Google apps including the Play Store. You can go ahead and install any other appstore you want.

    PassportSQW100-4/10.3.2.2639
    The runtime will definitely not be removed

    Posted via CB10
    10-02-15 01:16 PM
  6. Cobalt232's Avatar
    These pictures are not authentic. BB10 will not see anything related to Google. As I said, according to strict OHA rules, BlackBerry may be forced to remove the Android Runtime completely from its future BB10 OS maintenance updates
    This is a real common misunderstanding of the OHA. The OHA is valid for a PRODUCT that a company releases, and not for the whole company itself.

    That means that a company can release a product under the OHA, while at the same time it can release an other product that does not follow the OHA.

    For that reason, the runtime in BlackBerry OS 10 will for SURE not be removed.
    10-02-15 01:22 PM
  7. conite's Avatar
    For that reason, the runtime in BlackBerry OS 10 will for SURE not be removed.
    There is much debate about the interpretation, but one thing is for certain - the Android Runtime on BB10 will never get Google certification.

    PassportSQW100-4/10.3.2.2639
    10-02-15 01:29 PM
  8. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    This is a real common misunderstanding of the OHA. The OHA is valid for a PRODUCT that a company releases, and not for the whole company itself.

    That means that a company can release a product under the OHA, while at the same time it can release an other product that does not follow the OHA.

    For that reason, the runtime in BlackBerry OS 10 will for SURE not be removed.
    Nope. You have to be a member of the OHA to release an OHA device or product. One of the prime directives of the OHA is that no member of the OHA will promote a non-OHA product built from Android. A prime example of this is when Acer was blocked from releasing a separate device that wasn't in accordance with the OHA.

    I don't think BBRY will be required to remove the Android runtime from currently built and/or shipped devices. But they'll probably not be able to develop or produce any new BB10 devices with the Android runtime. That's my guess anyway.
    10-02-15 01:33 PM
  9. Cobalt232's Avatar
    There is much debate about the interpretation, but one thing is for certain - the Android Runtime on BB10 will never get Google certification.

    PassportSQW100-4/10.3.2.2639
    Absolutely agreed!
    10-02-15 01:34 PM
  10. Cobalt232's Avatar
    Nope. You have to be a member of the OHA to release an OHA device or product. One of the prime directives of the OHA is that no member of the OHA will promote a non-OHA product built from Android. A prime example of this is when Acer was blocked from releasing a separate device that wasn't in accordance with the OHA.
    They where stopped to release an Android device that dit not follow the OHA and should have had Google apps preinstalled.
    10-02-15 01:41 PM
  11. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    They where stopped to release an Android device that dit not follow the OHA and should have had Google apps preinstalled.
    They were stopped because Acer tried to release a device with Aliyun OS, which is an Android built OS and not OHA compatible. Not because it didn't have Google apps installed (because it couldn't anyway being a non-OHA OS). If Acer wasn't an OHA member they could have released it no problem, but they ultimately didn't want to lose their OHA membership.
    10-02-15 01:47 PM
  12. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    If BB10 had official Google Play Store.... we wouldn't be switching to Android in the first place, would we?

    I don't think they'll remove the Runtime from BB10 - nor do I expect they'll bother with updating the Android Runtime. What I question is sales of any new to market device using BB10.
    10-02-15 01:56 PM
  13. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    Nope. You have to be a member of the OHA to release an OHA device or product. One of the prime directives of the OHA is that no member of the OHA will promote a non-OHA product built from Android. A prime example of this is when Acer was blocked from releasing a separate device that wasn't in accordance with the OHA.

    I don't think BBRY will be required to remove the Android runtime from currently built and/or shipped devices. But they'll probably not be able to develop or produce any new BB10 devices with the Android runtime. That's my guess anyway.
    That is how I understand it.

    Another example, I believe, is Barnes & Noble. They were not required to remove its forked version of Android from previously sold devices, but it hasn't released "Nook" OS device since.

    My uninfallible interpretation based on previous action: BBRY cannot release a runtime-laden device concurrently with an OHA device, but older devices are fine as-is.
    LuvULongTime likes this.
    10-02-15 02:01 PM
  14. crucial bbq's Avatar
    These pictures are not authentic. BB10 will not see anything related to Google. As I said, according to strict OHA rules, BlackBerry may be forced to remove the Android Runtime completely from its future BB10 OS maintenance updates (but they will probably look the other way and allow us to keep the antiquated one we have now).

    If you want Google, you will have to buy a Priv.

    PassportSQW100-4/10.3.2.2639
    There is no evidence of this and considering that Android owns ~85% of the market but Apple earns more in revenue from mobile sales/app market than all other handset/OS vendors combined, and, that Samsung dominates over Google and since 2012 or so Google lost any real control over Android and never figured out how to fully monetize from it (and the reason why Rubin left, by the way), the deal between Google and BlackBerry is between Google and BlackBerry and not with the OHA.

    Android Run Time will not be removed from 10.3.3 and in reality it would make more sense financially for Google to allow GPS on BB10, anyways. For those who have installed Google Play and "installed" Google Services on their BB10 device would note that they get a lengthy "warning" stating that the app/service was downloaded to a BlackBerry device that does not support Google Services and as such may not work. This warning is coming from Google, not BlackBerry and not from the OHA. Why isn't Google (or BlackBerry) cracking down and denying these illegal downloads?

    Google Play, Google Services (or whatever it is now called), and Google branded apps are all private property of Google's. The only thing they have to do with Android is being Android compatible and they surely have zero to do with the OHA. Yeah, Google/Rubin strong armed compliance in the past but the Android OS itself is free for anyone to do with what they please. Keep in mind that Android has Apache and GNU licensing that Google must comply with. So, the "power" is not entirely in Google's hands and there are 7 million or so Android hackers and hobbyist out there as well as numerous custom ROMs and so on. According to Motley Fool developers who post to the Amazon App Store earn twice as much there then they do in the Google Play Store. It helps that Amazon customers typically are of the type who spend money were as the typical Android/Google Play jockey just wants stuff for free.

    Heck, even Microsoft makes more money from/off of Android than Google.

    The European Commission is conducting a long-term investigation into whether or not Google is violating any antitrust laws by forcing vendors to adopt Google's "stuff" onto their phones and is likely to rule against Google. Google's defense? That the OHA is necessary for competition. The ECs response? You dominate the world's market with ~85% share. What competition? Do you really think BlackBerry wants to be involved in that nonsense? Current OHA members want to leave, too, but how many is not known. Samsung surely does not need them and I guarantee you Samsung could tell Google to eff off AND they would still give them continued access to Google Play.

    I'm not picking on you here but I'm just tired of all the "OHA" stuff around here. I mean, considering BlackBerry's past relationship with Google don't you think this sort of thing would be top news with the tech outlets?

    Besides, to my knowledge BB10 does not use any Android or Dalvik code in the ART, so they would not be violating anything because BB10 is not fork or fragment of Android. BB10 translates Android calls into BB10 calls, so in reality ART is just an emulator.

    What Acer did was fork Android and then claim that their Dalvik was compatible with the other Dalvik. Google said otherwise.

    Nope. You have to be a member of the OHA to release an OHA device or product. One of the prime directives of the OHA is that no member of the OHA will promote a non-OHA product built from Android. A prime example of this is when Acer was blocked from releasing a separate device that wasn't in accordance with the OHA.

    I don't think BBRY will be required to remove the Android runtime from currently built and/or shipped devices. But they'll probably not be able to develop or produce any new BB10 devices with the Android runtime. That's my guess anyway.
    They were stopped because Acer tried to release a device with Aliyun OS, which is an Android built OS and not OHA compatible. Not because it didn't have Google apps installed (because it couldn't anyway being a non-OHA OS). If Acer wasn't an OHA member they could have released it no problem, but they ultimately didn't want to lose their OHA membership.
    Not quite. Acer wanted to release a version of Android specifically for the Chinese market and this version would not include "Google" because the Chinese Government censored Google from the Country (sort of, they actually just banned the Google search engine, iirc).

    And it was not "the OHA" that told Acer no; it was Google, and more specifically it was the "boss of Android" Andy Rubin who shot them down and went after them. Since Rubin left that position Google has taken a softer stance against fragmentation/non compatibility and let's be honest; the "rules" are different for each vendor/OEM.

    Acer only backed down because they ultimately did not want to lose Google Play/Google Services from their other markets. That is largely the reason why any member stayed but times are changing and Google does not have this power anymore. I suggest you look into Samsung's dominance over "Google Android" and into just how loony and controlling Andy Rubin was/is. Fascinating stuff.
    10-03-15 02:11 AM
  15. DonHB's Avatar
    It is extraordinary how few people have read the Android-CDD. It does not mention the OHA even once yet it mentions alternate kernels.

    I had surmised that BBRY would have used QNX with its Posix compatibility to run ART so that investment in Android development could be reused with BB10. They didn't do this which suggests that unless they use the SOC and other hardware from the Passport, as suggested elewhere, nothing new will be coming to BB10. Also, the CEO Chen used to rave about QNX and hasn't recently. The US has at least 220 million cars, but QNX is only in 60 million world wide. I can't believe it has much of future at BBRY. Shame because it never realized it's full potential as an OS.
    10-03-15 12:23 PM
  16. Taigatrommel's Avatar
    Since 10.3.3 is said just to be a smaller security and bugfix release, I am pretty sure we won't see any big changes regarding app stores or the runtime itself. I'm not even holding my breath for smaller new features at all, at least not for typical consumers.

    Posted via CB10
    10-03-15 09:46 PM
  17. DamianWarS's Avatar
    Given the recent focus on android it would be wise for blackberry to release an update with a little more substance to prove their commitment to BB10 which they are continued to say. I know android run time is not really an OS improvement but an update with greater android support OOB would be welcomed.

    Posted via CB10
    10-05-15 09:36 PM
  18. trsbbs's Avatar
    Sad to see everyone guessing when BB should have a clear path by now. Chen is grasping for life
    here.
    Dunt Dunt Dunt and JeepBB like this.
    10-06-15 08:30 AM
  19. Maxxxpower's Avatar
    Funny how people just make up some bullsh1t and call it a rumour. What about: "Rumor: BB10.3.3 is going to be a Windows Mobile 10 based OS"?
    LuvULongTime likes this.
    10-06-15 08:35 AM
  20. tdawg00's Avatar
    Ummm. Someone received the longest and most inaccurate post award today...
    From Googles "Mobile Application Distribution Agreement which all members of OHA must comply to have a Google Play License.

    Device manufacturers will have to include Set-up Wizard, Google Phone-top Search, Gmail, Google Calendar, Google Talk, YouTube, Google Maps for Mobile, Google Street View, Contact Sync, Android Market Client, Google Voice Search, and Network Location Provider as pre-loaded apps on Android devices.

    Aside from this, another requirement is that Google Phone-top Search and the Android Market Client icon must be placed at least on the panel immediately adjacent to the Default Home Screen.

    All other Google Applications will be placed no more than one level below the Phone Top.

    Google requires that anyone who distributes an Android handset under their rigorous guidelines submit monthly sales data, which shows device sales in a regional breakdown.

    Google restricts any OEM from forking Android, noting in the MADA any actions that may cause or result in the fragmentation of Android are not permissible.
    Each manufacture must send 4 handsets for approval
    10-06-15 11:25 PM
  21. RubenDM's Avatar
    How is it possible that people start rumors like these when Chen himself told us clearly that only security updates where comming to current bb10 devices.
    He also mentioned that they had to go to android to get all the apps cause it wasn't possible due to some rules etc to get the google play services on b10.

    So i don't want to burst your bubble, but it is officialy stated that this will NOT happend.

    Posted via CB10
    DJM626 likes this.
    10-07-15 12:16 AM
  22. DamianWarS's Avatar
    ...must send 4 handsets for approval...
    Not sure if you were disqualify that quote or validating it. If true however what are the "4 approved handsets" from BlackBerry?

    Posted via CB10
    10-07-15 01:37 AM
  23. Soulstream's Avatar
    Not sure if you were disqualify that quote or validating it. If true however what are the "4 approved handsets" from BlackBerry?

    Posted via CB10
    It doesn't mean 4 types of device, just 4 devices of the same type. So in BB's case they must send 4 Privs to Google for certification. I think it's in case one breaks or they just want multiple people/departments testing the device at once.
    10-07-15 08:11 AM
  24. DamianWarS's Avatar
    Is bb10 android runtime an example of android being "forked"

    Posted via CB10
    10-07-15 08:16 AM
  25. joeldf's Avatar
    Ummm. Someone received the longest and most inaccurate post award today...
    From Googles "Mobile Application Distribution Agreement” which all members of OHA must comply to have a Google Play License.
    And, that has just recently been invalidated in Russia... Google ordered to stop anti-competitive Android practices in Russia | The Verge

    India is looking into this. As is the EU. In the U.S., the FTC has already forced Google to back off on most of those requirements, but it may not stop there.

    It already seems like most of those OHA requirements are slowly being eroded.
    10-07-15 10:51 AM
31 12

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