03-20-16 07:11 PM
36 12
tools
  1. hoopitz's Avatar
    BlackBerry 'exploring alternatives' to WhatsApp for BB10

    This is ridiculous. How about, oh, I dunno, BBM?!? You do own it and everything! I understand that a lot of BlackBerry users use WhatsApp, so this is a relevant issue, but this is almost comical.

    The irony that WhatsApp initially, heavily targeted BBM users when they first launched, aside, it's so sad that BBM is just going to waste. It's a great app, and they should have been marketing it down people's throats. They're so concerned about how to slowly monetize BBM, when clearly having the users is where the real value is.
    03-03-16 01:25 PM
  2. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    BlackBerry 'exploring alternatives' to WhatsApp for BB10

    This is ridiculous. How about, oh, I dunno, BBM?!? You do own it and everything! I understand that a lot of BlackBerry users use WhatsApp, so this is a relevant issue, but this is almost comical.

    The irony that WhatsApp initially, heavily targeted BBM users when they first launched, aside, it's so sad that BBM is just going to waste. It's a great app, and they should have been marketing it down people's throats. They're so concerned about how to slowly monetize BBM, when clearly having the users is where the real value is.
    Too Little, Too Late..... that is unfortunately BlackBerry's corporate mantra.

    By the time BBM went cross platform (and a year went by while it was in beta and unusable), WhatsApp, LINE and a dozen other had already eaten away most of BBMs market share, and had become the main choices.

    I really love the whole " commitment to BlackBerry 10 and our developers is unwavering," - I've seen no sign that BlackBerry is committed to developers in ANY way. No new developer tools, no plans to upgrade the runtime, ending of the Built for BlackBerry program, problems with developer payments....

    Let's face it... for the customer base that BB10 will be appealing too during this period, there isn't much need for Whatsapp.
    JeepBB and SeeBeeEss like this.
    03-03-16 01:37 PM
  3. Al moon's Avatar
    seems like bb themselves dont know what they have. bbm is just as good as any other messaging app out there but guess what most people dont use it because bb doesnt know how to ram anything down peoples throat
    03-03-16 01:39 PM
  4. BCITMike's Avatar
    Meaning, we'll see if Android side loaded will work.

    Posted via CB10
    03-03-16 04:10 PM
  5. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    I think you missed the entire point of the article. The point wasn't to find an alternative messaging client or service altogether. Obviously BBM is there. Instead, the point was exploring alternatives options to still support Whatsapp after Whatsapp's official support ends. ie... BBRY is considering an option to provide an in-house development option to continue supporting Whatsapp after Whatsapp themselves halt development. Basically, BBRY is tossing out the option of "If you'll allow us, we'll continue development of the app at no cost to you."
    03-03-16 04:26 PM
  6. europolska00's Avatar
    I think you missed the entire point of the article. The point wasn't to find an alternative messaging client or service altogether. Obviously BBM is there. Instead, the point was exploring alternatives options to still support Whatsapp after Whatsapp's official support ends. ie... BBRY is considering an option to provide an in-house development option to continue supporting Whatsapp after Whatsapp themselves halt development. Basically, BBRY is tossing out the option of "If you'll allow us, we'll continue development of the app at no cost to you."
    Maybe they could spend those dollars not on facilitating their competitors app, but rather by beefing up their own. I don't know like adding the long promised BBM Video to BBM Android...the os your flagship phone is using. Use those dollars to support the servers for that service. Dark theme wouldn't hurt either.

    Posted via CB10
    hoopitz and Stewartj1 like this.
    03-03-16 05:47 PM
  7. early2bed's Avatar
    Maybe they could spend those dollars not on facilitating their competitors app, but rather by beefing up their own. I don't know like adding the long promised BBM Video to BBM Android...the os your flagship phone is using. Use those dollars to support the servers for that service. Dark theme wouldn't hurt either.
    So, outspend or out-innovate FaceBook AND take their entrenched market-share (where people must use what contacts are using) AND get this done by the end of the year?
    03-03-16 06:18 PM
  8. hoopitz's Avatar
    So, outspend or out-innovate FaceBook AND take their entrenched market-share (where people must use what contacts are using) AND get this done by the end of the year?
    It doesn't take a fortune to out innovate someone else. BBM already has a foundation that is, in my opinion, much better than WhatsApp, and they already have the capabilities for cross-platform video chat (a la BBM Meetings). This is perhaps a moot point, but BlackBerry should have been working on beefing up BBM long before WhatsApp made this announcement.

    None of this changes the fact that they have no choice but to figure out how to service BlackBerry WhatsApp users, and they are going to spend a lot of resources doing so, which could be used elsewhere. It's just sad.
    03-04-16 03:45 PM
  9. koool1's Avatar
    I will not miss Whatsapp. Already deleted.

    Posted via  BlackBerry Z30
    03-04-16 03:54 PM
  10. hoopitz's Avatar
    I think you missed the entire point of the article. The point wasn't to find an alternative messaging client or service altogether. Obviously BBM is there. Instead, the point was exploring alternatives options to still support Whatsapp after Whatsapp's official support ends. ie... BBRY is considering an option to provide an in-house development option to continue supporting Whatsapp after Whatsapp themselves halt development. Basically, BBRY is tossing out the option of "If you'll allow us, we'll continue development of the app at no cost to you."
    Yeah, I understood that. I'm just saying it's very sad, and somewhat ironic that they are going to be spending all of these resources to develop someone else's competing service (if they're allowed). If they would have just taken BBM cross platform earlier, when Balsillie wanted to (and yes, I know hindsight is 20/20) WhatsApp wouldn't even be on the map. Now, they have to waste time and money solving this problem.
    03-04-16 03:57 PM
  11. JeepBB's Avatar
    Now, they have to waste time and money solving this problem.
    Nope, BB won't spend a dime on this. They'll instead issue a PR saying they are working on a way around this. I'm pretty sure that'll be the extent of BB's "efforts"
    03-05-16 03:16 PM
  12. GadgetTravel's Avatar
    Yeah, I understood that. I'm just saying it's very sad, and somewhat ironic that they are going to be spending all of these resources to develop someone else's competing service (if they're allowed). If they would have just taken BBM cross platform earlier, when Balsillie wanted to (and yes, I know hindsight is 20/20) WhatsApp wouldn't even be on the map. Now, they have to waste time and money solving this problem.
    They won't actually spend money on this. BBM is not the answer either. Even if it was cross platform earlier I don't think it could compete well with modern messaging systems.
    03-05-16 03:41 PM
  13. menshawy's Avatar
    Regardless to the article, it came to my mind now how it was possible for MSN Messenger and Yahoo Messenger users to add and chat with each other back on the old days.

    Posted via CB10
    03-05-16 04:04 PM
  14. app_Developer's Avatar
    Yeah, I understood that. I'm just saying it's very sad, and somewhat ironic that they are going to be spending all of these resources to develop someone else's competing service (if they're allowed).
    It would be sad and ironic, if it were actually true. The WA team doesn't want to support 3rd party developers. They don't want to build monetization features on unpopular phones. BB management doesn't want to spend money developing WA for BB10 when they could spend that money improving BBM for Android instead.

    As others have said, this is just what PR guys say when instructed to keep BB10 going along for another quarter or two.
    JeepBB and chance1180 like this.
    03-05-16 04:06 PM
  15. chance1180's Avatar
    That is exactly the purpose of their so-called exploring alternatives. Just so BBry can squeeze the last bb10 devices out of their inventory. They would say anything right now to make customers think bb10 is still afloat and a viable OS. Profits are one hell of a drug.
    03-05-16 05:14 PM
  16. ZeBB45's Avatar
    So BlackBerry is exploring options such as developing their own whatsapp client? If that were true then I could imagine it to be a disaster.

    We all remember how their own facebook app panned out...

    Q10 - 10.3.2.2876/SR .2836  < α∂∂ιт > 
    03-06-16 03:01 AM
  17. ZeBB45's Avatar
    One of WhatsApp's reasons for discontinuing support for BB10 is the lack of avalable API's to them, that would cause their development team problems as whatsapp moves forward.

    Maybe BlackBerry would look into opening up more api's in 10.3.4.

    Q10 - 10.3.2.2876/SR .2836  < α∂∂ιт > 
    03-06-16 03:15 AM
  18. JeepBB's Avatar
    One of WhatsApp's reasons for discontinuing support for BB10 is the lack of avalable API's to them, that would cause their development team problems as whatsapp moves forward.

    Maybe BlackBerry would look into opening up more api's in 10.3.4.
    BB told Devs, in a well-publicised letter of several months ago, that development of the SDK, APIs, Android RT, etc, etc was frozen in place and that no further updates to the toolset would be coming. WhatsApp has good reason to point the finger at BB in this, but I'm sure BB's disappearing market share was the decider for WhatsApp.

    I seriously doubt that the "we're done with BB10 tool support" decision would be reversed in 10.3.4. There's no will to develop BB10 within BB and, even if there were that will, most of the developers who would do that work are either working on the Priv Apps, or working for some other company. And, as I doubt BB10's market share is going to increase from this point on, even if those developer tools were updated, the already pitiful (and shrinking) BB market share likely removes any remaining incentive for WhatsApp to continue supporting BB10.

    BB can "explore alternatives" all they want, though as I've mentioned I think that's meaningless PR fluff to keep the faithful on-board, but it's over.
    03-06-16 04:50 AM
  19. Invictus0's Avatar
    BB told Devs, in a well-publicised letter of several months ago, that development of the SDK, APIs, Android RT, etc, etc was frozen in place and that no further updates to the toolset would be coming. WhatsApp has good reason to point the finger at BB in this, but I'm sure BB's disappearing market share was the decider for WhatsApp.

    I seriously doubt that the "we're done with BB10 tool support" decision would be reversed in 10.3.4. There's no will to develop BB10 within BB and, even if there were that will, most of the developers who would do that work are either working on the Priv Apps, or working for some other company. And, as I doubt BB10's market share is going to increase from this point on, even if those developer tools were updated, the already pitiful (and shrinking) BB market share likely removes any remaining incentive for WhatsApp to continue supporting BB10.

    BB can "explore alternatives" all they want, though as I've mentioned I think that's meaningless PR fluff to keep the faithful on-board, but it's over.
    They did say new API's will be released "as required", I assume that means existing private API's could be made public to some extent if needed. Whether or not they actually do release them is anyone's guess.

    An update for BlackBerry 10 Developers | BlackBerry Developer Blog
    03-06-16 12:07 PM
  20. JeepBB's Avatar
    They did say new API's will be released "as required", I assume that means existing private API's could be made public to some extent if needed. Whether or not they actually do release them is anyone's guess.

    An update for BlackBerry 10 Developers | BlackBerry Developer Blog
    The "we'll add more stuff as required" is yet more PR fluff designed to soften the harsh "we're done with further BB10 development" message of the main text IMO. I wouldn't bet a cent on the likelihood that BB would *ever* determine that more stuff is "required" in BB10.

    The "truth" is that BB really *is* done with BB10. To believe otherwise is delusional IMO.

    BB10 *phones* will continue to work for as long as the owner is prepared to use a platform that is frozen-in-time, as several posters here have indicated they are willing to do. That strategy is sustainable providing the wider tech world doesn't move too fast. Steadily, existing apps will cease to work, new apps won't work on the elderly Android RT, native BB10 development won't happen, new protocols and frequency bands will come, and your BB10 phone will eventually cease to be usable.

    Anyone prepared to become a BB10 die-hard and hold onto their BB10 phone "forever", will have an increasingly unproductive and frustrating future. I doubt too many will follow that road for long.

    All in my opinion of course, though to believe otherwise likely involves unicorns.
    LuvULongTime and chance1180 like this.
    03-06-16 12:51 PM
  21. Invictus0's Avatar
    The "we'll add more stuff as required" is yet more PR fluff designed to soften the harsh "we're done with further BB10 development" message of the main text IMO. I wouldn't bet a cent on the likelihood that BB would *ever* determine that more stuff is "required" in BB10.

    The "truth" is that BB really *is* done with BB10. To believe otherwise is delusional IMO.

    BB10 *phones* will continue to work for as long as the owner is prepared to use a platform that is frozen-in-time, as several posters here have indicated they are willing to do. That strategy is sustainable providing the wider tech world doesn't move too fast. Steadily, existing apps will cease to work, new apps won't work on the elderly Android RT, native BB10 development won't happen, new protocols and frequency bands will come, and your BB10 phone will eventually cease to be usable.

    Anyone prepared to become a BB10 die-hard and hold onto their BB10 phone "forever", will have an increasingly unproductive and frustrating future. I doubt too many will follow that road for long.

    All in my opinion of course, though to believe otherwise likely involves unicorns.
    We're pretty much on the same page, my view is if new API's aren't released/made public with 10.3.3 (especially in light of WA's announcement) we probably won't see them with 10.3.4 either.

    I do wonder if there are any stats in regards to how many "high profile" apps on BlackBerry World still work, partially work, etc.
    JeepBB likes this.
    03-06-16 03:11 PM
  22. ZeBB45's Avatar
    I do wonder if there are any stats in regards to how many "high profile" apps on BlackBerry World still work, partially work, etc.
    The only apps that will lose their functionality are those that require a connection to a server for its key functionality, or form communication with the Internet. For instance, say the dev for the SuperTube youtube client stopped updating his app then it would stop functioning the day google made any changes on their Youtube server. On the other hand, apps such as ClipMan would work forever as it's an offline utility app.

    The stock Facebook is the best example of how apps will stop functioning correcty over time, facebook made server-sided changes, and BlackBerry didnt/couldn't update their client. I say couldn't because I don't think the New API's were public.


    For argument sake, let's pretend that all the native devs decided to stop working on their apps, the following apps would stop functioning correctly over time:

    * Inst10
    * SuperTube
    * Evolution Browser
    * Bowsie
    * Face10
    * FastTube
    * Twittly
    * ReaditNow
    * Hub Browser
    * IGrann

    That's just a list off the top of my head, I'm sure there plenty of other apps I've not included that require Internet communication.

    Here's a small list of apps I believe that would always work as stated:

    * ClipMan
    * Camera++
    * StarTracker
    * Duckto
    * PhotoStudio
    * PSP (privacy studio pro)

    Q10 - 10.3.2.2876/SR .2836  < α∂∂ιт > 
    03-06-16 04:24 PM
  23. Invictus0's Avatar
    The only apps that will lose their functionality are those that require a connection to a server for its key functionality, or form communication with the Internet. For instance, say the dev for the SuperTube youtube client stopped updating his app then it would stop functioning the day google made any changes on their Youtube server. On the other hand, apps such as ClipMan would work forever as it's an offline utility app.

    The stock Facebook is the best example of how apps will stop functioning correcty over time, facebook made server-sided changes, and BlackBerry didnt/couldn't update their client. I say couldn't because I don't think the New API's were public.


    For argument sake, let's pretend that all the native devs decided to stop working on their apps, the following apps would stop functioning correctly over time:

    * Inst10
    * SuperTube
    * Evolution Browser
    * Bowsie
    * Face10
    * FastTube
    * Twittly
    * ReaditNow
    * Hub Browser
    * IGrann

    That's just a list off the top of my head, I'm sure there plenty of other apps I've not included that require Internet communication.

    Here's a small list of apps I believe that would always work as stated:

    * ClipMan
    * Camera++
    * StarTracker
    * Duckto
    * PhotoStudio
    * PSP (privacy studio pro)

    Q10 - 10.3.2.2876/SR .2836  < α∂∂ιт > 
    Sorry I should have clarified, I meant official apps. For example, The Guardian app stopped working last week, Slacker Radio and Print to Go stopped a few months before that, etc.

    But you're right, apps that don't connect to a service should work just fine barring any compatibility issues that may arise with an OS update.
    03-06-16 05:24 PM
  24. ZeBB45's Avatar
    Sorry I should have clarified, I meant official apps. For example, The Guardian app stopped working last week, Slacker Radio and Print to Go stopped a few months before that, etc.
    I guess like all other native devs it's the same situation. However, i live in the UK and use an android Met Office app for my weather and I use a really old version of the application. In fact, it's 2+ years old, and still functions correctly.
    I've even used tools like lucky patcher to modify it's apk to remove advertisements etc. Each app would be an individual bases.

    When the news came that WhatsApp are ending support for their native app at the end of 2016 had caused a big stir-up around here. Many, I believe jumped to the conclusion that whatsapp will stop working completely on new years day, 2017. We could, for instance have a situation where the core functionality lasts us the next two years (messaging only) but the voice notes stop working properly.

    I'd say that it would last longer as it's an official app and not a third party client. Best example is that I'm using a really old version of Messenger for Facebook (android) as it plays nice with the runtime and works properly, even though it's really old.

    Q10 - 10.3.2.2876/SR .2836  < α∂∂ιт > 
    03-06-16 05:52 PM
  25. early2bed's Avatar

    I'd say that it would last longer as it's an official app and not a third party client. Best example is that I'm using a really old version of Messenger for Facebook (android) as it plays nice with the runtime and works properly, even though it's really old.

    Q10 - 10.3.2.2876/SR .2836  < α∂∂ιт > 
    Well you will certainly find people, hear, that are willing to do much of their daily messaging on an app that may or may not work the next day, the vast majority of users even BlackBerry users won't do this. For most people, messaging is about convenience and reliability not hey cool this still works!
    JeepBB likes this.
    03-06-16 06:19 PM
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