04-13-15 11:59 PM
233 ... 45678 ...
tools
  1. BACK-2-BLACK's Avatar
    Are you irritated that there's no BlackBerry flagship all-touch??
    Not at all, quite the opposite actually.
    03-22-15 11:38 AM
  2. jmr1015's Avatar
    I realise that this will come as a shock to many CB'ers, but most iPhone buyers aren't actually mindless fools, and are perfectly capable of choosing a product that suits them and their lifestyle. They are certainly influenced by marketing and advertising, which is surely its purpose, but they won't repeatedly spend their cash on turds, buying more of them every year, no matter how shiny it is.


    Quit making sense! You're ruining the age-old "iSheep" defense that so many hold dear...
    03-22-15 01:52 PM
  3. jmr1015's Avatar
    You can (and will) play the spec game all day long..... It means nothing to 99.9% of the world.... People want a "cool" phone that works.... and Blackberry has not been able to make a phone that was "cool" they do make many that "work" great but are not "cool"... It's all marketing....... Blackberry fell way behind and are trying to scratch out a small chunk of market share... Part of the charm of my Blackberry is BECAUSE nobody els has them. That is my statement....
    BlackBerry should run with that. It's the phone for Hipsters, because it's not mainstream and no one else has them.

    "What kind of phone is that?"
    "Oh it's just a BlackBerry Passport. You probably haven't heard of it."
    03-22-15 02:03 PM
  4. birdman_38's Avatar
    BlackBerry should run with that. It's the phone for Hipsters, because it's not mainstream and no one else has them.
    The hipsters I know of all have what's popular... iPhone or Samsung Galaxy.
    JeepBB and techvisor like this.
    03-22-15 02:25 PM
  5. fishlove73's Avatar
    Even your IDC link shows Apple in a virtual tie for first place as the leading smartphone manufacturer in the world! Plus, Apple is far and away the leading smartphone manufacturer in the USA. http://www.comscore.com/Insights/Mar...r-Market-Share

    Apple is a luxury brand, so of course fewer people globally can afford Apple products than can afford cheap Androids/Windows Phones/ BlackBerries. But a userbase composed of non- affluent people doesn't produce the same impact as a userbase composed of affluent people. This is one explanation as to why developers prefer coding for iOS and why Apple gets so much more cooperation from other major companies than most competitors do.

    Great ideas. I could also see Apple taking mercy on Micro$oft out of consideration of the bailout that Gates/M$ provided that kept Apple alive.

    I'm a guy who likes the in-store experience at the Apple store, and not everyone has a friend with an iPhone. But apart from that, I agree with everything you wrote.
    Blackberrys... cheap? My ATT Passport was more money than Iphone6 when I was at the store.

    му ηєω мιηι ℓαρтσρ...αкα ραѕѕρσят!!!
    eyesopen1111 likes this.
    03-23-15 02:31 AM
  6. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    Blackberrys... cheap? My ATT Passport was more money than Iphone6 when I was at the store.

    му ηєω мιηι ℓαρтσρ...αкα ραѕѕρσят!!!
    Hahaha I was talking about the low-cost fleet phones. I agree, the Passport is NOT a cheap BlackBerry--its the most expensive one! But I think you make a great point that BlackBerry customers will pay a premium price for a premium product.
    03-23-15 03:32 AM
  7. anon(5061193)'s Avatar
    I am not sure about the reason for the Classic. I get the whole "retro" thing, but is that a mainstream making money idea?? It would be a good niche phone, but for a company that is in the dumps these days, catering to the few instead of the many is puzzling. The Passport on the other hand is a huge move... That is a risk worth making... They need to make big moves to get back in the game.. Apple just has to ad an "s" to their next phone and they will sell a billion of them..Time will tell....
    03-23-15 07:09 AM
  8. RyanGermann's Avatar
    I realise that this will come as a shock to many CB'ers, but most iPhone buyers aren't actually mindless fools, and are perfectly capable of choosing a product that suits them and their lifestyle. They are certainly influenced by marketing and advertising, which is surely its purpose, but they won't repeatedly spend their cash on turds, buying more of them every year, no matter how shiny it is.
    yes, but many are in a zone that keeps them ignorant of the possibilities... they can get onto that zone a number of ways not the least of which is years of negative reinforcement that blackberry is doomed and piled on with the (for lack of better term) bullying that went with it, shaming weak-willed and -minded to try another more "respectable" platform (an attitude that persists today in the form of 'the tool belt is old fashioned' among so-called BlackBerry fans").

    BB10 devices are a better fit for some iPhone users than iPhone is, but those users will never know, or are disinclined to invest the effort of trying BB10 to even find out.

    Posted via CB10
    03-23-15 06:22 PM
  9. crackberry_geek's Avatar
    yes, but many are in a zone that keeps them ignorant of the possibilities... they can get onto that zone a number of ways not the least of which is years of negative reinforcement that blackberry is doomed and piled on with the (for lack of better term) bullying that went with it, shaming weak-willed and -minded to try another more "respectable" platform (an attitude that persists today in the form of 'the tool belt is old fashioned' among so-called BlackBerry fans").

    BB10 devices are a better fit for some iPhone users than iPhone is, but those users will never know, or are disinclined to invest the effort of trying BB10 to even find out.

    Posted via CB10
    The primary reason most of those users will "never know" has nothing to do with bullying and everything to do with BlackBerry's bull headed and arrogant refusal to advertise.

    Posted via CB10
    03-23-15 06:29 PM
  10. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    The primary reason most of those users will "never know" has nothing to do with bullying and everything to do with BlackBerry's bull headed and arrogant refusal to advertise.

    Posted via CB10
    In addition to no marketing, BlackBerry doesnt produce the form factors that are in demand. IPhone owners are by definition flagship all-touch customers. BlackBerry stubbornly and IMHO stupidly refuses to make a flagship all-touch device. Apart from the very few iPhone owners who would be willing to give up their apps, status, cameras, Apple Pay, 64-bit chips, and Apple Care in exchange for BlackBerry's PKBs or enhanced security, BlackBerry is perfectly irrelevant to them.
    JeepBB and techvisor like this.
    03-23-15 06:52 PM
  11. fishlove73's Avatar
    In addition to no marketing, BlackBerry doesnt produce the form factors that are in demand. IPhone owners are by definition flagship all-touch customers. BlackBerry stubbornly and IMHO stupidly refuses to make a flagship all-touch device. Apart from the very few iPhone owners who would be willing to give up their apps, status, cameras, Apple Pay, 64-bit chips, and Apple Care in exchange for BlackBerry's PKBs or enhanced security, BlackBerry is perfectly irrelevant to them.
    I can attest to this. Found out about the passport on crackberry. Then found out ATT would have one. Went to ATT store...no dice, they didn't stock it. Checked online..no stores within 100 miles had one...and keep in mind there are tons of Businesses where I live. I had to order it online from ATT and over paid, got sucked into a contract because I wanted the curved one. I still have to order accessories online...which is even more of a chore...because I have the "curved passport". When I asked about blackberry at the ATT store...they were straight up diccs. So..even though I like Blackberry, somewhat happy with my device....that experience made me hot smokin mad. Mad enough to change? IDK, but I can tell you over all...the ATT experience, ordering and waiting, not finding ready accessories right away was a crap experience. On the + side, I pull out my phone and people are like "whoa, WTF is that"?

    му ηєω мιηι ℓαρтσρ...αкα ραѕѕρσят!!!
    03-23-15 07:08 PM
  12. BCITMike's Avatar
    There's an expression in my part of the world: "You can polish a turd 'til it gleams, but it's still a turd".

    Apple wouldn't be selling more ever devices, every year, and closing in on being the first TRILLION dollar company in history if all there was to their continued success was marketing.

    Apple's marketing is excellent, but surely the entire purpose of marketing is to convince buyers that they "need" a product. "Need" in quotes, because of course nobody "needs" a smartphone, anymore than they "need" a shiny new car, TV, fridge, stereo, camera, shoes, etc, etc. The purpose of marketing and advertising is to make that "want" seem like a "need".

    I realise that this will come as a shock to many CB'ers, but most iPhone buyers aren't actually mindless fools, and are perfectly capable of choosing a product that suits them and their lifestyle. They are certainly influenced by marketing and advertising, which is surely its purpose, but they won't repeatedly spend their cash on turds, buying more of them every year, no matter how shiny it is.
    You can only speak from anecdotal experience, as will I and most others. When I do an unofficial poll out of the 5-10 people I know in the circle, I can say most are mindless fools. For example, one of my buddies who can't pay any of his bills on time, satisfied with a simple nokia type phone for many years (moves providers due to non-payment and hates talking on the phone), decides he suddenly needs an iPhone so he can facetime with his nephew on Christmas Day... that he'll see hours later if not already see him in the morning (he lives 20 minutes away or so). To me, when you can't afford your basic living expenses and buy an iPhone for an annual video chat, I lean towards "mindless fool".

    What would be the definition of mindless in this context? People who think/assume something that is WAY wrong (ie, misinformed on how a feature/technology works)? People who buy it without considering their needs or wants but gets what their friends have? I think without a clear definition of "mindless fools", we won't be able to agree. But it's moot, since its all anecdotal, anyways.

    Anecdotal: Android friends are more technically inclined than iPhone friends. Follow tech news, knows computer terms, etc. Familiar with Android and Apple stuff. Where iPhone people typically do not know much outside of Apple world (anecdotally speaking!).
    03-23-15 08:41 PM
  13. JeepBB's Avatar
    You can only speak from anecdotal experience, as will I and most others. When I do an unofficial poll out of the 5-10 people I know in the circle, I can say most are mindless fools. For example, one of my buddies who can't pay any of his bills on time, satisfied with a simple nokia type phone for many years (moves providers due to non-payment and hates talking on the phone), decides he suddenly needs an iPhone so he can facetime with his nephew on Christmas Day... that he'll see hours later if not already see him in the morning (he lives 20 minutes away or so). To me, when you can't afford your basic living expenses and buy an iPhone for an annual video chat, I lean towards "mindless fool".

    What would be the definition of mindless in this context? People who think/assume something that is WAY wrong (ie, misinformed on how a feature/technology works)? People who buy it without considering their needs or wants but gets what their friends have? I think without a clear definition of "mindless fools", we won't be able to agree. But it's moot, since its all anecdotal, anyways.

    Anecdotal: Android friends are more technically inclined than iPhone friends. Follow tech news, knows computer terms, etc. Familiar with Android and Apple stuff. Where iPhone people typically do not know much outside of Apple world (anecdotally speaking!).
    I'm far from an iFan. I haven't owned an iPhone since the 3GS, but I do have more faith than you in people's ability to make sound decisions and take responsibility for their lives. Yes, we all know a feckless someone who stumbles thorough life, making irrational decisions at every turn. Those people (including those owning an iPhone) aren't even close to being in the majority... If they were, our species would have been toast eons ago!

    Someone who buys a phone because he sees that his buddies, who presumably lead a similar life, have one; *has* indisputably considered their needs. They've chosen to buy a phone that completely meets the needs of people leading the life that they do. That's hardly an irrational or mindless act.

    My main takeaway from your post is that you seem to believe that that majority of your social group are "mindless fools". Hopefully I've just got the wrong end of the stick, and you don't really believe that of your friends.
    03-24-15 03:33 AM
  14. bakron1's Avatar
    Bottom line is Apple did not get to where they are by selling products to iSheep, Fanboys or clueless consumers.

    They are where they are because they developed and marketed a product the consumer wanted and they are being rewarded for it period.

    All the Blackberry faithful are quick to forget that they where once in that same position, but then came complacency, lack of vision and worst one of all, they failed to deliver what the consumer ask for in a timely manner, period.

    I love Blackberry as much as any fan does, but the success of Apple and any other company for that matter is the result of delivering a good product, marketing and most important, customer support.

    All these factors are basic business concepts 101 and is the reason ANY company that follows these principles has the chance to be successful, end of story.
    03-24-15 03:51 AM
  15. lnichols's Avatar
    I used to buy my immediate family all BlackBerry devices so I could keep in touch with them when I traveled internationally and know when they got the messages. As soon as it went cross platform, that changed. So I bought a product for them specifically because it was part of the ecosystem I was in to communicate efficiently with them. So why is it that people now doing this for iOS/iMessage/Facetime are mindless automatons? Apple is clearly the app leader. They clearly have the high end smart phone market locked down at least in the US and many developed nations, so why are people that want to be part of this sheep, mindless, etc.?

    Posted via CB10
    anon(5061193) and techvisor like this.
    03-24-15 07:49 AM
  16. birdman_38's Avatar
    So why is it that people now doing this for iOS/iMessage/Facetime are mindless automatons? Apple is clearly the app leader. They clearly have the high end smart phone market locked down at least in the US and many developed nations, so why are people that want to be part of this sheep, mindless, etc.?
    There are some consumers who choose iPhone because their family and friends have it. I would venture to say about half of them do. Could be where that "mindless" concept comes from. But people need to understand why they do it. Fellow iPhone users are up to 100% satisfied with their device. And they have instant peer support. Can't say the same for BlackBerry 10.
    JeepBB and techvisor like this.
    03-24-15 08:00 AM
  17. tchocky77's Avatar
    You can only speak from anecdotal experience,
    That's a foolish thing to think.

    We can speak from empirical data, and do every single day.

    Just because you associate with fools that buy iPhones doesn't mean everyone of the millions of people that have bought, and then happily bought again, an iphone are of such low stock.

    But I'm not surprised, given that you think "we can only speak from anecdotal experience." That's just dumb.
    03-24-15 10:56 AM
  18. anon(5061193)'s Avatar
    There are some consumers who choose iPhone because their family and friends have it. I would venture to say about half of them do. Could be where that "mindless" concept comes from. But people need to understand why they do it. Fellow iPhone users are up to 100% satisfied with their device. And they have instant peer support. Can't say the same for BlackBerry 10.
    My daughter is off to college, my younger daughter is going to be going to school in Israel in the fall and they all have Apple everything. Iphones, Ipads, MacBook Air....... Why the hell would I not be part of the same ecosystem as the rest of the family? I love BlackBerry and will always have one, but the Iphone 6+ will always be my "go-to" phone.. Unless the entire family goes in another direction....

    It is frustrating as hell hearing people dump on Apple products.... It is just plain stupid...
    03-24-15 03:09 PM
  19. damojo's Avatar
    Posted via CB10
    03-24-15 04:10 PM
  20. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    The point of Apple's trade-in program would be to convert BlackBerry customers to a high-end all-touch iPhone. So Chen says he doesnt need or use a flagship all-touch BlackBerry device. Apple replies, "Flagship all-touch phones are all I sell, and take a look at my numbers!"

    There's an old saying that it costs a business nine times more to create a new customer than it does to keep an existing customer. That alone should get BlackBerry positioning some sort of flagship all-touch to at least partially answer the threat of Apple's iPhone. Even worse, with the iPhone 6 and 6+'s 99% customer satisfaction rating, any iPhone converts are unlikely to return to the BlackBerry fold. What is it in BlackBerry's DNA that makes it ignore threats from Apple until its too late? This is yet another example.

    I think that Chen, were he serious about staying in the hardware business, would be fighting tooth and nail to protect these Z-series and upgrade customers, because winning them back would be very difficult and expensive. So I suppose Chen finds these customers expendable, meaning that he has no plan to either protect them now or win them back later? Strange plan, isnt it?
    03-24-15 04:52 PM
  21. crackberry_geek's Avatar
    The point of Apple's trade-in program would be to convert BlackBerry customers to a high-end all-touch iPhone. So Chen says he doesnt need or use a flagship all-touch BlackBerry device. Apple replies, "Flagship all-touch phones are all I sell, and take a look at my numbers!"

    There's an old saying that it costs a business nine times more to create a new customer than it does to keep an existing customer. That alone should get BlackBerry positioning some sort of flagship all-touch to at least partially answer the threat of Apple's iPhone. Even worse, with the iPhone 6 and 6+'s 99% customer satisfaction rating, any iPhone converts are unlikely to return to the BlackBerry fold. What is it in BlackBerry's DNA that makes it ignore threats from Apple until its too late? This is yet another example.

    I think that Chen, were he serious about staying in the hardware business, would be fighting tooth and nail to protect these Z-series and upgrade customers, because winning them back would be very difficult and expensive. So I suppose Chen finds these customers expendable, meaning that he has no plan to either protect them now or win them back later? Strange plan, isnt it?
    I swear there must be something in BlackBerry's handbook that says we're gonna make the same mistakes over and over and over and over again... until something different happens.

    Posted via CB10
    MarsupilamiX, JeepBB and techvisor like this.
    03-24-15 05:19 PM
  22. notfanboy's Avatar
    The point of Apple's trade-in program would be to convert BlackBerry customers to a high-end all-touch iPhone. So Chen says he doesn’t need or use a flagship all-touch BlackBerry device. Apple replies, "Flagship all-touch phones are all I sell, and take a look at my numbers!"

    There's an old saying that it costs a business nine times more to create a new customer than it does to keep an existing customer. That alone should get BlackBerry positioning some sort of flagship all-touch to at least partially answer the threat of Apple's iPhone. Even worse, with the iPhone 6 and 6+'s 99% customer satisfaction rating, any iPhone converts are unlikely to return to the BlackBerry fold. What is it in BlackBerry's DNA that makes it ignore threats from Apple until it’s too late? This is yet another example.
    Actually BlackBerry predated Apple in offering a similar promotion. Just four months ago, BlackBerry had their trade-up program where they would offer up to $550 for an iPhone user to convert to BlackBerry. Did you forget about this?
    03-24-15 06:46 PM
  23. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    Actually BlackBerry predated Apple in offering a similar promotion. Just four months ago, BlackBerry had their trade-up program where they would offer up to $550 for an iPhone user to convert to BlackBerry. Did you forget about this?
    The BlackBerry trade-up program didnt slip my mind, it just wasnt relevant to the points I was making. I felt the BlackBerry trade-up was more about creating a public impression that BlackBerry was an Apple-level quality brand such that some Apple owners might wish to switch. There was no real thought that there would be many actual takers. The rumored Apple trade-in program, I think, is really about getting a large number of people to switch.
    JeepBB and techvisor like this.
    03-24-15 07:08 PM
  24. A_Aviator_A's Avatar
    Every BB user I know (myself included) can afford a 6+ without breaking a sweat or their wallet.
    For most of us its personal choice not a financial one. No thanks.
    byex likes this.
    03-24-15 08:59 PM
  25. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    What I think BB has learned while focusing on the Enterprise market is that there are not enough "bleeding edge" types who want the flagship phones. As the business is making money.. maybe BB figured out what many have tagged... " it's about productivity,,,, not toys".... the vocal minority who clamour for new and greater specs really should go wade in the Android pond as that is where there hearts desire is best represented... Flagship and specs... their two favourite words... Cannot see Apple or BB being their cup of tea as neither really focuses on specs...

    As for the dig at Windows Phone not being invited to the party... why bother???? everyone is up and arms when someone says something snarky about BB but seems to be fine to dump on WP and other brands..... as with BB they have their hardcore fan base.... so why insult them when BB takes such issues being insulted... seems all very childish....
    When we look at the iPhone 6/+, we see a phone that has great specs.
    Depending on where we look, not the best available, but then also some of the best, like the CPU.

    When we look at enterprise sales, we see higher priced phones like iPhones/Notes/Galaxies far outselling cheaper BlackBerries.

    I think that there is only one reason why BlackBerry uses the enterprise mantra:
    No consumer is dumb enough to pay 300$ for a Z3/Leap/Classic with those specs. Most consumers weren't interested in the Z30 either.
    The only 5 inch flagship without a 1080p display, back in the day...
    jmr1015, JeepBB and techvisor like this.
    03-24-15 09:12 PM
233 ... 45678 ...

Similar Threads

  1. How do I copy SMS from one BB10 to another BB10?
    By jpvj in forum BlackBerry 10 OS
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 03-19-15, 07:56 AM
  2. Camera quality decreased in update
    By Abhay Singh2 in forum BlackBerry Z10
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-18-15, 03:10 PM
  3. EE announces new Film Club to replace Orange Wednesdays
    By CrackBerry News in forum CrackBerry.com News Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 03-18-15, 05:51 AM
  4. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 03-18-15, 05:24 AM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD