03-28-11 04:01 AM
140 12345 ...
tools
  1. avt123's Avatar
    this is why what he said on the call yesterday will come back to haunt him. we all know 6.1 is not going to catch up to the competition. and if it's true that QNX is coming early 2012, why would someone commit to 6.1 on a two year contract when in about 9 months you can get the next gen devices?
    Most consumers aren't in the know. They buy what they see is currently sitting on the shelves. QNX means nothing to them.
    03-25-11 01:28 PM
  2. i7guy's Avatar
    Most consumers aren't in the know. They buy what they see is currently sitting on the shelves. QNX means nothing to them.
    Right and 6.1 doesn't have to be best in class. It has to compare favorably with the competition, IMO.
    03-25-11 01:38 PM
  3. dutchtender's Avatar
    Most consumers and businesses don't at what's coming out further than a month or two. Us who follow this industry are different - we are always looking for the newest thing. I think the new 6.1 phones will move from high-end to mid-tier once the QNX phones come out (in other words the QNX phones will be pricey)
    counting on the naivete of your customer does not sound like a business plan to me.
    03-25-11 01:39 PM
  4. avt123's Avatar
    Right and 6.1 doesn't have to be best in class. It has to compare favorably with the competition, IMO.
    Agreed. Something doesn't have to be the best for someone to like it.

    Look at Range Rovers. They are rated extremely low all around. Yet people still buy them, rappers still rap about them, and people continue to enjoy driving them.
    03-25-11 01:40 PM
  5. dutchtender's Avatar
    Most consumers aren't in the know. They buy what they see is currently sitting on the shelves. QNX means nothing to them.
    really? it's not actually the consumers you have to worry about. it's the carriers. they are always comparing phones which they have to sell to consumers. they know what's coming. oh and btw, if 6.1 does get take up and people sign 2 year contracts, who is going to buy QNX in 9 months?
    03-25-11 01:41 PM
  6. avt123's Avatar
    counting on the naivete of your customer does not sound like a business plan to me.
    There are more naive consumers than educated ones. Look at all the stupid **** people buy... Snuggie? I'm sure they are great, but I am fine with a blanket or a hoodie.
    Ferretling likes this.
    03-25-11 01:42 PM
  7. dutchtender's Avatar
    There are more naive consumers than educated ones. Look at all the stupid **** people buy... Snuggie? I'm sure they are great, but I am fine with a blanket or a hoodie.
    I don't think you can count on naive consumers bailing you out if you have a poor portfolio of products. consumers aren't that dumb. you can see from this forum that people "start" to wise up after a while. think for a second. rimm has been losing huge share in the USA. That to me is rational behavior by consumer who are choosing better products.
    03-25-11 01:44 PM
  8. avt123's Avatar
    really? it's not actually the consumers you have to worry about. it's the carriers. they are always comparing phones which they have to sell to consumers. they know what's coming. oh and btw, if 6.1 does get take up and people sign 2 year contracts, who is going to buy QNX in 9 months?
    The carriers push what they have on the shelves. Try to future proof you makes them no money. They will sell what is currently out and hope you come back for the upgrade. If not, they still made money.

    They we still pushing the Droid days before the Droid 2 came out. They were still pushing the Incredible before the ThunderBolt came out (I even saw a commercial for the Incredible the other day).

    They want to make money. Selling outdated tech and having people run back for the new devices makes them money.
    03-25-11 01:47 PM
  9. avt123's Avatar
    I don't think you can count on naive consumers bailing you out if you have a poor portfolio of products. consumers aren't that dumb. you can see from this forum that people "start" to wise up after a while. think for a second. rimm has been losing huge share in the USA. That to me is rational behavior by consumer who are choosing better products.
    I see what you are saying. But people are still buying BBs. People like BBM. Children love BBM. They are still selling. Yes they can't count on that for a long time, but QNX will be here soon. 9 months is far away, but it will be here faster than you know it.

    Also, yes RIM lost share, but the smartphone share rose a lot. They gained more numbers all while lossing a bigger piece of the pie. If the smartphone market did not gro at all, and they saw the drops of MS% they did, then it would be a much bigger deal.
    03-25-11 01:50 PM
  10. dutchtender's Avatar
    The carriers push what they have on the shelves. Try to future proof you makes them no money. They will sell what is currently out and hope you come back for the upgrade. If not, they still made money.

    They we still pushing the Droid days before the Droid 2 came out. They were still pushing the Incredible before the ThunderBolt came out (I even saw a commercial for the Incredible the other day).

    They want to make money. Selling outdated tech and having people run back for the new devices makes them money.
    really? I guess you forgot about how Android vanquished Rimm at Verizon. That was essentially a carrier decision based on what they thought would sell best. If 6.1 doesn't measure up to whatever apple and google have out then Verizon isn't going to take much of the product. Verizon puts it's chips on Android. They could have bet on rimm. Your analysis is static, yesterday will be like today. Things change and they change really really fast in wireless.
    03-25-11 01:52 PM
  11. dynot's Avatar
    There's a 6.1 Build for the Torch 1 already on the portal according to @RiseAgainstOdds on Twitter.
    Does this mean we can install a beta version now? What's this portal you speak of? A time gate between now and the date of its release?
    03-25-11 01:53 PM
  12. OMGitworks's Avatar
    So did mine as I see it as an excellent buying opprotunity...you know the whole buy low.....sell high...capitalism thing!

    It must be a lonely world under your bridge!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Surely you have heard of Apple and Google? Let's face it BB is dying company. Unless the PB is a miracle, which I doubt they will be getting their clock cleaned by Apple and Google and the rest of the real companies out there. But for the drop BB would be the best short out there, almost a sure thing. Life lesson - don't bet against the smart money on Wall Street, they always win....
    03-25-11 01:54 PM
  13. i7guy's Avatar
    really? I guess you forgot about how Android vanquished Rimm at Verizon. That was essentially a carrier decision based on what they thought would sell best. If 6.1 doesn't measure up to whatever apple and google have out then Verizon isn't going to take much of the product. Verizon puts it's chips on Android. They could have bet on rimm. Your analysis is static, yesterday will be like today. Things change and they change really really fast in wireless.
    For once I agree with your last statement: things change fast. Which is why I'm not discounting rim.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-25-11 01:56 PM
  14. OMGitworks's Avatar
    this is why what he said on the call yesterday will come back to haunt him. we all know 6.1 is not going to catch up to the competition. and if it's true that QNX is coming early 2012, why would someone commit to 6.1 on a two year contract when in about 9 months you can get the next gen devices?
    We waited for 6.0 as the next coming and it was basically a flop as far as I am concerned. I am not holding my breath for 6.1.... QNX might save BB, but they need to roll it out MUCH faster. 2012 will be too late. BB will become something AOL (remember them) users use and that's about it.
    03-25-11 01:58 PM
  15. OMGitworks's Avatar
    For once I agree with your last statement: things change fast. Which is why I'm not discounting rim.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Yes but RIMM moves so sloooooooooooow.
    03-25-11 01:59 PM
  16. avt123's Avatar
    really? I guess you forgot about how Android vanquished Rimm at Verizon.
    No I have not forgotten. I also have not forgotten how much marketing money VZW put into their Droid line and how they completely stopped marketing BBs.

    Let's also not forget that the newest BB out is the 9650. It is old. People are buying newer devices that are now marketed with specs.

    That was essentially a carrier decision based on what they thought would sell best. If 6.1 doesn't measure up to whatever apple and google have out then Verizon isn't going to take much of the product. Verizon puts it's chips on Android. They could have bet on rimm. Your analysis is static, yesterday will be like today. Things change and they change really really fast in wireless.
    I understand what you are saying. But VZW will put on the shelves whatever they think will sell. If they think OS 6.1 and the devices that come with it will sell, they will put it out. If not, they will wait for QNX.
    03-25-11 02:00 PM
  17. dutchtender's Avatar
    No I have not forgotten. I also have not forgotten how much marketing money VZW put into their Droid line and how they completely stopped marketing BBs.

    Let's also not forget that the newest BB out is the 9650. It is old. People are buying newer devices that are now marketed with specs.



    I understand what you are saying. But VZW will put on the shelves whatever they think will sell. If they think OS 6.1 and the devices that come with it will sell, they will put it out. If not, they will wait for QNX.
    that's exactly what I was saying if you go back and check. But don't forget by summer there will be new goog phones and the ip5. I don't think verizon or anybody in NA is going to make much room for 6.1 or qnx. that ship has sailed.
    03-25-11 02:04 PM
  18. OMGitworks's Avatar
    snip

    I understand what you are saying. But VZW will put on the shelves whatever they think will sell. If they think OS 6.1 and the devices that come with it will sell, they will put it out. If not, they will wait for QNX.
    Why would Verizon, as bad as they are, think an OS 6.1 phone will sell over Andriod or iphone. Let's face it Verizon getting the iphone will go down as a BB killer. Other then the fact that you really need a business e-mail phone and your company pays for it, why would you buy a BB device these days. They aren't cool, are slow and terrible on the net and terrible apps, but they do GREAT e-mail, that's it.
    03-25-11 02:15 PM
  19. i7guy's Avatar
    Why would Verizon, as bad as they are, think an OS 6.1 phone will sell over Andriod or iphone. Let's face it Verizon getting the iphone will go down as a BB killer. Other then the fact that you really need a business e-mail phone and your company pays for it, why would you buy a BB device these days. They aren't cool, are slow and terrible on the net and terrible apps, but they do GREAT e-mail, that's it.
    I think 6.1 is just what the doctor ordered but of course is arm chair ceos know what the buying public really wants.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-25-11 02:24 PM
  20. zkyevolved's Avatar
    So you can't live without GPS. Another core functionality of smartphones now. VZNAV is also offered on most if not all platforms that VZW offers in their lineup. Super App just sounds like more of a marketing gimmick for now, but in time I can see potential for the name.

    I can see it now-

    Android User- Hey look, I can fly at 4G speeds, and I have widgets woohoo!
    BB User- Well I have Super Apps such as Poynt!
    Android User- Umm, I got that installed as well dude.
    BB User- Oh, um... At least the PlayBook can use any of your apps and then some!
    Lol!! +1


    -Sent from my iPhone 4
    03-25-11 02:25 PM
  21. ewakil12's Avatar
    Adobe Flash for 6.1 would be great!
    03-25-11 02:31 PM
  22. crazy canuck's Avatar
    from the same CO-CEO who thought 6.0 was going to be so great....

    RIM product management is the easiest job on the planet.
    Wait for competitors to release innovative features, copy them and put them in the BB roadmap for 18 months later.

    Here is what i will guess are main features for BB OS 6.1

    -BB can become a hotspot and support up to 5 devices connecting to it. (android and apple have both launched this feature so soon RIM will)

    -Separate personal data from corporate data on the handheld
    (android and apple have both have this feature via Good technology so soon RIM will)

    -some kind of video chat (facetime clone)

    Geez this is so easy....I could be a RIM product manager
    K Bear and Rherndon like this.
    03-25-11 02:41 PM
  23. avt123's Avatar
    that's exactly what I was saying if you go back and check. But don't forget by summer there will be new goog phones and the ip5. I don't think verizon or anybody in NA is going to make much room for 6.1 or qnx. that ship has sailed.
    I agree with you. I do believe Android and the iPhone 5 will be the obvious money makers this summer. But, I do believe RIM will still have their place in the market and sell millions of devices.
    03-25-11 02:55 PM
  24. avt123's Avatar
    Why would Verizon, as bad as they are, think an OS 6.1 phone will sell over Andriod or iphone. Let's face it Verizon getting the iphone will go down as a BB killer. Other then the fact that you really need a business e-mail phone and your company pays for it, why would you buy a BB device these days. They aren't cool, are slow and terrible on the net and terrible apps, but they do GREAT e-mail, that's it.
    I am not saying an OS 6.1 will sell over an Android device, I am just saying that OS 6.1 devices will sell.
    03-25-11 02:57 PM
  25. i7guy's Avatar
    of course they will. but the market, in driving down rimm stock today some 12%, is not worried about this summer or this year. it sees big strategic problems further out.
    The company has to move ahead with its plans: as the saying goes measure twice and cut once. The last thing on the companies mind should be the stock price.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-25-11 03:18 PM
140 12345 ...
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD