07-02-11 03:45 AM
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  1. frfghtr's Avatar

    Why did a letter like this come out and now everybody is like "oh yea we agree! woohoo +1 blah blah blah"? yea nice followers of the mob crowd out there! lol
    It's all about credibility. People can believe what they want but the last time I looked outside the world didn't end in May either. At least that clown wasn't afraid to identify himself.

    I, personally, think the letter is bogus. jmho.
    06-30-11 04:50 PM
  2. avt123's Avatar
    Wow after reading this letter I think I may have seen the light. The CEO's ARE the problem. i have felt the same frustrations at almost every company I have worked. Very good expression of what probably all corporate slaves feel.

    But lets stop the bashing there - RIM is apparently a company with a lot of highly talented but frustrated, demoralized employees. I have always felt that happy employees are primary to any success.

    How about if we CEO bash instead of RIM and Playbook bash though? It's not RIM and playbooks fault

    Now can we all just get along?
    .
    Welcome to the real world.

    Ok I can't take it anymore, someone tell me what IMHO means? Is that something like HOMIE? lol
    It means "In my honest/humble opinion".
    06-30-11 04:50 PM
  3. frfghtr's Avatar
    Ok I can't take it anymore, someone tell me what IMHO means? Is that something like HOMIE? lol
    in my honest opinion
    06-30-11 04:52 PM
  4. kbz1960's Avatar
    Wow after reading this letter I think I may have seen the light. The CEO's ARE the problem. i have felt the same frustrations at almost every company I have worked. Very good expression of what probably all corporate slaves feel.

    But lets stop the bashing there - RIM is apparently a company with a lot of highly talented but frustrated, demoralized employees. I have always felt that happy employees are primary to any success.

    How about if we CEO bash instead of RIM and Playbook bash though? It's not RIM and playbooks fault

    Now can we all just get along?
    .
    I'm sick and tired of those dumb a__ CEO's at RIM and their dumb a__ ways. Who is ready to grab a pitch fork and torch so we can storm the fortress?? Anyone with me?

    Is that good enough?
    06-30-11 04:57 PM
  5. esqlaw's Avatar
    I'm sorry, we disagree, they are the only thing that matters in this market.

    Let me ask you this, have you installed any apps on your PlayBook? If the answer is no I will recind & agree with you. If the answer is yes could you explain why?



    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    I never said apps aren't important. I said RIM doesn't need apple's volume of apps. I said apps aren't the most important thing RIM needs to focus on. Its all a means to an end. They want app world to have many many apps, but to first do that they need to sell units to make app world profitable. Once app world has a larger market... then you need apps to sustain that market's demand. The best way to do that is by showing developers that they can profit by supporting their platform. But developers won't care if there is not enough profit to be made. Thus, sell more units = more demand = more profit to be made = attracting developers = more apps. Done. Good bye.
    06-30-11 05:17 PM
  6. kbz1960's Avatar
    It's a tough place to be. Sell more so devs start writing good apps, devs aren't writing apps because it hasn't sold enough. Consumers aren't buying because there isn't enough support for it yet and it's still missing fundamental OS operations that every other OS has. Some of us consumers are considering buying it after the fundamental OS operations are there and others are considering it only after the fundamental OS operations are there and there is dev support.

    Wow, RIM has taken a hard punch to nuts and is laying on the ground. Can they get up and punch back with a complete OS that will entice more purchases and dev support? I hope so but if they don't do it soon I think they are toast in the consumer market, maybe they can keep their 3rd world market and government.

    I wouldn't want to be in their place. I still like their OS and phones better than the rest but I guess if I have to find something else it may be a dumb phone until something comes out that is appealing to me.
    Coachbulldog likes this.
    06-30-11 05:27 PM
  7. LCW's Avatar
    I'm sick and tired of those dumb a__ CEO's at RIM and their dumb a__ ways. Who is ready to grab a pitch fork and torch so we can storm the fortress?? Anyone with me?

    Is that good enough?
    There's got to be a way for the shareholders to demand Jim & Mike's resignation and/or vote them out.!!!???
    06-30-11 05:38 PM
  8. kbz1960's Avatar
    Too bad most here aren't shareholders. I'd also like to over throw our dumb a__ government that does nothing but rip us off on a continual basis.
    06-30-11 05:42 PM
  9. xandermac's Avatar
    That sounds great & the underpants gnomes would be proud, but what is your "step 2".

    Step 1, build the device
    Step2, ........
    Step 3, profit!!!!!

    You have no step 2 other than "sell more devices"

    Step 2 is apps. Plain & simple in this market applications sell devices. Call the PR dept of a couple of manufacturers & ask them what sells devices.

    I love your plan, but it isn't really a plan. "Sell devices to make app world profitable", that depends on having apps!

    RIMs #1 priority is developers, entice them thru whatever means necessary, even if its a loss leader to begin with. that's the key to success in the long run.

    A free PlayBook might entice joe blow but it won't get flipboard or autodesk. A possibility is to pay development costs of a few major developers & have a 50/50 revenue split instead of 70/30 to recover those costs over time. That way rim is taking the risk but it is rim that has everything to lose or gain anyway. without developers on board & apps on the market this device won't sell the way it will need to.

    I never said apps aren't important. I said RIM doesn't need apple's volume of apps. I said apps aren't the most important thing RIM needs to focus on. Its all a means to an end. They want app world to have many many apps, but to first do that they need to sell units to make app world profitable. Once app world has a larger market... then you need apps to sustain that market's demand. The best way to do that is by showing developers that they can profit by supporting their platform. But developeros won't care if there is not enough profit to be made. Thus, sell more units = more demand = more profit to be made = attracting developers = more apps. Done. Good bye.
    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Last edited by xandermac; 06-30-11 at 06:01 PM.
    06-30-11 05:52 PM
  10. shootsscores's Avatar
    With a fully functioning browser, fewer apps are required. That's just a fact, jack.

    The apps will be coming and then, according to the logic of the local itroll, ipad is history seeing as how it lags the PB in every other category.
    06-30-11 05:58 PM
  11. blackjack93117's Avatar
    in my honest opinion
    OH wow thanks - never would have guessed that- are there really so many dishonest opinions that this has become an acronym? wow. I guess i can believe that - I just didn't know dishonest opinions were so commonplace and accepted that they had to be differentiated...

    "umm wait a minute, before I respond to what you say, is that your HONEST opinion or is it your DISHONEST opinion?"

    wow just wow.

    Are you sure it's not "in my homie's opinion"? that would be a cool way to avoid accounting for what you said... I should use that when I get banned ...everything is prefaced with IMHO

    Oh, that wasn't MY opinion it was my Homie's opinion!


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    .
    Last edited by blackjack93117; 06-30-11 at 06:08 PM.
    chicken29 likes this.
    06-30-11 06:02 PM
  12. bb-bandit's Avatar
    Really dumb move IMHO.

    Now everyone and their mother knows about the letter from earlier in the day. They just gave it validity when it could have just been easily dismissed.
    Agreed and let's face it, if it was bogus letter, RIM's response would've been this is completely false. That's not what they said. The letter appears to be legit and the issues cited by the employee seem to be mostly true as RIM tried to address some of them in their response. I continue to think the next quarters are going to be really, really bad for RIM. Nothing that RIM is saying or doing is inspiring confidence. And the same people who ran the company into the ditch are the ones trying to get her back on track.
    06-30-11 06:03 PM
  13. kbz1960's Avatar
    Does anyone know if RIM just bought QNX and TAT as investments and don't have their people working on this or do have their own RIM programers working on it? If they are using their bbos programmers on it then that could be where the problem is in getting a polished product out.
    06-30-11 06:03 PM
  14. blackjack93117's Avatar
    I'm sick and tired of those dumb a__ CEO's at RIM and their dumb a__ ways. Who is ready to grab a pitch fork and torch so we can storm the fortress?? Anyone with me?

    Is that good enough?
    Meh a little better, you're showing signs of restraint. But we gotta find the guy that wrote the letter first because there will need to be a new CEO and he shows that he knows what goes on in the trenches, which always gets my respect..
    Last edited by blackjack93117; 06-30-11 at 06:19 PM.
    06-30-11 06:10 PM
  15. blackjack93117's Avatar
    Agreed and let's face it, if it was bogus letter, RIM's response would've been this is completely false. That's not what they said. The letter appears to be legit and the issues cited by the employee seem to be mostly true as RIM tried to address some of them in their response.
    wow I almost like you there for a minute, then you had to blow it with the same old sourpuss pessimism...IMHO

    I continue to think the next quarters are going to be really, really bad for RIM.
    Nothing that RIM is saying or doing is inspiring confidence. And the same people who ran the company into the ditch are the ones trying to get her back on track.
    Well ok maybe you're right judging by the phony response.. but I'm still stocking up on RIMM, IMHO

    Anyway I owe you a semi-apology and that's the best you're gonna get until you can make my day brighter instead of always being such a downer...IMHO
    Last edited by blackjack93117; 06-30-11 at 06:21 PM.
    06-30-11 06:17 PM
  16. lawguyman's Avatar
    RIM shouldn't take the time to address the rumors and innuendo that BGR loves to spread.

    Instead, what RIM really needs to address publically is when the Native Email suite will be addressed.

    Again, if this guy really is a RIM employee, he is a tool because he is criticizing management even though they share many of his opinions.

    If he is a RIM employee he is probably someone who is slated to be canned because he can't work well in a team environment.
    Jake Storm likes this.
    06-30-11 06:17 PM
  17. PineappleUnderTheSea's Avatar
    I never said apps aren't important. I said RIM doesn't need apple's volume of apps. I said apps aren't the most important thing RIM needs to focus on. Its all a means to an end. They want app world to have many many apps, but to first do that they need to sell units to make app world profitable. Once app world has a larger market... then you need apps to sustain that market's demand. The best way to do that is by showing developers that they can profit by supporting their platform. But developers won't care if there is not enough profit to be made. Thus, sell more units = more demand = more profit to be made = attracting developers = more apps. Done. Good bye.
    I agree in principle, the issue is that RIM doesn't have a good hook to sell their phones and PB. So the hook should be apps, it's what Apple and Android have conditioned us to believe. But RIM is not known for apps, so what do you market? Hardware improvements over iPad and Android is too complicated for the general public. Bridge only works for BB owners. Their phones have the same issues. You need a good hook to reel in consumers, and as of now I can't say I see a good selling point.
    06-30-11 06:29 PM
  18. xandermac's Avatar
    Precisely. They foot the bill for EA to develop need for speed and gave it away free. That was a pure loss to make the device attractive. If they did this with a few key name developers with a 50/50 split that would eventually make the money back and have some names on board so that they actually had something to market. Just a few key apps to get the ball rolling, take the risk away from those developers and show other developers that they believe and stand behind the platform, that it can be profitable. Then market the crap out of it.

    I agree in principle, the issue is that RIM doesn't have a good hook to sell their phones and PB. So the hook should be apps, it's what Apple and Android have conditioned us to believe. But RIM is not known for apps, so what do you market? Hardware improvements over iPad and Android is too complicated for the general public. Bridge only works for BB owners. Their phones have the same issues. You need a good hook to reel in consumers, and as of now I can't say I see a good selling point.



    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    06-30-11 06:34 PM
  19. esqlaw's Avatar
    I agree in principle, the issue is that RIM doesn't have a good hook to sell their phones and PB. So the hook should be apps, it's what Apple and Android have conditioned us to believe. But RIM is not known for apps, so what do you market? Hardware improvements over iPad and Android is too complicated for the general public. Bridge only works for BB owners. Their phones have the same issues. You need a good hook to reel in consumers, and as of now I can't say I see a good selling point.
    Agreed. Its a point of contention, it seems, apparent from the letter. I think if RIM goes up head-to-head on apple on the point of apps, they will fail. I'm not a genius market entrepreneur, but I know that BB's presentation in retail stores hasn't been acceptable. They need to work with retailers to improve their sales. ...
    06-30-11 06:36 PM
  20. frfghtr's Avatar
    OH wow thanks - never would have guessed that- are there really so many dishonest opinions that this has become an acronym? wow. I guess i can believe that - I just didn't know dishonest opinions were so commonplace and accepted that they had to be differentiated...

    "umm wait a minute, before I respond to what you say, is that your HONEST opinion or is it your DISHONEST opinion?"

    wow just wow.
    .
    First came across the phrase while following the stock forums years ago. People would accuse companies of illegal activities and then state it was just an opinion so that they could avoid legal action.

    Hey judge, I never said it was fact, it was just my opinion.

    The forums haven't changed since they were first established. Sometimes they're educational and informative, other times they're just a. Well you can finish that part of the statement.
    06-30-11 06:39 PM
  21. xandermac's Avatar
    I'm sorry that you're just a lawyer and don't understand this stuff but you have to have something to market! How is that hard to understand. Merely having a device doesn't cut it, the numbers and guidance prove that. I can't make it any more simple for your little esquire mind. As the last guy said, there has to be a hook, and it has to be big enough to combat iOS and Android. BBM isn't it anymore, apple saw to that with iMessage. I imagine you think the pinto would have been a success with enough marketing. Moron.

    ...



    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    06-30-11 06:40 PM
  22. southlander's Avatar
    With a fully functioning browser, fewer apps are required. That's just a fact, jack.

    The apps will be coming and then, according to the logic of the local itroll, ipad is history seeing as how it lags the PB in every other category.
    Yep and that's the heart of the issue. I do not want apps. I want a well designed web site. I want to be able to open my browser and use ONLY the browser to access information online. And I want companies to provide open standards based web sites to facilitate that.

    BUT, the apps turf grab by Apple appears to be working. They are taking us away from an open web to a proprietary computing model.

    So instead of the clean device with a browser, we end up with iPads littered with screen after screen after screen of shortcuts to open apps. Reminds me of those people that have PCs with 5000 shortcuts on the desktop. Yeah that's progress.
    Last edited by southlander; 06-30-11 at 07:02 PM.
    06-30-11 06:42 PM
  23. Economist101's Avatar
    BUT, the apps turf grab by Apple appears to be working. They are taking us away from an open web to a proprietary computing model.

    So instead of the clean device with a browser, we end up with iPads littered with screen after screen after screen of shortcuts to open apps. Reminds me of those people that have PCs with 5000 shortcuts on the desktop. Yeah that's progress.
    You should check your history. During the iPhone's first year, all it had was the web and web apps. Developers weren't interested.
    xandermac likes this.
    06-30-11 07:22 PM
  24. kb5zht's Avatar
    It's all about credibility. People can believe what they want but the last time I looked outside the world didn't end in May either. At least that clown wasn't afraid to identify himself.

    I, personally, think the letter is bogus. jmho.
    Oh i would say fear of termination and a lawsuit for libel is a good reason to stay anonymous.

    There are industries that, were a whistle blower identified himself, he would be lucky to survive. The teamsters come to mind.

    This person even mentioned a single position in detail (developer for the discontinued 9530). Imagine this whistle blower ending with "sincerely, john doe." .... what kind of hostility do you think john doe would encounter the next morning at work?

    Are you employed? post a letter with all your local papers talking about how irrelevant, worthless and in some cases, incompetent your coworkers and bosses are and sign your name at the bottom.

    Then go to work the next day.

    Let us know how that works for you.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    06-30-11 07:23 PM
  25. s219's Avatar
    The reason the iPad sold is because all of the apps already available for the iPhone and iPod Touch work on the iPad. Had the iPad been introduced, but it had few apps, nobody would have bought it.
    I was part of the iPad "gold rush" prior to launch. Apple bent over backwards to help devs make iPad-specific apps before the device went on sale. As a result, there were about 4,000 available at launch. Most of them were the cream of the crop. It's the polar opposite of how RIM handled the situation.
    xandermac likes this.
    06-30-11 08:30 PM
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