07-11-11 06:01 PM
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  1. kbz1960's Avatar
    Oh I thought the iphone5 was only going to be 3g and now I see rumors are it is going to be 4g. I don't think uscellular is going to have 4g anytime soon in my area anyway.
    07-04-11 07:46 AM
  2. Rootbrian's Avatar
    Open source is good, in my opinion. I never really used the Do Not Disturb options, so that's not a deal breaker for me

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-04-11 09:14 AM
  3. VicAjax's Avatar
    Don't forget ridiculous little mistakes by RIM that show they're tone deaf to the needs/wants of their users.

    What pushed me over the edge, after the decline in hardware quality, was the elimination of the Desktop Redirector with no warning or explanation whatsoever.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-04-11 11:57 AM
  4. otacon#AC's Avatar
    I must be confused as to the definition of innovative, as I don't understand how introducing LTE which is a standard and emerging technology on their devices could be considered innovative, and not just evolutionary.
    Because it would show RIM isn't being left behind...again. RIM could've knocked it out of the park with the upcoming 9930 by giving it a dual core processor, LTE, mobile hotspot anyone?, AMOLED/qHD display, and on and on. But they of course are playing catch up like they have been for years now watching their market share go down. This was my first BlackBerry...



    ...and the 9650 will be my last.
    07-04-11 05:30 PM
  5. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    Because it would show RIM isn't being left behind...again. RIM could've knocked it out of the park with the upcoming 9930 by giving it a dual core processor, LTE, mobile hotspot anyone?, AMOLED/qHD display, and on and on. But they of course are playing catch up like they have been for years now watching their market share go down. This was my first BlackBerry...



    ...and the 9650 will be my last.
    I'm still confused to the corrilation between LTE and innovative....

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-04-11 05:45 PM
  6. CommanderElvis's Avatar
    A few articles about 4G. Please read and form your own opinions. My take: Has become nothing but advertising hype. Any change you see would probably be the result of the the speed of the hardware.

    Does 4G Deliver?

    AT&T Relabels Wireless Network, Speeds Up Next Generation Rollout - WSJ.com
    07-04-11 07:22 PM
  7. avt123's Avatar
    A few articles about 4G. Please read and form your own opinions. My take: Has become nothing but advertising hype. Any change you see would probably be the result of the the speed of the hardware.

    Does 4G Deliver?

    AT&T Relabels Wireless Network, Speeds Up Next Generation Rollout - WSJ.com
    I'm pretty sure 12+Mbps is much faster than the .5-1.5Mbps I am getting right now on CDMA Rev A. Hardware helps but download speed DOES make a difference. Example, the AT&T iPhone 4 loads webpages faster than the VZW iPhone 4 over the 3G network. Why? Because AT&T has a faster network (GSM iPhone 4 is capable of up to 7.2Mbps I believe). The hardware is the same. Network speed does make a difference.

    Load a webpage on 3G on the Thunderbolt/Charge and then load the same page on 3G and I bet it loads slower.
    Last edited by avt123; 07-04-11 at 07:36 PM.
    07-04-11 07:24 PM
  8. BergerKing's Avatar
    Size doesn't seem to be a problem. Bigger devices have been selling for over a year now.

    RIM is just waiting, again.
    On other platforms, yes. But not everyone wants to carry a brick. And as noted, they aren't going to make their
    Handhelds a lot larger. Even the BlackBerry Bold Touch may have the original Bold form factor, it is still thinner. The Style open is a lot larger in height than other BlackBerry devices, but when folded is smaller. Bigger isn't necessarily better.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-05-11 01:05 AM
  9. avt123's Avatar
    On other platforms, yes. But not everyone wants to carry a brick. And as noted, they aren't going to make their
    Handhelds a lot larger. Even the BlackBerry Bold Touch may have the original Bold form factor, it is still thinner. The Style open is a lot larger in height than other BlackBerry devices, but when folded is smaller. Bigger isn't necessarily better.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    I never said bigger is better. But maybe some people are willing to pay for it. BlackBerry has many options, why not include this? The market has shown they want it so far.
    07-05-11 01:35 AM
  10. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    A few articles about 4G. Please read and form your own opinions. My take: Has become nothing but advertising hype. Any change you see would probably be the result of the the speed of the hardware.

    Does 4G Deliver?

    AT&T Relabels Wireless Network, Speeds Up Next Generation Rollout - WSJ.com
    I'm pretty sure 12+Mbps is much faster than the .5-1.5Mbps I am getting right now on CDMA Rev A. Hardware helps but download speed DOES make a difference. Example, the AT&T iPhone 4 loads webpages faster than the VZW iPhone 4 over the 3G network. Why? Because AT&T has a faster network (GSM iPhone 4 is capable of up to 7.2Mbps I believe). The hardware is the same. Network speed does make a difference.

    Load a webpage on 3G on the Thunderbolt/Charge and then load the same page on 3G and I bet it loads slower.
    Here are the official standards for 4G, per the ITU. dailywireless.org ITU: The “Official” 4G Standard Approved
    07-05-11 03:39 AM
  11. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    I'm pretty sure 12+Mbps is much faster than the .5-1.5Mbps I am getting right now on CDMA Rev A. Hardware helps but download speed DOES make a difference. Example, the AT&T iPhone 4 loads webpages faster than the VZW iPhone 4 over the 3G network. Why? Because AT&T has a faster network (GSM iPhone 4 is capable of up to 7.2Mbps I believe). The hardware is the same. Network speed does make a difference.

    Load a webpage on 3G on the Thunderbolt/Charge and then load the same page on 3G and I bet it loads slower.
    That speed will keep going down the more people jump on LTE though and 3G speed will be getting faster as a consequence. I already find GPRS and EDGE has improved a lot since everybody's on 3G now.
    07-05-11 05:00 AM
  12. howarmat's Avatar
    On other platforms, yes. But not everyone wants to carry a brick. And as noted, they aren't going to make their
    Handhelds a lot larger. Even the BlackBerry Bold Touch may have the original Bold form factor, it is still thinner. The Style open is a lot larger in height than other BlackBerry devices, but when folded is smaller. Bigger isn't necessarily better.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    you are right somewhat. except BB owners have been sold this line that they need to carry a 7 inch tab to complete their BB experience instead of having large screen phone options.
    07-05-11 06:10 AM
  13. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    I never said bigger is better. But maybe some people are willing to pay for it. BlackBerry has many options, why not include this? The market has shown they want it so far.
    See my quote
    "you can't be all things to all people"

    Blackberry or RIM I should say can not afford to diversify their line by making an LTE device for 500,000,000 potential people when the market for a non LTE device is 3 times the size,

    Once RIM has it's ducks back in a row, THEN they can start looking at specialty products, though I expect LTE will be main stream by the time RIM is ready to deploy said technology since I really don't think they'd deploy it until a QNX device or two are up and running.

    QNX needs to be their focus, NOT a new wireless standard that has yet to be globaly adopted and the hardware yet to be refined
    07-05-11 08:11 AM
  14. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    you are right somewhat. except BB owners have been sold this line that they need to carry a 7 inch tab to complete their BB experience instead of having large screen phone options.
    Somewhat true as well.

    I would gladly carry a 7" tablet, and my Blackberry phone, I WOULD NOT carry a 4.3" phone, the torch is about as large/heavy as I want to go, even the bold 9000 was a bit to big, I'm excited for the Bold 9900 because it will have shaved off much of the thickness that the 9900 had but keep the size within my shirt pocket.
    07-05-11 08:13 AM
  15. kbz1960's Avatar
    Didn't RIM wait to make a 3g phone until it was more widespread?
    07-05-11 08:26 AM
  16. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    Didn't RIM wait to make a 3g phone until it was more widespread?
    I'm still waiting for 3G to become widespread although I remember reading something about making the 2G bandwith awailable to 3G in the near future.

    3G seems to be urban only, drive out of town and you're back to 2G.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-05-11 08:35 AM
  17. howarmat's Avatar
    Somewhat true as well.

    I would gladly carry a 7" tablet, and my Blackberry phone, I WOULD NOT carry a 4.3" phone, the torch is about as large/heavy as I want to go, even the bold 9000 was a bit to big, I'm excited for the Bold 9900 because it will have shaved off much of the thickness that the 9900 had but keep the size within my shirt pocket.
    i agree the 9900s thinless makes it a better phone over the 9000.

    I think the reason why the 7 inch form factor isnt a huge hit with android is that you can get 4.3 inch screens. the jump isnt big enough to justify for many people. i know that is part of the case for me. I can get most anything i need to done on my thunderbolt. sure 7 inch would make it easier for some things but 4.3 works very well in a pinch for everything i have had to do. the fiance got a EVO 3D and the size of that is truly perfect i think. its not as wide as most all the other 4.3 screens so it fits in the hand better. Damn thing is very solid in the hand too.

    Anyway, enough offtopic discussion lol....i just wish we could see a nice big touchscreen running QNX and also usable on LTE from RIM. To me if they can get the software working it would be a true "superphone" and shows they mean business and are going after the android army. If its a hit it could really help out the company overview and perception that it has right now.
    07-05-11 08:36 AM
  18. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    i agree the 9900s thinless makes it a better phone over the 9000.

    I think the reason why the 7 inch form factor isnt a huge hit with android is that you can get 4.3 inch screens. the jump isnt big enough to justify for many people. i know that is part of the case for me. I can get most anything i need to done on my thunderbolt. sure 7 inch would make it easier for some things but 4.3 works very well in a pinch for everything i have had to do. the fiance got a EVO 3D and the size of that is truly perfect i think. its not as wide as most all the other 4.3 screens so it fits in the hand better. Damn thing is very solid in the hand too.

    Anyway, enough offtopic discussion lol....i just wish we could see a nice big touchscreen running QNX and also usable on LTE from RIM. To me if they can get the software working it would be a true "superphone" and shows they mean business and are going after the android army. If its a hit it could really help out the company overview and perception that it has right now.
    I think I would be adding 2012 Mistake: taking on the android army:
    RIM can't match pricing, and can't match device turn over speeds, so they would be fighting for 3 months then be "dated" RIM needs to address the Need for a quality global touch screen phone, using their Strengths, which have been their form factor/size and shape, the Storm, was a delight to hold in your hand, as is the curve, and the bold, and the torch to a lesser degree.

    If you compare the RIM bodies of the last 10 models they very much are the same, slight variations but every device without looking at it felt like a blackberry. making a Slab phone will be outside their strong area, and competing in a market I TRULY BELIEVE they can not win at as they require far greater ROI's than those in the hardware market making androids
    07-05-11 08:44 AM
  19. BergerKing's Avatar
    you are right somewhat. except BB owners have been sold this line that they need to carry a 7 inch tab to complete their BB experience instead of having large screen phone options.
    When you have the army of what, a dozen manufacturers port your OS into a mishmash of devices, I would think there's the luxury of having whatever someone can come up with. I see Android ported into HTC, Sanyo, Kyocera, Samsung, LG, and Motorola just off the top of my head.

    With a whole host of hardware teams, it's like a box of chocolates, you never know what's gonna be next. Think Kyocera Echo, or Motorola Backflip, just for a couple that mess with your head. I'm sure there are some that think they're pretty cool devices, but really?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Last edited by BergerKing; 07-05-11 at 08:55 AM.
    07-05-11 08:51 AM
  20. howarmat's Avatar
    I think I would be adding 2012 Mistake: taking on the android army:
    RIM can't match pricing, and can't match device turn over speeds, so they would be fighting for 3 months then be "dated" RIM needs to address the Need for a quality global touch screen phone, using their Strengths, which have been their form factor/size and shape, the Storm, was a delight to hold in your hand, as is the curve, and the bold, and the torch to a lesser degree.

    If you compare the RIM bodies of the last 10 models they very much are the same, slight variations but every device without looking at it felt like a blackberry. making a Slab phone will be outside their strong area, and competing in a market I TRULY BELIEVE they can not win at as they require far greater ROI's than those in the hardware market making androids
    i agree they do have basically all the same size for the phones. the storms were not much bigger than the other phones RIM had released and it works well for them. I just cant go back to that size screen anymore.

    and yeah taking on android head to head would not be smart but i do think they need something a little out of the norm for them to get people to come back. Even 4 inch will be nice if they do that.
    07-05-11 08:53 AM
  21. howarmat's Avatar
    When you have the luxury of what, a dozen manufacturers port your OS into a mishmash of devices, I would think there's the luxury of having whatever someone can come up with. I see Android ported into HTC, Sanyo, Kyocera, Samsung, LG, and Motorola just off the top of my head.

    With a whole host of hardware teams, it's like a box of chocolates, you never know what's gonna be next. Think Kyocera Echo, or Motorola Backflip, just for a couple that mess with your head. I'm sure there are some that think they're pretty cool devices, but really?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    each one of those differs themselves in some way to stand out. Software has a ton to do with it.

    HTC sense provides the best user experience out of all the skins IMO. That is a huge reason why HTC is selling phones like mad right now. They have nailed it in that dept. They have a great LTE phone and also a great 3G only release also.

    Moto makes some of the best hardware and has the best battery life out of all android devices IMO. They also have moto blur which people dont really like most times. They also do the most designs with keyboards for high end devices.

    LG is just now entering the game really for high end androids. They have a decent UI and LTE with the revolution. Its got some things that the thunderbolt doesnt so customers have a choice

    Samsung makes some of the best screens you can find. They are beautiful. they also sell the most out of the android support phones last i heard. The phones are very fast and generally look nice. the charge is an oddball lol. The UI is a copy of iOS though which is a turn off to many though but again people atleast have choice.

    Sanyo and Kyocera take care of the 2nd tier/lower end devices i think. They compete against the curve and other feature phones most often.

    Is it fragmented? sure a little, you have 1.6, 2.1, 2.2, 2.3 and 3.0 for tabs but the customer has options on every level and with different sizes too. It has its drawbacks also. Google is feeling that more and more i think which is why there is talk of limiting what vendors can and cant do. Just have to see how it plays out.
    07-05-11 09:09 AM
  22. kbz1960's Avatar
    each one of those differs themselves in some way to stand out. Software has a ton to do with it.

    HTC sense provides the best user experience out of all the skins IMO. That is a huge reason why HTC is selling phones like mad right now. They have nailed it in that dept. They have a great LTE phone and also a great 3G only release also.

    Moto makes some of the best hardware and has the best battery life out of all android devices IMO. They also have moto blur which people dont really like most times. They also do the most designs with keyboards for high end devices.

    LG is just now entering the game really for high end androids. They have a decent UI and LTE with the revolution. Its got some things that the thunderbolt doesnt so customers have a choice

    Samsung makes some of the best screens you can find. They are beautiful. they also sell the most out of the android support phones last i heard. The phones are very fast and generally look nice. the charge is an oddball lol. The UI is a copy of iOS though which is a turn off to many though but again people atleast have choice.

    Sanyo and Kyocera take care of the 2nd tier/lower end devices i think. They compete against the curve and other feature phones most often.

    Is it fragmented? sure a little, you have 1.6, 2.1, 2.2, 2.3 and 3.0 for tabs but the customer has options on every level and with different sizes too. It has its drawbacks also. Google is feeling that more and more i think which is why there is talk of limiting what vendors can and cant do. Just have to see how it plays out.
    Wow and they say bb is fragmented when android not only have all the different screen sizes but all the different flavors of OS's and each OS has its own layer on top yet they have dev support from the same devs that say bb is too fragmented but I guess RIM has the extra layer of security that turns them off also.

    RIM you really need to start throwing money at devs like apple and android do.
    07-05-11 09:18 AM
  23. howarmat's Avatar
    Wow and they say bb is fragmented when android not only have all the different screen sizes but all the different flavors of OS's and each OS has its own layer on top yet they have dev support from the same devs that say bb is too fragmented but I guess RIM has the extra layer of security that turns them off also.

    RIM you really need to start throwing money at devs like apple and android do.
    well its not bad really. Most apps written 2 years ago for 1.6 still work on 2.3 and 3.0 even. THAT is something that RIM has issue with. programs that worked on 4.7 might have to be fixed to run on 5.0 or 6.0 and 7. If all the apps from 6.0 could carry over to OS 7 that would be great but i dont think that will happen. and screen sizes dont matter for most apps either as scaling the apps to fit the screen work very well. Keep in mind they are all built for touchscreen for the most part so that helps tremendously im sure. In the end devs dont have to work about all the skins nor the version of android as much as you would think.
    07-05-11 09:23 AM
  24. kbz1960's Avatar
    You might be correct that they cannot compete with Android and/or Apple. If that is the case, then should RIM downsize, forget about consumers, and focus only on it's corporate business? As the market has been showing us, RIM's form factor is out-dated. There are certainly some who appreciate it (you have mentioned this), but you seem to be in the minority. By sticking to the classic BB form factor, RIM is severely limiting itself.
    Say what????????? So if you can't be number 1 just give up? You have to be kidding, I would even settle for number3.
    07-05-11 09:26 AM
  25. BergerKing's Avatar
    each one of those differs themselves in some way to stand out. Software has a ton to do with it.

    HTC sense provides the best user experience out of all the skins IMO. That is a huge reason why HTC is selling phones like mad right now. They have nailed it in that dept. They have a great LTE phone and also a great 3G only release also.

    Moto makes some of the best hardware and has the best battery life out of all android devices IMO. They also have moto blur which people dont really like most times. They also do the most designs with keyboards for high end devices.

    LG is just now entering the game really for high end androids. They have a decent UI and LTE with the revolution. Its got some things that the thunderbolt doesnt so customers have a choice

    Samsung makes some of the best screens you can find. They are beautiful. they also sell the most out of the android support phones last i heard. The phones are very fast and generally look nice. the charge is an oddball lol. The UI is a copy of iOS though which is a turn off to many though but again people atleast have choice.

    Sanyo and Kyocera take care of the 2nd tier/lower end devices i think. They compete against the curve and other feature phones most often.

    Is it fragmented? sure a little, you have 1.6, 2.1, 2.2, 2.3 and 3.0 for tabs but the customer has options on every level and with different sizes too. It has its drawbacks also. Google is feeling that more and more i think which is why there is talk of limiting what vendors can and cant do. Just have to see how it plays out.
    That fragmentation is exactly what RIM needs to avoid until they get their ducks lined up and quacking. If they make a decent run with the Monaco/Monza, they may have the option of adding a larger handset later. iOS does what it does, and they do ok with their one form factor. Kinda like Henry Ford's qoute of 'You can have any color you want, as long as it's black." Android has a plethora of touchscreens, plus a fee landscape sliders, but only has one mediocre portrait keyboard.

    There's definitely room for improvement on many fronts. The whole Smartphone arena is evolving, and tomorrow is another day.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-05-11 09:44 AM
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