[Jo_795]

http://www.androidcentral.com/take-y...king-contracts

i just thought this article was interesting because theres many out there that cancel their accounts just for a new phone and i would agree with this here

[CapnCrunchBerry]

Good article. I don't know why people would cancel their account just for a new phone. Even without all the fees TMobile tacks on for doing it before 120 days are up, it's still cheaper in the long run to buy it unlocked from ebay, amazon, etc.

14-day grace period though? Eeeee.

[papped]

Good article. I don't know why people would cancel their account just for a new phone. Even without all the fees TMobile tacks on for doing it before 120 days are up, it's still cheaper in the long run to buy it unlocked from ebay, amazon, etc.

14-day grace period though? Eeeee.

It's pretty straight forward.

I want a new phone that easily costs ~$600 retail. ETF = prorated anywhere from maybe ~$100 - $175.

Phone cost after new contract/rebates, $100-200.

So you can pay ~$200-350, or you can keep your contract and pay ~$500-600 for the phone... Phone value depreciation takes time (even longer for them to be sold as "used"), especially if it's a hot handset, especially since anyone who buys one has a 30 day window to return it for full refund, so they don't have to sell it until after that period.

[papped]

Also fairly easy to point out that 14 days is pretty short of a window for finding out how much of a problem things like the reported 3g issues really are.

Network problems are a lot harder to pin down than stuff like hardware defects.

[Jo_795]

the 14 grace period is a little wack but everything else i agree. i was mostly referring it toward many that cancel ETF free just for a new phone recently

[papped]

Yeah, that opportunity is a small case though, it doesn't happen very often and definitely not even a majority know about it (not to mention Sprint intentionally doesn't train the support about ETF cancellation clauses).

[bllackkman]

Damn!! That's a car note

[CapnCrunchBerry]

Seems like a lot of hassle to me and in today's world, I'm sure such tactics mess with your credit score. Not worth it to me.

[papped]

Seems like a lot of hassle to me and in today's world, I'm sure such tactics mess with your credit score. Not worth it to me.

ETFs have no affect on your credit score, unless you are talking about not paying something, which always goes to collections anyways.

[ERDude]

Contrary to what a lot of the tech sites are claiming carrier ETF's are not used to make up for monies lost from the cancellation of your plan, they're used to recoup the subsidy of the phone.

T-Mobile is the bad guy here not Google, every 3rd party reseller has their own "equipment recovery fee" in addition to the carriers and the state right in their TOS that you're paying the difference between the actual cost vs the subsidized cost. If you make any changes in the first 6 months and 1 day you're liable for fees ranging from $200 - $300 in addition to the fees the carriers charge.

Check out Wirefly's disclosure, much more stringent than Googles.

When you sign up for wireless carrier service through Wirefly, we discount your phone purchase price by an Equipment Discount amount ranging from $200 to $300. By ordering through Wirefly, you agree to repay this discount if, during the 181 days after your new equipment is activated, if you:

Fail to pay your balance due to your carrier each month
Disconnect this line of service
Transfer this equipment to another line of service
Change your carrier service rate plan to a lower monthly service rate plan
Deactivate the email/data feature if one was required at the point of purchase
Transfer/port an existing phone number from another account if this is a new line of service
Replace an existing account with this account if this is a new line of service
Return or exchange your phone and it is not in its original, new condition with no more than 30 minutes of usage
If you break any of these contract provisions, except as a result of a documented service quality issue related to the carrier service, you authorize us to charge your credit card in repayment of the Equipment Discount.

[papped]

T-Mobile is the bad guy here not Google, every 3rd party reseller has their own "equipment recovery fee" in addition to the carriers and the state right in their TOS that you're paying the difference between the actual cost vs the subsidized cost.

This is true IF google is the one doing the subsidization... Normally carrier does the subsidization and pays full price to the manufacturer. I still haven't seen any clear terms on who is actually paying for the subsidization here.

[ERDude]

Interesting fact, Sprint has a full 30 day guarantee no matter which state you're in.

Our Guarantee

Never knew this, thought it was just a Cali thing.

[ERDude]

This is true IF google is the one doing the subsidization... Normally carrier does the subsidization and pays full price to the manufacturer. I still haven't seen any clear terms on who is actually paying for the subsidization here.

Papped the way I understand it and it's being reported across the web is that Google is not getting a red cent from T-Mobile until after the 120 day period is exhausted.

That aside does it really matter? Googles policies are the same as every other third-party reseller out there, in fact they're a little less restrictive, if you cancel service and don't return the phone within 14 days you owe them the price difference. Other third-party retailers don't give you the option to return the phone.

Existing T-Mobile Customers Can Get the Nexus One for $179 | DroidTalk

[CurvyCocoa]

14 day grace period is appalling. I would never agree to it--especially on the first release of a first gen phone.

All of you Nexus owners are taking one for the team. Much appreciated!

[papped]

That aside does it really matter? Googles policies are the same as every other third-party reseller out there, in fact they're a little less restrictive, if you cancel service and don't return the phone within 14 days you owe them the price difference. Other third-party retailers don't give you the option to return the phone.

On the contrary, they pretty much took the exact same policy that places like Wirefly already had:

Wirefly Return Policy - 100% customer satisfaction on all cell phones & plans.

Also I doubt the Nexus prices even with 3rd party subsidization are going to get as low as places like Wirefly, hence the stricter terms.

[blackmagik84]

Wow, for once I agree with Jo-Jo. #mercy

[ERDude]

On the contrary, they pretty much took the exact same policy that places like Wirefly already had:

Wirefly Return Policy - 100% customer satisfaction on all cell phones & plans.

Also I doubt the Nexus prices even with 3rd party subsidization are going to get as low as places like Wirefly, hence the stricter terms.

I still don't see the big deal, Amazon does it, Wirefly does, as do a host of other resellers. So why is it wrong for Google? If you read the fine print you knew what your were getting into when you bought the phone. If you didn't read the fine print who's at fault the consumer or Google?

Google is following T-Mobile's return policy, I'm sure when the Nexus One hits Verizon the return policy will be 30 days. Again Google is not to blame here, it's T-Mobile. All other carriers have a 30 day return policy.

AT&T Return Policy

Verizon Return Policy, although I can't be positive their return policy is 30 days in every state as they asked for a zip code before allowing me to view the policy.

Sprint Return Policy

[papped]

I still don't see the big deal, Amazon does it, Wirefly does, as do a host of other resellers. So why is it wrong for Google? If you read the fine print you knew what your were getting into when you bought the phone. If you didn't read the fine print who's at fault the consumer or Google?

The end consumer doesn't really care who does it, but the result is that they are discounting the phone less than most 3rd party retailers, yet ultimately still collecting roughly the same in combined fees for breaking the contract.

~$0-100 phone from amazon or so, with $175 + $250 for breaking both contracts. $425 roughly.

~$179 i believe for the nexus on the cheapest subsidization, with $200 from Tmobile + $350 from Google. $550 roughly, not including the higher price of the subsidized phone to begin with...

[ERDude]

The end consumer doesn't really care who does it, but the result is that they are discounting the phone less than most 3rd party retailers, yet ultimately still collecting roughly the same in combined fees for breaking the contract.

~$0-100 phone from amazon or so, with $175 + $250 for breaking both contracts. $425 roughly.

~$179 i believe for the nexus on the cheapest subsidization, with $200 from Tmobile + $350 from Google. $550 roughly, not including the higher price of the subsidized phone to begin with...

So Google doesn't have the right to recoup the $350 their out because someone didn't take the time to read the fine print? Again the problem here isn't with Google it's with T-Mobile and their shortened "test drive" period.

At least with Google you're only locked in for 3 months as opposed to the 6 months and 1 day of the other resellers, who can collect their fees for something as trivial as missing a payment & temporary disconnection.

For the record T-Mobile doesn't subsidize the phone one bit, the subsidy is all from Google. Again if the purchaser follows the terms they agreed to, return the phone and cancel within 14 days the point is moot. Again Google doesn't get their subsidy reimbursed until the 120 day time period has expired. ETF's were designed to recoup the cost of phone subsidy not income lost due to a canceled contract. I'll say it again the bad guy here is T-Mobile, not Google. Until the 120 days has expired T-Mobile has lost nothing.

[Jo_795]

Wow, for once I agree with Jo-Jo. #mercy

which part do you agree on..

[papped]

So Google doesn't have the right to recoup the $350 their out because someone didn't take the time to read the fine print? Again the problem here isn't with Google it's with T-Mobile and their shortened "test drive" period.

Google can do whatever they want. So can Tmobile. That's the bottom line. Don't like it, don't buy from them.

At the same time, they are asking for more money in general combining both the ETFs + initial cost. Nobody is going to care who is at fault... That's the other bottom line. Should google care if Tmobile is doing something wrong and making their labeled phone look worse? Probably... So they're responsible whether they caused the problem or not.

[blackmagik84]

which part do you agree on..

The stance that you and the article have.