12-24-09 12:57 AM
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  1. anon(67796)'s Avatar
    iim not gonna start tripping till i wake up in the morning and its still not there.....
    12-22-09 11:13 PM
  2. Pilot Prop's Avatar
    i would have to say the Droid...but that would never happen seeing as how i would NEVER leave AT&T, no other phones really catch my eye but my 9700 and the Droid(which is loosing its appeal to me)
    12-22-09 11:13 PM
  3. Da Pope's Avatar
    the way thing's are going with rim and the pricing of i-phone and droid etc, we should all take a page from the native American Indians and practice the art of smoke signal's it's cheaper to burn newspaper or wood and all you need is a blanket or potato sack to wave smoke signal's, or Morse code with flash lights you choose.
    12-22-09 11:20 PM
  4. ImAGoodGuy's Avatar
    If this isn't fixed by the morning I might be jumping ship to the iPhone
    12-22-09 11:45 PM
  5. coldconfession13's Avatar
    This is the only major outage. The others I would consider minor.
    12-22-09 11:46 PM
  6. shrtbus's Avatar
    Thanks to RIM i am actually considering going Droid.
    After hearing this crap, I may just go out tomorrow and get a new phone.

    . [Update: The Core Mail service for BlackBerry Infrastructure was unavailable as of 18:33 EST. As of 2020 CT / 2120 ET, all BIS and BES services are down.]
    12-22-09 11:47 PM
  7. bluz's Avatar
    My BB addiction is too deep to e affected by this outages.
    12-22-09 11:56 PM
  8. twester65's Avatar
    In a year, this is the first outage that has affected me. I'll stay put for now (unless VZW doesn't fix the 3G outage in my area quickly). The 3G outage is the bigger deal.
    12-23-09 12:01 AM
  9. MNotar91's Avatar
    I have been looking at other phones lately and have been considering a switch. These recent outages just make me move closer to actually doing so.
    12-23-09 12:04 AM
  10. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    I'm sticking with BB. I love my Tour and outages happen. I am sure RIM is working feverishly to get it fixed and probably is more upset that any of us. After seeing the sheer immaturity of some BB users on Twitter (they are literally throwing TANTRUMS!) and also of some iPhone users (who are getting their kicks belittling and insulting BB users) my opinion of both groups has gone down. The abuse being hurled at RIM is ridiculous. Do people really think they don't care about the outage or aren't doing anything to resolve it? Please! You can bet there are probably a few engineers/techs that won't be getting any sleep until this is fixed.
    Well, gee, maybe they should change the way the BB infrastructure works. 50 billion other Smartphones around the world only depend upon carrier data and not a 3rd party to be able to work online. RIM's handsets are the only one that depend upon both the carrier and RIM to work. Take away one of the two and you're left scratching your a**.... and RIM goes down more often then a blond on prom night. lol
    12-23-09 12:48 AM
  11. khanusma's Avatar
    Just gives me another excuse to jump ship to a Droid. I was hoping to wait until spring so a couple handsets would be out but I might as well get a droid tomorrow on my 1 year upgrade through Verizon.

    I don't know why RIM thought it would be a good idea to make me go through them to get to the internets.
    Last edited by khanusma; 12-23-09 at 12:57 AM.
    12-23-09 12:55 AM
  12. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    Just gives me another excuse to jump ship to a Droid. I was hoping to wait until spring so a couple handsets would be out but I might as well get a droid tomorrow on my 1 year upgrade through Verizon.

    I don't know why RIM thought it would be a good idea to make me go through them to get to the internets.
    "Because it's safer." Ya ye betcha, doncha know?
    12-23-09 01:11 AM
  13. amazinglygraceless's Avatar
    This is the only major outage. The others I would consider minor.
    While it is annoying, I really wish more people looked at this way.

    Think about it for a second, even if there were 25 outages this year that would
    still mean the service worked as expected for 333 out of 358 days (as of now).

    That is 93% reliability. RIM has it's shortcomings but Lord people are blowing
    this way out of proportion as if this is a daily occurrence.
    12-23-09 01:22 AM
  14. Gawain's Avatar
    What's that, 3 major outages in a short amount of time? Unacceptable. I rely on this device. No, nothing is perfect- but this is out of control. I also hate how RIM leaves us in the dark.

    I'm thinking of jumping ship to Android.

    How about you? What phone are you tempted to get?
    The only other devices that have tempted me are the Nokia N900, which would require me to leave Verizon, and go to T-Mobile (I'm not ready to do that), or the Palm and WebOS, which if I wait, will come to VZW early next year. The Android OS just doesn't capture me. WebOS is really really cool though. The Maemo/Linux OS in the N900 looks slick as well. I'm not willing to jump to WM, not until they have something akin to a Windows 7 which is lean and mean. Too many gizmo-whats-this-stuff in the Windows Mobile environment.

    However, I am really not ready to abandon RIM (or BBM). What we are seeing, and what I am prepared to push, as a shareholder, is a top-to-bottom reevaluation of RIM's disaster recovery plan. The fact that there isn't hot-swappable gear, at a separate NOC somewhere is unforgivable in today's information environment.
    12-23-09 01:33 AM
  15. twester65's Avatar
    While it is annoying, I really wish more people looked at this way.

    Think about it for a second, even if there were 25 outages this year that would
    still mean the service worked as expected for 333 out of 358 days (as of now).

    That is 93% reliability. RIM has it's shortcomings but Lord people are blowing
    this way out of proportion as if this is a daily occurrence.
    I wish my phone was fully functional, but **** it's 23:31. Who am I going to email or message? I realize that there are people who rely on service at this hour, but I'm in front of my PC which is fully functional.

    Does that mean that I don't stare at my phone and will it to show signs of life? No, but there's nothing really serious going on here. I'm just glad I'm not a network engineer at RIM with corporate, non-technical shirts breathing down my neck. So glad to be out of that business...
    12-23-09 01:38 AM
  16. twester65's Avatar
    H*ll is a dirty word?
    12-23-09 01:39 AM
  17. drumzalicious's Avatar
    for some people to say that we should be getting over the fact there is a major outage going on right now.

    Some of us work around the clock and not regular 9-5 jobs. I myself am a musician and therefore it is important to stay connected 24/7 because i get just as many emails for gigs as i do phone calls if not more so right now im losing money.
    12-23-09 01:40 AM
  18. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    However, I am really not ready to abandon RIM (or BBM). What we are seeing, and what I am prepared to push, as a shareholder, is a top-to-bottom reevaluation of RIM's disaster recovery plan. The fact that there isn't hot-swappable gear, at a separate NOC somewhere is unforgivable in today's information environment.
    It takes them 3 weeks to make changes for Push customers when an IP changes on the customer's server. (ISP/Host change or whatnot). How long do you think it would take them to reroute all the traffic from one NOC to another? lol
    12-23-09 01:42 AM
  19. Gawain's Avatar
    While it is annoying, I really wish more people looked at this way.

    Think about it for a second, even if there were 25 outages this year that would
    still mean the service worked as expected for 333 out of 358 days (as of now).

    That is 93% reliability. RIM has it's shortcomings but Lord people are blowing
    this way out of proportion as if this is a daily occurrence.
    When you consider that most network operations have an up-time measured in "five-nines" of reliability, your example of RIM's 93% is horrific. By any IT standard, a service level commitment below 99.999% is not competitive, or even given credibility. DIAS has a heavy hardware reliability requirement to it as well. Tier 1 providers measure their failures in terms less than "hours per year". If something breaks, back-ups kick in or are up in usually less than 30 minutes.

    There is no justifiable reason for this. There was just an outage last week, for at least 2-3 hours (maybe more depend on who/where/etc). Network providers pay out the nose to their clients when this kind of stuff happens.

    You make it sound like "oh, it's just another blue screen of death" type thing from the old Window 3.1 days. I haven't had a BSOD in years. But it's sad, I've had a multi-hour failures with RIM twice in a week.
    12-23-09 01:48 AM
  20. Gawain's Avatar
    It takes them 3 weeks to make changes for Push customers when an IP changes on the customer's server. (ISP/Host change or whatnot). How long do you think it would take them to reroute all the traffic from one NOC to another? lol
    I remember that thread, but I thought folks were seeing that as a measure of priority? Either way, the wizards at RIM should be happy that I'm not king for a day...
    12-23-09 01:50 AM
  21. amazinglygraceless's Avatar
    Some of us work around the clock and not regular 9-5 jobs.
    Completely irrelevant. What is relevant is the fact that YOU decided to trust
    your business and by extension, your income to a single source of
    communication.

    I chose not to. That is why I have a computer, 2 non RIM OS phones and a
    landline. It's also why I am not viewing this or any other outage as an end of
    the world.
    12-23-09 01:55 AM
  22. amazinglygraceless's Avatar
    By any IT standard, a service level commitment below 99.999% is not competitive, or even given credibility.
    That is all very well and good but we are not talking about IT standards. We are
    talking about END USER standards. As you and I both know, those are very,
    very divergent criteria.

    Toss around all the esoteric technical data you wish, bottom line is the END USER
    does not care. They just want it to work. And in this case the END USER is reacting
    in a shockingly unreasonable and unrealistic fashion.
    12-23-09 01:58 AM
  23. GaryG7's Avatar
    Phone? Hah! I'm switching to a carrier pigeon.
    12-23-09 02:12 AM
  24. Gawain's Avatar
    That is all very well and good but we are not talking about IT standards. We are
    talking about END USER standards. As you and I both know, those are very,
    very divergent criteria.

    Toss around all the esoteric technical data you wish, bottom line is the END USER
    does not care. They just want it to work. And in this case the END USER is reacting
    in a shockingly unreasonable and unrealistic fashion.
    Seeing as how it's all BIS/BES services are in the toilet, I disagree.

    It's not esoteric data. It's market reality.

    Your bottom line is spot-on though. The end-user does not care. They just want it to work. End users are decision makers. How many large, corporate accounts with Verizon, AT&T and Sprint are also RIM customers?

    When VZW, L3, AT&T or Sprint provide a T-carrier circuit for DIAS to one of their customers, they guarantee performance on everything from latency, to packet loss to up-time. They make this data available on demand, and report it to their customers on regular intervals. Given the data load in our 24-hour cycles of information it's no small measure to accomplish this task. Yet it is done, day in, and day out.

    My Blackberry is making phone calls just fine. VZWs network is up. Can't remember the last time I had an outage.

    One major outage with Danger, Inc., has caused Microsoft to reevaluate their mobile platform approach and reassess its future. T-Mobile stopped selling Sidekicks for how long?

    I'm not giving up on RIM, I have a vested interest in their continued success.

    ...to make a 93% service-up-time look impressive...well it just isn't.
    12-23-09 02:14 AM
  25. Gawain's Avatar
    Phone? Hah! I'm switching to a carrier pigeon.
    Pssst...they're extinct.
    12-23-09 02:15 AM
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