1. dbollman423's Avatar
    India has a population 4X the US. For those that doubt that the international market is going to be a real game changer, please read the following. For BB/RIM OS 7 phones will probably be dominant for some time to come in India because they are just getting to 3g.


    Apple Cedes Surging India Smartphone Market to Nokia-RIM: Tech

    Oct. 3 (Bloomberg) -- Apple Inc., the world's largest smartphone maker, is having trouble selling iPhones in India, a market with 602 million active subscribers.

    Apple, which will introduce a new iPhone version tomorrow, ships fewer handsets to the world's second-largest mobile-phone market than it does to Norway. Nokia Oyj and Research In Motion Ltd. sell more devices in India, where smartphone shipments are forecast to grow almost 70 percent a year until 2015, helping mitigate their market-share losses in the U.S. and Europe.

    Sales for the world's biggest company by market value are hindered because Indian wireless carriers, which started third- generation networks this year, have yet to offer nationwide services fast enough to take advantage of iPhone features, said Gus Papageorgiou, an analyst at Scotia Capital Inc. in Toronto.

    Networks in India are just not conducive for Apple -- 3G networks aren't quite where they are in Western Europe and North America, he said. RIM got the right product, the right timing, the right app.

    Apple shipped 62,043 iPhones to India in the quarter ending June 30, or fewer than to Norway, Belgium or Israel, according to estimates by Framingham, Massachusetts-based researcher IDC.

    BlackBerry Messenger

    Apple dropped 0.6 percent to the equivalent of $381.08 in German trading as of 11:22 a.m. in Frankfurt.

    Apple accounted for 2.6 percent of India's smartphone shipments in the quarter ended June 30, trailing RIM's 15 percent, Samsung Electronics Co.'s 21 percent and Nokia's 46 percent, IDC estimates.

    The iPhone only really works when you have Wi-Fi, said Kshma Shah, a 25-year-old interior designer in Mumbai. 3G has barely started in India, and on 2G you just can't have the same experience.

    The world's largest maker of tablet computers also shipped about 21,150 iPads to India in the same period, or 0.2 percent of its global total, according to IDC.

    RIM's BlackBerry Messenger instant-messaging service is popular because it was one of the first, and it functions well on networks a generation behind the speeds offered in the U.S. and Europe, Papageorgiou said.

    Only a few of my friends have iPhones, said Mahafareenn Sarkari, a 25-year-old dance instructor in Mumbai. BlackBerry is where everybody is, so it made sense for me to be on it, too.

    RIM's Wave'

    RIM, which entered India in 2004, plans to extend its lead over Apple after expanding distribution to 80 cities from 15 starting last year, said Krishnadeep Baruah, director of marketing for Waterloo, Canada-based RIM in India.

    We want to ride this wave, Baruah said. This is really the time to expand into the emerging towns and cities.

    That contrasts with RIM's struggles worldwide, with its stock falling 65 percent this year on the Nasdaq Stock Market. At least five RIM executives have left since March, and the company sold half as many PlayBook tablets in the second quarter as analysts had forecast on average.

    Nokia has more than 200,000 outlets in India and offers 13 smartphone models, Vilsha Kapoor of New Delhi-based Six Degrees PR, hired by Nokia to handle public relations, said in an e- mail.

    The Espoo, Finland-based company is seeking to reverse its global performance. Shares are down 45 percent this year, and it is eliminating at least 7,500 jobs as Apple takes global market share and Asian competitors push the price of smartphones below $100.

    68% Growth

    Smartphone shipments in India are poised to jump almost eightfold, or an average of 68 percent a year, to 81.5 million units by 2015, according to IDC.

    Apple products aren't as accessible in India because consumers can't buy iPhones, iPads and iTunes songs from company stores or its website. Apple sells through licensed resellers, including a Reliance Industries Ltd. subsidiary and Tata Group's Croma.

    Apple continues to invest in India as a growing market for the company, Alan Hely, a London-based spokesman for Apple, said in an e-mailed response.

    Steve Dowling, a Cupertino, California-based spokesman for Apple, declined to comment.

    In China, Apple operates six stores, including its highest- grossing ones worldwide. Revenue in China, Taiwan and Hong Kong increased six times to $3.8 billion in the quarter ended June, Apple Chief Executive Officer Tim Cook said in July.

    Pathetic' Advertising

    Apple may be relying more on word-of-mouth among India's wealthy, said Harish Bijoor, who runs his own brand consulting firm in Bangalore.

    They don't see a big enough market for their products to make it worthwhile, Bijoor said. They've barely done any advertising. It's pathetic, really.

    Cost is also an issue in a country where the World Bank estimates that about 900 million people live on less than $2 a day.

    The cheapest iPhone 4 costs $705 at Reliance's iStore, while the cheapest iPad 2 sells for about $603. In Apple's U.S. online store, the iPhone 4 starts at $199 with an AT&T Inc. contract and the iPad starts at $499.

    BlackBerrys under $200 made up 40 percent of their shipments in India in the quarter ended June 30, said T.Z. Wong, an analyst for IDC.

    I don't think Apple is a brand for the masses, said Ajit Joshi, managing director of Croma, which also sells other brands besides Apple. It's a brand for the classes.

    The masses may be getting wealthier as India's new five- year plan aims for 9 percent growth in gross domestic product. India last year joined the top dozen countries with the most millionaires, according to a report by Capgemini and Merrill Lynch Global Wealth Management in June.

    Salaries in India also are set to rise the most in the Asia-Pacific region this year, according to an Aon Hewitt LLC survey released in March 8.

    It's a brand-in-waiting, said Viren Razdan, managing director of consulting firm Interbrand's Mumbai office. Apple is waiting for infrastructure and consumer maturity.



    To contact the editor responsible for this story: Young-Sam Cho at ycho2@bloomberg.net
    VeGiTo likes this.
    06-06-12 10:42 AM
  2. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Yep, mid/long-term position will be great, especially when those markets go mature (i.e not only cheap phones and plans).

    P.S: Note this article reefers to Oct 3 2011, some parts may not be very up to date regarding figures.
    06-06-12 10:47 AM
  3. brucep1's Avatar
    There's always money in the banana stand India
    addicted44 and Rickroller like this.
    06-06-12 10:50 AM
  4. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    There's always money in the banana stand India
    Contemptuous now ? We've read better from you.
    06-06-12 10:55 AM
  5. cgk's Avatar
    That sounds great until you realise that Nokia and Rim are selling low margin (Chris on the crackberry blog says that the gross margins for curves are either zero or near to zero) high volume items - of course they are going to beat the iphone in a segment that the iphone doesn't compete in, it says as much in the article:

    “I don't think Apple is a brand for the masses,” said Ajit Joshi, managing director of Croma, which also sells other brands besides Apple. “It's a brand for the classes.”
    So they will generate some services revenue but not at a level to make a significant difference to the over-all future.

    If we want to compare like to like - how does the blackberry bold line sell against other premium devices in those countries?
    06-06-12 11:02 AM
  6. dbollman423's Avatar
    Oh, is that why RIM is opening up to 15 premium stores by year end. To sell low end. Brilliant.
    06-06-12 11:48 AM
  7. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Oh, is that why RIM is opening up to 15 premium stores by year end. To sell low end. Brilliant.
    Real Estate prices and employees fees goes accordingly. Acquisition of a market have a price. This one is still low, for now.
    06-06-12 12:28 PM
  8. mdarscott's Avatar
    They just lost their executive responsible for global sales. Maybe they should promote someone from their India division since 1) this division seems to know how to sell phones and 2) understanding this market (and other markets like it) is going to be way important for years to come.
    06-06-12 03:24 PM
  9. tchocky77's Avatar
    India cannot save RIM by itself. Too many other low-end androids to compete with, I fear.

    Also a billion people is a lot for Apple to ignore. Perhaps they will re-release iPhone 2 and 3g for India's primitive wireless networks, making them free on contract. In this scenario, Apple runs away with the market like they have everywhere else.
    Last edited by tchocky77; 06-06-12 at 04:18 PM.
    06-06-12 04:06 PM
  10. inicophone's Avatar
    I think a combination of growth in India, the Middle East, some parts of Africa, and then Central & South America may be enough to save the BB7 and take BB10 into 3rd place.
    06-06-12 04:16 PM
  11. cgk's Avatar
    India cannot save RIM by itself. Too many other low-end androids to compete with, I fear.

    Also a billion people is a lot for Apple to ignore. Perhaps they will re-release iPhone 2 and 3g for India's primitive wireless networks, making them free on contract. In this scenario, Apple runs away with the market like they have everywhere else.
    Unless something goes drastically wrong, Apple will be happy to settle for the percentage of the population who will buy devices that provide a high margin for them, they have no interest at all scrapping around at the bottom of the margin for zero or near zero margins.
    06-06-12 05:04 PM
  12. tchocky77's Avatar
    Yeah,....I actually agree. They just don't need to go there.
    06-06-12 05:16 PM
  13. ekafara's Avatar
    Keep a good name in India and when they start to buy higher end devices they will do amazing. ...well, here's hoping...
    06-06-12 05:31 PM
  14. morlock_man's Avatar
    There's always money in the banana stand India
    Thats kind of racist.

    Unless something goes drastically wrong, Apple will be happy to settle for the percentage of the population who will buy devices that provide a high margin for them, they have no interest at all scrapping around at the bottom of the margin for zero or near zero margins.
    Yeah, until they get dealt multiple antitrust suits for price fixing and market manipulation.

    France's biggest Apple reseller sinks: 'Tech titan crushed us'

    Apple is to the tech world as De Beers is to the diamond world. They generate artificial scarcity so the demand, and the price, stays high.
    06-06-12 05:37 PM
  15. robtanz's Avatar
    There's always money in the banana stand India
    Nice usage. That's a quote from Arrested Development...no racist.
    brucep1 likes this.
    06-06-12 06:15 PM
  16. tchocky77's Avatar
    Nice usage. That's a quote from Arrested Development...no racist.
    LLOLL! I instantly recognized it and had a good laugh. You know who sees racism EVERYWHERE, though.......?



    Closeted racists.
    06-06-12 06:46 PM
  17. jr4941's Avatar
    Too bad I burned the banana stand down...
    06-06-12 06:59 PM
  18. tchocky77's Avatar
    I love NetFlix. So much the more for commissioning an ENTIRE NEW SEASON of this modern classic!
    Rickroller likes this.
    06-06-12 07:07 PM
  19. brucep1's Avatar
    I love NetFlix. So much the more for commissioning an ENTIRE NEW SEASON of this modern classic!
    I can't wait for the new season, next year I believe. Releasing all episodes at once. Hopefully Netflix will be on ALL platforms by then.
    06-07-12 07:17 AM
  20. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    06-07-12 09:17 AM
  21. varunsain's Avatar
    I've seen iPhones sell upto 1500$ and that really helps them.. But BlackBerry India is on it's way to opening up a whole new market for itself which will help them pull out of the mess. OS, UI and 90% of apps don't matter in the Indian market. BlackBerry launched the 9220 and it's working really well for them.

    BlackBerry Curve 9220: Review: NDTV Gadgets

    I don't agree with the screen display being weak according to the review since it's a good screen display when you compare it to some same budget phones.. Not the best.. but really good display..

    and it highlights the point about the phone being highly priced which shows that RIM is slowly increasing profit percent on low budget phones to cover up for sales.. The price is right for the market as RIM is offering 7.1 OS (they key where Apple and Android make money on OS).

    IMO the 8520 and other such old models should be sold off in India and other such countries like discounted PB prices which will flood the market with BB phones..

    Generally everyone forgets that RIM make a recurring income on each BB handset considering they are subscribed to the BIS/BES network. They can make huge money here.. since most of BB users are subscribed to atleast the basic plan which is of BB and PIM+IM at just Rs.199 pm.

    There is so much that RIM can do..
    06-08-12 01:16 AM
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