02-08-14 01:31 AM
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  1. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    Yes, look at the edit. The only things that got busted, are your delusions.

    Posted via CB10
    Hold on, are you saying Middle East, Africa, Latin America and Asia Pacific contain NO developed countries? You consider them ALL emerging markets?

    Amazing!

    Posted via CB10
    12-20-13 04:47 PM
  2. Dave Bourque's Avatar
    Hold on, are you saying Middle East, Africa, Latin America and Asia Pacific contain NO developed countries? You consider them ALL emerging markets?

    Amazing!

    Posted via CB10
    Well they would contain the majority... that doesn't leave many regions.... rofl

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.0.1803
    12-20-13 04:49 PM
  3. BennyX's Avatar
    The high-end Bold still looks premium and is a perfect size for email, messaging, even basic browsing if need be. For business use it still does the job.

    The Curve models, though... those just look cheap.
    BigAl_BB9900 and Legal Eagle like this.
    12-20-13 04:54 PM
  4. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Hold on, are you saying Middle East, Africa, Latin America and Asia Pacific contain NO developed countries? You consider them ALL emerging markets?

    Amazing!

    Posted via CB10
    Per definition, the Middle-East, Latin America and Africa have not a single country that qualifies for being a "developped" one.
    (Of note: this is meant value-neutral)

    The Asia Pacific region only features Australia and Japan as developped countries that come to mind.
    Since BlackBerry doesn't sell devices in Japan anymore, we can ignore them.
    And Australia with a 1.5% of BlackBerry marketshare, will not change my simplified calculations a lot.

    So.... What was your point?

    Posted via CB10
    Omnitech likes this.
    12-20-13 04:57 PM
  5. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    Well they would contain the majority... that doesn't leave many regions.... rofl

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.0.1803
    Dude, you said OS7 sells in emerging markets not in countries like Canada, US and UK.

    You were proven WRONG, 50%+- of sales were exactly in countries like Canada, US and UK

    Posted via CB10
    12-20-13 04:59 PM
  6. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    Per definition, the Middle-East, Latin America and Africa have not a single country that qualifies for being a "developped" one.
    (Of note: this is meant value-neutral)

    The Asia Pacific region only features Australia and Japan as developped countries that come to mind.
    Since BlackBerry doesn't sell devices in Japan anymore, we can ignore them.
    And Australia with a 1.5% of BlackBerry marketshare, will not change my simplified calculations a lot.

    So.... What was your point?

    Posted via CB10
    Point is it's a busted myth that most sales of BB7 devices are in emerging markets, fact is only roughly half do, the rest come from good old developed countries.

    28.5% of sales come from North America alone.

    Posted via CB10
    12-20-13 05:05 PM
  7. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Dude, you said OS7 sells in emerging markets not in countries like Canada, US and UK.

    You were proven WRONG, 50%+- of sales were exactly in countries like Canada, US and UK

    Posted via CB10
    Since we have proven, that more or less 50% of BlackBerry's sales happen in emerging markets, you can guess how much lower the average income is in these regions.

    China for example, has a GDP per capita of about 6.6k $ a year.
    India has about 1.2k.
    The US has about 50k.

    Now take a big guess, how much spendable income someone has for a phone in an emerging market...
    How much exactly, will be hard.
    The general situation, as the GDP/Capita itself shows, is as such that there is way less money to spend/waste.

    Which is one of the major reasons why WP8 and Android sales have been so incredibly strong in these regions, in the last 5-8 quarters.

    When I say,( and I assume that Dave means the same) that most BBOS sales are realised in emerging markets, then what I mean is, that from these + -50% of BlackBerry sales that happen there, the vast majority of these sales will be BBOS ones.
    It's an economic necessity, when you have between 10-50 times less money to spend than the average US customer.

    The average phone sold in the US, is worth way more in $, than the average smartphone sold in China.
    (avg price of an Android device sold is at about 200$ in China. They do have an incredible smartphone penetration rate of about 80% though. India for example has way less.
    http://www.techinasia.com/q3-2013-ch...ndroid-phones/ )


    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by MarsupilamiX; 12-20-13 at 08:17 PM.
    12-20-13 05:22 PM
  8. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Point is it's a busted myth that most sales of BB7 devices are in emerging markets, fact is only roughly half do, the rest come from good old developed countries.

    28.5% of sales come from North America alone.

    Posted via CB10
    Did you think that the numbers from the quarterly report, are only BBOS devices?

    Posted via CB10
    12-20-13 05:29 PM
  9. Omnitech's Avatar
    Did you think that the numbers from the quarterly report, are only BBOS devices?

    75% of sales (3.2M vs total 4.3M as I recall) were BBOS in Q3.


    (Edit: Handset sales.)
    12-20-13 05:33 PM
  10. def_vlad's Avatar
    Lol


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    12-20-13 05:37 PM
  11. erekshun's Avatar
    The 9900 costs more new than a z10 now. Significantly more.
    Why?
    Trackpad, the BlackBerry email advantage, better battery life, easy travelling, better reception, better keyboard arguably, better instant actions ie more responsive, better messaging capabilities ie multitasking inboxes and apps like viber, holster profiles, better led, better notifications and customisable alerts, better phone design, better speakers and speaker placement and more reliable BBM. I'm sure I missed some points out.
    Bb7 phones offer a BlackBerry advantage that people still value.
    There's very very little BlackBerry in bb10.
    So people stick with what they love until BlackBerry or someone else makes something they want more than bb7.

    Whoever thought bb10 phones would be what bb7 users expected in a mobile device needs to take a long hard look at themselves. And those belittling bb7 advantages as obsolete and outdated must have got a bit of a shock today.

    Posted via CB10
    All they had to do was make BB10 with the exact options/features as BB 7. They could of enhanced BB 7 by having a better browser and kept the gestures and I think they would have had a hit. Lack of headless apps is a problem to because if the phone keeps rebooting the active frames get closed. I had a Z10 and had to sell it so I could get a Torch 9810. I think this phone is awesome.
    bobauckland likes this.
    12-20-13 05:38 PM
  12. Omnitech's Avatar
    They could of enhanced BB 7 by having a better browser...

    You can't "enhance the browser" when the main problem was trying to squeeze content through this tiny pinhole called "BIS".
    mkelley65 likes this.
    12-20-13 05:57 PM
  13. bobauckland's Avatar
    You can't "enhance the browser" when the main problem was trying to squeeze content through this tiny pinhole called "BIS".
    Lol it's funny how you keep pushing this when it's just not true.
    The browser is written completely differently for bb10. To you it's all about BIS.
    It's just hilarious, you'd be frothing at the mouth if someone 'debated' you the way you 'debate' the merits of BIS to people.
    12-20-13 06:01 PM
  14. Omnitech's Avatar
    Lol it's funny how you keep pushing this when it's just not true.
    The browser is written completely differently for bb10. To you it's all about BIS.
    It's just hilarious, you'd be frothing at the mouth if someone 'debated' you the way you 'debate' the merits of BIS to people.

    Please lay off the insults, sir.
    12-20-13 06:19 PM
  15. David Murray1's Avatar
    In the software side, BB7 is the result of a slow process of maturity that started with OS4.X.
    Sadly, BBRY did not take the experience acquired with BBOS in order to create a better BB10 from the very beginning. That's why OS7.X has a lot of features that we're still waiting on BB10.
    In the hardware side, BB10 devices are not being created with low-budget customers in mind.. not at all. 2GB RAM requirement is still too much for cheap devices. A trio of high-end, med-end and low-end devices should be on market since day one, but even the Q5 is not suitable for low-income people.
    The lack of BIS is also a drawback for BB10. Legacy devices are able to get low cost social data plans with BBM-only access, that's not possible with BB10.
    So, definitely, BB10 is not a platform for the same type of customers currently using OS7.x devices.



    Do you know what REALLY infuriates me ... drives me up the bleeding wall ... is the assumption that everybody who uses (or wants) a BBOS device is a 'poor person' or somebody in a 'developing economy'.

    I could blow my top at this all-too-prevalent, extremely ignorant and very arrogant attitude.

    Maybe BBOS sells well today because it's (or comes bundled with) a good product?
    12-20-13 06:23 PM
  16. bobauckland's Avatar
    Please lay off the insults, sir.
    Please re read my post I did not insult you. I corrected an untruth you continue to spread that bis was the sole cause of browser issues on legacy devices.

    Posted via CB10
    12-20-13 06:27 PM
  17. lnichols's Avatar
    Point is it's a busted myth that most sales of BB7 devices are in emerging markets, fact is only roughly half do, the rest come from good old developed countries.

    28.5% of sales come from North America alone.

    Posted via CB10
    Most of those are business phones connecting to BES5. Nobody,or very few people, are buying OS7 devices in North America for personal use. Any companies invested in BES5 that have to replace or add phones have to buy BBOS. That's why they are gouging people with the Bold 9900 prices still because they know they have customers that are stuck. Government is the same, as organizations are still testing BES10 and planning rollouts. Oh and I see so many "why can't we use iPhones" or "BlackBerry is dead" and other comments about how much BBOS devices are hated on the internal message boards that it is sad. BBOS can't go away soon enough in US government business because people hate the devices and it is tarnishing the BlackBerry brand severely.

    Posted via CB10
    MarsupilamiX, bbq10l and mkelley65 like this.
    12-20-13 06:44 PM
  18. ChainPunch's Avatar
    I can tell you why some people have OS7 devices and that is because that is all their carrier offers. U.S. Cellular I am talking about you in my paticular case.

    If you want to speak in general terms then OS7 device offers a cheaper phone plan for many users and they are not willing to give up those plans for a new BB10 device that will increase their plans.
    12-20-13 06:53 PM
  19. Omnitech's Avatar
    Do you know what REALLY infuriates me ... drives me up the bleeding wall ... is the assumption that everybody who uses (or wants) a BBOS device is a 'poor person' or somebody in a 'developing economy'.

    I see no evidence that the words you quoted made that assertion in the stark manner you claim.

    Regardless, it's a clear and obvious fact that MOST of BB7 production these days goes to non-wealthy countries. If BB10 had done better, that distinction would have been even starker.

    I still have my Bold (there is data on it that I haven't migrated off of it yet) and there are certainly some features of that platform that I found handy.

    That said, on an overall basis, for me, it was an inefficient, slow, laggy, backwards system in a variety of ways, including various email limitations despite the old-school cries of "But email is superior in every way!". Well, it's not.

    Different strokes for different folks.
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    12-20-13 07:20 PM
  20. Omnitech's Avatar
    Please re read my post I did not insult you. I corrected an untruth you continue to spread that bis was the sole cause of browser issues on legacy devices.

    I realize that perhaps in your peculiar idiom of the English language, accusing someone of "frothing at the mouth" is not an insult.

    I guess we just use a different English idiom over here.


    It's just hilarious, you'd be frothing at the mouth if someone 'debated' you the way you 'debate' the merits of BIS to people.
    12-20-13 07:23 PM
  21. David Murray1's Avatar
    Those 'inefficient and backward' phones happen to have full QWERTY, trackpad and touch screen making them very efficient for certain purposes. Besides BIS. And this is coming from somebody who isn't poor and who has a Z10 as well as a 9900. And used an iPhone once, and didn't buy the hype on it. (Sure it can play fancy games, but at the end of the day nobody enjoys playing fancy games on a tiny screen.)
    Legal Eagle likes this.
    12-20-13 07:27 PM
  22. Omnitech's Avatar
    Those 'inefficient and backward' phones happen to have full QWERTY, trackpad and touch screen making them very efficient for certain purposes. Besides BIS. And this is coming from somebody who isn't poor and who has a Z10 as well as a 9900. And used an iPhone once, and didn't buy the hype on it. (Sure it can play fancy games, but at the end of the day nobody enjoys playing fancy games on a tiny screen.)

    As I said, different strokes for different folks.

    I think everyone would benefit from at least attempting to understand that not everyone prefers or uses things the same precise way that they do.

    You think the qwerty is fabulous, other people think it's horrible.

    I actually would PREFER a qwerty and a trackpad myself - it's just that the overall technology was so problematic in so many other ways that my BB10 devices are in a completely differently class from my old BBOS devices, for ME.

    If I could have that AND all those other things, even better. But this is the best combo for me right now. And I'm certainly not the only one who feels that way.

    Once again: vive la difference. Let's leave it at that.
    12-20-13 07:39 PM
  23. David Murray1's Avatar
    Vive le difference indeed, so let's stop pressuring people happy with BBOS devices to switch to BB10 simply so that Chen and co can get more $$$ out of them and the stock price goes up. Let's see it from the consumer's point of view.
    12-20-13 07:46 PM
  24. IAmMrFrazier's Avatar
    It's not cost for me... it's design. I am in love with the bold 9900/9930 devices. Yes. I carry the z/q 10 phones, I do love them, but I still have my bold as my daily driver.

    Posted via CB10 from my Verizon Q10!
    Saiga likes this.
    12-20-13 07:48 PM
  25. David Murray1's Avatar
    BIS isn't slow anyway, but 3G certainly is.
    12-20-13 08:18 PM
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